buggy aesthetic

[Saito2 6686]

Is anyone else bummed out by how buggies look under their bodies nowadays? Running throughout the 80's into the early 90's, I have a picture in my mind of what cool buggy components look like.

Chassis: Typically, Aluminum, fiberglass/FRP or Carbon Graphite. AE's gold, black and neon colored aluminum tubs were boss but nothing looked sexier than a double deck graphite chassis

Shock towers: Again, give me fiberglass or graphite. I miss those long front shocks too. They instantly make me think AE's Stealth cars, JRX-Pro or even Top Force. Molded towers look entry level to me.

Shocks: Oh, lets see those beautiful anodized shocks again. Gold is great and Kyosho's were some of the best but silver or any other stand-out color is fine too. Dark to black shocks look so dour.

Colors. I typically wear black, dark grey or blue clothes but I want my buggies colorful, whether bright primaries from the 80's or the screamin' neons from the early 90's. Stick that tribal stuff elsewhere.

Tires: Spikes, X's H-pins, whatever, just make them look sharp and bite-y not soft and fuzzy.  

I am so bored with how modern racy buggies are lumps of molded black composite. Who knew that Losi's molded matrix composite chassis that debuted on the Junior 2 would propagate the way it did. I miss yellow CVAs. Black is boring. Tamiya could mold them in any color. Dull bronze colored hard anodized alloy shocks are nowhere near as cool as gold ones. There's something about all those different materials, stamped or cut out that looks better than something out of an injection molding machine. Molded black was Tamiya domain and the better the Tamiya the more special materials made their way into the kit. Just reminiscing...   

[Kol__ 3377]

Yep, I'm with you mate. I like a bit of stealth from time to time, but in general I love a colorful RC car! I have plans to rit dye quite a few sets of wheels and shock bodies for future builds, just to get some ******* colour on these things!!!

[markbt73 5316]

I think I know the aesthetic you're talking about. It's the sort of chassis that almost looks like the Terminator without his skin, almost skeletal, obviously mechanical, and 100% business. Metal and/or carbon fiber, massive parts count, none of this "the bulkhead is also the gearbox is also the shock tower" nonsense. Bits of the drivetrain exposed, like a clear gear cover or the little inspection windows on the Optima chain guides. (Or even better, an exposed chain like the Progress/Gallop or Rocky.) Sixteen different holes for mounting suspension links with no clear explanation as to what moving them to a different hole did, but the extra holes sure looked cool.

The sort of chassis that you just stared at for a while after building, because it was kinetic art in its own right. (The only reason I would ever want an Avante or Egress is just to stare at the completed chassis.) You're right; no modern pile of complex plastic moldings comes close. You can optimize the suspension geometry all you want, use whatever high-strength materials; it still looks like a toy next to an original RC10 or something.

[Willy iine 18806]

@Saito2  I agree.. this is why I only basically have rere versions of vintage RC buggies.  Dual deck CF is basically a requirement unless aluminum frame, like Kyosho for me.

But I am sure modern buggies are fun in their own ways.  

 

[Mad Ax 9313]

14 hours ago, Saito2 said:

Tamiya could mold them in any color

Or, Tamiya could mould them in white, and sell us dye to make them any colour we want.  How cool would that be?

[Saito2 6686]

10 hours ago, markbt73 said:

You're right; no modern pile of complex plastic moldings comes close. You can optimize the suspension geometry all you want, use whatever high-strength materials; it still looks like a toy next to an original RC10 or something.

Pretty much nails it. Take even an original RC10 and a new composite molded buggy, peel back their bodies (ok, you can throw the modern, cab-forward one in the trash bin) and show them to the general public. The RC10 looks like a race car, or something crafted at least, and the new buggy could come from Walmart in the average viewer's eyes.

1 hour ago, Mad Ax said:

Or, Tamiya could mould them in white, and sell us dye to make them any colour we want.  How cool would that be?

Such an excellent idea. Tamiya are you listening?

 

I think aesthetic in general is dour, angry and generally not fun anymore. Lifted 4x4s are prevalent in my area and I miss bright colors, chrome/polished aluminum wheels and a rack of smilin' KC Daylighter lights on a triple tube bed bar. Now everything is dark and brooding and serious and menacing. Even Jeeps have "angry eyes" now. Everything looks aggressive and hateful, much the way the drivers behind the wheel act as well. I guess bright colors are seen as silly and dark, broody ones are tough or mature (lol) but in the end we're all just big kids playing with toys, scale or 1:1. Sorry, I digress...

[Mad Ax 9313]

37 minutes ago, Saito2 said:

Everything looks aggressive and hateful, much the way the drivers behind the wheel act as well

Around 15 years ago, there was a Toyota or Nissan or other such lifted Japanese crew cab truck, painted black, with "Intimidator" written down the sides in big block letters.  I wonder what you need to be compensating for to drive something like that..?

Despite so much space being given to the woke agenda over the last decade, the world is still full of toxic masculinity.

[Willy iine 18806]

2 hours ago, Saito2 said:

I think aesthetic in general is dour, angry and generally not fun anymore. Lifted 4x4s are prevalent in my area and I miss bright colors, chrome/polished aluminum wheels and a rack of smilin' KC Daylighter lights on a triple tube bed bar. Now everything is dark and brooding and serious and menacing. Even Jeeps have "angry eyes" now. Everything looks aggressive and hateful, much the way the drivers behind the wheel act as well. I guess bright colors are seen as silly and dark, broody ones are tough or mature (lol) but in the end we're all just big kids playing with toys, scale or 1:1. Sorry, I digress...

This is so true and makes sense why I started liking classic Beetles recently.  It's basically a relief from all the modern looks you noted.  

I like things to have a fun demeanor..  (M38.. Willy looks so serious and yet so cute looking )..I have a few black version cars, but that was to contrast bright themes for variation. 

[Saito2 6686]

2 hours ago, Willy iine said:

This is so true and makes sense why I started liking classic Beetles recently.  It's basically a relief from all the modern looks you noted.

When the great recession hit, I moved into classic aircooled VWs for a few years as a hobby. It was such a refreshing break from, what is now termed, the toxic masculinity that permeated the muscle car world. While I returned to "muscle cars" later, I never did rejoin its "community" preferring to enjoy my vehicles outside of that lifestyle. I still dearly miss the AC VW world though, with its friendly, caring and sometimes entertainingly sharp-witted folks.

[Kol__ 3377]

21 minutes ago, Saito2 said:

I still dearly miss the AC VW world though, with its friendly, caring and sometimes entertainingly sharp-witted folks.

Its ok mate, you've got us bunch of dunces to fill that void now!😂😂

[Nicadraus 6199]

I agree, the looks and design of buggies back in the 80s and 90s were more "buggies" than F1 looking cars now. I love how the Wild One which I fell in love with looked like, as well as the Scorpion/Turbo Scorpion, RC10, Ultima, Optima, Astute/Super Astute, Avante/Egress, Top Force, Dyna Storm and the list goes on. Those buggy designs are timeless. It's disappointing how today's buggies look cheap as compared to before plus as mentioned, the parts used (FRP, Aluminum, CF vs mostly plastic). 

[Saito2 6686]

1 hour ago, Kol__ said:

Its ok mate, you've got us bunch of dunces to fill that void now!😂😂

Lol. No, there aren't any dunces here. This is, as mentioned by others, one of the nicest corners of the internet. A little less acerbic wit than the AC VW crowd (which could be brutal, but funny at times) but plenty of intelligence here.

[markbt73 5316]

I am absolutely over the "tactical" look for 1:1 4x4s. Never did like it, actually. Everything armor-plated and black powdercoated, rows and rows of LED light bars, black wheels with a few polished details picked out, or a ring of undoubtedly fake beadlock bolts, and the "angry face" grilles all need to go away. And what's funny is I associate all those things with cheapness and poor quality, possibly because I know how much of it comes from China and is sold for cheap through questionable outlets. Trucks like that don't look tough to me; they look flimsy and second-rate. Much like the modern RC chassis do.

Now, gimme a good old square-body Chevy or something with a chrome roll bar, tube bumpers, and Centerlines with white-letter tires, and that looks like someone spent some money and took some time on it. And it looks capable and purposeful, but it also looks like a blast. It may not actually be as capable as a modern off-roader, but it looks like so much more fun that I wouldn't care.

[Kowalski86 3034]

This might be the unpopular opinion, but for me the functionality and ease of repair are the most important factors with a chassis, I let the body be the part that looks cool.

That being said, most modern buggys lack the character of old offerings. They look more like door wedges than something you'd drive.

[Mrowka 495]

16 hours ago, markbt73 said:

I am absolutely over the "tactical" look for 1:1 4x4s. Never did like it, actually. Everything armor-plated and black powdercoated, rows and rows of LED light bars, black wheels with a few polished details picked out, or a ring of undoubtedly fake beadlock bolts, and the "angry face" grilles all need to go away. And what's funny is I associate all those things with cheapness and poor quality, possibly because I know how much of it comes from China and is sold for cheap through questionable outlets. Trucks like that don't look tough to me; they look flimsy and second-rate. Much like the modern RC chassis do.

Now, gimme a good old square-body Chevy or something with a chrome roll bar, tube bumpers, and Centerlines with white-letter tires, and that looks like someone spent some money and took some time on it. And it looks capable and purposeful, but it also looks like a blast. It may not actually be as capable as a modern off-roader, but it looks like so much more fun that I wouldn't care.

I'll take "What are 'Posers'?" for $500 and the Daily Double, Alex!

[Willy iine 18806]

I know Kyosho is planning to release a new buggy soon, but I'm not sold.  I still prefer their vintage buggies.  It needs to be a modern flagship buggy with CF, aluminum, and beautifully anodized dampers, etc etc to get me to buy one.  Go cheap and it looks cheap..and at my age, I don't want cheap looking things in my pretend RC shop.  I want only premium stuff. 

I like that they are adding interest to the industry, however.  Perhaps I'm just too old school.

[87lc2 2666]

Definitely agree on the buggy front (and the 1:1 street truck front), but I'm the opposite with my RC monsters.  I actually go out of my way to paint/powder coat everything black underneath so it looks more "real", like links, sway bars, etc.  Don't like the look of polished trailing arms, colored shocks, etc. on RC monsters.  With that said I often fly way under the radar when I go racing.  A lot of people never give my trucks a second look because the "bling" parts don't stand out which is fine with me.  For buggies its very cool though, anodized gold shocks are one of the greatest things ever created   

Guess this really has nothing to do with what you're asking, just what I thought when I read the original post. 

[Saito2 6686]

6 hours ago, Willy iine said:

I know Kyosho is planning to release a new buggy soon, but I'm not sold.  I still prefer their vintage buggies.

Oddly, that's what prompted this thread. When I initially saw the new Ultima Dirt Master, I was just happy to see an old-style rear motor 2wd buggy with a nice (read: non-cab forward) body. When I saw the body-off pics, I knew something felt missing. The whole thing's awash with black plastic. That got me thinking about how cool the first gen RC10s looked compared to the B4s. I mean, I'm grateful for this retro-ish offering from Kyosho, but some old-school bling and color pop would have put it over the top for me. Then again, its B4-style old-school (which doesn't seem old to me, but probably is now), not 80's old-school. 

[Willy iine 18806]

14 minutes ago, Saito2 said:

Oddly, that's what prompted this thread. When I initially saw the new Ultima Dirt Master, I was just happy to see an old-style rear motor 2wd buggy with a nice (read: non-cab forward) body. When I saw the body-off pics, I knew something felt missing. The whole thing's awash with black plastic. That got me thinking about how cool the first gen RC10s looked compared to the B4s. I mean, I'm grateful for this retro-ish offering from Kyosho, but some old-school bling and color pop would have put it over the top for me. Then again, its B4-style old-school (which doesn't seem old to me, but probably is now), not 80's old-school. 

Yeah, I hope they release a competition grade (CF?) soon after.. not that I’m going to be racing, but I want something with a more premium feel and appearance..

Too bad the market is forcing manufacturers to go cheap.. 

[Kol__ 3377]

1 hour ago, Saito2 said:

When I initially saw the new Ultima Dirt Master, I was just happy to see an old-style rear motor 2wd buggy with a nice (read: non-cab forward) body. When I saw the body-off pics, I knew something felt missing. The whole thing's awash with black plastic.

I think this is due to where this product is aimed. It's a cheaper offering from Kyosho and not one of the premium Legendary buggies. It's affordable and most importantly it looks useable. It's not something I personally would buy and sit it on the shelf as a queen because it's too nice and too expensive to risk damaging. The Dirt Master is something I would and probably will to be honest (and it would be my first Kyosho) buy to use and bash it and just have a laugh with it. It looks durable, I assume spare parts will be readily available and that it will take brushless no problem. For the price point and the intended buyer/user it looks spot on to me🙂

[ThunderDragonCy 7881]

Question then: would you buy something fairly high end and modern layout (CF chassis, mid motor, modern diff, long arm suspension, shorty lipo fitment etc) if it had a vintage style body? I am a big fan of grafting the classic bodies onto more useable and better driving chassis, and that Dirt Master hits the spot for me. But a lot of people here seem to want really high end. So what if kyosho had done a dirt master style shell on an RB7 variant? Would that do it? Or do you think it would lose something in being so modern in layout? 

[BuggyDad 4475]

13 minutes ago, Kol__ said:

I assume spare parts will be readily available 🙂

Fingers crossed! 

Perhaps not the same thing but my searching for the odd Mid part has left me thinking this might be an issue. A lot of things are not very available (or seem expensive for what they are. So hopefully they'll see this differently and back it up with full parts availability. 

[Saito2 6686]

36 minutes ago, Kol__ said:

think this is due to where this product is aimed. It's a cheaper offering from Kyosho and not one of the premium Legendary buggies. It's affordable and most importantly it looks useable. It's not something I personally would buy and sit it on the shelf as a queen because it's too nice and too expensive to risk damaging. The Dirt Master is something I would and probably will to be honest (and it would be my first Kyosho) buy to use and bash it and just have a laugh with it. It looks durable, I assume spare parts will be readily available and that it will take brushless no problem. For the price point and the intended buyer/user it looks spot on to me🙂

I think you're spot on and I'd probably get it for some guilt-free bashing. I've got to keep in mind that what I consider beautiful buggy aesthetic, chassis-wise, is definitely in rerelease-land by this point. The B4 architecture (and TRF201/RB5) was pretty darn good and not so dated that it needs to be apologized for which is where Kyosho is definitely going with this. 

[BuggyDad 4475]

43 minutes ago, ThunderDragonCy said:

Question then: would you buy something fairly high end and modern layout (CF chassis, mid motor, modern diff, long arm suspension, shorty lipo fitment etc) if it had a vintage style body? I am a big fan of grafting the classic bodies onto more useable abs better driving chassis, and that Dirt Master hits the spot for me. But a lot of people here seem to want really high end. So what if kyosho had done a dirt master style shell on an RB7 variant? Would that do it? Or do you think it would lose something in being so modern in layout? 

I sit somewhere in the middle.

For me, the more vintage(/"scale") style shells appeal more and anywhere outside of racing (maybe even racing too, to some extent?) are presumably almost entirely a style choice. 

Anything other than a really top end chassis is a balance between price and performance, and although it shouldn't be driven by looks we have preconceived ideas of what high performance looks like, so people value carbon and shiny metal. But then also, i have a big soft spot for examples of great performance at a lower price point, because that's a big achievement in itself. I've got an Optima Mid to build and when I do I might (but probably won't) be a bit afraid of running it.  

In between are the very visible (on a buggy) bits like shocks and towers, where they certainly affect the aesthetic and a bit of colour wouldn't hurt, and probably wouldn't cost much extra either. I think they could've done that. But then again, so can the buyer. Stick colourful shocks, CF towers and chrome wheels on it? 

I am a big fan in things like architecture of "form follows function" but that doesn't preclude a bit of fun in your finishes.

Edit: just had another look at it and I applaud it and it looks like it drives brilliantly, but I do also think the shell is a bit bland as @GeeWings just posted. It's designed in a slightly retro theme but is I guess deliberately understated. Result is a bit "Racing Fighter". Then again, I'd also be wary of trying too hard to pretend to be old - that often stands out like a sore thumb. 

[Kol__ 3377]

8 minutes ago, Saito2 said:

rerelease-land

That sounds like the best place ever😎

Two things spring to mind, one being that many of us live rerelease-land in our thoughts and ways throughout our daily RC journeys, and the second is that...

...if that was a real place, how good a trip could the TC gang have if we all got together and visited the magical theme park "Rerelease-Land", coach trip style!😆