Daily rant, just because

[skom25]

Tamiya is also bit specific and I believe it was also the same in the past.

"Hop Ups" is something which is inevitable from their models. There are not too many cars in offer, which are "nice" straight from the box. I think it is part of the fun which competitors do not have or have in much smaller scale.

You can like this or say that kits are just poor quality. I am somewhere in between. I see that many things in kits could be better, but I also like to make my own custom cars. 

This also allow many people to try RC. You can build basic TT-02 and have some fun or spend ton of money for Hop Ups, just because you like to do this.

I have to admit, that it was quite long road for me to understand this.

[Nikko85]

I recently picked up a crawler from Funtek, but based on the Thunder Tiger CR12 platform. It was £50 (hence why I picked it up) but usually retails for £120 for so.

I had to upgrade the gears (plastic, known to break), plastic ring gears (known to break) but diff gears and a new gearbox (originally badly designed). All this to run a 380 motor.

In the end it cost more than my Pumpkin or MF01x, which can take a much more powerful motor, with less issues or expensive parts. 

I think Tamiya can be ok value, but I think looking in the context of Japanese prices they do make more sense!

Personally I like them, cause they are fun, cheap and spares don't cost the Earth. I run simple models, mainly based on the TL01 platform (TL01, GF01, MF01x) and I can play with them like Lego, mixing and matching as I go. 

I like the BB01, the TD-4 looks awesome and the Hornet Evo is going in the right direction (come on Clod and Pumkin and Blackfoot EVOs)

 

 

 

 

[Kowalski86]

21 minutes ago, Nikko85 said:

I recently picked up a crawler from Funtek, but based on the Thunder Tiger CR12 platform. It was £50 (hence why I picked it up) but usually retails for £120 for so.

I had to upgrade the gears (plastic, known to break), plastic ring gears (known to break) but diff gears and a new gearbox (originally badly designed). All this to run a 380 motor.

In the end it cost more than my Pumpkin or MF01x, which can take a much more powerful motor, with less issues or expensive parts.

You can also run a much bigger variety of motors with most Tamiya platforms. The most recent Element12 iteration is even worse, with a 2-in one esc and a propietary servo size.

[River19]

Tamiya to me is like boxed Mac & Cheese, objectively it isn't really that good compared to everything else available BUT it takes me back to when I was a kid in the 80s and while Mac & Cheese may not be the best food in the world, it serves its purpose and on some days it is exactly what I need to cure a craving.  

Tamiya cars are like that for me.  They aren't objectively "good" by 2025 standards, in fact most of them save for the latest TRF and possibly the BB01 are kinda straight crap compared to a modern platform, BUT there is something about a cheap Tamiya kit and the the pursuit of "un-crapping" a car like the TT-02 or my current project of racing a DT-04 in a silver can class that is enjoyable as ever.

Sure my Schumacher and TLR cars are far more advanced, faster, more adjustable, more durable etc. but Tamiya is the underdog, they march to their own drummer and for better or worse that drummer has been the same for 40 years..........you either love it for what it is, or just grab something else.  If someone wants to throw shade at Tamiya for what they are not doing, it tends to fall on deaf ears as they clearly are happy doing their own thing.

Just my $0.02......

[alvinlwh]

4 hours ago, skom25 said:

There is one thing: prices. In Japan kits and Hop Ups are really, really cheap. In Europe we pay at least two times more... If you think about this, TT-02 for 50 Euros is not so bad...

 

2 hours ago, Kowalski86 said:

I would happily pay $80 for a re-re Frog kit, unfortunately the Frog jumps up to $212 here in the States.

I said it before and I say it again... Go buy a ticket and fly out to Japan (or the Far East) and buy in person. The savings will more than cover your airfare. Or buy a really big ticket item to sell, like the 1/16 tank I helped someone bought is ~£660 there while it is £1200 here. I charged him £100 on top but if I am to list it on ebay for £1000, it will probably still sell. Or there might be really rare old kits out there, like the Tumbling Bull I got myself, <£100 out there, ebay listings at ~£400. 

3 hours ago, skom25 said:

They have aslo Mini 4WDs which are very popular, especially in Japan.

In Asia. They have (South) Korean, Hong Kong, Philippines, Indonesia, etc Cup races on top of the top tier Japan Cup. Mini 4WD is a huge market out there. 

[alvinlwh]

1 hour ago, Thommo said:

it does best, static models

True. Tamiya is basically a static model company with some RC on the side. 

[vodka]

12 minutes ago, River19 said:

Tamiya cars are like that for me.  They aren't objectively "good" by 2025 standards, in fact most of them save for the latest TRF and possibly the BB01 are kinda straight crap compared to a modern platform, BUT there is something about a cheap Tamiya kit and the the pursuit of "un-crapping" a car like the TT-02 or my current project of racing a DT-04 in a silver can class that is enjoyable as ever.

Un-crapping is the new fetish. We enjoy paying to un-crap things. It’s part of the game. Sometimes my cars never even see a track — I build them, enjoy the build, test them, and forget them… until the next piece of crap. I’m in the club, for sure. Maybe it’s a new kind of pathology.

[Wooders28]

6 hours ago, vodka said:

feels stuck in time or misaligned with what the market offers today.

This mirrors my feeling , they're still riding on past glory days, similar to a chippy local to me.....

(The sign is a even more threadbare these days, clinging on by its finger tips)

 

Saying that, Tamiya are a plastic model company, so aligning my brain that they make models that happen to be Radio Controlled, rather than making Radio Controlled models, seems to fit better. 

 

6 hours ago, vodka said:

TRF line up: technically solid and well-made

Again at one point in time, this was the only chassis to have, so guessing they sold well.

 

6 hours ago, vodka said:

TRF line up is dead, or almost dead, unless you enjoy spending 300 bucks on ebay for the last available TRF 211 withe chassis

I'm thinking these didn't sell as well as tamiya hoped, other manufacturers got the jump on tamiya, as while they where making fun cars like the Monster Beetle, Schumacher and Kyosho cars had slippers, ball diffs ,carbon chassis etc and already championships under their belts.

 

6 hours ago, vodka said:

TD 2/4 Tamiya’s attempt at a comeback. Not bad, but not groundbreaking either

Actually disliked these, enough to like them, bit of an oxymoron but.....🤷‍♂️

They are/where quirky, very.....tamiya.

Unfortunately, way overpriced, as by the time you'd added the upgrades that should be standard at that price (slipper...🙄), you could buy a 'proper' race branded car, that would just be a better car in every aspect, bar being quirky. No provision for modern batteries, can't imagine adding a bit of a clamp for a shorty would have given tamiya too many headaches in the design or costing department,  then having a bit of a faff removing the battery in the 4 as you shouldn't charge ANY battery chemistry in a car, just kind of stopped me hitting the 'buy' button (even at the discounted rate, posted a thread somewhere..) 

 

6 hours ago, vodka said:

DT 02/03/04: nice platform, aimed at kids, often overhyped by fans

I'm an overhyped fan, so......🙄😬

Love the DT02 /03 (not got an 04) . I've picked up 03 kits on Amazon for £65, with oil shocks, esc, torque tuned motor, don't think you can complain much about that.

My only bugbear is the lack of a slipper for modern motor power.

 

6 hours ago, vodka said:

Older chassis and RERERE: sometimes charming

This did give the older generation I chance to get spares for their old cars, (so you can fit modern elecs without worrying ), or a bit of a nostalgia mid life purchase. 

Still think Kyosho did it better, with essentially a new car that looked old.

 

6 hours ago, vodka said:

Battery plug: in 2025 still using the old Tamiya plug? comon

The Tamiya Molex plug was bad even in the 80's! 🫣

They where the plug most batteries came with, because of the shear Tamiya dominace on the RC scene.

If you put anything more powerful than a stock wind (eg Parma K stock ) ,they went all smokey and bubbly.

 

Modern chemistry stick batteries don't come with the molex (some do come with an adapter though...💣) , most are Deans (UK at least, think its XT60 over the pond, plenty threads on that 'discussion ' on here..) 

[Mad Ax]

5 minutes ago, alvinlwh said:

True. Tamiya is basically a static model company with some RC on the side. 

This the important point here.  It was written here back when I first joined (around 15 years ago) that Tamiya is first and foremost a plastic model company - RC is a tiny subsidiary.  It's more like a vanity project for them, and they don't really seem to care what happens in the rest of the world as long as the domestic market is happy.

That said - I agree with pretty much everything the OP says.  I'm a die-hard Tamiya fan, around 80% of my collection is Tamiya, and any time I want a new kit, I always look first at Tamiya.  That said, I'm left cold by the majority of their current line-up.  TT02 - it's OK I guess, but has no soul.  You can get a near-identical chassis from any number of no-name Chinese manufacturers or other companies with more western presence (Maverick, FTX etc), you will pay less and get a better product, but mostly you will get an ugly preprinted or badly-decalled prepainted job on a boring body, and you'll have to spend extra on Tamiya or another brand to get anything that's different to what anyone else has.

The sell-a-basic-chassis-and-endless-hopups is a classic sales tactic and one of the big appeals for a lot of people.  Look at the build threads on here and see how many people start with photos of the car kit plus all the hop-ups they bought for it before they even built it.  Yes, you could just buy the hopped-up SRX-S+T-v1AlphaTurbo version, or even go with a proper club racer spec chassis from a competitor, but people don't.  It's not because they don't know any better, it's because that's what they want.

And if you actually look at the price jump between a TT02 Type SRX and a proper race car, like a Schumacher Mi-9 or Xray X4F 25 - and then consider that you can run the TT02 in a car park but the Schuey or Xray is going to need a dedicated tarmac circuit or carpet track plus several hundred pounds worth of setup equipment if you want to get even half its potential, and suddenly the SRX doesn't look so bad if all you want to do is run around a car park or do some entry-level club racing.  In fact my team-mate in the BRCA Sportscar Endurance championship is currently campaigning a TT02 against some very expensive dedicated race hardware at our local club, and is winning, because a) he can drive very well and 2) he knows how to get the best from the hop-ups.  And he enjoys that much more than constantly de-tweaking an Xray.

The comment about who wants a Plasma Edge re-re in 20 years is valid too, but I don't think that's because the Plasma Edge is a bad car (OK, it is a bad car, but that's not the reason) - it's because the kids of the Plasma Edge era weren't drooling over the Tamiya catalog like us middle-aged people were in the 80s.  They weren't even drooling over Traxxas or any other RC catalog.  RC has been pretty much dead among the younger generations since the late 90s.  The 1st gen PlayStation changed the world, it has never been the same since and I doubt it ever will be.

When I was a child, a car (a full-size car and by extension a model car) was an object of desire, an attainable dream and a ticket to freedom on the 17th birthday.  Today's youngsters are even questioning the concept of a 1:1 car, and if there's no desire for a full-size car, who cares about a toy one?  The homogenisation of full-size cars represents their transition from freedom and status to a means to an end, a tool to make a chore easier and more comfortable.

But I don't care about any of that.  I care that I can still buy a Clod Buster and turn it into something special, either with aftermarket hopups or with some aluminium and a hacksaw.  I care that I can still buy a comical buggy that has more character than a Traxxas or an FTX.  I care that I can still buy a G6-01, because who else makes that?  And I care that I can still get the spares for all of these, so after I've spent 12 weeks sawing and drilling and gluing, then I break my custom creation on the 1st run, I can still get spares for it.

[River19]

2 hours ago, vodka said:

Un-crapping is the new fetish. We enjoy paying to un-crap things. It’s part of the game. Sometimes my cars never even see a track — I build them, enjoy the build, test them, and forget them… until the next piece of crap. I’m in the club, for sure. Maybe it’s a new kind of pathology.

Well, there always has been the "muscle car" fanatics that love things like the Chevy Nova, Chevelle etc. which are objectively horrible cars.  They don't turn, stop, or hold together at any degree of quality and barely did anything but rip the occasional burnout.......but yet millions of people pay insane prices for a modified version that has made passable improvements to those areas.  Sounds like Tamiya to me......

[toyolien]

5 hours ago, vodka said:

I just happen to hope for something more. Like a BB01, but with full support.

What support do you want for the BBX that's not currently available? Lots of spares, hop ups and option parts from Tamiya and a whole host of other companies.

[zuqbu]

 OP I think you need to take a step back and realise that you might have some personal bias. A lot of people in this thread already mentioned this but Tamiya is primarily focused on Japan, and they are a private company and can do what they want without pressure from shareholders (trust me on this, you don't want pressure from shareholders).

Do I think Tamiya could offer more and better options? Certainly! F.e. I think with Formula 1 and WEC both being as popular as never before they're missing out on bringing in a lot of new people into the hobby. But I have no clue what the FIA, Liberty Media, the teams etc. are asking for in terms of licensing – both in terms of money and exclusivity. Who knows, maybe LEGO's recent partnership with F1 means no other manufacturer is allowed to make F1 toys, similar to EA's exclusive Porsche deal in video games from the 90s to 2010s. But their core market is Japan and they always had a steady stream of Super GT cars in their lineup as this is the series that is extremely popular over there.

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• TRF line up: technically solid and well-made, but rarely seen on track (nowadays). There are better performing options out there. OK

I think you're underselling the TRF421 – it's really competitive (as has been shown also at a very high level f.e. at the TITC) and more importantly easy to drive (consistently) and forgiving with it's setup. Can a world-class driver with decades of experience eek out maybe a tenth per lap with an Awesomatix? Yes. Most people can't and the TRF421 is quick enough that it can hold it's own in competition and the driver and preparation will make the difference. And the upcoming TRF104 is being eyed by a lot of experienced racers over here who are fed up with their XRay's pivot mounts breaking.

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• Older chassis and RERERE: sometimes charming, but in the better case we have some limited edition with some random fix, nice just for nostalgic old young boys (like me). Would love to see something like a modern Lunchbox. But instead? Kyosho MadVan says hi. bad

The Group C re-releases have proven to be very successful. Both the Sauber C11 and the Porsche 956 have been selling extremely well and the Mazda 787B which was exclusive to Japan was sold out immediately from what I have heard.
Other manufacturers such as Kyosho and Team Associated joining the Re-Re party proves that this is good business for them. Is every kit for everyone? No.

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• Spares: Need a tiny piece of something? Here’s a tree of 42 unrelated bits. Do not worry, you can always sell it as "various spares". bad

This is ridiculous, Tamiya is not just producing tooling and creating molds for every single part – manufacturing and economies of scale is honestly one of the huge advantages that Tamiya has and gets right. Just go to your local track and ask what the people running XRays have to pay for spares. 

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• Tyres: same tyres again and again.. ok, we don’t need to reinvent the wheel every time... but this is too much. XD bad
• Lifepo: I’ve always appreciated the idea, but outside Japan it’s a hassle (I don't know in Japan). Why not support your export customers with compatible batteries? I have to use NiMH? Really?? bad
• Battery plug: in 2025 still using the old Tamiya plug? comon... bad
• esc and motor: not the best out there... but I can deal it. meh
• Radio gear: Radio what? bad

Tamiya has chosen not to compete in these categories. They offer sometimes basic entry-level options, and that's it. And why should they? The market is wide open in this regard, you can choose from so many manufacturers that specialise in each of these categories, why do you need an option from Tamiya? I would rather have them stick to making cars and kits than stretching themselves thin and spending a lot of money and time into R&D, supply chains, marketing etc. of genuine high-level Tamiya electronics when it might not be profitable for them.

We will not know for sure as Tamiya doesn't have to disclose their earnings – but I will bet they are doing very well at the moment. Expecting them to cater to all audiences and have competitive options for everyone is just not realistic nor feasible.
Most of what Tamiya has in their catalogue doesn't interest me, too – But I am sure that there are others who will enjoy what I might not. In the batch of announcements from the Nuremberg Toy fair, some were excited about the DT-04, some were excited about the renewed collaboration with BMW, a lot of people here in Germany are extremely excited about the Porsche 911 GT3, and so on, and so on. None of this scratched my itch but I did preorder a TRF104 which in return doesn't interest a lot of people over here at Tamiyaclub.

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I think the current Tamiya catalogue is, well... a bit trashable.

One person's trash is another person's treasure.

[River19]

Let's be clear here, Tamiya electronics were entry level even when I was a kid in the 80s.  Back then they hyped up the "Technigold" motor as darn near the best they can produce and it was easily outclassed by anything from the race oriented brands when I was a kid racing in 1988-1990.  Trinity, Losi, Reedy, etc. all had $28 MSRP Stock Class motors that would run with or beat out a Technigold let alone any of their Mod motors in the 11-17T category.

Point being, Tamiya is wise staying out of the electronics business.  They clearly partnered with Hobbywing on the 1060 inclusion and that is very wise.  They can make all the silver cans they want.  Just leave it at that, build chassis and stick to what they know.

[alvinlwh]

In other news, Tamiya is releasing another Hornet. Rant away. 

[Alex97]

Tamiya most certainly have their flaws however they've survived the test of time. 

 

Pretty much every RC shop you walk into will stock tamiya models and parts, they offer something for nearly everyone and I'm sure most people have at least one Tamiya car in their fleet. Yes if you fit a 1/8 brushless system and 6s battery into one it will self implode however pretty much all of their cars will run quite happily on 2s with a nippy brushless system which is plenty for most of us! 

 

You know what you're getting with a tamiya, bushings and self tapping screws 😎

[urban warrior]

11 hours ago, vodka said:

I think the current Tamiya catalogue is, well... a bit trashable.

Well, I would second that in principle. When I compare the catalogues today against the "masterpieces" from the mid to late eighties. But I guess there is a reason for that. 35-40 years ago print media was common and good advertisement and presentation of any goods was typical there. These days have long gone. Today everything relevant is represented online and the focus is clearly more into digital media than the printed ones. You can see the actual Tamiya catalogue in paperform as a pure listing. That's the way it goes. In Germany we would say "Nothing is as consistent as change!" As humans we often got issues with changes and changing situations, it's the same with our modelling. When I built my first Tamiya RC (around 1987/1988), I had already build Tamiya static models for ten years and for me Tamiya was one of the serious modelling companies around here in Germany. As real manufacturers (for RC cars) we had Tamiya and Kyosho as the big two, Graupner and Robbe were either selling their own questionable cars or reselling kits from Kyosho under their brand. Today you got a large variety of different modelling companies from trash to treasure.

Admittedly I am always a bit torn when I think about Tamiya today. I whitnessed so many "milestones" in modelling history being issued by Tamiya that I often can hardly understand specific releases of models and technical solutions. I grew in RC modelling with Tamiya, so it will always be my first love. But if you want to compare it to a marriage, the honeymoon is over, and sometimes you may see your wife with a bit more critical eye now. The overcomplexity I often like to complain about, which is often been justified as "the Tamiya way", may be a concession to avoid getting interferred with patents of other modelling companies (Traxxas seems to be a candidate for sueing other manufacturers quite easily). And to be honest, I am still waiting every year, that something will be released by Tamiya that will be as breathtaking as Tamiya was for me in 1987.

[alvinlwh]

1 hour ago, urban warrior said:

Traxxas seems to be a candidate for sueing other manufacturers quite easily

You know with Trump pulling down the shutters, Traxxas may be the only company left in USA and no one left to sue. 

[Wooders28]

2 hours ago, River19 said:

They can make all the silver cans they want.

Is it not 'Mabuchi ' that make the silver cans?

Pretty much the largest motor manufacturer in the world.

For RC , for printers, for older battery drills (newer stuff is brushless), for women's 'adult toys'....🙄🤣 

[River19]

16 minutes ago, Wooders28 said:

Is it not 'Mabuchi ' that make the silver cans?

Pretty much the largest motor manufacturer in the world.

For RC , for printers, for older battery drills (newer stuff is brushless), for women's 'adult toys'....🙄🤣 

That's right......forgot it was Mabuchi..... even more reason for Tamiya to stay away from anything with wires......just keep partnering with reputable companies.......

[Wooders28]

1 minute ago, River19 said:

wires......just keep partnering with reputable companies....

Let's see what their next brushless line up looks like, now Speed Passion aren't producing motors (or are they the new Corerc 'star' brushless motors? 🤔) 

[alvinlwh]

31 minutes ago, Wooders28 said:

for women's 'adult toys

Do they use 540s in them??? Now I have a spare Sport Tuned around somewhere... Or perhaps one of the Super Stocks? Or a CR Tuned for endurance... Choices... 😂

[alvinlwh]

12 minutes ago, Wooders28 said:

Let's see what their next brushless line up looks like, now Speed Passion aren't producing motors (or are they the new Corerc 'star' brushless motors? 🤔) 

They should just stop including a silver can in their kits. Their standard kits do not even come with an ESC, it is the importer that usually shove one into the box. Most other brands don't include any electronics leaving the choice to the buyer. 

[yogi-bear]

44 minutes ago, alvinlwh said:

You know with Trump pulling down the shutters, Traxxas may be the only company left in USA and no one left to sue. 

although Traxxas gets manufactured in Taiwan and then assembled in the USA, so they are likely to take a hit as I think its 32% but couldn't find a definite number quickly. RC Kicks has an interesting analysis of how the tariffs may affect everyone world wide.

[alvinlwh]

26 minutes ago, yogi-bear said:

although Traxxas gets manufactured in Taiwan and then assembled in the USA, so they are likely to take a hit as I think its 32% but couldn't find a definite number quickly. RC Kicks has an interesting analysis of how the tariffs may affect everyone world wide.

Firstly, my Trump comment was made tongue in cheek. This is not the forum to get political. 

However your response made me look into details about the tariff. 

Taiwan - 32%

Japan - 24%

Philippines - 17%

In that case, Traxxas may sink under the weight of the tariff, which is actually something to be celebrated. 

Tamiya must be glad to have moved some of their production line to Philippines all those years ago! 

[kevinb120]

Meh I was born in 71, so the rere's are my meat and potatoes for nostalgia.  I just don't expect much out of them going further than an ST and even have nimh packs just for them.  I have a fair amount of Traxxas, arrma, and other modern brands that get the most run time and zero cares given what happens to them(I'd have a coronary if my re-re hornet flipped on its perfect lid), they're my 3s/4s/6s ballers. I consider the TD4 and BB01 the real runners of my Tamiyas with modern goodies(they have TRX connectors).  My brushed runners are Fazers, rustlers and bandits for me and the kids.  Love each and every car I have, even if a big part of them in quantity are rere driveway only shelters 

What Tamiya needs is something like the Kyosho Fazer.  Beautiful cars you're not scared to thrash and it's quite a nice drive. And man they are stupid simple genius(like an XL5/BL2 Traxxas).  Not unusual to go out with the brushed 240 rally and a Kraton and have a blast with both. And it's not like Kyo lost its roots with the past  I also have no Traxxas shelfers.  They need something besides an XB line.