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I've re assembled the Manta Ray, that was partly stripped down (mostly the electronics) after yesterday's accidental swim in the ditch.

Much to my surprise, everything worked perfectly. Great! The car definitely stayed at least 20 long seconds under two feet of water, so I'm quite amazed and very happy that I had no damage at all. This is the second time in two weeks (last week was the Hornet, less time underwater but a little longer to recover). At This point I feel like saying that, even thought they can't walk on the water like a Traxxxas or Jesus Christ, Tamiyas can definitely take some accidental scubadiving! :P

But... you know there's always something coming... I was enjoying a celebratory run, all happy for the zero trouble had, when this happened:

20200529-131117.jpg

I am quite baffled :huh: Like, really??

The prop shaft snapped just like that, out of the blue while the car was pacing on flat tarmac. I've checked everything and found absolutely nothing loose or suspicious. Only thing I can think of, it might have eventually snapped due to all the gravel and pebbles occasionally getting stuck around it, so it finally gave up now and this is unrelated to the dip in the water.

I'd value your opinion on the matter. Should I worry and investigate further, or should I just go ahead and get a new prop shaft and call it a day? Did that ever happen to you? 

At a closer look, the extremity of the shaft that snapped doesn't look that tough anyway, so it probably doesn't last "forever" unlike what I though.

 

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Started applying my original vintage Thunder Dragon stickers. I feel dirty using new originals on a used (admittedly reasonable condition) body shell 😬

Was considering doing PS16 but I find it hard to commit to a colour I can't see before doing. Took me long enough to get old paint off. Black and red is a before shot. I am pleased with white though.

20200529_212059 Screenshot_20170922-140237

 

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Added this to my TC showroom:

49949756657_dfc7fa6ae6_b.jpg

Still some changes to make but I couldn't resist posting it!

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1 hour ago, Ferruz said:

The prop shaft snapped just like that

I'm sorry that had happened to your awesome looking Manta.  Sadly, that is the reason why I don't prefer aluminum parts.  

Hobby grade aluminum is much weaker than steel wire.  6000-7000 grade zinc-aluminum alloy would be strong. But that kind of aluminum would be too expensive.  

Shaft breaking would happen on tarmac.  Because the front axle always turns more than the rear.  If you have noticed tire-prints on the ground, they never make 2 lines.  It's always 3-4 lines.  The farthest circle from the theoretical pivoting point, is the front right wheel in below picture. 

 

VIWeTbE.jpg

The rotation rate of the front axle is always greater than the rear axle.  Front right would make 2.1 turn, front left would make 1.9 turn, right rear would make 1.6 turn, left rear would make 1.2 turn.  If you average that, front 2 wheels would make about 2 turns, while the rear 2 would make 1.4 turns. 

But drive shaft turns at the same rate.  99.9% of Tamiya 4WDs are 4WDs.  Not All-Wheel-Drives.  Either front or rear would be forced to lose traction (or break the center shaft).  

rZr8Pax.png

I like the stock wire center shaft in DF01 and TA01 because it twists.  It kinda allows tiny bit of center differential action.  Of course, it will spring back and create a bit of a problem when the turning is done.  It's a pseudo-center differential of a sort.  At least, it won't break.  

One other way is to use One Way bearings on the front.  That allows the front 2 wheels to rotate more than the rear 2 wheels.  When you are reversing, it will turn into 2WD. (I didn't quite like that, because when the car dove into a ditch, that's when it needs 4WD the most)

So... I prefer to use wire shaft.  If you like to use aluminum shaft, you have to stay on loose surface, or use one-way bearings. 

 

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On 10/24/2016 at 5:14 AM, Truck Norris said:

It's PS-46 Iridescent Purple/Green. It goes on quite transparent so you back it with black (it actually states to do this on the can).

Whew...I'm glad I found this post.  I am 3 coats onto my Manta Ray with ps-46 and it looks like I've done nothing.  Should I go for 4-5 coats?

 

image0.jpeg

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29 minutes ago, Juggular said:

I'm sorry that had happened to your awesome looking Manta.  Sadly, that is the reason why I don't prefer aluminum parts.  

Hobby grade aluminum is much weaker than steel wire.  6000-7000 grade zinc-aluminum alloy would be strong. But that kind of aluminum would be too expensive.  

Shaft breaking would happen on tarmac.  Because the front axle always turns more than the rear.  If you have noticed tire-prints on the ground, they never make 2 lines.  It's always 3-4 lines.  The farthest circle from the theoretical pivoting point, is the front right wheel in below picture. 

 

VIWeTbE.jpg

The rotation rate of the front axle is always greater than the rear axle.  Front right would make 2.1 turn, front left would make 1.9 turn, right rear would make 1.6 turn, left rear would make 1.2 turn.  If you average that, front 2 wheels would make about 2 turns, while the rear 2 would make 1.4 turns. 

But drive shaft turns at the same rate.  99.9% of Tamiya 4WDs are 4WDs.  Not All-Wheel-Drives.  Either front or rear would be forced to lose traction (or break the center shaft).  

rZr8Pax.png

I like the stock wire center shaft in DF01 and TA01 because it twists.  It kinda allows tiny bit of center differential action.  Of course, it will spring back and create a bit of a problem when the turning is done.  It's a pseudo-center differential of a sort.  At least, it won't break.  

One other way is to use One Way bearings on the front.  That allows the front 2 wheels to rotate more than the rear 2 wheels.  When you are reversing, it will turn into 2WD. (I didn't quite like that, because when the car dove into a ditch, that's when it needs 4WD the most)

So... I prefer to use wire shaft.  If you like to use aluminum shaft, you have to stay on loose surface, or use one-way bearings. 

 

I am extremely thankful for such timely and detailed explanation. And now I finally seem to grasp the difference between 4WD and AWD :lol:

It was worth snapping the prop shaft as it lead to your post! I am also happy to know that there's nothing wrong witg the car itself.

To be honest, I've never even tried the "coat hanger" stock shaft as in all the threads I've researched before I even got the Manta Ray, I read that literally everybody was bashing it so hard that I ordered an alloy one right away with the motor mount. It's always better to test out things for yourself...

Anyway, your explanation makes so much sense that you've sold me the coat hanger in one post! 

I will definitely try it on the car before I consider buying another alloy shaft, and if I like how it runs I'll just keep it that way. 👍 just too bad I don't have it with me at the moment, but I'll be able to go get it soon.

Thanks again @Juggular!

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36 minutes ago, Ferruz said:

"coat hanger" stock shaft

Well, a post isn't worth a part, but thank you for your kind words.

Coat hangers are not perfect either.  It gives you the wishy-washy feel to the 4WD.  The rear will kick in first, followed by the front.  Some people would definitely prefer the one-way bearing option.  And one way bearing will protect the aluminum shaft. (but Tamiya sells steel shaft, which would be much stronger)  

I have no idea if this would fit Manta Ray.  If I remember correctly, TA01's one-way bearing was quite similar (if not the same).  

BJntYSV.jpg

 

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33 minutes ago, Ferruz said:

I am extremely thankful for such timely and detailed explanation. And now I finally seem to grasp the difference between 4WD and AWD :lol:

It was worth snapping the prop shaft as it lead to your post! I am also happy to know that there's nothing wrong witg the car itself.

To be honest, I've never even tried the "coat hanger" stock shaft as in all the threads I've researched before I even got the Manta Ray, I read that literally everybody was bashing it so hard that I ordered an alloy one right away with the motor mount. It's always better to test out things for yourself...

Anyway, your explanation makes so much sense that you've sold me the coat hanger in one post! 

I will definitely try it on the car before I consider buying another alloy shaft, and if I like how it runs I'll just keep it that way. 👍 just too bad I don't have it with me at the moment, but I'll be able to go get it soon.

Thanks again @Juggular!

@Juggular's argument against the alloy shaft makes a lot of sense, but the widespread dislike of the coathanger shaft is also not without good reason. In addition to the "wishy washy" feeling, it also tends to deform at higher RPM, whacking against the equipment deck and making a horrible racket while also increasing drivetrain drag.

So far the best solution I have found is Tamiya's own hop-up propshaft, made of hardened steel rather than soft alloy. I run this on my Manta Ray and have had no issues, even on very high-grip tracks.

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4 minutes ago, TurnipJF said:

Tamiya's own hop-up propshaft, made of hardened steel

I was going to edit to add this photo, but Turnip beat me to it!  

Turnip is right. In this case, Tamiya's clunky-looking steel shaft option (#47373) is a lot stronger than anodized aluminum shafts.   

VcB7zja.jpg

 

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@TurnipJF and @Juggular Thanks guys for your prompt help, really. It is much appreciated.

After reading your comments, Tamiya's clunky steel shaft definity seems to me the way to go. I'm going to place an order for one as soon as shipping costs allow it. And in the meantime, why not test the coathanger and see how noisy it gets! 

 

 

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Finished the body! Still have to cut down the rear sway bar ends, but I think I’m done with this period correct Fox for now. For all those wondering, the rear sway bar is a combination of a vintage Parma Optima rear sway bar and the fiberglass mounting plate from a vintage Parma Fox adjustable body mount. The only mods are to drill two small holes on the rear arms, along with cutting the body back a bit to clear the sway bar. 👍

10070622-910A-4AAB-873C-2E6249496789.jpeg

8EF7A627-D57D-4F58-80C9-B09618D82B17.jpeg

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Slow and steady progress.

-Window net in

-Rollbars painted and installed

-Still experimenting with stickers

IMG_7226.JPG

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9 hours ago, A-Baum said:

Whew...I'm glad I found this post.  I am 3 coats onto my Manta Ray with ps-46 and it looks like I've done nothing.  Should I go for 4-5 coats?

 

image0.jpeg

Get a bit of black plastic or card and hold it behind the paint to see what it'll look like when the black paint goes on. Keep going with the PS-46 until it looks right. I used a whole can for the Skyline I did.

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Cleaned these 2 shelf queens up this morning as I come to the decision to keep them both-

So back on the shelf for now, but light projects and making them runners is the plan 👍

image.jpg

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Comical hornet to resemble mini 4wd racers box. Taking shape with ps-55 flat clear, inside and out.

E390937E-D9F1-4A4A-A2A6-37A1C8BA18B6.jpeg

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On 5/28/2020 at 6:41 PM, Juhunio said:

Spent a few hours going through the egress manual and tracking down all the parts to build a set of egress hi cap dampers from scratch.

Found everything except a pair of front springs :ph34r:

Just grabbed a set of egress front springs and cylinders that popped up on eBay! Happy days, that’s front and rear hi-caps for my Super Astute sorted 😊

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started to fix my cc-01, last time I ran it I stripped the little tooth out of the diff gear, I did not want to order a 4 euro part and then pay 13 euro on shipping cost, I found some tt-01 new diff gears that uses flat spots on the outdrive shaft instead of the little tooth,  so I grind 2 flat spots on the axle shaft of the cc-01 and make it fit.

I put yeah racing shock towers and tamiya alloy shocks on my wr-02, the gmade shocks I had on them where a little to short, with these shock I get more ride height 1.3mm more, so now the car don't get stuck so easy.

49952011741_6603ac26ac_c.jpg

49951510238_8e6b4351fd_c.jpg

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7 hours ago, Truck Norris said:

Get a bit of black plastic or card and hold it behind the paint to see what it'll look like when the black paint goes on. Keep going with the PS-46 until it looks right. I used a whole can for the Skyline I did.

Ahhh crap I didn’t see this in time.  I did 5 coats then did a few coats of black.  It looks ok.  But my daughter was expecting purple based on Tamiya’s site and the can top.  It does look kinda cool and will be interesting to see it running out in the sun.

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1 hour ago, A-Baum said:

Ahhh crap I didn’t see this in time.  I did 5 coats then did a few coats of black.  It looks ok.  But my daughter was expecting purple based on Tamiya’s site and the can top.  It does look kinda cool and will be interesting to see it running out in the sun.

This is how mine turned out i can't remember how many coat's their is as I did it back in 2018 the light dont do it sny justice that is and my original manta ray not the re-re i got last year

IMG_20180506_122720.jpg

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22 hours ago, Ferruz said:

I've re assembled the Manta Ray, that was partly stripped down (mostly the electronics) after yesterday's accidental swim in the ditch.

Much to my surprise, everything worked perfectly. Great! The car definitely stayed at least 20 long seconds under two feet of water, so I'm quite amazed and very happy that I had no damage at all. This is the second time in two weeks (last week was the Hornet, less time underwater but a little longer to recover). At This point I feel like saying that, even thought they can't walk on the water like a Traxxxas or Jesus Christ, Tamiyas can definitely take some accidental scubadiving! :P

But... you know there's always something coming... I was enjoying a celebratory run, all happy for the zero trouble had, when this happened:

20200529-131117.jpg

I am quite baffled :huh: Like, really??

The prop shaft snapped just like that, out of the blue while the car was pacing on flat tarmac. I've checked everything and found absolutely nothing loose or suspicious. Only thing I can think of, it might have eventually snapped due to all the gravel and pebbles occasionally getting stuck around it, so it finally gave up now and this is unrelated to the dip in the water.

I'd value your opinion on the matter. Should I worry and investigate further, or should I just go ahead and get a new prop shaft and call it a day? Did that ever happen to you? 

At a closer look, the extremity of the shaft that snapped doesn't look that tough anyway, so it probably doesn't last "forever" unlike what I though.

 

This is what has been in my top-force since 1992 when my mates dad made is for me not far from the tamiya one 

IMG_20180506_122326.jpg

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work in progress... 

the grass hopper driver -yoo jae suk?

and a hornet pilot for my son.

 

WhatsApp Image 2020-05-30 at 9.32.21 PM.jpeg

WhatsApp Image 2020-05-31 at 1.29.10 AM.jpeg

WhatsApp Image 2020-05-31 at 1.29.34 AM.jpeg

WhatsApp Image 2020-05-31 at 1.38.30 AM.jpeg

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Took the basher to the beach as lockdown eased a little north of the border.  Ran brilliantly. I need some new tyres though as slicks are poor on sand. I need some advice on sand running I think I should probably replace the esc with a waterproof one but any tips on motor and receiver. I’ll take it again tomorrow then strip and clean. Can also figure out how many parts I am short from making a second one from parts!

3A055BD0-F3F4-44B5-AE10-539B6E48DEC8.jpeg

C147BFFB-9959-4CC9-94AD-BC1E375921B5.jpeg

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