Problem with TC Member & Ebay Seller

[focus1]

You have already done a lot by starting this tread. Thanks again for

that! And, you should mail him a link to this tread! Some thoughts. Did you agreed for innshured shipping? If not, I

am not shure if you can press charges against him, he can say it was

lost in the mail. You gott your recites for payment? Innvoice, Ebay add

coppy, email correspondance etc. Also you would do better with his full

name and adress. Go to your local police and explaine the situation...

Don't gett your hopes up, but it can't do any harm to try.

To do some more harm, you can post the add pictures in your showroom,

marking it as item not recived, waited 90 days, sellers not responding

etc.

Good luck.

[OCD]

Just an update:

ottaviano just left me some positive feedback; he's left some for corpsethrower and europro as well.

Apparently the message has gotten through to him?

[Corpse Thrower]

Well well.....look at that, eh?

Personally I'd rather have my items....but at least we got something for our money[]

Hehe....I might start selling positive feedback on ebay.....wonder how much I'd make?[]

[DJTheo]

Btw, unfortunately TC's current forum search still is buggy, so it doesn't find everything it should, that could explain why you didn't find it. Also don't forget there is an external mailing list for dodgy dealers http://tamiyaclub.com/CS/forums/thread/174727.aspx, am not sure its working for me though or noone bothers to post there, as since my subscription there didn't get a single mail?

Cheers

[akemag]

This may be off topic, but still related to having problems in trading/buying on TC. I´m surprised at the lack of courtesy when it comes to replying to mails in the traderoom.

You mail someone about an item in their traderoom, just to get no answer.

You get a mail about a trade you have, answers with the info they needed, to get no answer from them.

You ask someone about their car, perhaps wanting a picture, then the mails stop comming.

Very rude behaviour i must say. I have a list with these people so i easily can avoid doing any business with them in the future.

Too bad that some on the list are somewhat "known" TC members that you´d expect more from.

But i have made many smooth deals with people here on TC also.

[DJTheo]

True, also got no reply this week on an item someone wanted to trade, although I had what he exactly wanted, well he will loose as I also will never mail or deal with those people again.

Cheers

[Corpse Thrower]

Couple of quotes for you from our best mate:

Quote 1: "The auction item(s) will be sent out the following weekend."

Quote 2: "we ship out about 7 to 10 days after the auction ends and we ship by air mail which takes about 2 weeks overseas." 

[:|]

[Artie]

This slander has been brought to my attention and here are my responses to all of you:

DJTheo

Maybe the explanation is clearly stated in each and every auction that we only ship out once a week & this is due to the volume of our sales & to allow our customers to make payments.  It would be ridiculous to go to the post office each & every time someone made a payment.  We would have to set up house at our local post office and ask them if it was alright to live in their lobby.  I don't think my wife or the post office would appreciate that.  As far as ordering when someone wins an item on Ebay, do you think we are idiots?  Just ask my wife, our office and garage are full of product. We have nothing to hide and have been doing business on Ebay for over 7 years with over 6000 feedbacks and have had only 16 negative feedbacks in that whole time.  If I were still in college this would be considered an A+ average.  Oh well, you can't win them all.  Here is an idea, if you don't agree to the terms of the auction, don't bid.

europro975

First of all, I don't have a few negative and neutral feedbacks per month.  Anyone can go on Ebay and confirm that is completely false. Second, I have never, intentionally, "strung" anyone along so that 90 days passes and they can't do anything.  As I have said before, I have nothing to hide and my feedback score reflects just that. Third, I sent 5 parcels to you overseas and the shipping came to aproximately $130.  I have receipts in my file cabinet to prove it.  I wouldn't have to work anymore if I made that kind of money off of shipping.  You even acknowledged you received all of these parcels.  You say you are out $500?  How do you figure?  Here is the actual list & total of what you are waiting on:

6061040443 Midnight pumpkin glass  $6.50

6062217012 XC chassis $14.00

6062216760  blackfoot k parts   $6.50

6057206569 Tamiya sprt tuned motor $12.51

6057206575  Tamiya sprt tuned motor $13.50

6057206633  Tamiya Hummer tires   $15.50

 

 

Total   $68.51

 

Corpsethrower

 

It is "strange" how my feedback score doesn't reflect "all of these problems".  Maybe it is because there is no problem except people having nothing better to do than to post 3 pages of slander on this forum behind a person's back.  I have never heard of a person getting things from overseas in 5-7 days unless they pay extra for global priority but even at that, the weight limit is 4 pounds.  I have found that global priority is very expensive and most people don't want to pay for it.  You even acknowleged what I clearly disclose to every buyer: 

Couple of quotes for you from our best mate:

Quote 1: "The auction item(s) will be sent out the following weekend."

Quote 2: "we ship out about 7 to 10 days after the auction ends and we ship by air mail which takes about 2 weeks overseas." 

Once again, if you don't agree to the terms of the auction then you shouldn't bid. 

OCD

I find it strange that you only copied one e-mail that I sent to you and you didn't copy any of the other e-mails, including the ones you sent to me.  I also find it strange that you took a picture of the damaged box instead of the damaged lexan body. I thought we had this all cleared up until I was notified that I was being slandered by you and a few other members.  I gave you a decal sheet at our cost to make up for the situation and you agreed to it.  If  it was still an issue, why did you not try to work it out with me directly?  Instead, you go on this forum and complain that you have had trouble with me every time you ordered.  Why did you keep bidding on my items if you were so unhappy?  Talk about bad behavior. 

 

 

[Corpse Thrower]

 

Hello there RCRACER!![]

This slander has been brought to my attention and here are my responses to all of you:

 

 

Corpsethrower

 

It is "strange" how my feedback score doesn't reflect "all of these problems".  Maybe it is because there is no problem except people having nothing better to do than to post 3 pages of slander on this forum behind a person's back.  I have never heard of a person getting things from overseas in 5-7 days unless they pay extra for global priority but even at that, the weight limit is 4 pounds.  I have found that global priority is very expensive and most people don't want to pay for it.  You even acknowleged what I clearly disclose to every buyer: 

 

 

Slander, eh? I posted facts. Point out how my comments were slanderous please. 

Couple of quotes for you from our best mate:

Quote 1: "The auction item(s) will be sent out the following weekend."

Quote 2: "we ship out about 7 to 10 days after the auction ends and we ship by air mail which takes about 2 weeks overseas." 

Once again, if you don't agree to the terms of the auction then you shouldn't bid. 

I was pointing out the differences between what you state in the auction and what you sent me in an email. If you have an explanation for this, lets hear it.

My comments stand for now. If I ever recieve the items I will of course apologize to you if I have insinuated that you have never sent them, and withdraw the negative feedback you definitely will recieve if the items are not here by next Wednesday.

[QuesoGrande]

This has gone far enough and is quite up setting.  We need to set an example to younger members of the forum.

No,  not the who sent what part when and to whom, but the constant misuse of the word "slander".  Slander is verbal or spoken, what you are on about is Libel. But let's face it what we have here is a culture clash.  Americans appear to be long on "have a nice day"s but short on service and Brits, well we moan.

Hope this helps.

[OCD]

OK Artie - I've read your position, but now for some facts.

"I find it strange that you only copied one e-mail that I sent to you and you didn't copy any of the other e-mails, including the ones you sent to me. "

All of the emails were offered for public viewing; I am not attempting to hide anything either.. I did not post them in their entirety is because I felt that the context of my original post would be 'buried' in such a large amount of correspondence.  I only posted your initial email because I think that it is a fitting example of my communication with you.

"I also find it strange that you took a picture of the damaged box instead of the damaged lexan body."

I did not photograph the contents because they are not damaged.  Do you see anything wrong with those pictures Artie?  Is this how all of your packages arrive?

"I gave you a decal sheet at our cost to make up for the situation and you agreed to it."

This one has to be the most laughable: You did not send me anything at your cost.  I paid full price for those decals and you know it!  Moreover, you lied to me about when you sent them. I have proof of all of this if you wish to see it.

"you go on this forum and complain that you have had trouble with me every time you ordered. Why did you keep bidding on my items if you were so unhappy?"

Because I like to think that people are generally good.  As I said above, I waited until others had an issue with you, and then I stated my case.  I'm sorry if you feel that this is being conducted 'behind your back', but you've had a fair chance and plenty of notice to set things straight.  Instead you have decided to blast your customers by accusing them of being slanderous liars.  Just for the record, I put my trust in you (more than once) not because of your eBay feedback, (pointless anyhow) but because you touted yourself as a Tamiya Club Member!!  Have you thought about the example you may be setting?

-Steve

[ChrisB]

Well, reading through this whole thread start to finsh as an impartial observer, I have to say its a good example of why I suspect Chris had to put very strict criteria in place for adding sellers to the "dodgy traders" area of the forum.

The way I see it it looks like perhaps everyone is being a little "selective" with the information they are relaying / posting here.....

It probably won't be a popular opinion, but if someone states the shipping times / process they use on the auction (no matter how small the type / where it is in the description), then you need to make sure you read through the description to make sure you know what you are agreeing to.

Granted its not good practice to make this kind of info hard to find, but as a bidder its your responsibility to read the whole auction description before bidding. If the guy says he ships once a week on a Saturday and you win the auction on a Sunday, you ain't going to get the item in 5-7 days.

I'd also like to hear about the makeup of the $500 difference mentioned in the previous posts - so far we only have the seller side on that one. If you suggest someone is doing you out of $500 you gotta be able to back it up with details, thats only reasonable in my book. - no?

Sending a bodyset just in its box with no additional protection is also pretty lame in my book. Unless you are extremely lucky there is no way its going to reach its destination undamaged. - thats a bad move as a seller and is guaranteed to cost you more in reputation / business than you will save in packing / shipping - seems like common sense to me.

As to feedback ratings - surely that is a matter of record that can be verified directly on ebay?

As a buyer, no matter what info I am getting from the seller, or how nice they seem, if I haven't received an item after a month I would file a non-delivery report against the seller - no ifs, no buts, they haven't supplied what you bought so cover yourselves.

The only reason not to do this is if the auction explicitely states delivery via surface mail over a long distance or similar, and in that case I'd be reluctant to bid anyway unless I really had to have the item.

Sorry if this sounds a bit harsh, but reputations (both buyers and sellers), are at stake so people have to stick to verifyable facts, and make sure when you post youback up any points you want to make with verifyable information.

Its easy to get emotional over deals that didn't turn out as expected - we've all been there. My rule of thumb is if someone takes advantage I don't deal with them again unless they put things right to my satisfaction. That applies whether I am the buyer or seller. Put it down to experience and move on.

If this is a verifyable case of bad selling then submit the facts to Chris / the mods and if there is enough proof I am sure it will be added to the relevent section of the forum.

IMHO a forum topic like this just escalates into name calling, people's feelings and reputations get hurt, and everyone loses - all round bad idea in my book.

I guess I just get weary of seeing people having a go at each other on the forum - whats the point? Either lay down the facts about the issue in an impartial post that will stand up to scrutiny and be posted in the dodgy traders area.... or.... deal with it outside of TC (email/phone/PM/ebay).

Chris

[europro975]

TC'ers

I have been in contact with Artie and I have decided to sort this matter out privatly with him. I will update this thread with a positive out come

Antony

[Backlash]

Having also read this thread from start to finish, and getting past all the "he said, she said" type name calling, it seems that the real problem here is a simple lack of communication by the concerned parties at private level.

For the buyers concerned, please keep us informed of any outcomes in regard to your problems stated, I am interested to know how it all turns out.

[focus1]

Well, speaking hypotetically. Maybe going public somtimes helps the

conversation in the right direction. If not it will work as a warning

to other people. I have quite a different veiw of this than many of

you. If you have a problem. First you try emails. If thats not working,

try the forum or your trade section. "Needs to gett in contact with

....." If thats not working, use the forum to explaine the problem in a

calm and "facts only" way. Always email the person you are having the

problem with. Also mail it to a moderator to be shure you are following

the rules before posting. If the person still not responding, but keeps

on updating his showroom (a living person) It is time for the scammer

forum! Or second best, that list that mr.Pushrod made. Thanks for the

link Theo.

The point is pretty simular to what OCD said. You should belive the

best about a person to the opposite is proven. If you are beeing

ignored by someone, you have to try some other channals to gett their

atention. Still being ignored? Well I think that meens that the seller

is a bad seller! Rcracer is replying to this tread, so he is not a bad

seller in my opinion. Or atleast not as bad as it seemd to begin

with, still in dispute with OCD. It is good to read the last comment

from the starter of this tread. Hope it solves out for all of you! And

offcourse, maybe it would if it all had been kept private also? But if

it al ends with agreement I realy cant see any harm come out of this.

Apologize and virtuall handshakes in public will in my opinion restore

the debaters reputation. If it all goes well, I would not hessitate to

order a bodyset from this seller in the future as I am shure someone

that send a box like that twice, will lose all his creddebillety

forever!

focus1

[Corpse Thrower]

Well, I've said my piece, both here and privately to RcRacer.....lets see what happens. Hopefully this ends well for me, he has had my money for six weeks, and I have recieved nothing. I also ordered stuff a week or so later and that hasn't turned up either. So, I'm short 2 deliveries from him.

Now.......calling this a coincidence is a bit of a stretch, isn't it?

 I now have a poor Blackfoot Xtreme body with no chassis after being cannibalised for my Clod project. In hindsight, if I would have just bought a Double Blaze from a HK seller I would have had both my trucks up and running weeks ago for the same price. I might still have to do this I guess.

Got another package yesterday from another seller in the US......only a week after ordering, and I was sent tracking info.

Artie, I just want my bits, or alternatively, give me a refund and I can go and get the bits somewhere else.

[RETRO R/C]

Dont think we are not watching this guys...................[^o)].

Posts have come very close to the rules and started to bend them a bit.

Start a slanging match and we simply switch it all off and leave you to

email (like this sort of thing should be anyway to be honest).

We are passionate about our club - and exspecially passionate about

protecting its members. THAT MEANS from both "dodgy seller" claims and ALSO

from these members being unfairly hammered because something has gone wrong when they sold something..

Keep it clean and play nice! .

Cheers

Darryn

[Corpse Thrower]

Well, Arties hit me with a solution to the problem, and if it works I'm more that happy.[]

He's resending my items!! Major kudos to him for this[H]

[KEV THE REV]

I have bought many items from both Europro and Ottaviano, and i have found them both to be very professional ,efficient ,polite and friendly sellers and i thank them both for their excellent service to me ,cheers.

[Corpse Thrower]

Got some stuff from Artie yesterday!!![]

My second order has turned up. Posted 9th September, recieved on the 15th September. 6 days travelling time.

Still no sign of my first order from July though[] I really want these bits!! This is putting me behind!![:@]

[Woober Goober]

Just for the record, I have dealt with Artie in the past, and since nobody else has spoke up yet, let me- I found our transaction extremely pleasant- I was basically looking for some old Parma lexan wings for an RC10 sprinter, and he sold me the last 3 that he had for a very good price, and even threw in some stuff for free, that he thought went to the sprinters as well, but did not have any retail packaging or instruction, to indicate their exact use.

Another thing - I keep hearing the story of the body being sent in its original retail box only. A mindset that is shared here on tc, is the fact that the packaging must be pristine in order for the contents to be useable. I have to be honest, I have sent plenty of items in their retail packaging only, with the exception that I sometimes either wrap them with brown paper, or Christmas paper, turned white side out- this is simply to hide what the contents are. If the box was crushed, it was obviously mishandled by the shipper.

So, for the all the negatives regarding this member and seller, let me be one with thumbs up.

Sadly, I think Artie will eventually quit selling internationally- for a guy like me that does the ebay thing more as a hobby than anything else, it is no big deal, but for somebody who does it for a living, I can see him getting tired real quickly.

Just my two or three cents.

WG

[Corpse Thrower]

Another thing - I keep hearing the story of the body being sent in its original retail box only. A mindset that is shared here on tc, is the fact that the packaging must be pristine in order for the contents to be useable. I have to be honest, I have sent plenty of items in their retail packaging only, with the exception that I sometimes either wrap them with brown paper, or Christmas paper, turned white side out- this is simply to hide what the contents are. If the box was crushed, it was obviously mishandled by the shipper.

I do believe that the packaging should be at least still square shaped when it arrives.....and in order to guarantee that as much as possible that body and its packaging should have been placed in a stronger box. How would you like it if your new High Lift was shipped with just the kit box taped up and a shipping sticker over the photo?

I know what you mean about the boxes and the mindset here.....all you guys have most of the ebay shops well trained!!

An example of this: 1 NIB car- $130, same NIB car with VERY slight crushing to one side of box-$100!!

I wonder which one I bought.....[]

Personally I don't subscribe to this "NIB with perfect packaging" bizzo that the serious collectors here seem to take so seriously.

I do tend to get a bit of a laugh out of some Ebayers nuclear warhead-proof packing though.....JR-RC is one, I got an item from him once that was in a plastic bag, taped up, wrapped in bubble wrap several times, taped up again, put in a box about 20 times too big and filled with those little foam thingies, and then the box taped up so much it took me 15 minutes to get all the tape off!!

 

 

[Stefan(2)]

I do tend to get a bit of a laugh out of some Ebayers nuclear warhead-proof packing though.....JR-RC is one, I got an item from him once that was in a plastic bag, taped up, wrapped in bubble wrap several times, taped up again, put in a box about 20 times too big and filled with those little foam thingies, and then the box taped up so much it took me 15 minutes to get all the tape off!!

Going a bit more off topic, but you got to love that. If you buy from him, you just know nothing going to happen to it during transit unless a rig runs over it or get cought up in a stampede with mad elephants.

Hey, but you got to love this (pic) packing! (not from jr/rc or tc member) ..

It actually survived transit quite decent, by luck!

 

But, if a parcel going to spend time across the world, do you have any idea what they do "to it?" I do, as i have worked with/for postal services. Believe me, it is always worth to pack well.

Parcel boxes are a "bulk" product, and treated as such. No carfull gloves, no, i mean big crates and forklifts.  And just hope it is not monday morning or close to the weekend when your parcel gets handeled.

For me, it depends what i'll use the kit for, like the C group collection, i "demanded" mint boxes as some of them were ment to stay NIB. (and i mention that to the seller).

But, i also bought a slightly cheaper leopard 2a6 , as the box was dented.. as i wanted to build it anyway.

But would be quite mad if the seller just slaped on a parcel-sticker and send it across the world!

Stefan

 

 

[Hillman666]

Well I must say after reading this thread I am totally shocked!

 I have bought loads from Artie over the last 3 years and have had nothing but trouble free purchase! Everything has been well packed with nothing missing and delivered in a timely fashion. I have nothing but praise for Artie and have even exchanged emails with him on a personal level and found him to be very friendly and helpful.

The one time there was a slight hiccup with an order being late it turned out to be a mail issue and in no way linked to Artie. In Artie's defense he had promised to replace the item if it didnt show up. This was the act of a genuine seller with nothing to hide, offering to replace an item that was temporarily  lost through no fault of his.

Im sure the problems that some of you are experiencing will be sorted amicably as he is a helpful chap.

I shalll continue to check this thread for updates to see how you guys are getting on with resolving your problems so please keep us updated.

Personally I shall continue to support Artie and purchase items from him as he has delivered a faultless service with me. Its sellers like Artie and JR-RC that will continue to receive my trade as they are just great and I know I can count on them.

Good luck to you all and I hope everything gets sorted.

[OCD]

"An example of this:

1 NIB car- $130, same NIB car with VERY slight crushing to one side of box-$100!!

I wonder which one I bought..... []

 Personally I don't subscribe to this "NIB with perfect packaging" bizzo that the serious collectors here seem to take so seriously."

I think you've just disagreed with yourself there.

If I pay for a NIB anything, I expect it to arrive in the same condition that I originally paid for -- New In Box, not 'Crushed In Transit' and devalued by 25%.

-Steve