ESC and powerful motors

[Eurocupracing]

I am using a Speed gems 2 15t motor. With the stock Esc that came -with my Bmw TT-01. I have never had a heat problem or cut out problem. I drive it everywhere! And for about 1 Month now.... I will just use it until I brake it![]

[Backlash]

This is the second time Ive read through this thread and all I can come up with is WOW.

I really feel sorry for julesbristol, and any other newbie / rookie that reads this thread and tries to make sense of it.

Back in the early days of ESC's there was no such thing as a "Motor rating". All ESC's just had a maximum current draw, and that was that. It is far easier for a anyone to select an ESC, now we have motor turns ratings. From a sensible point of view, If you want to run a 15 turn motor, then get an ESC with a 15 turn OR LOWER motor limit. SIMPLE. I think that this would also be the recomendation of any sensible Tamiya Club Member.

ALSO, As a rule of thumb, and this will not work in all cases, it is recomended that when buying a suitable ESC to run 2 x motors wired in parallel, (eg. Twin detinator )then the turns of the motors to be run should be halved. IE, if you were to run 2 x 20 turn motors, then an ESC with a motor limit of 10 or less turns would be required.

I have but one question for TT01 owner, WHY would any ESC manufacturer under rate their ESC's?? It would be a better marketing idea to Over rate them, ie say they can run a lower turn motor than they really can, than to do it the other way round.

As for every thing else in this thread like running 11 turn motors on 20 turn ESC's?? Like I said WOW. You must be very lucky.

Backlash

[sosidge]

quote:Originally posted by Backlash

I have but one question for TT01 owner, WHY would any ESC manufacturer under rate their ESC's?? It would be a better marketing idea to Over rate them, ie say they can run a lower turn motor than they really can, than to do it the other way round.

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Because if you over-rate them you get a) a load of returns for repair and a bad reputation.

[Gruntfuggly]

Somebody is selling a Manta Ray on eBay at the moment with a Pink Acto Power motor in it and an MSC. The seller is a TC member, so I hope I am not causing any offence, but surely that combination can't work?

[DJTheo]

Only full speed and that also probably also not for long.

Cheers

[Backlash]

quote:Originally posted by sosidge

quote:Originally posted by Backlash

I have but one question for TT01 owner, WHY would any ESC manufacturer under rate their ESC's?? It would be a better marketing idea to Over rate them, ie say they can run a lower turn motor than they really can, than to do it the other way round.

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Because if you over-rate them you get a) a load of returns for repair and a bad reputation.

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Sosidge, I agree, thats EXACTLY WHY ESC manufacturers dont over rate their ESC's. It just makes me wonder why TT01_owner seems to think its OK to do so.

[jimbo858]

quote:Originally posted by Backlash

This is the second time Ive read through this thread and all I can come up with is WOW.

I really feel sorry for julesbristol, and any other newbie / rookie that reads this thread and tries to make sense of it.

Back in the early days of ESC's there was no such thing as a "Motor rating". All ESC's just had a maximum current draw, and that was that. It is far easier for a anyone to select an ESC, now we have motor turns ratings. From a sensible point of view, If you want to run a 15 turn motor, then get an ESC with a 15 turn OR LOWER motor limit. SIMPLE. I think that this would also be the recomendation of any sensible Tamiya Club Member.

ALSO, As a rule of thumb, and this will not work in all cases, it is recomended that when buying a suitable ESC to run 2 x motors wired in parallel, (eg. Twin detinator )then the turns of the motors to be run should be halved. IE, if you were to run 2 x 20 turn motors, then an ESC with a motor limit of 10 or less turns would be required.

I have but one question for TT01 owner, WHY would any ESC manufacturer under rate their ESC's?? It would be a better marketing idea to Over rate them, ie say they can run a lower turn motor than they really can, than to do it the other way round.

As for every thing else in this thread like running 11 turn motors on 20 turn ESC's?? Like I said WOW. You must be very lucky.

Backlash

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okay, I read this and I'm totally confused now. hahahaha... seriously, I was trying to find out some info to help fix my problem. So, if anyone can point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it. Anyways, I have the following setup;

- TL01b Chassis setup as a monster truck

- ball bearings throughout

- Venom 21T motor

- Duratrax DTXM1059 Autosport w/Reverse (can handle a motor down to 18T)

- 3300Mah NiMh battery.

Okay so the problem is that the motor is smoking? I ran it a couple of times and the motor is smoking badly. It's WAY too hot to touch. What should I do? What have I done wrong?

BTW, I can't add a motor heatsink due to the way that the chassis covers the majority of the motor.

[DCLXVI]

I don't know if you can with that particular chassi but I think I can safely say that you need to gear down a bunch...

[jimbo858]

any idea what I pinion I should use then? I'm already using a 19t pinion (which I think is the lowest stock pinion). Also, I'm using smaller diameter rims/tires from a wild willy (1.9" rims vs. 2.2" rims). thanks for the advice in advance....

[DJTheo]

Maybe there isn't a low enough gearing for those tires as TL01 wasn't designed for a MT. Another cause could be worn motor or brushes, better try first with a stock or a torquey 550 sized motor.

Cheers

[jimbo858]

quote:Originally posted by DJTheo

Maybe there isn't a low enough gearing for those tires as TL01 wasn't designed for a MT. Another cause could be worn motor or brushes, better try first with a stock or a torquey 550 sized motor.

Cheers

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yeah, that's what I was afraid of... I just took of the 550 motor to replace it with this venom motor. oh well, I'll probably just have to switch it back... unless someone else out there has a better cost effective solution?

[DJTheo]

I don't mean the kit 540 motor, but longer (more torquey) 550 one, Graupner and Kyosho make some, search previous posts for Kyosho Magnetic Mayhem and Graupner 600.

Cheers

[jimbo858]

quote:Originally posted by DJTheo

I don't mean the kit 540 motor, but longer (more torquey) 550 one, Graupner and Kyosho make some, search previous posts for Kyosho Magnetic Mayhem and Graupner 600.

Cheers

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yeah, the car actually came with a 550 sized motor. but, I wanted to put alittle more umph into it. the 540 sized Venom 21t motor did that. BUT, it also almost caught on fire. so, it's either I find a better 550 sized motor or put the original back in. I'm still kinda "new" to this stuff so figuring out if the Graupner 600 is a better improvement is difficult for me. I looked at http://www.hobby-lobby.com/speed600.htm and found some specs for it. but, it shows it at 12 volts. is that much better than a stock 550? Also, I can't seem to find the Kyosho Magnetic Mayhem being sold anywhere.

[DJTheo]

The 600 Speed is definetly faster then a stock 550, in the page you found there is also a 7.2V version, have 2 of them on my Clod and it goes pretty fast for the truck and specs http://www.tamiyaclub.com/moviecomment.asp?id=593&uid=16 . I heard that the Kyosho is discontinued but some stores still have it.

Cheers

[raemin]

You clod is really sweet and these graupner speed motor are really excellent value for money. With a proper winding mabuchi motors are great. Did you manage to get a reverse rotation engine in the speed 600 serie? Last but not least ESC rating, battery pack and autonomy?

[DJTheo]

I think they have no advanced timing (no direction printed on them) so no need for a reverse motor, can't compare though as my ESC isn't as powerfull at reverse. I think they are rated around 20T and my Carson truck ESC with 11T limit had no problems with 2 of them. 3300mAh Batteries last around 10-15min, siginicantly less then stock 540s but not too bad.

Cheers

[raemin]

Thanks for the hint Theo. My clod had lost interest since I decided to go for a Mad Force but with these cheap motors, I see a new project in the starting bloc...

quote:Originally posted by jimbo858

yeah, the car actually came with a 550 sized motor.

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Yes but all 550s are not equal: mabuchi winds and time their engines as per the specifications of their clients. For instance a regular mabuchi 370 is a 70turn 0deg engine, and this is the one call speed300 7.2, the hot speed300 6v is a 28turn (!!!) with 2 degrees timing. Same story for 550s.

In graupner terms, the lower the quoted voltage, the lower the number of turns (>>> the higher the final output). GWS also offer many variants of their engines based on the same can.

[jimbo858]

so what do you guys think of the Trinity Maxx motors vs. the Graupner's?

http://www.teamtrinity.com/motors/monster_maxx.html

[raemin]

These are very nice motors, but 3 times more expensive than the graupner ones, and not better than the old kyosho magnetic mayem that were much cheaper also.

[sgt.barnes]

quote:Originally posted by theshopkeeper

quote:Originally posted by tt-01owner

a msc can handle any motor thats what everyone used before esc's. as for esc's all esc's can handle all 540 motors. its becuase the ratings are all uNDERRATED. COOLING IS KEY for all esc, a no limit esc can get fried if you overheat it.

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I've not read such a load of nonsense in a long time.

Go try an 11 turn motor on a 23 turn esc. It will either cut out, catch fire or both. If it doesn't you're very, very lucky - and you've found the 1 in maybe 50 which is vastly overspecd in the batch...

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I agree bumkum! the esc was around long before any of these hot motors exsisted! secondly yes at one time all we had was msc's but the hottest motors around back in the day was a 27t stock etc as that is all that was brca etc legal. badword!! we had to re wind can motors at first as they wern't even commercially avalible