PSA: Don't Use Liquid Mask on TS Paint!

[bRIBEGuy]

Well, I've pretty much wrecked a month of painting with an accidental discovery of doom... Bob Dively Liquid Mask and Tamiya paints are not good bedfellows.

As some of you know, I've been in the process of restoring and rebuilding two Midnight Pumpkins.  I've been approaching the final stages after MUCH body work.  My Pumpkin finally had a nice smooth gloss black (TS-14) body, and had sat for over a week to cure.  The (not black) body on my daughters truck had cured longer, when she decided that she wanted some black oh hers too, and we made the decision that both trucks would get TS-29 Semi-Gloss Black window trim (as per the manual), running boards, and beds.  Since the rest of the paint work was complete, I figured the easiest way to do this was with liquid mask.

So, out came the Bob Dively and brush.  3 coats later, and we're looking good... 



Each coat dried for an hour or so before the next coat went on, and then the whole thing sat for 12 hrs to fully setup.  The next day we trimmed the mask, sprayed 3 coats of TS-29, and let is sit for a couple hours before pulling off the rest of masking.

Well, imagine my HORROR when this is what I saw...

Yup, the gloss finish is gone, and the black is all mottled and gross.  It's not something on the paint (I did dry to wash it off with dish soap and a soft cloth to no avail), it seems to be etched into the paint.

At this point I'm pretty much beside myself, furious, confused, and not sure what to do now (aside from starting over).  But... I figured I should at least post up my horror story, so hopefully no one else has to go thru the trauma of this "good idea" like I did.

[Frog Jumper]

Ouch!  That sucks!

[Superluminal]

Bad times! Sorry to see that.

Can you rub it down with some fine grade wet & dry paper then mask off the window rubbers with tape then give it a gloss clear coat over it?

[Willy iine]

Sorry to see this.  

If you have a container and a bunch of brake fluid, you might try dunking the body in it for a couple of hours to see if it can lift the paint off.. and just start fresh.

I HIGHLY not recommend cleaning the brake fluid with brake cleaner as the brake cleaner melted my M38 jerry can.    CRC MAF cleaner is okay, motor spray is also okay, soap and water is also okay.  Dawn might make the plastic brittle.  

Don't give up, there is nothing you can't fix on these bodies.  GL!  

[Busdriver]

Never seen anything like this before, but I’ve never really use liquid mask in that way. I’ve only really used it to fill in gaps or mask areas that are impossible to get tape into. I use Humbrol maskol which is a rubber like substance once dry. It’s never left any marks on previously painted surfaces???

[bRIBEGuy]

47 minutes ago, Frog Jumper said:

Ouch!  That sucks!

Yes.  Yes it does...
 

47 minutes ago, Superluminal said:

Can you rub it down with some fine grade wet & dry paper then mask off the window rubbers with tape then give it a gloss clear coat over it?

TBD.  Currently trying to regroup mentally and figure out the next step.

 

45 minutes ago, Willy iine said:

Sorry to see this.  

If you have a container and a bunch of brake fluid, you might try dunking the body in it for a couple of hours to see if it can lift the paint off.. and just start fresh.

I HIGHLY not recommend cleaning the brake fluid with brake cleaner as the brake cleaner melted my M38 jerry can.    CRC MAF cleaner is okay, motor spray is also okay, soap and water is also okay.  Dawn might make the plastic brittle.  

Don't give up, there is nothing you can't fix on these bodies.  GL!  

I don't know if I can mentally bring myself to strip it all the way back to bare plastic.  It's been almost 3 months of stripping/filling/sanding/painting at this point.  Not convinced I have the mental fortitude to start again...
 

20 minutes ago, Busdriver said:

Never seen anything like this before, but I’ve never really use liquid mask in that way. I’ve only really used it to fill in gaps or mask areas that are impossible to get tape into. I use Humbrol maskol which is a rubber like substance once dry. It’s never left any marks on previously painted surfaces???

I've used this stuff on probably 50+ bodies over 20+ years, and I have NEVER seen this.  Not that a statement as such makes any of this better....lol.

[alvinlwh]

Too late now but for future reference, what static modellers use are Microscale Micro Mask or Mr Hobbyr Masking Sol Neo. Some unconventional masking solutions that also works are Elmers (white glue) and Copydex (carpet glue). 

EDIT: Saw that you had used that stuff for 20+ years without problem so this is a really strange one, sorry can't help more. 

[Willy iine]

7 hours ago, bRIBEGuy said:

 

I don't know if I can mentally bring myself to strip it all the way back to bare plastic.  It's been almost 3 months of stripping/filling/sanding/painting at this point.  Not convinced I have the mental fortitude to start again...
 

 

I see what you mean.. I'm not sure if brake fluid removes putty too, so all the patching/sanding can potentially dissolve with the paint.

I don't know for the sake of sanity, have you considered just getting a new body and starting over?  while using this body for bashing?  I think some weathering can make this car look very cool..

[Tamiya Fan 1]

I would try to sand with 600 paper all over body as deep as needed and re-spray. If paint takes, it would be the easiest way. Should work. I hate painting. Ts paint can be funny till totally dry. (weeks) 

Good luck!

[GeeWings]

11 hours ago, bRIBEGuy said:

I don't know if I can mentally bring myself to strip it all the way back to bare plastic.  It's been almost 3 months of stripping/filling/sanding/painting at this point.  Not convinced I have the mental fortitude to start again...

Sorry to see what's happened. So frustrating. 

I too had a now well documented paint disaster  Though I hadn't invested the amount of effort you have. 

I had completed my second build; a GF-01 and it was looking great (in my eyes anyway). 

Then I took it for a drive and the paint immediately cracked and started falling off. Once I got home I realised my user error... I had grabbed TS not PS from the store

Once I flexed the body a few times it pretty quickly looked like this:

I've never been able to deal with fully stripping it.I just find it too frustrating and pretty soul destroying. I think I'm just going to use a different shell at some stage!

[No Slack]

Try some of the polishing products from Meguiars. They have several very good polishing compounds. It is used on 1:1 cars (and Fender gives you Meguiars polish for guitars, so it is good). Meguiars also have "clay" to clean your layer of paint.

If it doesn't work you can use it on your real car. 

[bRIBEGuy]

9 hours ago, GeeWings said:

Sorry to see what's happened. So frustrating. 

I too had a now well documented paint disaster  Though I hadn't invested the amount of effort you have. 

I had completed my second build; a GF-01 and it was looking great (in my eyes anyway). 

Then I took it for a drive and the paint immediately cracked and started falling off. Once I got home I realised my user error... I had grabbed TS not PS from the store

Once I flexed the body a few times it pretty quickly looked like this:

I've never been able to deal with fully stripping it.I just find it too frustrating and pretty soul destroying. I think I'm just going to use a different shell at some stage!

That is a RAD looking GF-01! 

Yup, it's oddly brutal when something like this goes wrong.  :(

[bRIBEGuy]

14 hours ago, Willy iine said:

I don't know for the sake of sanity, have you considered just getting a new body and starting over?  while using this body for bashing?  I think some weathering can make this car look very cool..

To be honest, if I had an option on getting another original MP body, I probably would go that route.  The issue here, is that I am irrationally DUMB, and am pretty dead set on the "Original" bit.  There are at least 5 versions of this body that I know of (white original, white new, orange, black new, chrome new), and the original molding on the white one is different than on later versions.  I have a NIB white body from the newer mold, and I just can't bring myself to use it.  It's not big changes, but it is noticeable, and I was hoping to keep this one all original.

Lame backstory: When I was a kid, my parents couldn't afford Tamiya, so I was rocking a Tyco Turbo Hopper and a Nikko Big Bubba.  My Uncle (who live some 800km+ away) really liked them, and decided to buy himself a Clod Buster and a Midnight Pumpkin.  I was never allowed to drive them, but saw them run a couple times a year, and was always in awe.  Some 20+ years later, and my uncle had left the hobby, and offered to send me all his RC stuff if I paid the postage (which I quickly did).  His Pumpkin had two bodies, a mint condition box art one for display, and a "blue alternate box art" one for running.  Shocks had been upgraded to Team Associated Gold oil filled ones.  A few years later some hard times hit, and I ended up selling off most of my RC collection.  I kept the Clod Buster, but the Pumpkin got sold, and I've regretted it ever since. 

I know the Midnight Pumpkin is not a great car (and heck, I personally even lie the Lunch Box WAY more...), but it's a car that is special to me, and I was using this as my opportunity to rebuild what I had once lost.  Sounds super cheesy and lame as I type it out, but hey... that's how things go.  It will likely never get driven... it will sit on a shelf (likely next to the Clod...).  And as such, I was hoping to keep it clean and OG.

Ya.

Anyone got an extra original Pumpkin body kicking around?  

[Willy iine]

That’s not a lame story at all @bRIBEGuy.  It actually makes sense why you want to restore it!

RC is just a chunk of materials anyone with some extra cash can buy.   It’s the stories, memories, and appreciation that holds the true value.   

So yeah, sounds like you’re going to have to restore it now!   

[rich_f]

As a previous poster has said, why not try a paint cutting compound to see if it polishes out before you go down any of the more serious routes? You can get some marketed at modellers or you can use stuff for full-size cars.

I personally use one called mer. T-cut is another but I've had it soften paint before. There are plenty of others. 

[bRIBEGuy]

29 minutes ago, rich_f said:

As a previous poster has said, why not try a paint cutting compound to see if it polishes out before you go down any of the more serious routes? You can get some marketed at modellers or you can use stuff for full-size cars.

I personally use one called mer. T-cut is another but I've had it soften paint before. There are plenty of others. 

Plan A is currently just that: Attempt to polish away the sadness.

Plan B is repaint.

Plan C is having a new body magically appear in the mail as if by magic and start all over.  

[Raman36]

I feel you. The same happened to me 2 years ago with liquid mask. I painted the bed of the Subaru Brat TS black. Used BittyDesign Liquid masked. Painted body TS Red and went to peal off the mask.. well you just found out how that went.

Liquid masks do not work with most  laquers.  They do work with PS paints for some reason 

[Willy iine]

Honestly I would be very careful even with 3M Scotch masking tape.. even over fully cured TS surfaces.  Something with their adhesive interacts with the paint.    The only tape I trust on TS is Tamiya's masking tape..  I use 3M masking tape (or painter's tape) over Tamiya's tape.

I also have a box full of wide NIchiban washi (rice paper) masking tape which I am pretty certain is the same material as Tamiya's tape.  

[Juls1]

I had a similar issue when I tried to paint over a second hand body someone else had painted. I cleaned it back with sandpaper a touch, then on with the TS paint, it was quickly evident that the paint on the body wasn’t TS because the whole lot bubbled up into a soupy bubbly mess. Basically ruined the whole thing.
 

But I’m not as fussy as you about painting, if it takes more than a day to do a body then I’m out lol  

totally get the sentimental value about your early experiences with the car, most of us can value our early tamiya experiences and it’s why I’ve got a fox on the shelf (first tamiya I ever drove) and a fighter buggy rx (first tamiya I ever owned) both cars suck by todays standards but that isn’t the point is it. 

[rich_f]

And some advice for the future - try to minimise the amount of painted surface that any masking tape/fluid is actually touching, as the adhesive can affect the paint (but I have never had a problem with tamiya masking tape).

In other words, if you're only painting the window trim, only put the masking tape around the window trim. The rest of the body can be covered with newspaper or a cut-up plastic bag or whatever, which is then secured to the body by taping it to the tape you just put around the window trim. And for this you can get away with cheap painters masking tape.

This has 2 benefits:

1. If you're unlucky enough to have a bad reaction like this, it localises any damage caused by the adhesive to just the bit around the newly painted area (minimising the area needed to be repaired)

2. It reduces the amount of expensive masking tape/fluid needed to do the job 

[alvinlwh]

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