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87lc2

JConcepts Regulator BTA Steering Kit

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Finally got around to installing these on my stock chassis retro truck after having them sitting on my bench for the better part of 3 months or so and figured I'd post my thoughts in case anyone was thinking of using them.  Reason I wanted to use them on this truck is due to the vertical servo mounts hitting the chassis at full suspension compression due to the longer wheelbase.  I also had to have a mild lift on the truck to avoid this as much as possible, so relocating the servos to behind the axle would let me remove the lift and solve two problems at once.  Plus, I could use the vertical mounts on my Regulator chassis build which I plan on starting any day now.

I was pretty against these for a while when they came out simply based on cost.  I don't mind paying for a good product, but for what you're getting these are outrageously overpriced.  To do 4-wheel steer on a truck you'll need two complete kits which is also annoying, they could at least sell the front axle steup seaprately.  With that said, this is a seriously nice kit and the absolute best steering kit you can get for a Clod hands down, and I've had them all at some point.  

The install is simple and takes about 5-10 minutes per axle.  Don't even need to remove the axles from the truck or even disconnect the shocks from the ladder bars.  You assemble the mount, install the servo to the mount, slide it between the axle brace & motor and bolt it in, couldn't be easier.  You do need to remove the wheels so you can flip the knuckles.  You'll also need to trim the knuckles a bit for full steering throw, see below picture marked in red.  I wasn't worried about this as I've never seen a Clod knuckle break on the arm, they typically just split at the hub mounting screws when they go.  I did space the drag link down a bit using 3mm spacers for a bit more room as it comes very close to the servo arm.  Other than that the kit dropped right in with no modifcation needed. 

I did end up gaining the extra clearance I needed which is all I was really after, but I also feel that the steering is more precise and the truck acts better over jumps with the servo tucked behind the axle rather than hanging out front of it.  I wasnt able to test much but set up a couple ramps in the shop and the truck behaved a lot better all around, very happy with the setup.  So much so that I ordered a second set for my Regulator build.  I was also able to remove the lift kit from my truck and nothing makes contact, lower COG is always nice no matter how slight.  This was always a very good retro truck and its even better now, feels much easier to drive with 4WS than it did before and a bit more planted in turns and taking jumps.  

The only thing I will say is that they hang a bit under the axle housing so it would not be an ideal setup for a crawler Clod.  It would work just fine, but you'd probably end up catching the link from the drag to the servo arm on rocks, etc.  For a basher or race truck they're great. 

 

 

 

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I've done the same on the clod I've been messing with. I wasn't happy about the price either especially when I purchased a second kit to get 4 wheel steering. It is a nice kit and solves allot of problems. 

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On 3/12/2022 at 9:16 PM, 76jimmy said:

I've done the same on the clod I've been messing with. I wasn't happy about the price either especially when I purchased a second kit to get 4 wheel steering. It is a nice kit and solves allot of problems. 

Yea, I think they'd sell a ton more of them if the price was reasonable.  Definitely a nice kit.  

Started on the Ragulator chassis build last night and my thoughts so far are pretty much the same > way overpriced but a nice kit.  Not overly impressed with it after assembling and trying to figure out where the value is.  The chassis kit should be $150 tops (and that's a stretch), they are charging way too much in my opinion.  I know it will perform well since I've driven one, but I probably could have built something for a lot less that would do the same thing.  Oh well, hopefully when she's all done and winning races the cost won't bother me anymore.  

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I'm finally paying attention to forum reviews on the BTA setup and chassis. Mostly all I seen after they were released were promotional, as if it was a total value because JConcepts made it. They are a great company and I can't say I've ever had anything from them that wasn't quality, but I wasn't sold enough on it for my 2nd Clod build for the price. Just before these were all available I had a box of goods from CPE and a SICNME chassis on it's way, so I'm already committed to that route. Maybe the next one after I catch up will be a Regulator.

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17 minutes ago, kotaman said:

I'm finally paying attention to forum reviews on the BTA setup and chassis. Mostly all I seen after they were released were promotional, as if it was a total value because JConcepts made it. They are a great company and I can't say I've ever had anything from them that wasn't quality, but I wasn't sold enough on it for my 2nd Clod build for the price. Just before these were all available I had a box of goods from CPE and a SICNME chassis on it's way, so I'm already committed to that route. Maybe the next one after I catch up will be a Regulator.

What are you planning on doing with the truck when finished?  If you're not racing then the CPE/Sicnme products will be fine.  The BTA steering kit is really only worth buying for competitive racing, but if that's not your plan then the CPE mounts work just fine.  I ran CPE vertical mounts on this truck for a couple years and won plenty of races with that setup.  I mainly switched because I had clearance issues and ended up really liking it, but definitley not necessary for a truck that you just need good steering on.  Any axle-mounted servo setup will give good steering on a Clod. 

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The "Regulator" chassis kit has been on my wishlist for a while now too, but the price has kept me away from it thus far.  Maybe one day!

The BTA system looks good... very reminiscent of the Thunder Tech Aggressor BTA setup from back in the day... 

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31 minutes ago, bRIBEGuy said:

The "Regulator" chassis kit has been on my wishlist for a while now too, but the price has kept me away from it thus far.  Maybe one day!

The BTA system looks good... very reminiscent of the Thunder Tech Aggressor BTA setup from back in the day... 

Almost forgot about the TTR kit, I had one a while back.  I think you can still get them?  They worked with 4-link trucks only if I remember correctly.  The JC kit is a little bit more trick in that you can use it with the stock ladder bars and it also tucks the servo down further which I think is the real reason the truck feels so much better.  

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4 hours ago, 87lc2 said:

but I probably could have built something for a lot less that would do the same thing.

...which, being poor and cheap, will be my plan, lol

Part of what makes the BTA setup, with reversed knuckles, better in my eyes is it corrects the reverse ackermann effect of a front mounted servo that plagues trucks like my Bennett Clod.

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7 minutes ago, Saito2 said:

...which, being poor and cheap, will be my plan, lol

Part of what makes the BTA setup, with reversed knuckles, better in my eyes is it corrects the reverse ackermann effect of a front mounted servo that plagues trucks like my Bennett Clod.

It have no doubt you'll come up with something as good or better!  After assembling the chassis there is only one thing that makes it perform so well - the brass weight tucked all the way under the radio tray in the bottom of the chassis.  It is very heavy and definitely helps handling.  Other than that there's nothing special about it.  The battery mounting solution is not ideal and annoys me a bit - You have room for only a shorty 2s Lipo and the hold-down uses M3 nuts so you need tools to swap the battery.  I'll either come up with something new or use thumb nuts, but still a bit annoying.  I've grown accustomed to velcro/rubber strapped battery trays and having to use tools to swap a battery seems a bit much.  

And you are correct about the steering setup, it does fix that issue and is really nice.  I rate the servo kits higher than the chassis kit at this point, but we'll see once I have the chassis all together.  Planning on building shocks tonight (going with TXT-2 shocks) and will get to the gearboxes later in the week.  Wheels/tires are done and have been sitting around waiting for a while now.  Also need to choose a body, either going with the 88 Chevy or 80s K10, both should be nice for the 10.5" wheelbase.  

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1 hour ago, 87lc2 said:

It have no doubt you'll come up with something as good or better!

I wouldn't say that, lol, cheaper for sure though ;). One thing I was curious about with the JConcepts steering was how they were able to get adequate 2WS by just installing their kit and hacking away at the knuckle and ladder bars for clearance. The stock dogbone-end axle shafts and corresponding axle cups do have a limit to which they can articulate before they start binding. CVDs, like my Bennett has, fix this but widen the truck. I was never sure how to get enough steering out of the front only, while keeping the truck narrow and not binding up the stock front shafts. Their installation video doesn't seem to mention it. 

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Funny you mention that.  I had originally intended setting up this truck with 2WS only, but even with gridning the knuckles and removing the stops no way was that going to work.  I didn't grind the ladder bars and the limiting factor at the moment is the tires hitting them.  I refuse to use wideners for a few reasons so I put 4WS back on the truck.  

I'm going to try and set up the Regulator chassis with 2WS only and it may work.  The Tribute wheels, even at the narrowest setting, offer a bit more clearance than the stock Clod wheels.  Found this out after installing them on this truck.  They are supposed to be stock offset, but they are a little wider.  Not enough to be noticeable, but maybe enought to make a difference.  I think the JConcepts ladder bars, knuckles, etc combined with the steering kit allow for more throw than stock parts which is all I can figure.  No way I'm buying those parts though, you'd have a Clod with well over $700 in it all told.  That's just crazy in my opinion and the stock parts work just fine.  I'll definitely try it when I finish up the chassis and see how much throw I can get out of it without grinding the ladder bars (that just looks bad in my opinion).  

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@87lc2

Good question of what I’m going to do with that 2nd truck… The time capsule truck started an itch for another Clod I could enjoy as a runner that performs better than stock. I don’t know of any local monster truck races since the old Monster Jam days in Bradenville, Pa., but figured eventually I’d find one to join the fun occasionally. So yes, I’m sure the parts I’ve gathered up will be plenty good enough for what I have in mind.

I believe the Aggressor is still available since it's on the TTR website. I do like the design of the BTA’s, not only for the chassis clearance and function but also for the scale appearance on retro/stock rigs. From your pics it appears that the JConcepts kit works as designed with the stock ladder bars but links could be an issue, maybe?

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18 minutes ago, 87lc2 said:

I'll definitely try it when I finish up the chassis and see how much throw I can get out of it without grinding the ladder bars (that just looks bad in my opinion).  

Interesting to see how it goes. They grind the heck out of the stock ladders in the install video and I agree, it looks bad. The 3D parts they offer give all the clearance but, as you note, are crazy-priced.

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3 hours ago, kotaman said:

@87lc2

Good question of what I’m going to do with that 2nd truck… The time capsule truck started an itch for another Clod I could enjoy as a runner that performs better than stock. I don’t know of any local monster truck races since the old Monster Jam days in Bradenville, Pa., but figured eventually I’d find one to join the fun occasionally. So yes, I’m sure the parts I’ve gathered up will be plenty good enough for what I have in mind.

I believe the Aggressor is still available since it's on the TTR website. I do like the design of the BTA’s, not only for the chassis clearance and function but also for the scale appearance on retro/stock rigs. From your pics it appears that the JConcepts kit works as designed with the stock ladder bars but links could be an issue, maybe?

 

Links are a bit of an issue with the JC kit, but there's a local racer that made it work on a mod Clod.  Definitely possible, just need to space the drag link a bit if I remember correctly from looking at his truck.  

Where in SW PA are you?  I'm in SE PA just outside of Philadelphia.  Too bad you're not closer, some decent racing out this way.  Closest to you that I attend would be Bloomsburg, PA but that's a pretty long ways from SW PA.  

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3 hours ago, Saito2 said:

Interesting to see how it goes. They grind the heck out of the stock ladders in the install video and I agree, it looks bad. The 3D parts they offer give all the clearance but, as you note, are crazy-priced.

Yea, definitely not going to grind the ladder bars so we'll see.  It worked well on this truck with 4WS so won't be the end of the world if I have to go that route.  I think the main issue with the old servo mounts what that even with rear steer turned off full throttle would cause the rear to step out just enough to upset the truck.  That didn't seem to be happening with the new mounts and solid servo arm so could be the best of both worlds.  Hopefully I can get the truck out for a proper run soon and see if that's really been fixed.  Only ran the truck on polished concrete in the garage so not the best gauge. 

No way would I pay what they sell those 3D printed parts for, just insanity if you ask me.  I'd assume theyre just putting them out there to see if there's enough interest to tool them up.  If they end up doing that I'd be intrigued.  

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6 hours ago, 87lc2 said:

Where in SW PA are you?  I'm in SE PA just outside of Philadelphia.

...and I'm right between you both in south central PA. 

 

6 hours ago, 87lc2 said:

That didn't seem to be happening with the new mounts and solid servo arm so could be the best of both worlds.  Hopefully I can get the truck out for a proper run soon and see if that's really been fixed.  Only ran the truck on polished concrete in the garage so not the best gauge. 

Look forward to your results. I'm shooting for the same setup but haven't pulled the trigger on mounts yet. I've got an MGB and Mustang hungry for parts at the moment.

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On 3/14/2022 at 10:03 PM, 87lc2 said:

No way would I pay what they sell those 3D printed parts for, just insanity if you ask me.  I'd assume theyre just putting them out there to see if there's enough interest to tool them up.  If they end up doing that I'd be intrigued.  

The only time I checked these parts out was when they were starting to release them. Added a whole mob of them together plus the cost of a Regulator and BTA's to a new built set of stock axles and was no longer interested. I know that 3D printing materials are evolving, but I'm not sold on them yet for any kind of a pounding that the molded materials can endure, especially those with carbon composites. As many years as Clod's have been modded and raced I'm surprised that there hasn't been a venture into more of the vulnerable parts via molding or modular construction despite the upfront costs. 

I'm just south of Pittsburgh. Years ago R/C was big around here and now there's not much left, but the few LHS's that exist compared to the old days are good though. Only a couple indoor carpet/multi use tracks within an hour and a couple way north that are nice. The racing out there in the east looks like a good time!

@Saito2 Are you near Bedford/Somerset? There's so much to see from down there up to the North but I'm almost always just passing through. 

We do live in a big state, or at least the drive across it feels that way even on the 'pike. But it's a beautiful one to live in if you like the four seasons.

 

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1 hour ago, kotaman said:

@Saito2 Are you near Bedford/Somerset? There's so much to see from down there up to the North but I'm almost always just passing through. 

I'm south of York, so probably 4 hours from you and maybe 2 hours from 87lc2.

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If either of you guys (or anyone else in the state) want to come out this way we'd love to have you.  Need more Tamiya guys!

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