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oneafrikan

Vintage Bruiser Build questions

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Hi All,

I*m new here, treat me nice ;-)

I've bought a Bruiser off eBay, with the idea being to restore and re-build where necessary. I work on computers every day, so this is a great way for me to work with my hands and get my mind away from computers and screens!

I bought it as a semit-complete kit - so the chassis & running gear are are all there, with working electrics, but the body needs to be completed, and there are two seemingly serious issues to deal with before the truck can run...

But, the last time I worked on an RC car was about 30 years ago and it was fleeting - when I was a kid this was the thing I wanted to do but my parents couldn't afford for me to do, so it was only with a few friends once or twice!  So basically I'm new to this, and have probably bitten off a bit more than I should to start with.  [To remedy that, I've bought a bunch of Grasshoppers off ebay too, which I'm going to work on as well - time to satisfaction much faster!]

So I have some questions which I hope the folks here can help with:

1) slop on the front axle?

When I put on the wheels, there was a bit of slop which I put down to tightening. Now that I've spent more time on the truck, I can see that the hub shafts are moving around in the knuckles too much.  More tightening, or is this normal? What to do?

2) what should it sound like?

What should a good motor + running gear sound like when it's running - what are the warning signs for more grease / bad lubrication / problems / etc etc?

3) shifting the tranny?

This thread from Nitomor is excellent, and it's highlighted how important it is to get the shifting right.  My one only shifts into 4wd drive if I really push the rod as far as it can go manually with my fingers, certainly can't do it with the servo alone - so how do I adjust this so that the servo can do it for me? What are the measurements I should be watching out for?

4) what servos to use?

Again, the thread from Nitomor is great for inspiration! Would metal gear servos be good as a matter of course? What ones are recommended? Which is tougher on the servo - direction (left / right) or shifting the tranny? I'm in the UK, so any suggestions on what to get would be appreciated.  Could follow Nitomor exactly, but then sounds like his Bruiser is mostly for the shelf, so wonder if there are better options?  Also, which servo saver?  Mine has new white circular ones on the tranny servo.

5) what transmitter to use?

I can get the transmitter to shift into the 2wd gears no problem, but moving the rod far enough back to switch into 4wd reliably, then keep it there, seems to be beyond the transmitter / servo combination. Is there a way to tune this I'm missing?

Again related to the servo question - seems like using a gate on the transmitter is a bit of a hack if you can use a switch instead?  Seems like if the switch can do Neutral, Left & Right, then you've got the 3 speed shifting you need?  If so, which transmitter is recommended?  Would any 6 or 7 channel transmitter within budget work, or are there specific models only? Nitomor is using the Futaba FF7, and there is a guy who posted a build using a Carson tx - so what should I be looking for?

Lastly, I'm not building this for the shelf - this is being built to run around with my kids.  I'm hoping to hop on a GoPro or similar so that I can take photos of my kids running around without having to actually keep up with them ;-)  So when answering please bear that in mind - I'm not looking for beauty or perfect lines, mainly something that will last and will be bomb-proof, much like my real life 1:1 Bruiser!

Cool, over to you guys, thanks in advance!

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Firstly welcome - and congratulations on your Bruiser, you've certainly jumped in at the deep end lol!

Having just completed a Hilux rejuvenation I hopefully can point you in some direction..

 

First and most importantly get yourself a printed or downloaded copy of the correct manual - www.tamiyausa.com have them to download, just search for Bruiser, select the correct model and then click on the manual tab/button   Or follow this link ;)   http://www.tamiyausa.com/pdf/manuals/58048ml.pdf

1.slop - assuming this is within the wheel hub area, there are three components involved - the hub shafts themselves, the brass bushing / bearing in the cast metal hub and the casting itself.  If it is still using the original brass bushing and its had some use then the bushings could be excessively worn, plus maybe some wear on the shaft itself if its been run in dirty conditions.  Bushings are available, either the knurled out rim originals of later plain ones (still used in many current models), or you could upgrade to metal sealed of rubber sealed ball bearings - '1150' is the Tamiya sizing.

Another area of slop is the connection between the hub assembly and the main axle housing, the cast in kingpin pivot points aren't exactly a tight fit with the hub assembly so some slop is to be expected - if you study youtube videos of the various 3speed tucks you will see they do tend to jiggle about a fair bit !

 

2. Sound wise there are a lot of gears in the transmission so there will be some transmission noise - i'd be more worried if you thought it was too quiet as that might indicate someone previously used  thick grease which adds drag for the motor and electronics. Provided there is no clunking then you should be OK, but of course we have no knowledge on prior use. The motor may be tired / worn too, so thats another area to consider. If you have the motor off its a good idea to check the white plastic spur gear - the first one inside the transmission case.  Until you are more familiar I wouldn't recommend stripping the transmission down, but there is a guide on the BruiserBuilder website that will either put you off altogether, or assist if you do decide to dabble !

3. Shifting - sounds as though the shifting mechanism doesn't have sufficient through or torque to reach the correct end point - could be a poorly set up servo (servo arm not set at neutral point), too little arc on the servo saver arm (often by putting the linkage to one of the inner holes on the arm, rather than an outer one with greater travel) poorly set up linkage rod (is is 67mm from the kink in the rod to the face of the rod end connector ?)  or poorly set selector arm on the end of the transmission. Are the trim sliders/levers on the transmitter central or significantly offset from zero trim point ?

4. Servos - everyone will have a personal choice, but 30 years ago there wasn't the selection there is today  - a lot of trucks ran around on basic or mid range Acoms / Futaba servos.  I put three new Allturn (available from modelsport) servos into my Hilux (on the basis I wanted to run it occassionally, so new was better for me than a  period correct display piece). If you wanted to put a better servo in one location then for the Bruiser the steering is the most needy - especially if you want to be able to turn the wheels when stationary , more so on soft ground or a lawn are with high contact area.  Shift servo and the speed controller only normally need standard basic servos.

5. Transmitter  - personal choice, but if you want the use all three speeds then you need a minimum of a 3 channel set up with 3 position capability on the third channel - some modern TXs only have on/off on the 3rd channel.  Next thought is wheel transmitter or stick ?  For me it had to be an old Acoms stick transmitter (so i have the vintage experience at the control end  as well as the visual delight watching the truck trundle around); if you have children then this might not be the best ergonomic solution for them; in fact you want to reduce the risk of an incorrect gear shift as much as possible !

 

Hope this is of some use in resolving some of your teething issues.

 

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Also bear in mind that nitomors thread is for the re-release version of the Bruiser, not the original 25-30 year old version. I assumed from the thread title you have the original version !

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Welcome to the club and congrats on your purchase! Percymon pretty much covers it all.

Thanks for the comments on my build thread, I'm pleased it has been of some use to others. I use the FF7 on that truck, I also have a Mountain Rider thread in the builds where I'm using the more modern, better and cheaper Futaba 10J which also has receivers available for far less. You could use the Futaba 8J which are available lighty used on ebay because lots of drone users run them and new they run at about £225 so cheaper than the 10J.

Mine are all built to be runners, although the Bruiser in that build and the Mountain rider will be mostly kept on the shelf. I'm building another rere Bruiser for active duty, on that I am using digital Futaba S3050 servos £35 a pop, ironically these are lighter duty than the ones in the shelfer but being digital they have greater holding power. I tried a regular Futaba S3001 servo in my Bruiser build for the shifting, but I think the torque required to cleanly shift is underestimated and I ended up having to put a beefier servo in 6.5kg+. I also needed to increase the pre tension on my servo saver tension rings.

I would make sure you're using the correct Servo saver to match the manual and as Percymon says, check the spacing and all dimensions pertaining to the shift. On the radio (especially if you get a high end one like the above Futaba's, you can really fine tune the throw and set it up exactly and on the 3 position switch which will give much more reliable shifting and reduce damage and chances of mis shifting.

With regards to the motor/tranny sound, the video in my thread should give you a good idea, from memory and the limited exposure I've had with my vintage hilux, I believe it sounds much the same as the Rere (Re Release). As Percymon says, the rere Bruiser has a totally different design transmission, albeit it is still pretty faithful to the original concept.

Hope that helps,

Cheers

Nito

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, oneafrikan said:

[...] So I have some questions which I hope the folks here can help with:

1) slop on the front axle?

First of all, as Percymon said, you probably have the original Bruiser, and when checking Nitomor's entries here in the forums you're taking notes on a truck that while is also called "Bruiser" is a 100% different RC vehicle.

The problem you're addressing has to do with use and age. The casts do wear with use. These things might seem durable, but you'll see they're pretty fragile. Anyway, here is a mod you might want to try with you front axle. All you need to do is work a bit some parts and use a pair of bearings of 7x4x2,5mm:

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4 hours ago, oneafrikan said:

2) what should it sound like?

These trucks doesn't sound like your usual electric RC car. Just not sure how to put this into written words. You might want to watch (and listen) to some action videos on YouTube. Be sure to identify the truck correctly -sadly, Tamiya gave the new truck the same name, so it's not that easy if your eye is not previously trained. There must be some videos on the main TC page that you can check.

4) what servos to use?

Tamiya cars, or at least the classic ones (1974-1990), do NOT require any type of funky or high-torque servos. The cheapest stuff will do, doesn't matter if it's a heavy truck like the Bruiser or the Clod Buster. I use both with the cheapest Futaba servos you can find, and they work as they should.

5) what transmitter to use?

There is no exact answer for this. If you have a Hobby store near you, go grab the 3 or 4 channel radios they have for sale. You need to FEEL the transmitter, and find what suits you better.

Good luck with the Bruiser. It must be one of the most beautiful classic scale pick-up trucks to ever exist, although not a very nice runner. Enjoy it and be sure to share some pictures of the truck here in the forums. ;)

Some ideas   :)          . Resultado de imagen para arrow up

 

 

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Shameless I know - but there might be some useful info in there (:

[Edit:] Reminder to self - get the body finished :P

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hey guys, thanks for all of this!

my little one has been ill, so free time has been at a premium! ;-(

 

 

I'm going to go through this then come back with some more questions.

 

In the meantime:  One of the Grasshoppers I bought to tinker with came with an old and pretty shabby Futaba FP-T6NL transmitter.  I thought that since it had 6 channels, and has the switches on the top of the transmitter, it would kinda do the same thing as the FF7 Nitomor is using... but when hooking everything up the switches only seem to have 2 "states" (do you call it that?) - on and off.  There is a knob, which has a "neutral" and I guess that could be used - but feels like the switch being used should have 3 "states" - on, neutral, off; or something like: left, middle (neutral), right; which would then give you your 3 gears for the Bruiser 4wd...  does that sound right?

 

If so, am I right in saying that the transmitters you guys have suggested do this, or have the 3 states on the switch?  
There are a few of them on eBay atm, so might try to snag one asap so I can do some more testing on the wknd...

 

Tom Hanks for now!

gareth


 

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