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Singapore_959

Raced 959 on carpet last weekend!

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Last saturday I raced my 959 and Dynastorm on an indoor carpet track  :-DD

 

First time I have raced in 13 years! Last time was in '93 on tarmac in Singapore.

 

Anyway... I had the OLDEST two cars at the meet, which consisted of 6 heats per category. Three qualifying and three races each.  "Buggy" and "Nostalgia" classes in my cases.   Both cars are completey stock, except for the rear shocks on the Dyna which I changed for adjustable, and the motor in the Dyna had to be changed to a SLOWER new 23 turn Tamiya BZ (my first time even of hearig about the new tamiya motors!) as per the race regs.  I only have one ESC so had to swap it between the cars during heats!

Dyna came 2nd, 2nd, 3rd !!!!!!!!! :DDD   Couldn't believe it!  The times were even faster than some of the cars in the in the modern touring class - tb04 or whatever the modern trick carbon, metal ones are called.  Fantastic fun.  Running on carpet is totally different from asphalt!  There is SO much traction that the car was doing wheelies acceerating out of alot corners.  (adjusting the slipper clutch is boring, just get out and race it!) First two qualifiers were hilarious and horrendous at the same time. The Dyna was constantly three wheeling and cocking up a rear wheel so high it was a fight to stop it flipping in every corner. Was highly specatular and the crowd enjoyed it, but this wasn't what I wanted to keep fighting with. Ideas from everyone about stiffening the rear to make it rock hard only helped somewhat, but it was still lifting and flipping in the tightest turns.   Eventually swapped the font springs for the orignal rears. THEN it handled like a great!  The front had been so soft the dipping under braking was unbalancing the thing.  Top fun after that, and staying out the accidents netted the good results.

 

The 959 .....   :=O   I had fitted a celica centre diff to it the week before and hoped this would help. I started of using the stock off road tires.  Absolutely zero traction and impossible to drive. The crowd was killing themselves with shouts and I was cringing in pain at the end of the straights as it slammed into the wall or barrier unable to stop in a line or make it round a corner.

Qualifying 2, I tried the orginal 20 year old! slicks and suddenly it was drift mania. Was infact alot of fun but using the orignal futaba stick type transmitter I could not control the drifts well enough and again kept loosing it entering and exiting corners. Lucky I have two bodies, the practice one is now sporting "racing incident" scars!! Third qualifying was much of the same. I was the last of the pack and desperately tying to stay out of everyones way when they came by.  BUT -  it was definitely just as fast as the others!!  On straight I could actually overtake some of the group C cars.

For the races someone lent me some traction paint for the tires and this helped a bit, and I was amazed at the grip the slicks generated after using this and from heating up as the races progressed.  For the races I also swapped the front springs for some MUCH harder ones borrowed from TC member "Manfred",  *THANKS DUDE!!*  he thinks he cut them out of a quick-drive but is not sure. I also swapped the rears for white springs from mini losi shocks.   ALOT better, but still wild.  It think I would have done better with a 'gun' style steering wheel transmitter. I really couldn't control the slides using the stick type transmitter.

Going to conservative fast in, brake late and straight, proved the only way to get around safe-ishly.  Race one went ok, still last and flipping several times as the grip overcomes the high weight center during cornering.  It's very painful to see and hear the precious shell flipping and rolling!

Race two and on the second lap the fancy celica center diff died on the 2nd lap. no-wheel or 2-wheel drive intermittantly. ****!!   I don't know why yet, but it basically froze up solid. People suggested that it's becuase of the carpet fibre, but I cant see how they would ENTER the gearbox. Havent had a close look at it yet. Dissassembleming the rear gearbox is no quick job. After much time stress with the buggy races to run, I managed to change the diff back to the orignal and it worked fine. Still a terrible handful but I finished the last race.   So all in all a cool day.

I've had for a while plans to change the front and rear suspension to accomdate TA01 or TB02 TRF shocks.  I have the shock towers and some standard TA01 shocks now to test fit it.  But after this weekends race I realise that that is not going to help alot on carpet races.  Unless I get a Kamtec body I dont really want to race it again but it would be cool to get it competitive!! It has got the speed for it.

The main problem on carpet is that the slicks produce too much grip for such a narrow chassis, with a relatively high weight centre. Causing flippig.  The off road tires were a worse problem.  So now I am thinking about the following -

does anybody have experience on carpet with those old DUAL COMPONUND tires that came on the Can Am Lola and other early cars? I am wondering if that could be a solution -  better grip but with a much lower break away point so it will eventually slide out rather than flip. But not oversteer like with the off road tires.

If someone from the car club posts up photos on the club race site I will link them here or post them up.

Race the vintage cars!!!  :-D

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Hi, I really enjoyed reading your post, although I wouldn't dare to run a 959 on our carpet track. How did you manage not to break it into 1000 parts when missing a corner?

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Glad you enjoyed it! 

The chassis is quite tough; the battery only came out once. Thankfully I only smacked it HARD!  flat against the wall once and the arms didnt break. I managed to avoid a head on, and clipping it on the corners dissapated alot of energy.  The worst bang was a direct hit on the rear by someone else, which 'didn't do the bodyshell any favours' iyswim!

 I took a camera but being there alone couldn't get any action photos.  I will update my showroom finally this week with picts of both cars tho!

 

OH - And I just bougt a Group C Daytona  car (the one with the parma shell and 01R motor)  to use in the next race instead of the 959 untill I get the tires or a kamtec shell sorted. Cheers to TC club member Michael for that only 39 EUROs!!!!!!  :) time to hunt down the winning f1 and the send place merc C11 in the next race in 2 saturdays!

[:D]

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Sounds so fun! Wish my local club where more in to stuff like this instead of 1/8 nitro's. Keep us informed on your future progress, I enjoyd it very much[Y]

I have been told that M-chassis wheels fit the 959. I also know that foam tyres on carpet makes a lot of traction and that rcmart use to sell foam tyres on rims for M-chassis for a very good price. You have to choose from making som customization to your wheel adaptors or find some foam witch is not glued yet and try to fit it on the original rims.

Cheers

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Thanks. Will do, and get some picts in too!  [<:o)]

 

I will try the foam tires but I think they need to be wiide to help reduce the flipping,  thats why I was thinkin about those dual compound ones.

 

Actually, come to think of it  how about the REAR tires from the 956 / toyota toms.  They are 1/12 scale so perhaps they fit the same size wheel adaptors on the 959.  Anbody know?

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I don't know, but I think that the Porsche 959 and Celica Grb. has unique wheel adaptors?

I took a look at the 956 manual and they don't look the same, but it is to hard to tell, just by looking at the picture, if it's a possible fit. If I remeber corect the 959 adapter has lots of smal tread, while the 956 looks like a six sided hex.

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Great read - really enjoyed that! Glad to here that the Dyna Storm was competitive - I had mine out running up and down the road last night and I love the way it flies over bumps...


Definitely get some action pics next time - we'd all love to see them!

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Dont the Avante hex's fit the 959 axels?

If so, you can fit modern wheels and there for modern tyres. I assume smaller diameter mini size wheels might do the trick.

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Awesome post!  You've inspired me to seriously consider racing my re-re Frog instead of my B4 at our last ooutdoor off-road race this weekend.  The way I drive, I'm going to come in last either way, so may as well have some fun, right?

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does anybody have experience on carpet with those old DUAL COMPONUND tires that came on the Can Am Lola and other early cars? I am wondering if that could be a solution -  better grip but with a much lower break away point so it will eventually slide out rather than flip. But not oversteer like with the off road tires.

Are you talking about "Duplo" tyres...?

Can Am Lola (Racing Master Mk1) does not use Duplo tyres, its got its own unique  solid single sponge on red wheels.

Only the early "CS" spec 1/12ths had Duplos.

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Thanks Willy,  yes those are tyres I am thinking about. Now I know they are called duplos! [:)]

 

So I am hoping they will provide more grip on carpet than the 959 rally tires, but LESS grip than the rubber slicks.   Willy -  I have seen your older posts and you seem have experience with these tires, can you comment?

 

I will also try pure sponge but, like the rubber slicks, I think they will have too much grip and cause flipping [:'(]

 

Everyones great feedback has inspired me to do another write up after the next race. YES, RACE THE ANTIQUES!!  [:D] [:P] [:P]

 

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Nice to hear of those oldies racing with success. Keep up the good work[:)]

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Acorn - I like this idea of smaller diameter wheels. This would also help lower the overall hight/weight center.  Will check out a few stores for options this weekend.

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Found a video of the day! [:D]

 

I will work out how to post it up here into the video section shortly!

 

or try this direct link!   My Dynastorm is the orange one with the large white center stripe  [:D] It's in there!

Nothing of the vintage and 959 tho [:'(]   Will find photos somewhere!

 

Enjoy

 http://www.rcauto.hu/download.asp?modellzo...a_10_30_web.wmv

 

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Just seen that it's not allowed to load up a video on TC if its hosted elsewhere.  So I hope that putting the link above is ok, Chris?

 

[au]

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Great race report!  You are a brave man to take a 959 to a club!  Well Done.  I too am surprised you didnt break it.  I took my Gr.B runner to my club one practice night, and just when I was getting the hang of having zero grip, i clipped an apex and bust the lower front arm - d'oh!!  Anyway just to back up what someone else said - see if you can get some hex adaptors off an Avante.  They have the splined centre so they will fit on the 959, and the hex is the standard size for standard wheels.

Looking forward to your next write up!

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Thanks for the Avante adaptor info!  I am looking for them on ebay now and will put a wanted ad here on TC.

 

Finally got some picts [H] [au] ,   have uploaded them into my showroom! Thanks again for all the positive comments.

 

Tonight I triued to fit the modern shock tower and shocks, only to find that the c.fiber tower is to low at the front, the back will work ok.

So instead of putting it back on the shelf I finally filled the rear shocks with oil using the required syringe. I raced with them empty!  The front I had filled previously.   I also swapped the rear arms for the shortest with the most camber, which is supposed to give it the LEAST oversteer. Its a finiky job with tiny eclips crampt up against the rear gbox.

 Then I swapped the slicks off, as they were more useful for racing, and put the orig rally tires on and went out to play. HO HO HO!   Reduce the oversteer my butt!  It was laughable! But as the temp had dropped to about 17 the tires were rock hard and it was just a joke. Will try tomorrow and see how it goes around midday.

Hopefully with have the avante adaptors and some sponge tires to try by Friday/Sat.

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Just seen that it's not allowed to load up a video on TC if its hosted elsewhere.  So I hope that putting the link above is ok, Chris?

[au]

Putting a link is fine, you can even upload it to TC if its yours or you have a permission, its just not allowed to put up videos to your showroom from others without permission of the owner.

Cheers 

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Have you quit racing your 959?

I used to race one a long time ago at the local asphalt TC track in Ripon, California. I ran it in stock class at the weekend

club races. I also raced a current TC in the Pro-Mod class. We raced in

the evenings and all the spectators loved the headlights on the 959. I

knew everyone pretty well, so they let me run it in the stock class

even though it wasn't legal motor wise. It didn't handle nearly as good

as a full blown modern TC, so they figured it was an even match and it

was really. It consistently finished on the podium.

It's been

boxed up for lots of years now, but after reading your post I dug it

out and snapped some pictures for you. (Links are below)

I ran Yokomo YR4 oil filled shocks on it. I also lowered it as

much as I could to get the center of gravity down. It was actually

quite competitive if you looked at only lap times.

I bought this

paticular car off of ebay and it only had probably 2-5 runs on it. The

body was painted decently in yellow, but trimmed very badly. So even

though it was a nice looking body, I didn't mind running it too

much. 

The box is one of two I used to take with me full of

spares. It was an expensive but fun car to run. Much more enjoyable

than my top-of-the-line modern TC.

If they race somewhere around

Portland, Oregon, I would consider taking it out again as I still have

plenty of spare 959 cars and parts.

Pics:

http://www.tuff240.com/images/rccars/myrccars/959racer01.jpg

http://www.tuff240.com/images/rccars/myrccars/959racer02.jpg

http://www.tuff240.com/images/rccars/myrccars/959racer03.jpg

http://www.tuff240.com/images/rccars/myrccars/959racer04.jpg

http://www.tuff240.com/images/rccars/myrccars/959racer05.jpg

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