Brushed motor upgrade for Rising Fighter

[Bodi007 3]

Hi,

Can anyone suggest a good brushed motor upgrade for the Rising Fighter? It's got the Tamiya tble02-s ESC. I was thinking of cheaper alternatives to the Tamiya motors. I was looking at this (only a tenner) : -

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/product/absima-electric-motor-thrust-eco-21t-380786

or

https://www.scmodels.co.uk/shop/etronix-sport-tuned-modified-21t-brushed-motor/

Or should I stick to the Tamiya motors?

Thank you

[alvinlwh 5895]

They are both out of specs for the TBLE unfortunately. It is, on paper, rated for down to 25T motors, and the 23T ST from Tamiya ONLY. 

So to use them, you need to change your ESC, often recommended is the HW1060. 

If you choose not not upgrade the ESC, then the TT, ST, LT or GT from Tamiya will be suitable upgrades. The last two are effectively the posh version of the first two. 

[Bodi007 3]

Ah ok, I'm glad I asked the question! Thanks for your help. Much appreciated. I will stick with my ESC so will look at the Tamiya motors you suggested.

[Juggular 4964]

Alvin is right, those won't work for TBLE-02S.  

It's designed for 25t or greater.  21t would cause it to shut down.  

[1]  Tamiya Sport Tuned would work.  Even though it's 23t, it works with TBLE-02S (unless you run it on a very hot day on tall grasses).  

[2]  Or, you can get Hobbywing quicrun 1060 ESC.  That ESC can handle 21t. 

[3]  You could also get a 13.5t sensored brushless motor.  TBLE-02S can handle both brushed and brushless.   

I have extra motors like 12t, but for light chassis, I tend to stick with Sport Tuned.  It's more powerful than Lightly tuned and Torque tuned. It's a good motor for most Tamiya chassis.  

 

[Frog Jumper 3663]

3 minutes ago, Juggular said:

Alvin is right, those won't work for TBLE-02S.  

It's designed for 25t or greater.  21t would cause it to shut down.  

[1]  Tamiya Sport Tuned would work.  Even though it's 23t, it works with TBLE-02S (unless you run it on a very hot day on tall grasses).  

[2]  Or, you can get Hobbywing quicrun 1060 ESC.  That ESC can handle 21t. 

[3]  You could also get a 13.5t sensored brushless motor.  TBLE-02S can handle both brushed and brushless.   

I have extra motors like 12t, but for light chassis, I tend to stick with Sport Tuned.  It's more powerful than Lightly tuned and Torque tuned. It's a good motor for most Tamiya chassis.  

 

To add more info, I'm running a 10.5 Tamiya brushless motor with a TBLE02 (with no fan) in one of my cars with no problems.  

Terry

 

[Juggular 4964]

Just now, Frog Jumper said:

To add more info, I'm running a 10.5 Tamiya brushless motor with a TBLE02 (with no fan) in one of my cars with no problems.  

Terry

 

I'm surprised! But that's good to know!  

Low gear ratio?  How's the hot day performance off-road? 

 

[Frog Jumper 3663]

11 minutes ago, Juggular said:

I'm surprised! But that's good to know!  

Low gear ratio?  How's the hot day performance off-road? 

 

Its my Frog.  I'm running standard Frog gearing and I only drive it on-road.  In fact, I've only ever driven in off-road once, and that was the infield of our local baseball field.

Terry

 

[alvinlwh 5895]

You have very limited pinion choice, 17T (FDR 9.33) stock and 19T option I think? With such a limited range, IMHO there is no point in  investing too much in motors. I think you should just keep that ESC and go for a TT or ST. In the future, if and when you decided to spend more and go more advanced, get a chassis with more pinions (and maybe even spur) choices and you can mess around with motors.

I myself is only recently started learning about gear ratios and TBH, while I said the GT and LT can be used, they are technically out of specs as well. Their published FDR are for 6.5 - 7.5.

[alvinlwh 5895]

And to add, I forgot the DT will also suit your ESC but IMHO feel it is not worth the price. 

[ThunderDragonCy 7886]

If you want to keep the TBLE02S then best thing is getting a 17.5 or 13.5 sensored brushless motor. If its on buggy rather than truck wheels then you can run a 19t pinion. Given the price of brushless motors you might find a 1060 ESC and a 21t brushed will cost you less. Keep the 17t pinion with the brushed. 

[markbt73 5316]

Either of the motors you posted will probably be fine with the Tamiya ESC in that car, as long as you don't plan to run continuously through tall grass or something. The Rising Fighter is light and efficient, and ESC motor ratings are approximate, and the Tamiya ones are rated pretty conservatively. A mass-produced 21 turn motor shouldn't hurt it any. And all it will do is "thermal out" (cut off power momentarily) if it does draw too much current.

Now, of course, this is advice given over the internet, from someone with many many years experience pushing these things beyond their limits, so take it with a grain of salt... but I personally would run either of those motors in that car with that ESC with no qualms.

However... the Hobbywing Quicrun 1060 is a way better ESC for brushed motors, has far better capabilities (12 turn motor limit, lipo cutoff), and is only $20. I'd get one of those, so you have room to grow.

[Wooders28 4723]

If it was me, I'd go the sensored brushless route. 

(Well, first big jump is running lipo, but your post is for motors, so...) 

You can pick up a ,Speed Passion motor ,for under £40 new, or under a tenner for a 2nd hand one (I got mine for a fiver!).

If I wanted a bit more speed after that, I'd go for the 10bl120 esc (£40), and add some timing. 

The 10bl120 will run down to a 3.5t motor, and if you still need quicker than that, that's a whole new level of awesomeness! 🤣🤣

 

[TurnipJF 9192]

I think we might be forgetting something here. The OP asked about a motor upgrade for a Rising Fighter. This is basically a Super Hornet with a Mad Bull gearbox. Single wishbone front suspension and a motor pod hanging on the back. Even with the oil shocks that the OP asks about in another thread, this is not a chassis that can handle a massive amount of power. The gears are strong, but the suspension is still basic, and thus for the same reason that we don't typically recommend people fit hugely powerful motors to their Hornets, I would also hesitate to recommend fitting a hugely powerful motor to a Rising Fighter. It might make it faster in a straight line, but also virtually uncontrollable on uneven surfaces or in turns.

How do I know this? Well, I have a Rising Fighter in my fleet, and I did put a faster motor in it - a 17 Turn. After one trip to the park, I swapped this out for a 27 as rolling it, flipping it and generally making a mess of it while also having less runtime was no fun at all.

I am not saying that a Rising Fighter should not have any motor upgrades at all, but I would hesitate to go for anything that exceeds the capabilities of the ESC, as it will likely also exceed the capabilities of the chassis. My Rising Fighter runs very well with one of these:

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/product/smd-power-tuned-brushed-modified-motor-27-turn-428009

At 27 turns but with bearings and adjustable timing, it gives a noticeable performance boost relative to a stock silver can, doesn't break the bank, can be disassembled for maintenance, and is within the capabilities of the stock ESC and chassis.

[alvinlwh 5895]

On 1/29/2022 at 5:57 AM, markbt73 said:

Either of the motors you posted will probably be fine with the Tamiya ESC in that car, as long as you don't plan to run continuously through tall grass or something. The Rising Fighter is light and efficient, and ESC motor ratings are approximate, and the Tamiya ones are rated pretty conservatively. A mass-produced 21 turn motor shouldn't hurt it any. And all it will do is "thermal out" (cut off power momentarily) if it does draw too much current.

Lucky you! My 04 thermalled and stopped until reset with the motor at no load low speed on a RZ doing a bench run in. Luck of the (ESC) draw I suppose. 

[alvinlwh 5895]

2 minutes ago, TurnipJF said:

I think we might be forgetting something here. The OP asked about a motor upgrade for a Rising Fighter.

I though you should know well enough by now that very often advice is given based on what the person giving wants, without considering what the asker need. I lost count of the number of threads where a beginner wants "a bit faster" and was told to get a nuclear powered 1.5T 100,000kv BL in a LB, GH, or whatever beginner chassis. 

I had since learnt to filter out such "noise", after one such "advise" where the person used RPM @ 8.4v to "show" a BL is better than a brushed but RPM for brushed are published at 7.2v. I soon realised the deception but a complete beginner may not and will actually believe that. 

[Bodi007 3]

Thank you all for the advice. It's great learning about all this and appreciate all your help. I do agree with TurnipJF in that the Rising Fighter probably will be difficult to control with a faster motor so I might just get the Tamiya ST for my Plasma Edge 2 instead. I could always swap it over to the Rising Fighter and test it out for a bit of fun.

 

Thanks all.

[alvinlwh 5895]

16 minutes ago, Bodi007 said:

Thank you all for the advice. It's great learning about all this and appreciate all your help. I do agree with TurnipJF in that the Rising Fighter probably will be difficult to control with a faster motor so I might just get the Tamiya ST for my Plasma Edge 2 instead. I could always swap it over to the Rising Fighter and test it out for a bit of fun.

 

Thanks all.

Are you on lipo? Have you considered lipo? I had a ST in my LB and after a switch to lipo, it became uncontrollable and I had to actually downgrade back to silver can. And that was a beat up old (over a decade) black ST. Granted they are different chassis, but the punch given by lipo is almost like an upgrade to the next step of motor. 

[Andreas W 1556]

I would say the Sport Tuned is the perfect all round motor for the solid axle buggies on nihm. It is fast enough so you have to have throttle control and has the extra torque to do donuts on overstear for example. It is loads of fun on a more or less even gravel surface like a ballfield. 

 

I have a Grasshopper with Hornet rear suspension, GH 2 wishbones and CVA shocks. Not unlike the route it seems you are going. I would say it is how good they can get before moving into the Ampro-universe. 

[Wooders28 4723]

On 1/29/2022 at 11:34 AM, TurnipJF said:

The OP asked about a motor upgrade for a Rising Fighter

I've misread that! 

With all the super cheap DT03's on amazon the now, I've read that as the 'Racing Fighter' 🤦‍♂️👀