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Good News!! another build thread!

Another buggy, and this one takes it right back to the first car I bought when i re-found RC 15 odd years ago, The DT-02. That took the form of the Madcap 2.0, a tribute buggy.

https://www.tamiyaclub.com/showroom_model.asp?cid=71854&id=19798

For this build i want to set a few ground rules:

  • Push the limit of the chassis - how good can it be?
  • Go big or go home - nothing is too much for this build.
  • Only Tamiya parts allowed - (bar bearings, electrics & one exception)
  • That said, NO BLUE :)
  • Minimal modifications - use off the shelf parts where possible

A lot of the parts collecting has already happened, so this might well move pretty fast.......

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Parts…. Many, many parts

24AC613C-DC1C-4A49-B2A2-88CFEEC8FA34.jpeg
 

and yes, the YR parts are for a rule I will willing break if need be :p

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9 minutes ago, ThunderDragonCy said:

[pulls up chair] 

And well you would be wise to, I have some treats instore…….

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Them thar dampers is blue(ish)! 

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16 hours ago, Juhunio said:

Them thar dampers is blue(ish)! 

they and other things have a date with some oven cleaner.......

 

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Are we sitting comfortably? in fact, get real comfy, I’ll wait.

 

ready?

 

We’ll all right then, let’s go.

E3954C9B-4B75-46C9-A333-A13A1A4C3D7A.md.
 

after the TD4 this a very sparse kit, so few parts! But we can probably fix that.

First though let’s get rid of some of the dead weight…

DEF02FD4-B00D-44F3-B449-AC53466AFD92.md.
 

All coming soon to a for sale / pay it forward thread near you…..

but wait I hear you ask? (Pause for effect….) what will he replace it with?

glad you asked. (electrics not pictured, or the Ti Hinge pins that are still to arrive)

F162E69C-C878-485E-A928-3984AA97BA76.md.
 

Close ups? Happy to oblige.

69091EAF-06AC-4FB2-A348-B6184FD4F57E.md.

2F9A32BB-3FB7-4703-ACC6-793CD3EB4F4B.md.

49AF71E5-963E-4135-99D8-54D683E2F599.md.

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The eagle eyed amongst may have spotted two different sets of arms there, DF03 and TD4.

Having learned from my DT03T build that the DF03 arms fitted on the rear and solved some fairly major deficiencies that the stock arms had, i wanted to explore more options:

The TD4 arms are stronger, and more readily available, so i thought this was an avenue worth exploring.  I think that they are useable, there would need to be some judicious trimming of either the mounts or the arms as they are very narrow, but thats not the reason i've ultimately decided against them.

As you can see here, the gap for the mount on the DF03 arms is almost as wide as the TD4 arm itself.

A124E4BA-F2D8-4E53-93F0-07CBF39CA6C0.md.

The two main issues are the front shock mount ( but i actually think this would work fine, just be fiddly is all) and the lack of toe in at the rear. The DF03 arms provide a real boost in toe in over the DT02, a really useful tuning aid that should help with forward traction. The TD4 of course has adjustable toe in and anti squat using the alloy mount, so there is no extra toe angle on the arms.

That decided, i'll be moving on the TD4 arms and CVD's as well as a set of M05 low friction King Pins and have already purchased Titanium hinge pins for the DF03 set up. They are actually M chassis and F104 king pins....

Mocked up the front arms and it looks like there will be a small wheelbase improvement too, which is nice.

EBE9580B-6DF3-4DFE-A8AF-A4219943FE0F.md.

 

 

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Not doing very well at abiding by the rules I set, more modification than I imagined but more on that in a mo.  Some small bits of progress whilst I wait for needless low friction things to arrive, which is totally on brand for this build. :)

2F97F383-6DF5-479B-B174-F4ECA9ACA95F.md.

Used the Tamiya Thread Forming die and the Modellers Hand Chuck to prep a load of threads, and decided to fit the Full Option shock tower brace.

ED79EA1B-3C23-47C3-8C62-F81053B5172B.md.
 

I’ve also contacted Custom RC Parts who make a load of stuff for Top Force/Astute etc to see if he would make a front bulkhead and chassis brace. I think it would look badass with the TF Evo front tower, as well as adding new shock mount and camber link positions. Finger crossed this comes to light in the future. 
 

Next up the Bumper….don’t ask me why but I thought it would be good not to have it….so some knife and file work and I ended up with this.

BE0C34E1-12C1-49A6-8F5D-725D897F470D.md.

I made a bit of a hash of it to be fair, the curves are not even at all. So what’s left but to Go Big or Go Home?  I mean I can always buy a new bumper. So more filing, cutting, sanding and we have this. 
 

1E660471-9C63-469E-A8EB-C0A910BE3E1F.md.

Test fitted the front and rear arms with and looks pretty good imo. Also appears to have a 270mm wheelbase, which is a 10mm improvement. :)

6871D411-ED14-42DA-BDCE-7528C0A8F4AB.md.

03DE59B0-5DF1-4BC3-ADE4-6936C70624CA.md.

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This is not going to be a build that follows the manual closely, mostly as so many parts are going to change, but let’s at least pretend by starting with the diff.

No gear diff obvs, unless someone develops an aftermarket slipper clutch. So ball diff it is. But just fitting the Hop Up DT02 diff would be dull.

A44F2A95-0A6D-4D43-A35A-35767F9691BC.md.
 

Thankfully the TF EVO got a re-release, so the alloy pressure plates were available again. Lighter, more precisely made and stronger that the pot metal stock parts, also very shiney. These are coupled with the hardened our drives and HCCA lightweight diff balls. 
I won’t bore you with the build details, except to say that rings were sanded, and tweezers were used.

6634460D-6E15-4B7E-B040-11192EC80F61.md.

Built to a 1/4 turn back from fully tight as a starting point and it’s super smooth. 

81FD8B35-C634-4A07-A9FD-A2CD19EA7757.md.
 

D690BCF0-8AE6-44C1-9705-465C296884C2.md.

 

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Full ABEC5 bearings because Mamma didn’t raise no fool.

5616A2B4-4438-49F9-87EC-D2A4930405A1.md.

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Great looking build so far!

I love the DT02 - but never really felt I could get one of these on a track that was anything but loose dirt or worn grass due to lack of or slipper or the in some ways limiting diff when racing. Any plans for these parts @matisse ? 

There's a great post here that covers a few changes that can be made that might be useful if your planning to hit the track at any point: https://www.thercracer.com/2013/10/tamiya-dt02-guide-mods-tuning-and-tips.html?m=0 (most interesting bit is probably the wheelbase increase that can be achieved!)

 

Edit: maybe XV01 front gearbox would fit on the back of one of these, that would open up option of Slipper + Oil filled gear diff from TA06/M07/TRF201 etc

 

 

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28 minutes ago, BuggyGuy said:

Great looking build so far!

I love the DT02 - but never really felt I could get one of these on a track that was anything but loose dirt or worn grass due to lack of or slipper or the in some ways limiting diff when racing. Any plans for these parts @matisse ? 

There's a great post here that covers a few changes that can be made that might be useful if your planning to hit the track at any point: https://www.thercracer.com/2013/10/tamiya-dt02-guide-mods-tuning-and-tips.html?m=0 (most interesting bit is probably the wheelbase increase that can be achieved!)

 

Edit: maybe XV01 front gearbox would fit on the back of one of these, that would open up option of Slipper + Oil filled gear diff from TA06/M07/TRF201 etc

 

 

:) def planning on racing at some point (if I can) but in the mean time it will just be a fun project build. Beefed up the ball diff as much possible and may investigate another rear gear box in due coarse. 

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Posted (edited)

Badass build mateB)

I've wondered about fitting the ball diff upgrade to my DT-02. People say it needs maintenance, although I have no real understanding of what is meant by that. Does your beefing up of the ball diff reduce the requirement for maintenance?

Could you share the detail around what parts you had to file? And could you also the part numbers for the mod to the ball diff bud? Cheers broski

Edit: beefy balls.

...re-read my post and just had to get that in there:ph34r:

Edited by Kol__
Balls a'la Beefy
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10 hours ago, Kol__ said:

Badass build mateB)

I've wondered about fitting the ball diff upgrade to my DT-02. People say it needs maintenance, although I have no real understanding of what is meant by that. Does your beefing up of the ball diff reduce the requirement for maintenance?

Could you share the detail around what parts you had to file? And could you also the part numbers for the mod to the ball diff bud? Cheers broski

Edit: beefy balls.

...just re-read my post and just had to get that in there:ph34r:

 

Basically after a while the balls and plates will need attention. The balls can develop flat spots and the plates grooves. You can reduce the the need to rebuild by attention to details during the build but maintainence is inevitable.

I always sand the plates using wet and dry paper, first 1200 and then 3000 grit. This levels plates and keys the surface for the balls to grip too. 
 

Then you can upgrade the diff balls themselves, tungsten carbide/HCCA/Ceramic are your choices here and all have their benefits that  are useage specific. The HCCA balls give a good balance between hardness and weight imo. Better balls are also more spherical, which seems strange to say but is definitely a thing.

lastly you choice of lube is important. AE make a great range of greases and their Stealh diff lube and Black grease are fool proof. We use two greases as the balls in the diff and the thrust race are subject to different forces, so need greases with different properties. The black grease is for the thrust race and the silicone based stealth lube is for the diff balls and plates.

to build this diff I used:

54863 - DT02 ball diff

53379 - 3mm Lightweight differential ball set

9805419 - Top Force/Touring Car Hard Outdrives

9805420 - Top Force Evolution Pressure plate.

I did more in-depth diff builds in my DT03 and DF01 threads.

https://www.tamiyaclub.com/forum/index.php?/topic/94047-aqroshot-to-the-heart-dt03-tb/&do=findComment&comment=863801

 

 

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What a most excellent and informative build thread. I know how much time and effort it takes to do a thread like this, so thanks. It's going to be great to follow along. I have a DT-03 I'm yet to build, but haven't thought about a DT-02. But there's a few nice examples on here at the moment, so I may look at adding one.

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5 hours ago, toyolien said:

What a most excellent and informative build thread. I know how much time and effort it takes to do a thread like this, so thanks. It's going to be great to follow along. I have a DT-03 I'm yet to build, but haven't thought about a DT-02. But there's a few nice examples on here at the moment, so I may look at adding one.

Thanks buddy, I actually really enjoy doing them and often get carried away, as evidenced by … we’ll all of my previous build threads. :)

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If you expected a “normal” shock build you’ve either not being paying attention or you don’t know my threads very well. If it’s the former, WAKE-UP! If it’s the latter, welcome friend!

26F86348-427D-4738-B4E1-5FE774B4CD33.md.
 

now looking at all of this stuff you’re probably thinking that I could have just gone for the big bores and been done with the it, but;

a) where is the fun in that

2) I’d already bought the HL cylinders (42132/42133) for the TD4 and kept them for this. 
It also worked out cheaper than two pairs of Big Bores. :)

22F0A090-1C1F-4E01-B93B-01838643CC93.md.
 

I think this is gonna work out well you know, the silver of the stripped collars against the gold of the HL cylinder is so choice. The HL cylinders will make the shocks even smoother too.

Recently switched from AE green slime to 1up blue grease for building shocks, very happy with it so far. Replaced the red O-rings with 42215 Damper X-Rings, smoother and a better seal.

Piston wise the stock pistons are great, but I’ve switched to 42274 TRF tapered pistons. They are thinner which gives less pack and the taper makes the return faster to keep the wheels planted on the ground. 
 

The choice now is whether to build them as aeration or bladder shocks, it’s one of those debates that doesn’t appear to have a clear answer and mostly seems to be a personal preference. I’ve never really got on with aeration, so picked up 53576 TRF Damper Oil Seal and 53577 TRF Damper Urethane bushing packs. Now you just build them like any bladder style damper. 
I also drilled the vent hole in the cap so they can be vented/unvented, another tuning option.

Oil wise, AE oils are what I’ve used for years, 40wt F and 35wt R, paired with Tamiya Blue springs F and Yellow R ( I already had the spring set)
 

Finally we have 53595 TRF Damper aluminium retainer (in silver) and 54593 Buggy Aluminum Suspension Balls (when they arrive)

 EFD81DF0-D288-4D0F-8113-09D08DFCE5C7.md.
 

Muy Bueno!

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2 hours ago, matisse said:

1up blue grease

Hey mate, what do you rate better about the blue grease as opposed to the green slime? I only picked up some green recently and used it for the first time on a shock rebuild. Seemed pretty good but I quickly learned that you only need to use a smidge:lol:

I'm finding that when the shocks haven't been actuated for a while, for example whilst sitting on the shelf, they stick a bit. This is on my DT-02 and Astute shocks I've rebuilt with new orange o-rings. This sticking is I assume down to the new o-rings that I guess need bedding in? When pushed down/actuated once to free up the sticking they are fine under further actuations. I'm wondering if those x-rings would be a better option in general, would they fit normal DT-02/03 style CVA's?

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1 hour ago, Kol__ said:

Hey mate, what do you rate better about the blue grease as opposed to the green slime? I only picked up some green recently and used it for the first time on a shock rebuild. Seemed pretty good but I quickly learned that you only need to use a smidge:lol:

I'm finding that when the shocks haven't been actuated for a while, for example whilst sitting on the shelf, they stick a bit. This is on my DT-02 and Astute shocks I've rebuilt with new orange o-rings. This sticking is I assume down to the new o-rings that I guess need bedding in? When pushed down/actuated once to free up the sticking they are fine under further actuations. I'm wondering if those x-rings would be a better option in general, would they fit normal DT-02/03 style CVA's?

So far they are much of a muchness, thick and stable when exposed to the shock oil. I came across is when i'd bought another brand of Green Slime when i couldn't get AE, it just dissolved almost instantly and mixed in with the oil. Saw a big pot of this on sale and gave it a go. That it comes in a pot is quite handy.

They sticking is a thing, any system that has some sort of hydraulic nature in that the seal is keeping two liquids separate (oil and air here) will experience it it's not much to worry about in this case.

The X-rings have two contact surfaces against the piston rod, so can provide a better seal over the single surface of the std o-ring. they are the same diameter both internally and extranally as the Tamiya red o-rings iirc, so will work fine in the CVA's

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