Hornet EVO Build - write up on page two.

[MadAnt]

I have plans for the Hornet evo coming, I will do an update eventually with my setup and also discuss a low buck setup for those who want to build one. Some of the "quirks" the Hornet EVO has is really not a big deal and can be fixed during assembly for pretty cheap or nothing. Most of the things you need to make the Hornet EVO better are already included in the kit.

Anyway, I'm now spending money on upgrading the Hornet EVO, but it just looks so good now. It's an experiment and my own personal flavor adding some Kyosho Scorpion wheels with some recycled Hotshot tires mounted on them.

[Andreas W]

@MadAnt. Looking forward to that update. These wheels are really tasty on these cars. Icarsa modern take on the classic design allowing us to run modern tyres while looking the business. 

[MadAnt]

Another small update.

I've been having an issue where the car would steer slightly or wonder to one side or the other. I noticed it was progressively getting worse over time, so I disconnected the servo from the servo saver and discovered that the bellcrank linkages were rubbing on the front control arm mount/bulkhead. It can be felt and when I took the front apart the wear marks were clear on the parts.

I beveled the edges of the idler arms and removed some plastic from the bulkhead to give just enough clearance when the parts are installed and flexed when screwed in.

Alright, it should be good now. Right? Nope! I still had the same issue of the front steering wondering to one side. It was like I was having servo drift, because the issue would return after settling the trim for the 1,000th time. Some readers might know that used a cheap Tower Pro MG996R metal gear servo, because I wanted a metal gear servo and this one fit. While testing, I noticed that this servo would wiggle after reaching the end of the throw I set, it even did it returning to center. So I figured I should stick with the tried and true brand that I have been using for years, which would be futaba. Unfortunately the only futaba servos I have stored in my inventory are the standard ones, but I figure it's better than taking a gamble with other Tower Pro servos I have. 

With the futaba S3003 servo installed, I noticed that the steering operation sounded smoother and seemed a little faster as well. Took the Hornet EVO out for a quick test drive and after a bit of trim adjustment it runs straight as an arrow. 

I don't know if that servo drift is an issue with just that one of my Tower Pro servos, but I do have a few more of them, so maybe I might try one of them in my Rustler or something else and see what happens.

[ABigChungus]

27 minutes ago, MadAnt said:

Another small update.

I've been having an issue where the car would steer slightly or wonder to one side or the other. I noticed it was progressively getting worse over time, so I disconnected the servo from the servo saver and discovered that the bellcrank linkages were rubbing on the front control arm mount/bulkhead. It can be felt and when I took the front apart the wear marks were clear on the parts.

I beveled the edges of the idler arms and removed some plastic from the bulkhead to give just enough clearance when the parts are installed and flexed when screwed in.

Alright, it should be good now. Right? Nope! I still had the same issue of the front steering wondering to one side. It was like I was having servo drift, because the issue would return after settling the trim for the 1,000th time. Some readers might know that used a cheap Tower Pro MG996R metal gear servo, because I wanted a metal gear servo and this one fit. While testing, I noticed that this servo would wiggle after reaching the end of the throw I set, it even did it returning to center. So I figured I should stick with the tried and true brand that I have been using for years, which would be futaba. Unfortunately the only futaba servos I have stored in my inventory are the standard ones, but I figure it's better than taking a gamble with other Tower Pro servos I have. 

With the futaba S3003 servo installed, I noticed that the steering operation sounded smoother and seemed a little faster as well. Took the Hornet EVO out for a quick test drive and after a bit of trim adjustment it runs straight as an arrow. 

I don't know if that servo drift is an issue with just that one of my Tower Pro servos, but I do have a few more of them, so maybe I might try one of them in my Rustler or something else and see what happens.

I have a problem as well similar to that with my Evo. I'm using the TA07 steering arms. It does seem like one wheel doesn't want to centre all the way, so it always seems to be drifting off slightly. It seems very tight, almost overly, and like it isn' t centring 100%.I've tried a few different metal geared servos, not cheapos either, and they all seem to do it. Checked all steering linkages, none were bent and all measured correctly. Even replaced with titanium turnbuckles, still doing it! The DT04 has a similar steering set up, and it works perfectly. Same metal geared servos as well.

On Reddit someone mentioned that they had a similar problem with the steering assembly, and Tamiya are aware and that there is a design flaw? To do with the steering posts not being aligned perfectly apparently. I did think on mine those TA07 arms were very tight to fit, whereas on the DT04 which has a similar set up, I had no issues at all. Tamiy are looking at addressing this in a revised part tree apparently.  How true that is I don't know, but interesting if it is!

[Kowalski86]

I have a Traxxas 2075 in mine that was removed from an abused Slash, so far I haven't had any problems with my steering even after hitting a trash can. Stock links and servo saver.

If it helps, I limited my steering angle to something like 80%. I've found that leaving it at 100% on most RCs makes it harder for their servo to re-center.

 

[MadAnt]

4 hours ago, ABigChungus said:

On Reddit someone mentioned that they had a similar problem with the steering assembly, and Tamiya are aware and that there is a design flaw? To do with the steering posts not being aligned perfectly apparently. I did think on mine those TA07 arms were very tight to fit, whereas on the DT04 which has a similar set up, I had no issues at all. Tamiy are looking at addressing this in a revised part tree apparently.  How true that is I don't know, but interesting if it is!

It's just one part that needs modification, which is the bulkhead/M5. It just needs a notch molded across the area where the rubbing is to give just enough clearance. Are they going to fix it? Who knows? If they don't, it can easily be done with a file.

[MadAnt]

Alrighty! Time for a setup update.

I've been playing around with the Hornet Evo and optimizing it to my liking and driving conditions, which is a combination of street and light off road. Also, keep in mind that the setup recommendations is also based on my opinion and if you think you have any better ideas, try it and share your findings. Experimenting is encouraged and the information gathered can be beneficial to someone. Anyway, my goal was to improve the Hornet Evo with mostly stuff that we already have in the kit and easy access too.

Rear suspension:

A lot of us here have noticed or heard how soft the rear suspension is. The instruction manual has you assemble the rear shocks with the 3 hole pistons, I recommend not bothering with that if you are using the soft oil that came with the kit. Instead use the 2 hole pistons, or if you plan on jumping pretty high, use the single hole pistons. I'm using the 2 hole pistons in the rear shocks with one medium and one large preloaded clips that came in the kit for more ride height and -1° of camber. (One thin and one large preload clip may help a bit too.)

Front suspension and steering:

Ok, I cheated. I used the super mini CVA shocks that I already had in my inventory. They have the 2 hole pistons in them and the soft oil that came with the kit. The kit shocks are the same body, but have longer shafts, which means external spacers have to be used to prevent the shaft from bottoming out into the diaphragm seal and the ride hight is higher. Since I perfer to have the front end lower and my setup works just fine, I never put the front kit shocks on. If you prefer a higher front end, run the factory setup from the instructions. If you want it lower like mine, buy a set of Super Mini CVA shock shafts. 

On to the steering system. First thing to take care of is the rubbing of the steering idler arms on the suspension bulkhead. Easy fix, just file off some material from the bulkhead where the components are touching each other, some filing on the idler arms may be necessary too. I did both, but I beveled the ends of the idler arms and have just enough room.

Next is the bump steer. When the suspension compresses the wheels toe-out. I just flipped the C hubs up side down which offsets the spindles/uprights and then repositioned the outer toe links to under the spindle arm instead of on top. This now has changed the geometry angle of the toe links, keeping them a bit closer to parallel with the control arms. The effect is a mostly reduced amount of bump steer, it's not perfect, but it's better and now with a very slight bit of toe-in when the suspension is compressed.

My front alignment at ride height is -1° of camber and near .5°ish of toe-out. For anyone doing high speed runs, a little bit of toe-in is recommended.

Weight distribution:

The Hornet Evo has got some understeer and on a 2S LiPO it will wheelie if there is enough grip. Without rolling back to try, my Hornet Evo does not do big wheelies. I run a shorty LiPO battery pack that's moved forward and held in place with foam. Foam is cheap and sometimes free, it's a no brainer for me, I like free. To get even more weight on the front end, I have 5, one inch diameter, 10mm inside diameter washers over the front body post and held in place by a scrap piece of rubber tubing wedged in. I'm not paying for stick on wheel weights, that's too expensive. Also, the washers can be removed and added back easily if needed.

Motor and gearing:

I thought about going with a brushless system, but the stock motor seems to accelerate the Hornet Evo around pretty good for the kind of driving I do and in the places I run in. So I've just messed with the gearing instead. The stock gear ratio of 9.28:1 with the 17 tooth pinion gear may be slow for top speed, but in rougher off road conditions, I think it's better when running the stock 27 turn motor. When running a 19 tooth pinion gear for the 8.30:1 ratio, the motor runs much hotter from being bogged more. My suggestion is to run the stock 17 tooth pinion gear if off roading is common, and if faster on road speed is desired if mostly ran on paved surfaces, then buying the 19 tooth pinion gear could be considered.

Wheels and Tires:

The stock tire setup can be ran if desired, but for on road driving I'm using JConcepts Hotties mounted on Kyosho 2.2 5 spoke Scorpion wheels in the front and ProLine M4 compound Hoosier Angle Block Dirt Oval tires mounted on kyosho 2.2 buggy dish wheels. These tires are soft and hook up great on asphalt. I do have some old hotshot tires, but they work well in loose sand like dirt and loose gravel. The wheel and tire package is mostly just my personal preference and is something that will get used on multiple rc models.

Anyway, that's the basics and no, I'm not going over the radio gear. Keep in mind this setup is for my use and that I'm not a racer, but most of the things done here can be done for almost free or for cheap... except the tires.

 

 

 

[Kowalski86]

5 hours ago, MadAnt said:

 

Motor and gearing:

I thought about going with a brushless system, but the stock motor seems to accelerate the Hornet Evo around pretty good for the kind of driving I do and in the places I run in. So I've just messed with the gearing instead. The stock gear ratio of 9.28:1 with the 17 tooth pinion gear may be slow for top speed, but in rougher off road conditions, I think it's better when running the stock 27 turn motor. When running a 19 tooth pinion gear for the 8.30:1 ratio, the motor runs much hotter from being bogged more. My suggestion is to run the stock 17 tooth pinion gear if off roading is common, and if faster on road speed is desired if mostly ran on paved surfaces, then buying the 19 tooth pinion gear could be considered.

Thanks for the write up, for a time I was trying to figure out how to bring the motor temperature down. If you run with a 19t pinion and a sealed can on asphalt (and with the small stock wheels) the motor will get extremely hot.

Running with a fanned motor solves this (or brushless), but I wish there was an easier fix.

[MadAnt]

3 hours ago, Kowalski86 said:

Running with a fanned motor solves this (or brushless), but I wish there was an easier fix.

Passive air flow is an issue due to the design of the DT-02 gearbox. Since there is not much room for a heatsink and attaching one to what little bit of the motor is sticking out might block the hot air from getting out, running a fanned motor seems like a great idea. 

[Kowalski86]

1 hour ago, MadAnt said:

Passive air flow is an issue due to the design of the DT-02 gearbox. Since there is not much room for a heatsink and attaching one to what little bit of the motor is sticking out might block the hot air from getting out...

It's either a fanned motor, brushless, or trimming the gearcase.

Tamiya used to make a 2mm motor spacer and a thin heatsink for the DT-02, maybe they'll bring it back mow that 4 different chassis use that gearbox.

[MadAnt]

I was going to run one of my OG but modified Hornets and the Evo, but then it got dark out. The EVO now has the black can Sport Tuned motor in it, which I had in my M06 Beetle. So now both of these Hornets have Sport Tuned motors, which should be better for doing some performance comparisons. 

At least I had a chance to run the old Hornet, which I forgot how fast it was with the Sport Tuned motor. Really I don't want it any faster, that's like the sweet spot for it. The EVO on the other hand, might be able to handle more power and speed, so we'll see if I get the itch for more.

[ThunderDragonCy]

@MadAnt Did I miss something or did you get some aftermarket front arms? The front end looks narrower

[MadAnt]

4 hours ago, ThunderDragonCy said:

@MadAnt Did I miss something or did you get some aftermarket front arms? The front end looks narrower

It's still pretty much the same, but I did get new Kyosho Scorpion wheels, which does make the rear track wider. I've got some new Schumacher block tires too for the loose grassy stuff and astro turf. I had Hotshot tires on the wheels, but they only worked well in a mix of dirt, sand and small gravel, plus they need a WD40 bath. I like to have multiple wheel and tire sets for different types of surfaces, because having the right tire make a huge difference for performance and enjoyment.

[MadAnt]

Just tried the Schumacher Block tires and they hook really well in grass and loose soil. I also tried them in gravel and they throw the little rocks at you lol. I need to get a pair for the front because with the extra traction in the rear I'm now getting more push or understeer. The grass around here is a bit much for the sport tuned motor even with the lower gearing, so it does get pretty hot and drains the battery faster. I'd love to try the Hornet EVO on a track, but I need to upgrade the shocks first, because we can't have the caps pop off. That will be sometime in the future and I need to figure out what spare replacement parts I should store as well. 

[Andreas W]

Psst: The Schumacher Mini Spike 2 for 4WD fits perfectly on the front Turbo Scorpion wheels. I run them in yellow and without inserts. 

[Kowalski86]

Something I'd like to note about my Wild One wheel setup, it requires teflon washers to stop the hub bearing from budging out. Even then the hubs rub on the washer and it is a little sloppy.

That being said, running 2.2 wheels does give the EVO more ground clearance, hides the rear motor better, and matches the front offset more closely. The biggest drawback is the increased tire cost and it reduces it's character.

So far no bent axles nor anything broken, but I've pulled one of the rear lower shock eyelets out, popped a front camber link, and ripped the wing (just like an OG Hornet).

[ajdragon01]

Hi

 

Have you had any problems with the M5 & M6 parts?

[Kowalski86]

I figured that I'd share my experience running 2.2 wheels and tires. I've tried a few Proline dirt tires and Traxxas Response rear tires, and even with a stiffer back end I've been having traction roll issues on asphalt, and even some on loose terrain. This is likely down to the Hornet chassis weighing basically nothing so the CoG isn't ideal.

I like the kit tires the most, the back tires work on gravel/dirt or asphalt once you've worn them down, and they're cheap to replace. Being able to swap between 2.2s and old style wheels is cool.

So far nothing broken, other than the "wing mount".

[OwdGinger]

Hi all. 

 

New to the site after googling hornet evosuspension issues. Has anyone had issues like in my pics on the lower ball joints on the rear suspension? Seems the wheels are small so with the soft tyres, the steel balls hit something before the wheels. 

 

I'll be doing some photos of my collection when I have taken some fresh ones 😊

[MadAnt]

55 minutes ago, OwdGinger said:

Hi all. 

 

New to the site after googling hornet evosuspension issues. Has anyone had issues like in my pics on the lower ball joints on the rear suspension? Seems the wheels are small so with the soft tyres, the steel balls hit something before the wheels. 

 

I'll be doing some photos of my collection when I have taken some fresh ones 😊

That's from hitting stuff on the ground. It's not as much of a problem when running larger wheels, but it's still a result of the gullwing arms being lower at that point.

[Kowalski86]

6 hours ago, OwdGinger said:

.has anyone had issues like in my pics on the lower ball joints on the rear suspension? Seems the wheels are small so with the soft tyres, the steel balls hit something before the wheels.

 

Mine got chewed up and one of them pulled out of the arm after some gravel running, my "fix" was to pop some ball joints into the connectors (collars are fine too), install some machine screws that were roughly the same length, and use shims in front of the screws as a guard.

Not only are the stock tires small for a buggy, but they're soft, that and the stock springs make the EVO easy to bottom out.

On another note, I did try Tamiyas new one-piece Hornet wheels. They fit, but the front wheels have a wide offset that simply doesn't go well with the EVOs already wide front end.

[OwdGinger]

5 hours ago, Kowalski86 said:

Mine got chewed up and one of them pulled out of the arm after some gravel running, my "fix" was to pop some ball joints into the connectors (collars are fine too), install some machine screws that were roughly the same length, and use shims in front of the screws as a guard.

Not only are the stock tires small for a buggy, but they're soft, that and the stock springs make the EVO easy to bottom out.

On another note, I did try Tamiyas new one-piece Hornet wheels. They fit, but the front wheels have a wide offset that simply doesn't go well with the EVOs already wide front end.

That's a really good shout! I have loads of spare hardware I could use to do that. I'll be giving this a try at the weekend as the buggy is really good fun to blast around and handles quite well aside from the understeer but I'm going to pack the diff with thicker grease as I saw in another thread to hopefully get the back end to step out more. 

 

Thank you 😊 

[OwdGinger]

The car in the background might give you a clue which wheels I pinched out of curiosity but the hub and offset mean they are a straight bolt on. I have a torque tuned motor on so might get away with it on the short term but I might need a more powerful motor. 

 

I can see this being very marmite as it does look a little mad but also very modified off road buggy style. The front wheels would also fit but that wouod need to trim the arms on front bumper. I might have to get a second bumper and give it a try. 

Edited April 24 by OwdGinger
Added comment on front wheels

[Kowalski86]

7 hours ago, OwdGinger said:

That's a really good shout! I have loads of spare hardware I could use to do that.

Thank you 😊 

Anytime, I just wish that I could remember who suggested the idea to me.

Stiffer springs/shock setup and bigger wheels definitely help too, I'm not sure why Tamiya went with three hole pistons for the EVO when they reccomended two hole pistons for the Grasshopper 2 and the Super Hornet.

[OwdGinger]

1 hour ago, Kowalski86 said:

Anytime, I just wish that I could remember who suggested the idea to me.

Stiffer springs/shock setup and bigger wheels definitely help too, I'm not sure why Tamiya went with three hole pistons for the EVO when they reccomended two hole pistons for the Grasshopper 2 and the Super Hornet.

I went 2 hole all round with 500wt in the front and 600wt oil in the rear and all the pre loads all round as well. I find it handles really well bar the understeer and with the monster beetle rears on just bounces over everything