Hibernaculum

And just to follow up, this was front page of the Washington Post this week. Facebook is trying to "pivot" to privacy... https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/mark-zuckerberg-claims-that-at-facebook-the-future-is-private-dont-believe-him/2019/05/03/b42f7564-6cf4-11e9-a66d-a82d3f3d96d5_story.html Quote from article... Seems legit.

The differential was never sold as a spare part for the Taiyo Jet Fighter. Some spare parts were sold for it, but not the differential. I would recommend buying a second Taiyo Jet Fighter in order to get another differential. It will cost no more than if the differential were available new in packet anyway. The best approach is to find one which is "non-working" or missing the transmitter, but still has a gearbox that turns OK without any issues. This will ensure the price remains low. The value of a used, non-working example of this car will be around US$30-$60 as a rough estimate. This car is quite collectible though, so the value of a brand new in box example is more around US$200-US$250. Brand new in box examples are quite rare. I do not personally recommend hacking cars like these with upgrades. They are pretty collectible cars. And there is no specific need to hack (unless just for kicks) because there are enough cars out there that can be used for spare parts, to service the cars that are getting restored. If you need more help, feel free to contact me at my website also. cheers, H.

It's funny how evocative that picture can be, even from my lame old photo scanner Every time I look at it, it's really reminds me of what effort the company went to with box art. Is he painting the entire thing, free handed? Also, I would like to know which old Japanese magazine or book this is... The page appears to say "Mini Monsters". With also some Japanese writing. Apparently this was a resource for the Porsche picture. Or they were just posing. I can check the Tamiya book if you like, and see if I can analyze more detail... cheers, H.

That's awesome Apologies, as a setting change had temporarily disabled the video at the link in my first post. It's enabled again if anyone wants to watch it.

Funny how we’re now nostalgic for the early days of the internet. Is it really that long ago?... It’s been 20 years of eBay for me, this year. Crikey. I did visit “Robysoldtamiya”, but my personal fave early Tamiya websites were: - Hiro’s RC Collector’s Page. I used to visit this almost daily around 1999-2001, to try to buy stuff (you had to email him and hope you were first! Then go the post office and mail him a Western Union Money Order). 2 years later, your stuff arrived. http://web.archive.org/web/20000226175856/http://www.kt.rim.or.jp/~hirofact/HOME.html Pics are gone on this next link, but I bet I bought that Grasshopper. And how about a NIB Monster Racer for US$247? Shows you what prices were like when online trade sprang to life. Before all the old stock was snapped up and they began to soar... http://web.archive.org/web/20000604045551/http://www.kt.rim.or.jp/~hirofact/NIB.html - Tamiya R/C Collector’s Site, Alex Jung. Who was once a member here also, and also published a little magazine about vintage Tamiya... before giving it all away and disappearing. http://web.archive.org/web/20010604065948/http://www.toyexchange.addr.com/tamiya.html - And of course, Darryn’s site full of NIB kits that always amazed me for how **** quickly he had accumulated this stash. http://web.archive.org/web/20010811133431/http://www.darrynsretrorc.20m.com/index.html H.

I just don’t seem to have time sadly ☺️ “Well if he spent less time posting novellas on Tamiyaclub, maybe he would!” Yeah, yeah I know 🙃 Black 934... I have never attempted to collect this. A mix of being mainly an off-roader guy, and the stratospheric cost. It really depends on you @SuperChamp82 and how much you love it. I tend to think collecting needs to be about personal choice and what you’re specifically most passionate about. So I tend not to collect to “fill gaps”. But everyone has their own approach, and the gap-filler collectors out there have my utmost respect... I will gladly pay to visit their museums if I can

Tamiya’s museum is not a good example to follow, as quite a few of the cars on display in the cabinets there are not setup or painted as per manual. I notice because I too am a big fan of following the book, to get the right look. I will also mention that box art is a “fantasy illustration”, not reality. So while it is a factor in determining “official”, its not the only one - and I personally hate the idea of slavishly following box art to the point of (for example) using third-party parts to achieve the SRB metal bumper. The later bumper is box art on the Rough Rider too anyway. And following the metal bumper logic could also mean doing all kinds of silly stuff to the kits (using non-kit parts) just to match the illustrations... That ain’t for me... So my approach is I use the primary catalogue photo as another true “official” example. I spent far more time looking at the old catalogues than I did at the box art, as a kid. The catalogue photos represented for me (in most cases), the perfect per-manual build that I used to daydream about. That’s not to say they were always perfect either. In some, there are early prototype photos of cars with totally different colours... So to come up with a reasonable compromise between box, catalogue and manual, here is my personal rule for deciding... “Build and paint based on (1) the manual. But also use the earliest (2) catalogue photo in which the car has the same colour and decals as (3) the box art image.” The Lambo is an interesting one because manual and box art totally disagree. What colour is it shown in the catalogues? Can that third point of reference be used to “break the tie” in this case?

As has been mentioned, the act of restoration itself is not inconsiderable, as helping to reduce waste. It probably does a great service in waste prevention each year. And some years ago, I remember reading on this forum, stories from people who had found Tamiya cars at rubbish tips. While the packing from kits is obviously the most common form of waste, people who dispose of the entire car itself must be worse in terms of sheer volume and weight of plastics. Below is one thread example, but I am sure there was a bigger one all about kerbside finds and dump finds ... which blew my tiny brain at the time. https://www.tamiyaclub.com/forum/index.php?/topic/7967-rubbish-tip-find/

Apologies again for the length of my previous double-posting. I’ll also just add - it’s really great to hear from others who are patiently seeking out the right vintage parts, to restore. Or patiently waiting for the right vintage kit. As that’s what I have been doing for a long time. Like you Maverick, I kept a lot that I had in childhood. Like you Andy, I have a lot of projects on the go, yet still think about starting more And when I miss out on something, it’s crazy to be upset... I am deeply fortunate to have what I already have. Collecting or restoring always has ups and downs too. If in one year you pay over the odds for something on eBay because you have no choice, remember that when you’re in the game all the time for years and years... the bargains do come along also. I’m guessing you guys have (in the past) had the odd glorious bargain come your way? I think it’s fairly rare for longtime collectors not to experience that to some degree. Whether its a good auction price, a random find, or something given to us by an acquaintance... sometimes we add things to our collection in a highly economical manner. Which may offset some of the harder expenses found via eBay. Late last year I paid a high price for an Audi Quattro. Last week I found two other cars for an incredible bargain, about half the eBay value. It’s a journey full of storms and plain sailing. ☺️ I totally get the eBay frustration - totally. And have ranted about it myself. But I remind myself of the bargains I’ve had too. And as mentioned - the harder something is to get, the more satisfying it is to eventually get it.

It's a valid question. But the answer is: hot or dry years were possible back then too. They just weren't as frequent. An outlier heat record may have been set 100, or even 200 years ago. But if 20 of the last 22 years have been the hottest on record, then something is different this time. One of the best illustrations of climate change temperature data, was the animation by Dr Ed Hawkins from Reading University, who created this 2 years ago. https://www.bbc.com/news/av/science-environment-38671660/how-global-temperature-has-changed And here is a similar one, also using global mean land-ocean temperature data. https://www.vox.com/2017/11/7/16612498/climate-change-carbon-dioxide-co2-temperature-animation

Sorry, the above post submitted before I was finished editing it. Below is an even longer version!.... *ducks while fruit is hurled at him* Speaking purely in relation to the vintage R/C kits (not plastic kits and not modern kits)... Well, speculators are nothing new. They were around in 1999 with high starting prices (eBay didn’t even have a “buy it now” function back in those days). And they are still around in 2019. This subject was recently discussed quite a bit also in the other thread in the Vintage forum. That said, yes - when something you are looking for and really want badly, appears to be inflated on eBay, it can be disheartening. So I totally get the sentiment Maverick. It's a hard slog, collecting. I have felt the pain many times. And scrimped and saved and paid things off slowly...on many occasions Remember also that auction ending prices and buy-it-now prices are two different things. The latter always adds a premium for the convenience of buying immediately. Also, on TC, sellers here have a much smaller audience, so they have to be less optimistic with prices. Whereas eBay sells to mainstream buyers, not just niche toy club members. And mainstream buyers may include one-off buyers, to whom price is no obstacle. I have seen it before, and I have sold to them before. Checking eBay right now... So I just searched worldwide for “tamiya vintage”. Sort price high to low. And the NIB vintage R/C kits I can see that I would describe as highpriced outliers with no past precedent (historically, in 20 years of my memory) at the price being asked, include these: Hilux Monster Racer AU$2856 Fast Attack Vehicle AU$1629 There are two Sand Rovers on the cusp of alleged reality at around AU$1800. Last one I bought cost me AU$1200. But that was some years ago and before the Aus dollar weakened further. 🤔 Of course, fifteen years ago the Rover would sell for AU$500. But times change. Cheetah for AU$4000... this is optimistic also. A very early, significant and detailed kit though. But I think that price is too far outside the maximums I have ever seen in the past. The rest though... most aren't a shock to me at this point in time. A few hundred dollars above, may bite the wallet... but kits do fluctuate a lot, there is no "expected price". There is only past precedent. And sometimes kits do sell above expectation. Many of the results I'm seeing right now, are what I would expect for these kits. And while a dip in price is an acknowledged consequence of what happens when a remake kit gets released, to me (as merely one collector) the existence of a remake doesn’t make me expect vintage kits to become cheaper. If they are cheaper, then great! But what I am saying is... since I have literally no interest in buying remakes, they don't cloud my thinking (or spending 😕) on vintage kits. Because they are two completely separate models to me. To put it another way: the scarcity and value of a particular vintage kit - to me as a collector - does not change whether a remake exists or not. At the other end of the scale, there are also some vintage kits currently listed that are, frankly, bargains too. Given their age, scarcity and significance. Taking inflation into account, some kits are routinely offered for sale at the same price or lower than their value was in 1984 (relative to consumer buying power). Anyone new to collecting vintage R/C kits, should quickly cotton onto that, and start by buying those It's nice to hear someone say they're a collector too. One thing I really don't like is when people dance around the word "collector" as if it's a dirty word. Nearly everybody on Tamiyaclub is a collector. There is no shame in it. Most people just collect and accumulate an array of runners. Some collect new releases. Some collect monster trucks. Some collect vintage - including kits. And vintage kits are at the top of the collecting pile, simply because they are both the rarest and most sought after type of object in this category. If you've got say, more than 5 R/C cars, and you're looking to buy more.... you're already a collector to some degree. If you've got more than that already, you're definitely a collector. Nobody in this world "needs" numerous R/C cars Having that many, makes it a collection, and makes you by definition a collector of that small collection. Collector (noun): "a person who collects things of a specified type, professionally or as a hobby." Cheers, H.

This is a great topic, and thanks for taking such time to think and post about. And for giving it so much detail. Personally, I am deeply concerned about the environment - particularly climate change, and waste. One only has to listen to David Attenborough's warnings now - the man whose wonderfully narrated documentaries we all grew up watching, is nearing the end of his life. Yet he is gravely concerned for our future on this planet, unless we act immediately to reverse humanity's impact on the environment. When it comes to R/C... I've always had such respect for Tamiya, and their models, that from an early age I never wanted to view anything in Tamiya kits as "waste" or "rubbish". Getting a single car or part, was extremely rare for me. So I never threw away the box, inner boxes, bags, body set boxes, or even the leftover parts sprues. I even kept some cut-off bits of lexan for later test-color sprays. The same applies to all the great Japanese brands of the 1980s. As they all took a great deal of care with their design, presentation and branding. And it made the product feel worthwhile and special. What you wrote there @MadInventor is exactly correct - the older kits and spares had a sense of detail and love poured into them, that Tamiya even decorated the kit dividers with images of other cars. And the parts bags had header cards with images of the cars on them. And so on. For these reasons, I simply kept them all. So, having a certain respect and nostalgia for Tamiya and just keeping all the leftover bits in the kit box, is actually one way to avoid contributing immediately and continuously to waste piles. Maybe it was the fact I grew up not having much access to expensive toys, that made me not become one of the people who think "I will just chuck all that out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" five minutes after building a kit. There are undoubtedly people out there in the world who are standing in their backyards, stomping empty Tamiya kit boxes into the garbage bin around midday on Christmas Day each year. Sometimes I wish I knew where they lived, because that behaviour seems like nothing a Taser wouldn't fix? And when it comes to old, used parts - I have parts drawers here that still contain the very first plastic bearings I wore out, back when I was a kid and didn't know when I was going come across another $10 for a new set. Yes, I kept it all. And yes, ok, that is extreme Tamiya behaviour. But tiny things like those really don't take up any space. Some of those old parts, even the worn ones, later get recycled for other things. And as you say, much of the larger packing material becomes collectible after a few years. Today, some empty kit boxes will get several hundred dollars alone - meaning the "I've run out of space, this is going in the bin!" mentality is also stupid from a financial standpoint. Just sell your kit boxes if you need to. Then store or recycle the smaller bits. I am pretty sure the modern Tamiya sprues even have recycle codes printed on them, don't they? Correct me if I am wrong. .:. I cannot remember the last time I threw something in the bin which had "Tamiya" printed on it. It's possible it has never actually happened. The real danger of waste from the R/C industry ...as with every industry, comes from China in my opinion. Shoddy Chinese R/C counterfeit companies (which some people even on this forum have actively supported ) and generally speaking - RTR R/C landfill manufacturers who are producing millions of generic, nameless, rubbish R/C cars per year that nobody has respect for... I bet thousands of those entire cars are chucked in the bin every day around the world, to end up in landfill. Furthermore, the trend of modern tech products using custom lithium batteries, rather than replaceable batteries, is stupid and horrific, and designed to force consumers to waste and re-purchase. And all of that stuff is manufactured in China too. As I wrote in another thread recently, products like Apple AirPods cannot be disassembled and fixed even by professionals. Their batteries die after 2 years. You chuck them out and buy another pair for another $200, or whatever. A disgrace. cheers, H.

Speculators are nothing new. They were around in 1999 with high starting prices (eBay didn’t even have “buy it now” back in those days), and they are around in 2019. This subject was recently discussed quite a bit also in the other thread in the Vintage forum ... (which I guess is where this thread could belong also to get all the right viewers)... That said, yes - when something you are looking for and really want badly, appears to be inflated on eBay, it can be disheartening. So I totally get the sentiment Maverick. I have felt the pain many times. ☺️ Remember also that auction ending prices and buy-it-now prices are two different things. The latter always adds a premium. And sellers on TC have a much smaller audience, so have to be less optimistic with prices. Whereas eBay sells to mainstream buyers, not just niche toy club members. Checking eBay right now... So I just searched worldwide for “tamiya vintage”. Sort price high to low. And the NIB vintage R/C kits I can see that I would describe as overpriced outliers with no past precedent (historically - in 20 years of my memory) at the price range being asked, are: - Hilux Monster Racer AU$2856 - Fast Attack Vehicle AU$1629 - There are two Sand Rovers on the cusp of alleged reality at around AU$1800. Last one I bought cost me AU$1200. But that was some years ago and before the Aus dollar weakened further. 🤔 Of course, fifteen years ago the Rover would sell for AU$500. But times change. The rest though, isn’t a shock to me at this point in time. A few hundred above, may bite the wallet... but kits do fluctuate a lot and sometimes they do sell above expectation. Many of the results are bang on what I would expect, for vintage. To me, while a dip in price is an acknowledged consequence of what happens when a remake kit gets released, at the same time... the existence of a remake doesn’t make me personally think anything should be that much cheaper. If it is cheaper, great! But what I am saying is... since I have no interest in collecting the remakes themselves, if I really want to buy some vintage kit then... the remake wouldn’t really cloud my thinking (or spending 😕) as they are two completely separate models to me. And vintage scarcity is not affected at all to me, no matter how many thousand remake examples are listed. At the other end of the scale, there are some vintage kits currently listed that are, frankly, bargains too. Given their age, scarcity and significance. 🤔..... Cheers, H.

Enjoyed your post @S-PCS So I will just sum up the facts as I know them to be: Early Wild Willys had a short wheelbase (SWB) Later ones had a longer wheelbase (LWB) The manual was updated to reflect this major revision in the kit. As far as some collectors are concerned, examples may have existed (kits) that contained parts from both. However this remains open for debate and is based on anecdotal evidence, mainly from @simensays who may not be here anymore. So for what it's worth, I had some time to check the two NIB Wild Willy kits I have. Both contained the exact parts detailed here as being SWB. So I cannot substantiate the hybrid kit theory myself. But hey, at least I raised the alert, and did the research. Are there any other NIB Wild Willy kit owners here? @RETRO R/C wanna nerd out, and check your kit(s) too? On the subject of SRBs though... Remember I mentioned that I had a kit with a blister containing both a supposed Mk1 and Mk2 part? I took some photos... This is from a vintage Sand Scorcher kit. The tops of these axles are supposed to have: Screw holes "supporting buttress" ...on what was allegedly "mk1" spec. Yet this kit has just one axle with the buttress. That's why the "mk" system can't be relied upon for SRBs, and its easier to speak in terms of "Early" and "Late". There can be no more definitive proof, than an unopened blister like that. And really, broader more relaxed terms... are relaxing. Much like @S-PCS enjoying those Michigans. I love a good nerd out over the shape of body pins (that waggly bit business on the Wild Willy kits is also true!). But I also need to relax, because all these kits smell of the same glorious 1982 cardboard, plastic and rubber. No matter which variant they are, early or late... it's all vintage man. *breathes it in* And so. Keep an open, relaxed mind about these variations, just in case they're not definitive. But for all I know, you can also keep using the SWB/LWB system for WWs H.

Recently, the website iFixit attempted to do a teardown on a pair of Apple AirPods. The verdict? Impossible. As in, actually impossible to pull apart without destroying the product itself. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/03/ifixit-teardown-apples-airpods-are-disappointingly-disposable/ Modern technology is heading in a direction where things are not just hard to fix. They cannot be fixed. Not even by professionals. Compared to this, the old days of R/C feel like a wonderland of antiquated toys, ripe for disassembly and repair. And that includes the "toy grade", or more broadly and accurately "ready to run" R/C cars. Sure, they often had stamped axle, and big circuit boards. And I'll admit there are plenty of RTR circuit board issues I still can't fix to this day. But then again... I can't fix the circuits in a "hobby grade" receiver either. Nor can I pull apart or fix a lot of the stamped rotating bezel systems in hobby grade transmitters. On the other hand, I have pulled apart scores of "toy grade" cars and transmitters with simple sliding contact point systems, and found them very easy to fix. Even to the point of tracing and isolating the copper circuit lines on the circuit board to determine what controls what, or tuning the frequency dials in the car or transmitter to adjust the car's reception to perfection. Sometimes more basic technology isn't less repairable - it's more repairable. A vintage Hotshot with enclosed chassis, and myriad wires to tuck inside during every reassembly...? This fills me with no less apprehension than taking the lid off a Taiyo buggy produced in the same era (circa 1985-1986). Neither one is quicker to inspect or repair, than the other. The Hotshot is just bigger and faster. And then there's another aspect. If you love "mechanical things that work", why wouldn't you love the internals of a vintage Nikko? Some of their designs were very intricate and complex. The need to produce their functionality in a factory-assembled form, did not automatically mean they were "not intended to be pulled apart and repaired". In many cases there was not a single component to be found that couldn't be disassembled. Nothing was glued. Transmission covers were screwed together. And all manner of levers, sliders, gears and shafts - and even sometimes mechanical speed controllers - could be found too. And in fact, I have found "toy grade" MSCs that were more repairable than the Tamiya ones, which were often not designed to be disassembled at all. While hobby grade enthusiasts (not you guys! - I am talking about many other people I have seen online over the years) often thumb their noses at the idea of working on or repairing a "toy grade R/C car", sometimes I think to myself: "Actually, what's so great about being able to disassemble and repair a model with a fully illustrated instruction manual to help you?" Working on things that may be considered "lesser" in performance, yet have no instructions, can be a greater challenge. Most of the appliances and objects we have in our world and our lives do not have fully illustrated repair manuals to go with them - so if anything, hobby grade kit models are in the minority. They may be among the friendliest things to repair in the world. They are in fact the user-friendly outliers - the Nikkos are more aligned with the more challenging majority of devices and appliances, most of which can be repaired with some initiative. There is some satisfaction to be gained from "making the discovery yourself" too, as Carl Sagan would say. One day I pulled apart a clock we had on the wall, which had stopped. I found that incredibly challenging. Pulling anything apart without a manual, and finding that it's inner workings are a feat of forgotten miniature engineering - perhaps engineering for which no designer at the Nikko factory ever got credit... that's quite a lot of fun. And I guarantee that a Nikko Toyota HiLux is far more complicated internally than a Tamiya Frog, for instance. Try pulling one of those apart completely and rebuilding it with no manual. I've done that It was a challenge. But it was no less satisfying than any Tamiya I have worked on. Much like my website - my workshop is 50% vintage hobby, 50% vintage RTR. The nostalgia I always had for both has always been equal...as you are all aware cheers, H.

The research continues... 🤓 But yeah - at this stage, those two - Taiyo Big Roader and Nikko Ford Ranger, do appear to pre-date all R/C monster trucks. As in, I have researched for years, the R/C range of every RTR manufacturer that existed at that time. And if we look at 1982... there were just no monster trucks to be found at all. First R/C Monster Trucks: Taiyo Big Roader (1983) and Nikko Ford Ranger (1983) And yes, first R/C kit based Monster Truck: Marui Big Bear (1984) It’s worth noting that those RTR R/C companies and their products changed just as rapidly as kit based R/C brands. Like... The development in those days was frenetic! For fun, here's a statistic from Nikko: 1980 Nikko had just 1 off road R/C vehicle in their range. 1981 they had 6. 1982 they had 10. Off road was very new and grew so rapidly. But there were literally no R/C monster trucks in the world before 1983, in any of the archaeological data I have uncovered so far. The closest thing anyone had to a monster truck the previous year, in 1982, was Nikko's Toyota HiLux 4WD - but this was a scale replica. It didn't have grossly outsized wheels/tyres. The wheels were a bit bigger relative to the car, than that of the Tamiya HiLux (which inspired it), but were nowhere near "monster" size as you can see here: This car was later (1985) reworked to have larger wheels of course... due to the monster craze which was in full swing by then... We should also remember that back in those days, there were not a bazillion nameless companies making R/C cars. It wasn't like today, where Chinese companies are manufacturing approximately 100,000 tons of R/C car landfill per day. Much of which goes directly from the factory, into landfill. Some Chinese cities are built on a foundation of R/C cars. And many of the Earth's mammals, birds and fish absorb the plastics. Before we in turn, eat the animals. Thereby, eating those R/C cars. [It is estimated that the average American consumes 1-2 whole Chinese R/C cars per year in their food] - I am joking. But on the other hand, look at these cows No... Back in those days of the early 1980s, there were so few manufacturers. And all of them had actual brands, and even product catalogues. Yes, Taiyo, Nikko, Atcomi, Matsushiro, Shinsei and all the others - had their own glossy product catalogues, and all of them trumpeted their quality. Because they were proud of the toys they were producing. And they didn't want to put them straight into landfill, or into our mouths. H.

Actually, technically, Marui weren’t the first at all. Prepare to be surprised The first radio controlled monster truck was not the Marui Big Bear (1984)... It was either the Taiyo Big Roader (1983) 1/14 or the Nikko Ford Ranger (1983) 1/18 Both made in Japan. The former is practically a scale replica of the famous Bigfoot real monster truck. And these models were out in force at the toy fairs in Japan a whole year earlier, where undoubtedly, the other brands were also present. Because back in those days, toys and hobbies were all one big fair. And the ready-to-run R/C models had all kinds of demos and events to support them, just like the bigger kits had. Taiyo Big Roader... Nikko Ford Ranger... I even went so far as to confirm the years of manufacture of both of these. The Big Roader was elusive, and I had to delve into Taiyo history to confirm it... but confirm I did. So if the Marui Big Bear was out in 1984.... then technically Marui may have got the idea from one of these little guys.

For a Samurai, NIB is around US$1000 I think... but it's always hard to be sure, when none have appeared on ebay for a while. And ebay still generally determines the price. Speaking of which, back to the RC10. The below example represents a high watermark on the value of a new built original RC10 - US$1094 (AU$1551). NIB will therefore be above this. https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Team-Associated-RC10-Gold-Pan-Original-Vintage-New-Built-Perfect-Condition/372620440723

Yes agreed, the manual did change. There are only two different sets of manual steps regarding wheelbase parts. But there seem to have been kits that contained some of the changes, yet not all. The comments from Simensays have long suggested that this is the case. And it would not be the first time I guess, that a Tamiya manual did not align perfectly with what was in the kit. So yeah, we are left with uncertainty. And "Early" vs "Late" is the easiest catch-all. With the disclaimer than SWB is a major characteristic of "early".

I think it might be easier to just buy the "earliest" Wild Willy you can find. Rather than try to convert to a specific configuration, from the LWB to SWB. But also. Should we put the SWB vs LWB moniker, to bed? I ask genuinely. It's really up to us, the collectors and restorers, how we define things. And too much specificity around designations, might be a lost cause. As with practically all variants in Tamiya kits including the SRB series, the whole thing about fixed delineations between one variant and the next seems to be a red herring. There is often no specific cut-off moment for all the changes we claim to know. I have vintage kit proof the SRBs cannot be split into the previously believed "mk1" vs "mk2". So what about Wild Willy. Was there a perfect cut-off moment in these two widely claimed Willy kit variants, whereupon nothing else was ever changed at any stage? What about the body clip with the waggly bit, was that purely done at the cutover moment from SWB to LWB? I very much doubt it. Of course that page is an exceptionally great analysis by Jonny Retro, with some pic credits to @waterbok Brilliant work. It shows the differences. Only question I am asking is: should we continue to define them as SWB vs LWB? Or just call them, more loosely, "Early" and "Late"? In the past, and over the years, I have seen some members say their willies were both short and long... I'll start again. Some TC members have said their Wild Willys contained both SWB characteristics and LWB characteristics, yet they were allegedly built from kits. Proof over a 9 year period, from Simensays... @simensays Is a significant fan, with more willy experience... I'll start again. @simensays has seen the most willies... <tomato hits him> You get the idea. The greatest enthusiasts for this model have encountered blended kits. Making "SWB" vs "LWB" a misleading description. At least when it comes to all the parts we claim were part of each variant. And yes, the kit definitely did undergo an extension in length at which moment, a bunch of parts all needed to change at once. It's just that some of the parts we also thought were part of that change... maybe were not. Meaning there were other changes to the kit... Meaning the history of the kit is not split into purely 2 types based on chassis length... And this may hopefully make @njmlondon 's mission a little easier actually... just seek out the "earliest" one he can find, based on the parts. And that's the best anyone can do FWIW, I still own two NIB Wild Willy kits that appear to be early vintage. If you want me to analyze the parts, I can. cheers, H.

AFAIK, that later Big Bear kit was identical apart from 4 or 5 changes - most notably, the upgraded motor. The kit box was the same except for the motor spec, and as far as I know, the Marui model number was also the same. And given the Big Bear was still in production in the late 1980s, I would tend to think of this as a "variant" of the kit. So we might call it the "late vintage". (You could call it "Mk2", but I am staying away from that term forever as it leads to too much confusion when applied to all cars). So this Big Bear late vintage variant was the same as how Tamiya revised their kits with numerous variants - except Tamiya did it without telling anyone, leaving collectors an easter egg hunt 30 years later. Whereas Marui told everyone and advertised it. Clearly they did it to refresh the car, against competing products. The Phoenix/Marui thing... I'm guessing that was just co-branding from an American distributor. Much in the vein of Tamiya and MRC. "Phoenix" doesn't appear printed on any of the Marui kit boxes, to my knowledge. Some other brands did this also, but took it further - such as US manufacturer/distributor Cox sharing co-branding on all the Kyosho kits sold in the US, in the early 80s. I guess this is proof Marui was still a retail brand for R/C cars as late as 1991.

Yep, that is the strange, true history of Marui - guns. Fake guns. Though in the post R/C era (1990s onwards) they did still make one or two other odd R/C items I think? They just weren’t cars. Might have been some basic R/C tanks and an R/C Mothra monster, from memory? Also, AFAIK they released one (just one) late 1980s, very “Tamiya style” full colour product catalogue, which I have. Never found any others though.

Honestly, it's a myth I think mate. I have no idea how the "Marui has weak plastic" started either, but it has no basis in fact as far as I have seen. Sure, there are stories of people who broke their Marui cars. There are also people who will claim the Hornet is weak.

Also re: Marui... Yes, they are still a bit cheaper. But they have caught up to Tamiya somewhat, over the years. I remember back in the late 1990s on eBay, Marui NIB R/C kits were going for an absolute song - AU$200 for a Hunter? Now they're around 3 times those early internet values. In those early days, the lesser known R/C brands often slipped under the radar. In the early 2000s, a NIB Sand Scorcher was already getting around US$1000... but that price quickly climbed over the years that followed. However, many other brands stayed low for longer, partly because many buyers were not as familiar with them. I know I picked up one particular kit for just $60 NIB which nowadays goes for $500-$1000. Things have changed though. And it's actually great to see (even with this thread) those other brands getting the attention they deserve. Kyosho... Big fan of Kyosho also of course, and while the box art was always a photo... there is something just as iconic about those early product photo style boxes too. I mean, we all loved the Tamiya catalogue images, right? Kyosho's boxes were like catalogue images, and I grew to appreciate them. Even if the kits made it difficult to reproduce those images exactly, especially when it came to the decals. Box internals of Kyosho kits were also pretty cool... but a little different to Tamiya and Marui. Some Kyosho NIB kits are incredibly rare now - rarer than NIB examples of either Tamiya or Marui kits. When was the last time anyone saw a truly NIB Kyosho Beetle (original)? Not the Graupner/Kyosho one, just the plain Kyosho branded one.

It's really interesting to hear your approach to this Mark. It actually makes me think you're on the road to appreciating (more) the NIB working model kit, as much as you do the NIB plastic model kit Essentially because the 1970s/1980s era of Japanese kits was full of crossover between the two. Kyosho and Yokomo and a few others may have been more singularly R/C focused (or at least, did not have plastic model lines), but the rest of the Japanese companies essentially saw an R/C kit as a "premium" level plastic model kit. The plastic model world and R/C world, were pretty much... one world. We saw that a lot obviously from Tamiya in the beginning of their R/C product line - i.e. Porsche 934 & 935 literally being upgraded 1/12 plastic model kits. But the same was true for many other brands. Notably Fujimi, Otaki, Marui, Nichimo, Eidai Grip and others. In some cases, motorized plastic models were made which looked to me like they were "potential" R/C cars... but their scale was never quite increased large enough to make it to the R/C league. These sub-R/C kits included ones like the 1/16 off roaders from Marui which like little R/C models... without the R/C ability... Marui kits are outstanding. And while yes, you can see similarities between some Marui cars and Tamiya cars. And of course, Marui copied the box art style... that is actually where the similarities end. Marui cars were innovative in many ways. And when you often hear people compare say, the Marui Hunter with the Tamiya Frog - well actually, those two cars could not be more different to one another. They are completely unique from one another. Marui kit presentation was also outstanding. The Hunter kit is actually a lot nicer inside the box, than the Frog kit. And I do love both... but Marui made really beautiful kits. Honestly, I cannot say enough nice things about Marui. As for the collectibility, it is getting right up there now - the Shogun and the Samurai in particular, have been nudging and topping US$1000 for a while now. These kits will never undergo remakes either. That is absolutely INSANE. The find of the year, or maybe the last 5 years? Well done sir. That is $5000 worth of kits for I'm guessing, $500. Incredible find.