TTC for Blitzer series

[ruebiracer 1171]

Hi guys, 

fiddling on my next Monster beetle, I tested a main shaft I made from the TRF201 for my MB also in my Blitzer beetle, which I used in April 2024 for attending the Tamico offroad cup. The result is nice, and will be tested the next weeks. It means nothing less than Tamiya Traction control in combination with an oil filled gear diff from TB04 in a serial blitzer gear case:

[ruebiracer 1171]

It´s tight, but clearance is given:

[ruebiracer 1171]

The gear diff mod I already run in the cup in April, it worked flawlessly. But I kept it very open with 7k oil for the dusty clay track. (seems reasonably locked for an Touring car, but with the big monster wheels it´s still quite free to work with the slippery condition. But I´d wish I would have had the slipper already in April. 

More infos and testing to come...

[BuggyDad 5385]

I would love to find a way to fit both a sealed gear diff and different spurs for gearing adjustment into the Blitzer gearbox. It'd enable me to set the gearing for buggy wheels (I've used the Blitzer chassis and gearbox to make my "Super Falcon").

Are you using rare parts there or could this be done with standard stuff? I'd be very interested to see a breakdown of what you've done? 

[wtcc5 5569]

@ruebiracer: This is genius!

[ruebiracer 1171]

Thank you Kevin for the kind comment! Actually the diff idea I had after seeing your Sand Viper mod!

[ruebiracer 1171]

@Buggydad:

These are the ratios I already checked! I chose for the Torque tuned the ratio identical to the 15t pinion I drove in the Tamico Offroad cup. 23/75 is this giving 8,75:1. But many others are possible in either the 13z mounting holes or the 15z mounting holes (upper ratios). So it´s possible, to build ratios in the range of the bear hawk. So, there should be something to find for your awesome Super Falcon!

[BuggyDad 5385]

13 hours ago, ruebiracer said:

@Buggydad:

These are the ratios I already checked! I chose for the Torque tuned the ratio identical to the 15t pinion I drove in the Tamico Offroad cup. 23/75 is this giving 8,75:1. But many others are possible in either the 13z mounting holes or the 15z mounting holes (upper ratios). So it´s possible, to build ratios in the range of the bear hawk. So, there should be something to find for your awesome Super Falcon!

Nice - thanks! I'd love to know what parts you used for shaft, slipper parts, spur? Also, how is the spur end of the shaft held in the case? Did you drill through so you keep the normal bearing but the spring is outside of it? 

[ruebiracer 1171]

You´re correct @BuggyDad! Spur end is covered by a bearing, and the spring set outside the gear box. Load is applied over the inner ring of the bearing.

It run 20 minutes ago the third time today, and it works like acharm now! Had to shim some clearance for the spring load, so that the spring seat is not in contact before the clutch discs. But it´s very fine adjustable. I only knew the DF03 Slipper clutch so far.

[ruebiracer 1171]

What I used is:

Tamiya 54260 DN01 slipper clutch set (identical TRF201)

1 flanged 850 bearing,

1 flanged 840 bearing (both from TRF 416)

1 blue M3 locknut.

Some 4,5 mm inner diameter  Tamiya shims for fine adjustment on the slipper shaft.

1 Asso 75T 48dp slipper Spur (identical to Tamiya design), guess it´s from B6.

1 Traxxas pinion gear 23T 48dp mounted in the Tamiya 15t pinion motor mounting holes.

1 Pinion for 5mm axle, 19T 0,8 module as drive for the diff on the slipper shaft. 

[ruebiracer 1171]

First step is to bore through the 5mm axle seats from the original spur gear axle. It´s easy with a step reamer with mm steps. Final bore has to be 8mm, so that the 2 flanged bearings can be popped on.

I also reamed the diff outdrive holes up to 10mm, to let the outdrives from the oil diff be slided in place from the inside, as these are assembled with the oil filled gear diff in advance.

[ruebiracer 1171]

Here the main shaft, have to do better pics:

The high reflecting area is the "2flat connection for the pressure discs. This area has to be prolonged with a Dremel, CNC or hand tools.ca. 4mm to the right side in the pic. There is a little diameter step up to 5mm, which is the perfect border for the end of the lengthened 2 flat. The area has an inch diameter for the spurs from Asso and TRF 201. For this reason, I milled the diameter of the shaft at the end of the thread down to 4mm ca. 4 mm wide to take the 40 bearing.

The 19Z counter gear can be mounted on the main shaft with the 3mm inbus screw then. As I used a quite big Traxxas pinion already suited for 5mm shaft, milled it down on a small lathe to reduce the diameter of the step screw part, to avoid a collision in the gear half. didn´t want to dremel the plastic of the gear box. If a regular pinion with 3,17mm bore is used and bored up to 5mm shaft thickness, this step is not needed. 

[ruebiracer 1171]

Have to make more pics, as I only did take some for my Monster Beetle slipper so far. So Blitzer will be driven a full pack and dismantled afterwards for pics of the single parts and build in manual. Hope you have the patience with me, little bit stressy at the moment. I just can say, it sounds nice when driving, and it makes the BB more driveable. It´s quite surprising, how fast this car is with a torque tuned on 2s, I was surprised in the Tamico cup about the top end speed and acceleration. 

[ruebiracer 1171]

Spoiler :

this was the initial dream, MB TTC Version 2.0 (with serial gear box width). But Blitzer compatibility was obvious with a little fiddling.

[BuggyDad 5385]

46 minutes ago, ruebiracer said:

Here the main shaft, have to do better pics:

The high reflecting area is the "2flat connection for the pressure discs. This area has to be prolonged with a Dremel, CNC or hand tools.ca. 4mm to the right side in the pic. There is a little diameter step up to 5mm, which is the perfect border for the end of the lengthened 2 flat. The area has an inch diameter for the spurs from Asso and TRF 201. For this reason, I milled the diameter of the shaft at the end of the thread down to 4mm ca. 4 mm wide to take the 40 bearing.

The 19Z counter gear can be mounted on the main shaft with the 3mm inbus screw then. As I used a quite big Traxxas pinion already suited for 5mm shaft, milled it down on a small lathe to reduce the diameter of the step screw part, to avoid a collision in the gear half. didn´t want to dremel the plastic of the gear box. If a regular pinion with 3,17mm bore is used and bored up to 5mm shaft thickness, this step is not needed. 

Wow. This is all great info on a mod that's a real stroke of genius I think. 

So the flats on the shaft for the slipper plates have to be extended by 4mm essentially because the bearing to the gearbox casing is moving from between the gears to outside the spur, right? 

I need to get more coordinated with my Dremel! 😬

A small lathe would be a wonderful thing to own I think. 

[ThunderDragonCy 8125]

@ruebiracer This is fantastic! Two questions:

1) Could you skip the step where you turn the 4mm section for the bearing if you used an inch size bearing? You would need to make the hole in that diff half inch size too, but that's easier that needing a lathe. 

2) Could the TD4 slipper kit work too? I have one and i am 99% sure it's same as the 201 kit. This is more easily available at the moment.

Thanks!

[ruebiracer 1171]

Hey my friend, try to answer your questions:

1. You can skip that step in 2 ways: keep it original and use an 850 bearing instead of the 840. this leaves a tiny bit of slop. I thought about putting a dab of Tamiya rubber cement between the bearing inner ring and the axle during assembly. This way the bearing could slightly move elastic left to right to transfer the axle loads by changing spring pressure of the clutch. The little rubber film stops the wobble and kills the slight klicking noise.

Alternative: your way. Take e.g. a Team Associated bearing for 3/16 inch (=4,625mm) / 5/16 inch (=7,9375mm) in flanged design. There is a pack of 2 in Team Associated AE6902. The original is up to 25€ here in Germany, but if you have a source for cheaper clones, it´s more attractive.

2. The TD4 slipper is a 100% match. Funny is, it´s even cheaper than the DN1 version at the moment, although the kit contains more stuff. (Tamiya 222031)

[ruebiracer 1171]

On 7/16/2024 at 12:02 AM, BuggyDad said:

Wow. This is all great info on a mod that's a real stroke of genius I think. 

So the flats on the shaft for the slipper plates have to be extended by 4mm essentially because the bearing to the gearbox casing is moving from between the gears to outside the spur, right? 

I need to get more coordinated with my Dremel! 😬

A small lathe would be a wonderful thing to own I think. 

Thanks for the kind words @BuggyDad, indeed I spent a lot of time on ideas to make this mod as simple as possible. This way some more users can try to built one for themselves! And don´t worry about your Dremel talents: The photo shows the second main shaft I made as perfect as possible for my Monster beetle. There I could use my dad´s small model-lathe to make the bearing seat smaller. The 2 flat was done by a collegue at work, who modified it during lunch break on a CNC machine for a favour. I was a lucky guy. Anyway, the first shaft is the one running in the Blitzer. This was done as aprototype already 3 years ago by me and a classic file. It looks far from perfect, but is functional. I found an old pic during the making: you have to be patient, but it can be done with hand tools:

[ruebiracer 1171]

With the pressure plate sliding on and off you can check your progress. less is more for each file move.

My intention was, to make my slipper conversion from 2012 much more easy and feasible for more Tamiya fans around the world. Unfortunately, some steps may still be one step too much for most fans. But it´s the closest up to now I ever built. For Tamiya it would be so easy, to make a modified main shaft and a counter pinion for the diff.10-20€ in Tamiya pricing.

Found again the packaging of the pinion for the counter gear:

It´s an Arrowmax AM308019:

[Mad Ax 10127]

Fantastic work - I love this kind of ingenuity!  I probably wouldn't be able to race that mod at Iconic Revival because it uses parts from later cars, but it's a great mod nonetheless.

[BuggyDad 5385]

On 7/12/2024 at 11:21 PM, ruebiracer said:

It´s tight, but clearance is given:

How's the mesh between (repurposed) pinion and diff? It might be the photo or the open case but it looks a bit loose? 

[ruebiracer 1171]

34 minutes ago, BuggyDad said:

How's the mesh between (repurposed) pinion and diff? It might be the photo or the open case but it looks a bit loose? 

It´s the open case and the axle slightly tilting. It´s completely original mesh when assembled, as the pinion is exactly the same size as the plastic counter gear spur. 

[Collin 2041]

Hey cool slipper mod. Tamiya slipper clutches mostly are the same now and TD4 is a precious gift only because of transmission parts : )

DN1 slipper pressue plates have a larger diameter then new ones, isnt it?

[ruebiracer 1171]

Hi Tom,

thanks for your nice comment. Actually, I think these are the same as TD4. At least, Seidel in Germany sells it this way as spare part.

[Collin 2041]

Aw.. of course. DF03 are the one with larger diameter. All the rest should fit the same shaft.