RCMart customs charge advise

[alvinlwh 5894]

3 hours ago, Zealot said:

Picking up on what you said in silvertriple's M06 thread regarding RCMart:

They certainly aren't what they used to be, which was the best, but now their competitors, ATees and RCJaz, have much better customer service and generally better prices. Annoyingly, RCMart often has better stock levels, however.

Unfortunately, with regard to the M06 hop-ups I still require, RCMart is my only option as they stock YR products which are good quality, not overly expensive and most importantly, available where certain genuine hop-ups are not.

I would prefer to buy elsewhere and I do whenever I can, but sometimes they just have you by the proverbials. 

They still flat refused to admit they made a mistake, even saying they stated USD34.14 VAT paid was stated on the CN22 form. Problem is, CN22 is for stating the value of the actual goods, not total including VAT and postage, brackets or not, and is that total, plus postage, I was taxed on. 

You are absolutely right, my  first and last order from them consist of mainly YR (and 3R) parts for the M-06 where nowhere else seems to carry. Usually, I source Tamiya own brand from PJ, but they are mostly out of stock for the M-06 now. 

Interesting that you brought up AT, I am eying some kits there and am wondering if they are good? 

Are you UK based? If you are, you best keep your total purchase (including VAT and postage) below 125 GBP or USD coz if they do the same thing on your CN22, you will end up in the same place as me. And we cannot bet on the numb nuts at customs not to just take take USD on the form as GBP (which my taxed amount seems to be). 

[Zealot 397]

@alvinlwh RCMart used to sell in your local currency but they did away with that several years ago, probably to make life easier for their own accounting.

Yes, I have purchased from ATees and RCJaz for almost 12 years and never had an issue with either.

ATees will send photos of your order contents before they ship so that's also good for a little extra peace of mind. They also allow you to add items to your order if you get in before they ship, which is another handy feature in case you forget something. I find their shipping fees to be the lowest of the three stores in question, but it may differ for other countries as I am in Australia.

I have found Australian customs to be quite lax when it comes to charging import duties and GST if the vendor did not do so. Previously, a purchase had to be over AUD1000 to attract either of those but the law was changed largely due to a certain businessman in retail electronics who wasn't happy that Australians could mail order things from overseas for less than half, in some cases, of what he was asking. But still, I seem to get away with it quite often.

[Kol__ 3377]

Interesting read, what was the outcome of this @alvinlwh?

[alvinlwh 5894]

20 minutes ago, Kol__ said:

Interesting read, what was the outcome of this @alvinlwh?

I just got an email from them offering to refund me the charges I paid in store credit. While not ideal, is appealing as they do have some really good offers on. They asked for documentation that I had been charged the amount I claim, which I did sent off to them, but of course, they are closed for the new year holidays. 

If I do get the money back in credit, I will provide an update. 

[alvinlwh 5894]

Update: the excess charges had been paid back as store credits, not ideal as I have to now spend more to use them and RCMart postage is really sky high. Now if I am really cheeky, I can do another claim with HMRC. 

[Kol__ 3377]

6 minutes ago, alvinlwh said:

Now if I am really cheeky, I can do another claim with HMRC. 

Exactly what I was thinking the other day when you mentioned what was likely to happen. You just have to decide who you'd be conning, RC Mart or HMRC? 

[alvinlwh 5894]

Just now, Kol__ said:

Exactly what I was thinking the other day when you mentioned what was likely to happen. You just have to decide who you'd be conning, RC Mart or HMRC? 

Will be RCMart as tax prepaid to them will have to be paid to HMRC anyway, unless they cook their books. 

[Kol__ 3377]

11 minutes ago, alvinlwh said:

 

 Double post

[simalarion 2196]

@alvinlwh - parts & bits (RcMart do have a lot off that) have a ok shipping price while a kit has +- 100$ to Norway and thats a no go, i asume it will be the same for you. You can also sort out free shipping product but the price on these products are usually higher than “normal”. 

[alvinlwh 5894]

14 minutes ago, simalarion said:

@alvinlwh - parts & bits (RcMart do have a lot off that) have a ok shipping price while a kit has +- 100$ to Norway and thats a no go, i asume it will be the same for you. You can also sort out free shipping product but the price on these products are usually higher than “normal”. 

Well, problem is I need a kit first to buy parts for. Of course, alternative is to buy a kit from Asiatees or 3Racing (both reasonable charges) or even UK and then buying parts from RCMart. But that will be quite an outlay. Also, I am considering some non-Tamiya kits, which don't really need any/much upgrades OOB. 

You are right, I was looking at some "cheap" <USD150 kits but postage at USD80? Are they mad? 

[alvinlwh 5894]

1 hour ago, Kol__ said:

 Double post

Forum is doing that a bit recently. 

[GeeWings 2830]

I placed an order from RCMart a few days ago and then received this email today:

Due to the Airmail/EMS shipping service being suspended, we can only ship out the order via Fedex, put value as real amount, please advise that you agree with this arrangement or not.

Attention:
***Local taxes and customs duties usually apply and are added once your shipment reaches its destination. Please see your local authorities for more information. rcMart does not know when additional charges such as additional brokerage fees will apply. These additional charges are the responsibility of the buyer. You are responsible for following import regulations for your country.

If the parcel finally returns back to the seller, we will charge you for the return, reroute, duty and taxes and other surcharges incurred. Thank you for your attention.

 

I wrote back pointing out that I’ve already paid GST and they said they will mark that on the shipping notice!?! No idea what’s going to happen when it arrives and if I will be charged. 

[simalarion 2196]

As it is today you never know if you do not pay Vat at all, pay double up with Vat, or pay Vat as intended so its just a huge mess this (mainly Ebay and all Asian Webshops i have this problem)

Im quite OK with webshops adding Vat before sending becouse then you should be sure that you payd all and should have no more worries, but no ... 

Edit: Germany webshops remove Vat from their prices as most UK shops as well when shipping to Norway, that is also a method a prefer becouse then you either pay Vat is intended or not at all, both these are ok  

[GeeWings 2830]

I just have this nagging feeling they were trying it on. Like they had charged the GST but were then intending to keep it and hide it in the costs and leave me paying GST a second time. Am I being unfair? I might be missing something obvious.

[alvinlwh 5894]

7 hours ago, GeeWings said:

I wrote back pointing out that I’ve already paid GST and they said they will mark that on the shipping notice!?! No idea what’s going to happen when it arrives and if I will be charged. 

In such cases, they should not be using a CN22 simple form and just list one item but a complete and detailed shipping form listing everything like JP sellers does. 

[alvinlwh 5894]

3 hours ago, simalarion said:

As it is today you never know if you do not pay Vat at all, pay double up with Vat, or pay Vat as intended so its just a huge mess this (mainly Ebay and all Asian Webshops i have this problem)

 

Oh, I know, IF the customs forms are filled out correctly. UK rules are, pay seller if <£125, pay HMRC if >£125. If my form was filled out correctly, I will not need to pay HMRC again, but RCMart did not bother to fill it out correct (or by items), instead just putting the total I paid on, pushing it beyond the £125 limit. 

[alvinlwh 5894]

1 hour ago, GeeWings said:

I just have this nagging feeling they were trying it on. Like they had charged the GST but were then intending to keep it and hide it in the costs and leave me paying GST a second time. Am I being unfair? I might be missing something obvious.

They might be. I really cannot understand how this pay seller before entering UK system work. How can HMRC enforce some overseas seller collecting tax for them? And then, only some do that. RCMart does, along with eBay, Aliexpress... PJ, 1999, AT, 3R don't. Just those I know of. 

To know if they are trying it on or not, I suppose you can ask them for their VAT/GST number? 

[TurboRSR 356]

4 hours ago, alvinlwh said:

How can HMRC enforce some overseas seller collecting tax for them?

By international trade law. 

The reason that some webshops collect tax and some don't is because of their turnover to the specific country, they need to register if their turnover reaches a certain threshold. 

[alvinlwh 5894]

27 minutes ago, TurboRSR said:

By international trade law. 

The reason that some webshops collect tax and some don't is because of their turnover to the specific country, they need to register if their turnover reaches a certain threshold. 

Isn't VAT a UK law and this collect at point of purchase a new thing that came in on 1 January 2021?

Still, how does HMRC knows if a store (not a front like ebay/Amazon/Aliexpress) reaches the threshold or not? Will they inspect the tax returns and accounts of all overseas stores? 

In the case of HK, for example, there is no general sales tax (IIRC), so selling overseas does not need a tax removal, like say buying from Germany. So there is probably no need to record? Also, good luck to them checking such records in China, where records tends to be "flexible". 

Not a tax expert, not a lawyer, not looking for an argument, just wondering how all these really get enforced. The same question also came up a year ago on various drone/technology/vape forums and no one can say for sure. 

[alvinlwh 5894]

On 1/4/2022 at 3:21 AM, GeeWings said:

I placed an order from RCMart a few days ago and then received this email today:

Due to the Airmail/EMS shipping service being suspended, we can only ship out the order via Fedex, put value as real amount, please advise that you agree with this arrangement or not.

Attention:
***Local taxes and customs duties usually apply and are added once your shipment reaches its destination. Please see your local authorities for more information. rcMart does not know when additional charges such as additional brokerage fees will apply. These additional charges are the responsibility of the buyer. You are responsible for following import regulations for your country.

If the parcel finally returns back to the seller, we will charge you for the return, reroute, duty and taxes and other surcharges incurred. Thank you for your attention.

 

I wrote back pointing out that I’ve already paid GST and they said they will mark that on the shipping notice!?! No idea what’s going to happen when it arrives and if I will be charged. 

Any updates on what actually happened? 

[GeeWings 2830]

It arrived and I wasn’t asked to pay anything. 

[GeeWings 2830]

On 1/22/2022 at 11:06 PM, alvinlwh said:

Any updates on what actually happened? 

Just FYI I placed another order with RCMart on Friday morning. Later RCMart emailed to say:

• They have to send via Fedex (I had already paid for express shipping anyway)
• They would have to label correct value (nothing new there, they always do)
• That I might get charged Tax and Customs fees (I shouldn't)

I pointed out (as before) that I have already paid GST. They responded simply saying OK, we will ship. 

It seems to me they are trying to keep the 10% GST for themselves and hope the customer doesn't notice.

[Kol__ 3377]

That sounds proper dodgy @GeeWings mate. From what @alvinlwh was saying previously it sounds like RCMart are intentionally filling out the incorrect box on the shipping docs to avoid them being charged for customs charges (assume they get a monthly customs charges bill or something to pay the duty) after they've already charged the customer for them. Then the incoming country thinks the fees haven't been paid and then charge the customer again. Have I got that right? And if it's not that, then why aren't they simply filling out the docs correctly? They are clearly aware of this issue from what I've seen so far. It's sort of putting me off from ordering from them at the mo tbh.

[GeeWings 2830]

3 minutes ago, Kol__ said:

That sounds proper dodgy @GeeWings mate. From what @alvinlwh was saying previously it sounds like RCMart are intentionally filling out the incorrect box on the shipping docs to avoid them being charged for customs charges (assume they get a monthly customs charges bill or something to pay the duty) after they've already charged the customer for them. Then the incoming country thinks the fees haven't been paid and then charge the customer again. Have I got that right? And if it's not that, then why aren't they simply filling out the docs correctly? They are clearly aware of this issue from what I've seen so far. It's sort of putting me off from ordering from them at the mo tbh.

Yes, I’m not certain it’s intentional but it does feel that way.

Every time I order I just make sure I fill out the notes section stating that I want the true value and the tax paid clearly labelled on the documents. 

[alvinlwh 5894]

@Kol__ @GeeWings on my second purchase from them, even after alerting them to their mistake and getting a store credit, they still wrote the total (goods + tax + postage) on the form, which is incorrect as customs will take that number and add postage on top for their calculation. That second time, I was careful to ensure that no matter what, my total will be below the £135 threshold for UK and I was OK but I will not buy from RCMart again if I can help it, and will never buy kits or total of over £100 from them ever.