TT-02 Rally Build, what do I need? Suggestions?

[Prospek 19]

Hi There, 

I have a standard TT-02 chassis that I am planning to build for Rally use. It is not a competitive build but more something durable that my son can use. Planned power is a 3100kv motor on 2S so my aim is to have a driveline and suspension setup that should withstand a reasonable amount of bashing.

Any thoughts on whether the below list of parts would do the job? Of course I also need to sort out shocks and wheel/tire combo.

Thanks in advance for the advice!

[Pylon80 2618]

I am doing the same.

I went with oil filled gear diffs rather than spending on the stock diffs (oil filled ones come with their own out drives).

You will need oil socks else the car will just bounce and bounce and bounce and...

[TurnipJF 9183]

How about rubber sealed bearings and a steel pinion?

[Big Jon 684]

I'd recommend the High Speed gearset with an aftermarket 48p. spur and steel pinion with the Yeah motor mount, mostly for easy spur replacement.

3° rear bearing carriers make them easier to drive with power like yours, Low Friction balls reduce suspension binding, and so on. You'll find all sorts of little improvements to make as you drive and maintain it, and they make a fun project.

I will say, though, that my TT-02 cost more than a stock XV-01, and doesn't perform as well, requires more maintenance (the suspension binds often and needs to be cleaned frequently), and is more fragile due to the plastics used.

I'd do it again, of course. It was a fun project, I got to try some ideas, I like driving the car, it's good enough to be my backup when I'm racing. I best it up in my yard and street all the time.

[Prospek 19]

16 minutes ago, Big Jon said:

I will say, though, that my TT-02 cost more than a stock XV-01, and doesn't perform as well, requires more maintenance.

I hear what you are saying, the TT-02 is a spare chassis I have had for years now which is the only reason I am using it. I may do a similar rally build later this year with the new XV-02 if they are available. 

[Big Jon 684]

Just now, Prospek said:

I hear what you are saying, the TT-02 is a spare chassis I have had for years now which is the only reason I am using it. I may do a similar rally build later this year with the new XV-02 if they are available. 

One can never have enough rally cars. I'm eyeballing availability daily now!

Are you planning a build thread?

[Prospek 19]

1 hour ago, Pylon80 said:

I went with oil filled gear diffs rather than spending on the stock diffs (oil filled ones come with their own out drives).

So with the Yeah Racing diff I assume I would still need to get the Tamiya bevel gear set? I also guess these tamiya bevel gears fit the Year Racing diff?

 

 

[Prospek 19]

11 minutes ago, Big Jon said:

One can never have enough rally cars. I'm eyeballing availability daily now!

Are you planning a build thread?

Yeah may do however I don't have the patience to do anything as in depth as some of the great build posts that are available.

[TurnipJF 9183]

I currently run TA-02 and TT-01 rally cars, and in both cases I have found leaving them mostly stock to be preferable to loading them with hop-ups. Stock plastic parts are generally quite resilient, don't show the wear as much as anodized alloy ones, and are cheap to replace.

Both cars feature the obvious ones, such as rubber sealed bearings, steel pinions, alloy motor mounts, uprated prop shafts, ballraced steering and longer shocks to increase ride height. Apart from that though, they are are pretty much as supplied in the box. Neither have suffered any significant damage and continue to be reliable runners.

[Juhunio 6830]

I haven’t done this myself (yet) but am considering it, and would expect the key considerations are weather proofing and ground clearance

For weather proofing, rubber sealed bearings throughout is a good start, plus maybe consider the newish TT02 chassis cover which should keep the worst of the rally terrain out of the tub

For ground clearance, a set of mini CVAs built with the long eyelet on the bottom would also be a good start. Someone on here did a really useful build thread where they converted a TT02 from a drifter to a rally car which included a mod where they cut some material off the lower arms to  increase the ground clearance further still. Sorry, don’t have it to hand but it’s worth looking up.

A set of front universals will help reduce the risk of dogbones popping out when driven vigorously over rough terrain, and the alloy motor mount / racing spur gear will help with gearing options and a more securely fixed motor. 

I suspect that everything else, particularly alloy bits, is mostly cosmetic benefit that will show the wear of rally driving quite quickly, as suggested above. 

Definitely do a build thread 👍

 

[OoALEJOoO 3127]

Hello! Great to see rally cars are getting some spotlight

I have run two TT-01 and one TT-02 rally cars for years without major problems. I echo the same experience as @TurnipJF, with good reliability using mostly stock cars. Some notes:

• The only hop-ups used initially have been rubber-sealed bearings, CVA shocks and hard-coated pinions (not even steel). Everything else is stock.
• All cars have been run with a custom-made cloth cover, attached via velcro, to prevent too many rocks/dirt from getting into the tub. This makes a huge difference in preventing dirt into the gear cases. The TT02 now has an official cover part that can serve this purpose (part 22023).
• I've used motors form the stock silver can,  torque tuned to the Super Stock TZ. The faster you go, the most likely you will have bad crashes. I would hesitate to give something faster than the regular silver can to an inexperienced driver. Perhaps it's best to let your boy drive the silver can for a while and then have him "graduate" to a faster motor once the skill and judgement is there.
• The only parts that I have had issues or breakages are:
  • By far the weakest point has been the front uprights. I've broken several sets after a few months of running each. The culprit seems to be hitting concrete edges/steps at high-speed (e.g. clipping the inner apex on a sidewalk corner into the grass and up again into the concrete). The problem was solved once I upgraded to aluminium uprights.
  • The front shock tower on the TT01 has been broken one time each on the TT01s, so not as frequent as the uprights. Since Parts-A are contain both uprights and the shock towers, I have plenty of spare shock towers from the sets I've bought to get spare uprights.
  • Eventually the steering links, being plastic, will wear after continuous use in dirt and create a significant increase in steering slop. I eventually upgraded to turnbuckles, which have greatly improved wear resistance. Turnbuckles also allowed to fully realize the modded increased ride height.
  • The bodies do take a beating, perhaps more than the chassis. I would recommend reinforcing them with shoegoo+mesh. A fast and nearly as good alternative is to reinforce internally with thick gorilla duct-tape on the nose, sides, rear and roof areas.
  • I have not run the TT02 as long but so far zero breakages. This car got aluminium uprights from day one as the TT02's seem to be weaker than the TT01's. I also very quickly upgraded to turnbuckles as the plastic steering link balls were wearing fairly fast, but it really depends on how fine/abrasive the dirt in your area is.

I am currently in the process of making a RWD TT02 rally car and am taking the same route, except that this time I'm upgrading straight away to aluminium front uprights & shock tower plus turnbuckles. Currently working on the body, but will also cover the chassis on my thread over the next few weeks.

[Pylon80 2618]

9 hours ago, OoALEJOoO said:

I am currently in the process of making a RWD TT02 rally car and am taking the same route, except that this time I'm upgrading straight away to aluminium front uprights & shock tower plus turnbuckles.

I would love to see that chassis! Keep us posted.

@TurnipJF would you then run the plastic chunky drive shafts on a TT-02? I don't care much about bling anymore and just want something reliable.

[TurnipJF 9183]

4 hours ago, Pylon80 said:

 

@TurnipJF would you then run the plastic chunky drive shafts on a TT-02? I don't care much about bling anymore and just want something reliable.

I would indeed. They take a surprising amount of punishment, as do the chunky outdrives and axle cups. 

[Frankster 2030]

Good tires!  
I build a Porsche 911 RSR Safari with oversized Sand Blaster tires.  Check out the build page.  Still a WIP

[TurnipJF 9183]

Tyres do indeed help a lot. Cheap Chinese knock-offs of Tamiya Rally Blocks are available, which are ever so slightly larger and significantly softer than the real thing, giving you a little more ride height and noticeably better grip. 

Plus, a set of 4 including wheels and inserts is usually cheaper than just 4 Tamiya tyres.

[Big Jon 684]

10 hours ago, TurnipJF said:

Tyres do indeed help a lot. Cheap Chinese knock-offs of Tamiya Rally Blocks are available, which are ever so slightly larger and significantly softer than the real thing, giving you a little more ride height and noticeably better grip. 

Plus, a set of 4 including wheels and inserts is usually cheaper than just 4 Tamiya tyres.

For some reason, those tires plain WORK on a TT-02. They work better than anything else I've tried. However, they slow my XV-01 down. Weird.

[Exit13 673]

How about the yeah racing conversion kit?

[Prospek 19]

So I did end up moving ahead with this build and it is mostly complete. Basically the aim was to build a low cost rally car that would be reliable on mild 2S Lipo/Brushless setup.

Comments after about 20 mostly hard battery cycles on grass/dirt/gravel/asphalt all wet and dry:

TT02 -58631 - 99 Subaru WRX Kit. - Clearly a beginner kit, not much more I can say. I didn't use the kit body as I am saving that for something else down the line so went with a Killerbody item. 

Motor/ESC -  Good old Banggood special 2050Kv brushless ESC/Motor combo (non sensored). This has been through a few kits now and it has been very reliable for the little $$$ I spent on it originally. Only issue is that there is nowhere to set throttle end points as there is no setup button, I assume you would need a program card or some type. Anyway seems to work fine with a 25t .06 pinion. Yeah racing motor mount fitted (TT02-013BU).

Steering/Suspension

- Using Tamiya CVA shock kit (53619) assembled with the long connectors at the end of the shaft using the kit springs. It provides approx 20mm ride height however the kit springs are to firm. Any suggestion for a set of softer springs?

- I cut off the steering end stops on the front suspension arms and front uprights to increase steering angle. The steering stops are clearly designed for a basic transmitter with no EPA so they badly limited the turning circle, it was horrible. The steering linkages are obviously low end but they do the job for the time being, the kit runs true with the slightest bit of Tx trim.

- Using the Tamiya Rally 26mm Wheels (51021) with Xtraspeed Rally Tires (XS-59574). The tires are a copy of the Tamiya bloc tires however they absolutely do the job an cost $4.50(USD) including foams.

Other

Yeah Racing main drive shaft + diff cups, Yeah Racing Uni Drive shafts, lowest cost metal diff cups I could find on eBay and of course full rubber sealed bearings.

- Running with diff putty in the front front and kit grease in the rear. The essentially locked front diff provides great traction on dirt but kills the turning circle on grass and asphalt, tune-able sealed diffs would be nice. 

- The Tamiya TT-02 chassis cover set it great and definitely works as intended. I have no motor/ESC cooling issues however I haven't yet run in high ambient temperatures.

Anything Else Needed? - In the interest in spending as little as possible I would say just the steering linkage set and softer springs. I think the plastic diff gears will fall victim soon enough with the way myself and my small son drives so I will also look at a sealed diff upgrade when that happens.

 

[RC Perspective 511]

2 hours ago, Prospek said:

So I did end up moving ahead with this build and it is mostly complete. Basically the aim was to build a low cost rally car that would be reliable on mild 2S Lipo/Brushless setup.

Comments after about 20 mostly hard battery cycles on grass/dirt/gravel/asphalt all wet and dry:

TT02 -58631 - 99 Subaru WRX Kit. - Clearly a beginner kit, not much more I can say. I didn't use the kit body as I am saving that for something else down the line so went with a Killerbody item. 

Motor/ESC -  Good old Banggood special 2050Kv brushless ESC/Motor combo (non sensored). This has been through a few kits now and it has been very reliable for the little $$$ I spent on it originally. Only issue is that there is nowhere to set throttle end points as there is no setup button, I assume you would need a program card or some type. Anyway seems to work fine with a 25t .06 pinion. Yeah racing motor mount fitted (TT02-013BU).

Steering/Suspension

- Using Tamiya CVA shock kit (53619) assembled with the long connectors at the end of the shaft using the kit springs. It provides approx 20mm ride height however the kit springs are to firm. Any suggestion for a set of softer springs?

- I cut off the steering end stops on the front suspension arms and front uprights to increase steering angle. The steering stops are clearly designed for a basic transmitter with no EPA so they badly limited the turning circle, it was horrible. The steering linkages are obviously low end but they do the job for the time being, the kit runs true with the slightest bit of Tx trim.

- Using the Tamiya Rally 26mm Wheels (51021) with Xtraspeed Rally Tires (XS-59574). The tires are a copy of the Tamiya bloc tires however they absolutely do the job an cost $4.50(USD) including foams.

Other

Yeah Racing main drive shaft + diff cups, Yeah Racing Uni Drive shafts, lowest cost metal diff cups I could find on eBay and of course full rubber sealed bearings.

- Running with diff putty in the front front and kit grease in the rear. The essentially locked front diff provides great traction on dirt but kills the turning circle on grass and asphalt, tune-able sealed diffs would be nice. 

- The Tamiya TT-02 chassis cover set it great and definitely works as intended. I have no motor/ESC cooling issues however I haven't yet run in high ambient temperatures.

Anything Else Needed? - In the interest in spending as little as possible I would say just the steering linkage set and softer springs. I think the plastic diff gears will fall victim soon enough with the way myself and my small son drives so I will also look at a sealed diff upgrade when that happens.

 

I love this chassis cover. It works great! I have holes cut for two fans and used screen to block larger debris from entering the cover. May add sweeps to prevent stuff from entering through the steering, as that's the biggest area where debris still enters. This cover also works wonders for keeping moisture out when running in the rain!

-RC Perspective

[Pylon80 2618]

3 hours ago, Prospek said:

Any suggestion for a set of softer springs?

Tamiya 53163 are made for it. Not sure if anyone else is using them. 

[DTSCB 96]

8 hours ago, Prospek said:

Anything Else Needed? - In the interest in spending as little as possible I would say just the steering linkage set and softer springs. I think the plastic diff gears will fall victim soon enough with the way myself and my small son drives so I will also look at a sealed diff upgrade when that happens.

What is a sealed diff upgrade?  Oil filled?

[Pylon80 2618]

13 minutes ago, DTSCB said:

What is a sealed diff upgrade?  Oil filled?

If an oil filled gear diff is easy is meant then the Tamiya one is very good. You do need small diameter steel universals rather than the kit plastic ones to use it though. 

[StueyS 41]

5 hours ago, Pylon80 said:

Tamiya 53163 are made for it. Not sure if anyone else is using them. 

I would recommend these too, red on the rear and yellow on the front. Rear toe in hubs also give you more rear end stability.

[Busdriver 6209]

Now can I be a little contentious here!!! Are we talking about a scale representation of a rally car, a car that will handle 1/10 scale rally type surfaces or a car that will travel over roads that  a real car wouldn't All of the above advice is valid and will affect what a TT02 chassis can or can be made to do. True the XV01 will drive in a way that is way more scale but will only really perform on the right surfaces. The best rally car I have is is the Losi Baja Rey Raptor!! Even more contentious I hear you say but it does all of the above and more. It handles every type of offroad/tarmac surface that I've thrown at it. Now I'm not suggesting that you should buy one, you can if you like and they are real fun, but you have to decide what you want to acheive. Now before anybody finds an old quote from me along these lines, yes I have asked the same question many times, but I now realise that perhaps I'm asking the wrong question. What do you want to be able to do?????

[Prospek 19]

10 hours ago, Busdriver said:

Now can I be a little contentious here!!! Are we talking about a scale representation of a rally car, a car that will handle 1/10 scale rally type surfaces or a car that will travel over roads that  a real car wouldn't All of the above advice is valid and will affect what a TT02 chassis can or can be made to do. True the XV01 will drive in a way that is way more scale but will only really perform on the right surfaces. The best rally car I have is is the Losi Baja Rey Raptor!! Even more contentious I hear you say but it does all of the above and more. It handles every type of offroad/tarmac surface that I've thrown at it. Now I'm not suggesting that you should buy one, you can if you like and they are real fun, but you have to decide what you want to acheive. Now before anybody finds an old quote from me along these lines, yes I have asked the same question many times, but I now realise that perhaps I'm asking the wrong question. What do you want to be able to do?????

The aim is to have something that looks and performs somewhat scale whilst still being durable. I have an Arrma Kraton and a few buggies that will easily bash in the dirt all day long but this build wasn't aiming for that.