Trying to understand the new XV-02RS PRO variant

[echobase 5]

Hello everyone, this is my first post to this great forum. Vive Tamiya!

I’m looking to build an XV-01 or XV-02 chassis. TBH, I don’t have a suitable off-road location close at hand to visit regularly enough. So it’s tarmac for me. Even though the XV-01 is reputed to edge out the XV-02 in tarmac handling excitement and really tempts me, it’s the growing plentifulness and better pricing of parts for the XV-02 that is hard to ignore.

I see the new XV-02RS PRO variant is available. It’s priced lower than the original XV-02 and yet…it seems to be a step up with the inclusion of more upgraded parts??? Am I reading that right? Is it better equipped than the original?

[skom25 1906]

XV-02RS is on road version of XV-02. It is like XV-01TC which was on road version of XV-01.

Remember that you have to buy electronics ( in both generations) and body ( only in XV-02). However, XV-02RS price is really nice and to be honest, I started to think why I have not bought it. 

I bought XV-01 but with few Hop Ups it is somewhere around price of XV-02.

If you will run it only on tarmac, maybe it is worth to consider e.g. TT-02S? 

[toyolien 5595]

The RS is the tarmac version of the XV-02. The only differences are a carbon reinforced chassis and shorter dampers with carbon stays. The rest is the same I believe. The original XV02 is more suited to off road, but can be made perfectly good on road with a few tweeks. But, for purely tarmac I'd go RS.

[Kowalski86 4076]

If you've never had an on-road RC before, I suggest starting with a basic TT-02. Then when you feel the need to get into hop-ups, grab an XV-02.

Its better to start a new part of the hobby with something cheap and simple, just in case if you end up not liking it.

[bRIBEGuy 3376]

14 minutes ago, Kowalski86 said:

If you've never had an on-road RC before, I suggest starting with a basic TT-02. Then when you feel the need to get into hop-ups, grab an XV-02.

Its better to start a new part of the hobby with something cheap and simple, just in case if you end up not liking it.

Or "Buy once cry once"?

I think the "start cheap" argument has a time and a place, but I have also seen it drive people out of a hobby.  If you have your eye on something nice, and can afford said nice thing... I say go for it.  Then again, I have no love for the TT-02, and I DO like the XV-01/02, so maybe I'm also biased?  Or just a terrible enabler?

When I worked in the cycling industry, it was VERY common for new cyclists (with some money) to talk themselves out of a decent bike.  They come in with a particular $3000 bike in mind...... cash in hand.....and love it.... and then start looking at cheaper stuff.  Often they would get pushed towards this cheaper option (friend, significant other, sales staff), and settle on something half the price.  A month later they're back not really happy with the bike.  Can I go Tubeless?  Well yes... but you need new tires first.    Can I run metallic brake pads?  Yes, but you need new rotors first.  6 months and hundreds of dollars later, they're still not happy, and wishing they had bough the better bike to start with... but maybe no longer have the means (or interest) in doing so.  After a while they would associate their bad experience with a cheap product with the hobby/sport, and instead of "trying again", they would leave.

I probably should have used an RC car example (of which I have as well), but I guess it's a bit late for that now.  Whoops.

XV02RS seems like a great option (IMO) for tarmack running.  If you decide you want to boost it up a bit for some mild offroad later, you can just swap on different shocks and towers.

[skom25 1906]

13 minutes ago, bRIBEGuy said:

Or "Buy once cry once"?

I think the "start cheap" argument has a time and a place, but I have also seen it drive people out of a hobby.  If you have your eye on something nice, and can afford said nice thing... I say go for it.  Then again, I have no love for the TT-02, and I DO like the XV-01/02, so maybe I'm also biased?  Or just a terrible enabler?

When I worked in the cycling industry, it was VERY common for new cyclists (with some money) to talk themselves out of a decent bike.  They come in with a particular $3000 bike in mind...... cash in hand.....and love it.... and then start looking at cheaper stuff.  Often they would get pushed towards this cheaper option (friend, significant other, sales staff), and settle on something half the price.  A month later they're back not really happy with the bike.  Can I go Tubeless?  Well yes... but you need new tires first.    Can I run metallic brake pads?  Yes, but you need new rotors first.  6 months and hundreds of dollars later, they're still not happy, and wishing they had bough the better bike to start with... but maybe no longer have the means (or interest) in doing so.  After a while they would associate their bad experience with a cheap product with the hobby/sport, and instead of "trying again", they would leave.

I probably should have used an RC car example (of which I have as well), but I guess it's a bit late for that now.  Whoops.

XV02RS seems like a great option (IMO) for tarmack running.  If you decide you want to boost it up a bit for some mild offroad later, you can just swap on different shocks and towers.

I am also cycling guy but remember one thing: you have to build Tamiya kit.

I started now with XV-01. I built and heavily upgraded DT-03 and TT-02B so I can say, that I have some experience. Despite that, I think XV-01 is quite complicated kit and I am not sure if it is good choice for first try.

TT-02S is not simple car. It has TRF suspension and rest of parts are standard. Talking shortly, you have great suspension with no slope and cheap rest of the parts. I considered it and really wanted but I run also on pavement, so Touring Car ride height is not for me.

BTW, my impression is that it will not be OP first model, so maybe discussion does not make sense.

BTW #2: all rotors can be used with metallic pads. They will just last bit shorter and heat dissipation is not great in low end level

[Elbowloh 1235]

My first proper road bike came with a decent frame, but "only" tiagra groupset, but didn't want to splash too much as I didn't know if I'd really get into cycling...within months, I'd bought an ultegra groupset and fitted it myself. I'm, guessing I'm an upgrade and tinker kind of guy!

[bRIBEGuy 3376]

13 minutes ago, skom25 said:

BTW #2: all rotors can be used with metallic pads. They will just last bit shorter and heat dissipation is not great in low end level

Not true.  Shimano has a whole line of rotors that at resin pad only.  Very easy to damage if you use a metallic pad with.  Just FYI. 

 

6 minutes ago, Elbowloh said:

My first proper road bike came with a decent frame, but "only" tiagra groupset, but didn't want to splash too much as I didn't know if I'd really get into cycling...within months, I'd bought an ultegra groupset and fitted it myself. I'm, guessing I'm an upgrade and tinker kind of guy!

Nice upgrade!

Sorry @echobase, not trying to derail(leur) your thread!

[echobase 5]

Thank you all for these illuminating replies. I don't mind the extra outlay for the XV-02. I'm an engineer and am looking for a really fun build experience as much as anything else. I suspect I'll enjoy the fit and finish of the XV-02. I should've added before that my favorite bits of this forum are the build logs! The more detail and build tips, the better! I assume a thread-forming tap will be in order for the XV-02 chassis and other components?

[Kowalski86 4076]

29 minutes ago, bRIBEGuy said:

I probably should have used an RC car example (of which I have as well), but I guess it's a bit late for that now.  Whoops.

9 times out of 10, the RC equivalent is to attempt to get in to the hobby with a cheap Amazon/Bangood special "'because one of them youtubers said they good", which I always advise against.

I hear you on the TT though, it's why I suggest "upgrading" to an XV or any of the nicer TB/TA chassis before anyone starts tossing hop-ups at it.

[skom25 1906]

3 minutes ago, bRIBEGuy said:

Not true.  Shimano has a whole line of rotors that at resin pad only.  Very easy to damage if you use a metallic pad with.  Just FYI. 

 

Nice upgrade!

Sorry @echobase, not trying to derail(leur) your thread!

I used different rotors designed for wide pads, so bottom line of Shimano products. All were fine with metallic pads.

Just my experience and opinion. I do not want to start war

2 minutes ago, echobase said:

Thank you all for these illuminating replies. I don't mind the extra outlay for the XV-02. I'm an engineer and am looking for a really fun build experience as much as anything else. I suspect I'll enjoy the fit and finish of the XV-02. I should've added before that my favorite bits of this forum are the build logs! The more detail and build tips, the better! I assume a thread-forming tap will be in order for the XV-02 chassis and other components?

Definitely go for Thread Forming Tool from Tamiya. It is gamechanger.

[Rinskie 860]

I actually like the idea of the RS and might consider getting one later on down the road. I see it still as a rally car, just the street version of it as oppose to a delicate touring car. May be totally wrong but that's how I see it. I have nothing to add about bikes, sorry. 

[Willy iine 18826]

I'm definitely getting the RS if I decide to drive more outdoors on parking lots.   I have the XV02-Pro and it is a fantastic car.  I just like the hopups the RS comes with in stock form.. Tamiya should do a XV02-Pro2 with the same hopups on the rally version.. that might better suite me.

[Blista 1549]

I'd go with the XV02RS.  On loose surfaces the XV01 is great, but I don't think it would be better on tarmac.  There's a few hassles with the XV01 that the XV02 doesn't have as well, like the battery compartment.

[Re-Bugged 11297]

I found myself in a similar predicament @echobase weighing up between the 3 XV’s

The XV-01 became very attractive due to a decent price drop, and I don’t have a belt drive on road car.

The XV-02 PRO was new so parts should be in good supply.

Then came the XV-02 RS. That got me most excited.

In the decision making I answered my own question in another thread as about 99% of off road scenarios were I am need really need at least a 2.2 wheel to enjoy them.

I ended up going for the XV-02RS as it to would be mostly used on tarmac. I also liked the idea of it being easier to install electrics than the XV-01 & getting the battery in and out. ( & I didn’t want another TT02 chassis either 😉) I already had a Body shell I wanted to use and felt the the high Shock Tower of the Pro wouldn’t work for it.

The Chassis was a lovely build, but I’d recommend a thread forming tool as the M3 countersunk screws hex heads are a bit soft and shallow stripping the head easily if not careful. The Button heads weren’t a problem though.

The Dampers in it are just fantastic.

The kit comes with the plastic long damper shock towers sprue as the Pro, so you could fit longer dampers down the track if you want to. There is lots of unused droop on the suspension arms so you could also fit slightly longer dampers than the RS comes with as well.

I added the front body post brace, aluminium steering arms & an aluminium spur gear holder in the way of hop ups when I ordered it.

I’ve still never owned an XV-01 to compare it to but I was very happy with the RS after a quick shakedown when it was finished.

Oh yes nearly forgot, the RS doesn’t come with the clear Lexan chassis cover that the Pro has. 
 

(on a side note about bikes, I thought Carbon frames were all hype, until I got one now I can’t go back to aluminium. Both my Roadie & MTB are now Carbon 😉)

[chris.alex 1080]

A friend of mine recently wanted to buy a second XV02 pro. His plan was to convert it into a street version. Then Tamiya released the XV02 RS pro. He still bought the non-RS kit. His reasons: 1. He prefers the rallye wheels and tyres. 2. He likes the dust cover. 3. It's a little cheaper, so he can buy the carbon shock towers for the price difference, he already has the appropriate dampers.

[BuggyDad 5390]

12 hours ago, echobase said:

Thank you all for these illuminating replies. I don't mind the extra outlay for the XV-02. I'm an engineer and am looking for a really fun build experience as much as anything else. I suspect I'll enjoy the fit and finish of the XV-02. I should've added before that my favorite bits of this forum are the build logs! The more detail and build tips, the better! I assume a thread-forming tap will be in order for the XV-02 chassis and other components?

In that case I would most certainly go for an XV-something over a TT-02, because you'll appreciate its design ideas, materials etc over a cheap quick kit. I've built and run an XV-01, which I really like, and have an XV-02 kit to build sometime soonish. from what I read (most notably @Willy iine's comments comparing the two although I don't know where to find them) I suspect you might also appreciate the step up in quality of XV-02 over 01, for both how it affects the enjoyment of the build and the quality of the end product. Price differences probably small enough not to affect your decision. 

[skom25 1906]

What is cost of XV-01 and XV-02 now in your area?

I bought XV-01 Lancia Delta for 890 PLN. XV-02 costs 1308 PLN + Body around 200 PLN, so at least in Poland, it is not marginal difference. It is on totally different level.

1 Euro is around 4.5 PLN now.

[BuggyDad 5390]

22 minutes ago, skom25 said:

What is cost of XV-01 and XV-02 now in your area?

I bought XV-01 Lancia Delta for 890 PLN. XV-02 costs 1308 PLN + Body around 200 PLN, so at least in Poland, it is not marginal difference. It is on totally different level.

1 Euro is around 4.5 PLN now.

Fair enough. I might've bought my XV-02 kit on a great deal from the far east now I think about it, vs XV-01 locally. And my XV-01 cost more than yours (just over £200). 

[Willy iine 18826]

Hummm.. I did not know the RS does not come with a cover, thanks for the info, @Re-Bugged.  Not that it's a show stopper since my touring cars never had a cover, but where I drive (unprepared parking lot) a cover is nice to have.   

I'd probably just get the XV02-Pro cover assuming it fits the RS.  

I do understand where @chris.alex's friend is coming from.  The rally tires actually work EXCELLENT on unprepared surfaces with the right amount of grip and wears real nice.  I don't need to think about which compound to take based on temperature or driving surface.. rally blocks just work over concrete, asphalt, loose gravel, dirt even.  Can't say that about most touring tires as they are pretty picky.. 

The XV01 is a bit of a pain to get the battery out from the bottom as I also need a screw driver to remove the cover, but vs that and removing body clips and cover to get to the battery on the XV02-Pro, not sure which is more convenient.   I suppose my argument (?) is why did Tamiya not offer bottom loading battery (using clips like HotShot/WildOne or Kyosho Scorpion) on the XV02-Pro and just leave the cover on 100% of the time.  

[skom25 1906]

I think it really depends on person. I have my body clips on TT-02B really tight and HATE to remove body. Cover on bottom looks nice in that terms.

Probably XV-02 is better, because it is just newer. I believe ( hope?) Tamiya just listen users and try to fix issues. On the other hand, XV-01 has unique handling and belt. 

[njmlondon 572]

I am just finishing my XV01 off and already considering my next build. I mainly drive on tarmac and have both perfectly smooth areas and nice and rough / broken tarmac to play with.

Amongst the many reasons I chose the XV01, one of them was the quietness. Whenever I watch a video of one, I am blown away by the whispering silence insead of the high pitched squeal I get from my older TA chassis. I thought that may be the belt driven vs shaft...

Does anybody have both and can you comment on the noise levels / types. I don't know why but I just love the butter smooth sounds of the 01.

[Willy iine 18826]

4 hours ago, njmlondon said:

I am just finishing my XV01 off and already considering my next build. I mainly drive on tarmac and have both perfectly smooth areas and nice and rough / broken tarmac to play with.

Amongst the many reasons I chose the XV01, one of them was the quietness. Whenever I watch a video of one, I am blown away by the whispering silence insead of the high pitched squeal I get from my older TA chassis. I thought that may be the belt driven vs shaft...

Does anybody have both and can you comment on the noise levels / types. I don't know why but I just love the butter smooth sounds of the 01.

I never thought my XV02-Pro was 'loud' but it could be because it has a cover and a body on top to insulate the noise.   Belt is very quiet and I like that too.

I've had great luck with my XV01 driving it in front of my house.  My driving space is similar to yours, mostly concrete, a few rough spots, and a little gravel area.  It kind of took my TT02B's place as the XV01 does pretty much everything my TT02B can do.. well, the Delta body's front clearance is a bit low, but besides that. 

Since you already have the XV01 I would just enjoy that car without adding any hopups unless you really need it.  Mine is bone stock (except for high torque servo saver if the car did not come with one) and running a BZ motor.   I am happy the way it is.. huge bang for the buck, Delta looks sharp, and fun to drive.   If I was to do it again, I would get a BL motor, perhaps a 17.5 or 15.5 for maintenance free.. but I had a pretty decent stash of BZ motors so wanted to use them.

 

[chris.alex 1080]

6 hours ago, njmlondon said:

I am just finishing my XV01 off and already considering my next build. I mainly drive on tarmac and have both perfectly smooth areas and nice and rough / broken tarmac to play with.

Amongst the many reasons I chose the XV01, one of them was the quietness. Whenever I watch a video of one, I am blown away by the whispering silence insead of the high pitched squeal I get from my older TA chassis. I thought that may be the belt driven vs shaft...

Does anybody have both and can you comment on the noise levels / types. I don't know why but I just love the butter smooth sounds of the 01.

I also like the low quietness of my XV01. However, my XV02 is a relatively quiet vehicle too. Maybe it's the newer oil diffs that keep the car quiet even though it's driven by a propeller shaft.

[njmlondon 572]

2 hours ago, Willy iine said:

I never thought my XV02-Pro was 'loud' but it could be because it has a cover and a body on top to insulate the noise.   Belt is very quiet and I like that too.

I've had great luck with my XV01 driving it in front of my house.  My driving space is similar to yours, mostly concrete, a few rough spots, and a little gravel area.  It kind of took my TT02B's place as the XV01 does pretty much everything my TT02B can do.. well, the Delta body's front clearance is a bit low, but besides that. 

Since you already have the XV01 I would just enjoy that car without adding any hopups unless you really need it.  Mine is bone stock (except for high torque servo saver if the car did not come with one) and running a BZ motor.   I am happy the way it is.. huge bang for the buck, Delta looks sharp, and fun to drive.   If I was to do it again, I would get a BL motor, perhaps a 17.5 or 15.5 for maintenance free.. but I had a pretty decent stash of BZ motors so wanted to use them.

 

This is my 2nd XV01... had one a while ago and sold it to focus on an expensive vintage restoration, but realised I missed it. For the first time in years I decided to go stock and not add the bling. I think the XV01 is close to perfect as a runner as Tamiya make straight out of the box. I was going to do a long damper conversion but at the last minute bought the 1998 Subaru body and it sits too high so had to switch back. Mine has a rather nice Technigold motor onboard (not branded as Technigold but exactly the same motor) that I bought a while ago and it does look pretty up front!