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typeshige

Re-Re electronics suggestions

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I'm an old RC guy. Started with the original Hot Shot at age 11.

My last RC was the Associated TC-3 touring car and I recently got back in with the Schumacher Cougar Classic (and Pro Cat Classic is on order).

I'm eying the Avante Black and Optima Mid next.

My only experience is with NiCd and brushed motors. I have a sense the new stuff is a lot more powerful (potentially) and Schumacher even has upgraded transmissions for modern motors.

That said, how can I start researching some brushed motors and escs that would be good in the re-res mentioned above. For reference I'm looking for the speed of an old RC-10 with a 10T modified brushed motor with matched NiCd batteries from the early 90s.

I don't know what kind of battery to get either some kind of lipo I imagine.

Thanks!

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You can stay with 7.2V NiMH if you want, several of us do.  A 2s lipo (rated 7.4V) is roughly 5-10% faster.  It handles the power drain of acceleration a bit better, so you get a little more punch on acceleration.

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I wouldn't waste any time looking for "fast" brushed motors. They simply aren't available any more, and the quality of those that might look suitable is very low.

Brushed is great for a "slow" runner, a Hobbywing 1060 and a sealed can motor can give fun performance for not much money.

If you want a fast car, brushless is the way to go. For the "race" throttle feel you need a sensored system. Even an 8.5 motor (the slowest modified motor you normally find) would feel fast compared to an old 10-turn motor running on NiCds. A 10.5 or 13.5 might be a bit easier on the drivetrain of the car (I know a couple of people who run 13.5s in their vintage buggies).

Hobbywing 10BL120 is a good value sensored ESC.

Certainly LiPo is the battery technology to go for. Again, the NiMH cells available today are poor quality compared to what was available in the past.

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As above, brushed motors are on their way out imo, even things like battery drills and washing machines are brushless these days.

Brushless have more power, more rpm and more efficient.

Similar with battery tech. Pretty much everything has a lithium battery, lightweight and alot more power.

There's a few lipo info pages out there, but found this one the best.

https://www.rogershobbycenter.com/lipoguide/

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Great! I probably wasn’t clear, I’m looking for what a modern brushless plus lipo combo to get that would be on par with a fast brushed motor from back in the day.

so far it seems like a 2s with 13.5 brushless might be the way to go! Thanks! I’ll need to research what the sensor stuff does for me but at least I have a starting point! Thanks everyone!

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I find a lot of people tend to lump the 2 things in together.
Motors and batteries.
They are completely independent of each other.
 some stuff to think about :
 Motors.  GO BRUSHLESS !!   seriously. you'll be amazed how little maintenance you need to do, and how quickly they get up to speed.
You do of course, need a brushless specific speed controller. and within that there are 2 general systems, Sensored, and sensorless.  go SENSORED !!  
as to which one, and which motor rating, well, that depends on what you are doing.  racing being VERY different to bashing.  17.5 or 13.5 quite common, and plenty fast.

Batteries.
Li-Po for sure is where it's at these days. However, there is a fair bit of a learning curve with those, and some specific equipment required as well, including some safety items.

Nickel Metal (Ni-Mh) are still quite usable, especially if you already have charging gear.

Lastly, I find, if you ask 100 people their opinion on these 2 items, you'll get close to 100 different opinions !
 I do always recommend going to your local club, if you have one, as those guys and girls tend be be running the most modern gear, so can help advise on what you would need, even if you don't intend on racing, and also there is always used stuff for sale, which tends to be higher end at decent prices !

  Have fun !   

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Awesome! Thanks I’m definitely interested in the most modern technology for my rereleases and very little of what I knew from before seems to apply but learning is part of the fun. Thanks for the advice! 

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Choosing what turn motor can be more difficult for rere cars. They often have limited gearing options, so while a 17.5T in a modern buggy or TC is plenty fast, it will be slow in a Boomerang because even with the biggest pinion its still under geared. I have no idea about the Avante or Optima, if you can easily swap spurs and pinions then even a 21.5T brushless can be fast.

I find 13.5T to be pretty decent in stuff like the Boomerang, its still under geared with the biggest pinion, but then the chassis can't handle much more anyway.

The other thing though is if you get an ESC with boost and turbo then the motor choice doesn't really matter, as you can program more or less speed in via the ESC. Even a cheap brushless ESC like the Trackstar 80a Turbo can do this, although you'd probably want something that can handle faster motors. I find the SkyRC TS120 to be good bang for buck, just get one of the program card options so you can program it.

So a 8.5T - 13.5T with a programmable ESC and lipo and you'll be set.

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Yikes, more variables to factor! Also I wonder what the cut off is for what the stock Cougar Classic transmission can handle before needing the heavy duty version.

 

maybe I need to build a collection of different motors. This is how the madness starts right?

Are the brushless lemans any good? Are they rebranded hobby wings or something? Might be fun to match that with the optima mid, and I did run the original lemans 240 in the hotshot too!

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@typeshige 

22 minutes ago, typeshige said:

 

Are the brushless lemans any good? Are they rebranded hobby wings or something? Might be fun to match that with the optima mid, and I did run the original lemans 240 in the hotshot too!

Yes, I installed one today, actually in my Optima MID.  I have the 15.5 version.   I am running a HobbyWing XR10 'just stock', LeMans 240S motor and it runs exceptionally smoothly.  If you plan to go with this setup, I suggest you also get the HobbyWing programmer (similar to the Novak Wizard from the TC3 days) so that you can edit the features of the XR10.

I also have an Optima MID with the LeMans 490 brushed motor with a HobbyWing 1060 ESC.  This is also a great mild set up unless you need to go fast.  

One thing to note is brushless motors have super torque.. the gearing you were once familiar with brushed motors do not really apply as brushless can take much lower gearing.  The interesting find with the LeMans 490 was that it can accept similar to brushless motor gearing.  So on the Optima MID, I run a 35 teeth pinion (kit pinion is 25) and it's got good speed even though it's a 15000 rpm motor..similar to a silver can..but with a lot more torque and does not run all that hot.  

The 15.5 with kit 25 teeth pinion Optima MID is noticeably faster than my brushed motor Optima MID, but it can probably take the same 35 teeth pinion as well and go significantly faster...especially with a 2S LiPo.  

 

On my rere Egress I wanted to keep the vintage flavor so I run a Tamiya SuperStock BZ brushed motor (26,500 rpm) with kit pinion and 1060 ESC.  It's fast enough for me.   GL with your planning and have fun out there!  :D 

 

Here is a fresh picture from earlier today of my Optima MID #2.

IMG_2022-11-6-093853.jpg.fae0d55ffce2a4c4da49a67fbaeb5412.jpg

 

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