Let's Say You Just Want A Perfect, Box-art, Display Model...

[Hibernaculum]

G'day,

Sometimes I look at the Expert Built versions of the Frog, Hornet, Grasshopper, Porsche 934 etc, and I think "Why go through the trouble of building and try to get the stickers and paintwork perfect, if the work is already done for you?". Especially if all you want is a perfect shelf queen.

How tempted are you guys by these expert built models? Or do you prefer the challenge of trimming and painting the body and trying to get it to look perfect?

I love the building process. In fact I love the detailing too. But sometimes, you finish a kit off perfectly, only to look at it again a year later and see a bubble beneath a sticker or two. These minor flaws can drive a perfectionist insane.

Seeing those perfect cars, pre-detailed by Tamiya, well....

What are your thoughts on this issue?

cheers,

H.

[Victorious Secret]

I like to build mine so I will probably not purchase a XB model. Besides the newer car have black windshield which I dont like so I prefer to detail the bodyshell myself.

VS

[zulu69]

I have the same question myshelf.. ...

I have accepted the fact that I will buy all this nice XB examples and display them ..as with Tamtach Porsches and Ferrari and keep also the radio gear.

If you calculate the price it is also a better deal than to buy the kit,paints,radio gear,battery,charger. I bought the Mini Cooper Monte Carlo XB allready.Its a very nice detailed model -one of the hardest to decal.Couldnt do it better myshelf.I put it in display and took out the radio gear.

Next step my all times favorite >>> THE FROG <<<.

Greetings!

T.

[yamita]

XB shells arent always perfectly decaled. And I cant stand the black stickered windows... Pre cut and masked shells would be nice...

[Saito]

Ah yes, so tempting indeed! I love the mechcanical build up of cars but not the bodywork. Its not that I can't do it (I did it to full-size autos for years). Its just sooo stressful for a perfectionist like me. Even though I might be unable to actually see that small decal I applied slightly crooked on the shelf (as it faces the wall), it still nags at me because I know its there. Alas, if I didn't do ALL the work (bodywork too) then its not MY model. It loses a little of its soul or connection to me. A prebuilt is just a purchased object that sits on a shelf like any other decoration.

[secretasianman]

Never thought of it. Like Saito said, it's just a purchased thing. It has no story like the ones you've built, the ones yo'uve raced and retired, the ones you got off ebay and laboriously but delicately cleaned to presentable condition. the ones that you coveted so much in your youth that you had to have it the moment you could afford it. The one thhe guy in the adjacent pit bench begged to borrow a belt from because he snapped his own.

Those make much better conversation pieces than the ones an unknown wage worker assembled for the third time that day.

[Mad Ax]

I've been very tempted by the TamTechs as display models, not because they look good but because they are an interested modern rendition of old classics. However, I don't think I'd buy an XB model for the shelf then IMO 1:10 RC is about building as much as displaying or running.

I'm only just starting to understand the shelf-display phenomenon and am starting to be gripped by it more than buying cars to run. I really enjoy the building process, and I enjoy knowing that I put something together properly and understand how it works. I don't really enjoy trimming, masking, painting etc. and it usually goes wrong despite my best efforts to do it all by the book - but even so, I don't think I'd want to make a display model with a pre-painted shell.

I can understand the concept of buying XB models to get running quickly, but even that doesn't appeal to me. Even when I'm trying to find bits for custom projects, I'd rather buy an NIB model, strip out the bits I need and sell the rest, than buy second-hand built kits or built axles etc...

[WillyChang]

i took a close look at the built TTG 934s & Ferrari... gee, the driver figures aren't well painted.

Painter @ factory must have been having a really off day.

[secretasianman]

I've been very tempted by the TamTechs as display models, not because they look good but because they are an interested modern rendition of old classics. However, I don't think I'd buy an XB model for the shelf then IMO 1:10 RC is about building as much as displaying or running.

The Tam-Techs are a treat and have excellent runtimes. They're also fun in the kitchen and living room before you get them dirty. They don't have psychotic speeds like the Associated RC18 series but we're having fun, not racing seriously.

I'm only just starting to understand the shelf-display phenomenon and am starting to be gripped by it more than buying cars to run. I really enjoy the building process, and I enjoy knowing that I put something together properly and understand how it works. I don't really enjoy trimming, masking, painting etc. and it usually goes wrong despite my best efforts to do it all by the book - but even so, I don't think I'd want to make a display model with a pre-painted shell.

Well, some of us don't buy to collect, at least not initially. we just can't stop buying. they might as well look good for visitors.

I can understand the concept of buying XB models to get running quickly, but even that doesn't appeal to me. Even when I'm trying to find bits for custom projects, I'd rather buy an NIB model, strip out the bits I need and sell the rest, than buy second-hand built kits or built axles etc...

That's the nail on the head. it's for running quickly and instant gratification. A lot of newcomers are scared off by the idea that they have to assemble their kits, select a radio, buy a battery, then a charger, meet other hobbyists, then feel inferior for having the basics before revisiting the cycle with more serious gear. Most turn away before learning about THAT much.

But I support the XB's. Before, there was a huge gap between A toy-store RC and a hobby shop RC, The hobby route was intimidating as mentioned before and the toy route left a sour wanting taste in their mouths. It's taken marketing groups far too long to realize that and close that gap. Plus a lot of us who race or raced at any level can trace their roots to that Frog, Hornet or Fox they got as a gift in the 80's. They make great christmas gifts if not for nostalgia.

[theRuggedMan]

XB shells arent always perfectly decaled. And I cant stand the black stickered windows... Pre cut and masked shells would be nice...

I agree! a mate of mine bought a XB Mercedes Benz DTM 2004 and the rear window "decal" was completely misaligned!

[markbt73]

I'd never buy an XB, because I love building kits. But I have been tempted by the kits with the pre-finished bodies, especially for runners. I tend to bang my cars up pretty good, and I hate spending a lot of time on bodywork only to see it get mangled. If I was building one for the shelf, I'd want to do every inch of it myself. But for a runner, I'd let someone else paint it, so I could get on the road faster.

I just wish they would offer more than one color scheme. I don't want the same yellow Corvette or blue Subaru as everyone else.

[Hibernaculum]

Interesting to hear some negative comments about the quality of Tamiya's pre-painting.

Previously I had only heard people say good things about it...

I don't think I could give up on the building part. Maybe the only solution is to buy both the kits and the XBs, and be a totally insane tamiya completist...

(XB window-box packaging is rather nice ).

cheers,

H.

[Live Steam Mad]

it's for running quickly and instant gratification. A lot of newcomers are scared off by the idea that they have to assemble their kits, select a radio, buy a battery, then a charger, meet other hobbyists, then feel inferior for having the basics before revisiting the cycle with more serious gear. Most turn away before learning about THAT much.

But I support the XB's. Before, there was a huge gap between A toy-store RC and a hobby shop RC, The hobby route was intimidating as mentioned before and the toy route left a sour wanting taste in their mouths. It's taken marketing groups far too long to realize that and close that gap. Plus a lot of us who race or raced at any level can trace their roots to that Frog, Hornet or Fox they got as a gift in the 80's. They make great christmas gifts if not for nostalgia.

OK here's my opinion for what it's worth...

Funny how people's views can be different, as I have almost the exact polar opposite view. Back in the day (the time that I came from) the Kit was King, and I only occasionally saw RTR stuff as models that had been assembled by staff and were on "special offer". People only bought kits. Life was FUN. The joy of the experience was in ogling the box art, reading the instructions, assembling the whole mechanics of the car, painting it, decalling it, and then seeing it come to life when running it. The MANY MANY HOURS that people spent assembling and painting the thing caused them to appreciate the car inside and out, and it became embedded in their minds. Not just a "thing" / "decoration" / "toy" that you buy ready built, run for 5 minutes and then get very bored with.

In my mind, RTR is a complete and total betrayal of the hobby as it was back in the day when RC was at it's peak (1986 it seems). Truggies, RTR cheap **** from China with zero imagination or character to the thing, just yet another vague Lexan blob, are also complete and total dissappointments and betrayal. It's the Shoe Event Horizon effect again, but with lexan truggy blobs (Douglas Adams reference LOL).

I'm afraid that I have a rather old fashioned and closed view of this, it's true, but I cannot be changed as I am now just a stubborn old hack that refuses to give up on his dreams of building and racing Vintage RC buggies.

RTR sucks, bring back kits,

Oh yeah and another thing that really bugs me is the box art dissappearing on the newer buggies. Yet another case of lack of foresight and imagination.

BTW I wonder how people would feel if they were to open the Tamiya 2008 catalogue and see nothing but RTR truggy **** with vague lexan?! I wish that someone would do something about this problem before it's too late. Then again what does it matter to us stubborn die hard old hacks that want box art, Sand Scorcher / Avante / Egress re-releases, driver figures in the cockpit, kits only, etc etc...

Sorry for the rant but this touched a raw nerve (so what's new).

BTW H., got your pm, many thanks, it's a joy to read, really brightened up my day. PM coming your way real soon mate.

Cheers,

Alistair G.

[WillyChang]

i was hoping i'd get a nice Monte Mini from an XB, but alas not

on closer look... the white roof is roughly masked, but is hidden by a white line sticker at the edge.

The front indicator lights also have a strip of sticker to make the orange/red border neat.

... open the Tamiya 2008 catalogue

I haven't seen any 2007 RC Guidebook yet... anyone?!

[bakaguyjean]

i was hoping i'd get a nice Monte Mini from an XB, but alas not

on closer look... the white roof is roughly masked, but is hidden by a white line sticker at the edge.

The front indicator lights also have a strip of sticker to make the orange/red border neat.

Great that means you will not have a problem driving it. You can order the spare parts for the body from Tamiya and run the XB body all day. Really you will not notice the masking or decals placement when you drive it around.

I haven't seen any 2007 RC Guidebook yet... anyone?!

You only get the 2007 Perfect guide this time around.

Im still digging around for a CLK Carbon picture I might have been on drugs

[secretasianman]

Funny how people's views can be different, as I have almost the exact polar opposite view. Back in the day (the time that I came from) the Kit was King, and I only occasionally saw RTR stuff as models that had been assembled by staff and were on "special offer". People only bought kits. Life was FUN. The joy of the experience was in ogling the box art, reading the instructions, assembling the whole mechanics of the car, painting it, decalling it, and then seeing it come to life when running it. The MANY MANY HOURS that people spent assembling and painting the thing caused them to appreciate the car inside and out, and it became embedded in their minds. Not just a "thing" / "decoration" / "toy" that you buy ready built, run for 5 minutes and then get very bored with.

I don't dispute you. Enjoying the kit and developing an understanding otf tech is *OUR* persepective: people who *DID* get into RC. The view I posted was the impression I got from the people who didn't belong in RC to begin with. the impatient instant gratification consumer who don't want to do the work and probably also don't understand that you need to change your oil and maintain your brakes in regular intervals. Yes: toys are scoffed at. Kits are king. and if they're going to get bored after 5 minutes, then we're not associated with those people because these are NOT toys and they were shortly interested for the wrong reasons. But at least they got running before decide that this is not they what.

In my mind, RTR is a complete and total betrayal of the hobby as it was back in the day when RC was at it's peak (1986 it seems). Truggies, RTR cheap **** from China with zero imagination or character to the thing, just yet another vague Lexan blob, are also complete and total dissappointments and betrayal. It's the Shoe Event Horizon effect again, but with lexan truggy blobs (Douglas Adams reference LOL).

I'm afraid that I have a rather old fashioned and closed view of this, it's true, but I cannot be changed as I am now just a stubborn old hack that refuses to give up on his dreams of building and racing Vintage RC buggies.

RTR sucks, bring back kits,

I'm not a fan of RTR either but I don't mind them too. However you need to ask yourself was there ever time that it being RTR and not a kit was a dealbreaker? If yes, did you really miss out? They're targeted at the low end who MAY develop a deeper interest in the hobby if not giving up early in the game. As for betrayal, wouldn't a hobby shop selling a store made kit be just as much a betrayal? Should they EXPECT the customer to build their kit to be a worthy of coming to the shop and giving them money?

BTW I wonder how people would feel if they were to open the Tamiya 2008 catalogue and see nothing but RTR truggy **** with vague lexan?! I wish that someone would do something about this problem before it's too late. Then again what does it matter to us stubborn die hard old hacks that want box art, Sand Scorcher / Avante / Egress re-releases, driver figures in the cockpit, kits only, etc etc...

You're being both stubborn and bitter. Last time I checked Tamiya has too many diverse markets as a model company and has been at it for decades. They will never stop making kits.

Besides, noone can be a hardcore enthusiast or winner or truly have fun with just a RTR. If they buy a RTR and discover they need more car for better results, they WILL buy a kit. RTR's can't destroy the hobby, they open doors. It's not the RTR that will kill interest. it's the driver deciding on whether or not they're interested.

[Live Steam Mad]

I don't dispute you. Enjoying the kit and developing an understanding otf tech is *OUR* persepective: people who *DID* get into RC. The view I posted was the impression I got from the people who didn't belong in RC to begin with. the impatient instant gratification consumer who don't want to do the work and probably also don't understand that you need to change your oil and maintain your brakes in regular intervals. Yes: toys are scoffed at. Kits are king. and if they're going to get bored after 5 minutes, then we're not associated with those people because these are NOT toys and they were shortly interested for the wrong reasons. But at least they got running before decide that this is not they what.

Woah, yep I agree very much with what you say here, us lot here tend to be an "into R/C" kinda crowd, thank goodness, which is much of what matters, in my mind.

I'm not a fan of RTR either but I don't mind them too. However you need to ask yourself was there ever time that it being RTR and not a kit was a dealbreaker? If yes, did you really miss out? They're targeted at the low end who MAY develop a deeper interest in the hobby if not giving up early in the game. As for betrayal, wouldn't a hobby shop selling a store made kit be just as much a betrayal? Should they EXPECT the customer to build their kit to be a worthy of coming to the shop and giving them money?

I can see your 2 points, and yes if there was a RTR Avante / Egress / Turbo Scorpion / Gallop Mk. 2 / Optima / Top Force Evo / Rough Rider, and no kit, then I would have DEFINATELY missed out, for sure. Also yes it is wrong of me to expect the average consumer of today to have to go through the "nightmare and hassle" of building the kit. However for people of from the RC generation (my lot LOL) this was the beauty of the hobby, building and enjoying it.

I suppose that ironically the wonderful thing for us vintage RC people is that practically all the kits that we ever wanted have already been released, and are obtainable from TC / Ebay, and no amount of modern day marketting / production of vague lexan blob bodied truggy **** can change this. Yahey!

You're being both stubborn and bitter.

Hahaha hehey SO WHAT'S NEW. I warned you that this topic touched a raw nerve Man this is like therapy, as someone here on TC said (directed at me) LOL...

Seriously though, I can also see the argument that I heard on RClive.com, that RTR / truggies / glow engined cars have done much to keep the hobby alive in the past few years, but IMHO we have paid a terrible price for it.

To my mind, this hobby should be about things like ;-

1) SCALE looks, and very good realism

2) Sand Buggies, cars of all kinds, lorries (that's trucks for you lot in the rest of the world LOL), tanks, boats, planes, helicopters etc

3) RC equipment that is easy to use (that means stick transmitters for those of us that started in the 1980's LOL), yet another one of my pet hates is wheel type TX's ROTFL!

4) Styrene hard type body shells on non-racers that look absolutely breathtaking and reproduce the original in nearly every detail

5) Mouth watering box art that I can drool over

6) Motors with character like Technigold, Dynatech 02H

7) Kits, not RTR

8) Painting in all kinds of lovely colours, have you ever noticed how some cars can look completely different with new colour schemes like that awesome orange DynaStorm that someone brought to the Kidderminster 2007 TC meet, goodness that was just wonderful to see, well worth the visit!

9) Decalling, yes I am one of those maschokists (spelling? LOL) that gets a real kick out of decalling, I can't get enough of it, I really love those old Vintage decals because they have all kinds of wonderful trade names on them that Tamiya will NOT buy the licenses for anymore, so the modern cars / rereleases of the old cars don't have them anymore

10) Having detailed driver cockpits with a proper driver in it, which takes time to paint and care has to be taken over it which enhances the whole experience more and more

11) Getting the older catalogues (1982 Tamiya RC catalogue or something) and getting mesmerised over the wonderful older models THAT HAD INDIVIDUALITY AND CHARACTER, not like today's vague looking rubbish

12) Going racing with vintage buggies with like minded friends to an awesome track where you can meet everyone, race the cars, and KNOW HOW TO FIX THEM SINCE YOU DIDN'T BUY IT RTR AND ARE THUS NOT AFRAID TO GET YOUR HANDS DIRTY AND ROUGHED UP IN FIXING THE CARS. LOL.

It's a selection of vintage RC dreams that I absolutely 100 per cent refuse to let go of. Blimey as I read this back to myself I realise that as I get older I also get a lot more stubborn and am not willing to compromise or let modern vague Lexan change anything for me.

Besides, noone can be a hardcore enthusiast or winner or truly have fun with just a RTR. If they buy a RTR and discover they need more car for better results, they WILL buy a kit. RTR's can't destroy the hobby, they open doors. It's not the RTR that will kill interest. it's the driver deciding on whether or not they're interested.

Yes I can agree with that also to some extent.

If RTR attracts more people to the hobby then that's a good thing I suppose, but at what cost? When I go down to the newsagents and have a look in the modern RC car magazines I nearly always start to get depressed, it makes me want to cry. The only good thing in them is the vintage section (if you can find one). If I could bring back the early days of RC and start the whole thing over again from 1979 and reset the clock, I would be tremendously happy, man imagine going into the shops and buying Model Cars from 1981 and seeing the advert for the Sand Scorcher that was new out on the back cover, for example, I would be in heaven .

I go into my local Hobby shop and see almost nothing but RTR and vague lexan. God it's depressing. Shaun of Vulcan Hobbies my LHS refused for the last many years to become a Tamiya dealer, I asked and begged and pleaded with him but alas, nothing doing.

However I have to remember that there are upsides to things as they are now. Kits galore in the RC 1/14 lorries (trucks) of Tamiya, tanks are nearly all RC kits, box art still reigns there (mostly), and that's wonderful to see. Also heartening to see is the relatively new phenomenon of "Drift", with a huge emplasis on DETAIL AND REALISM. Yes, realism, now there's a shock. This can only be a good thing. Also the release of the Hilift and rerelease (sort of) of the Hilux, they are gorgeous looking car kits. Pity they didn't go with box art for those. Oh well.

Cheers, and good RC dreams to all,

Alistair G.

P.S. the Tamiya RC Perfect book (the one published by Gakken Mook) which was mentioned above is very, very nice. Slight problem (for me at least) that it's all in Japanese! Awesome pictures though. I love my copy very much.

[secretasianman]

1) SCALE looks, and very good realism

2) Sand Buggies, cars of all kinds, lorries (that's trucks for you lot in the rest of the world LOL), tanks, boats, planes, helicopters etc

3) RC equipment that is easy to use (that means stick transmitters for those of us that started in the 1980's LOL), yet another one of my pet hates is wheel type TX's ROTFL!

4) Styrene hard type body shells on non-racers that look absolutely breathtaking and reproduce the original in nearly every detail

5) Mouth watering box art that I can drool over

6) Motors with character like Technigold, Dynatech 02H

7) Kits, not RTR

8) Painting in all kinds of lovely colours, have you ever noticed how some cars can look completely different with new colour schemes like that awesome orange DynaStorm that someone brought to the Kidderminster 2007 TC meet, goodness that was just wonderful to see, well worth the visit!

9) Decalling, yes I am one of those maschokists (spelling? LOL) that gets a real kick out of decalling, I can't get enough of it, I really love those old Vintage decals because they have all kinds of wonderful trade names on them that Tamiya will NOT buy the licenses for anymore, so the modern cars / rereleases of the old cars don't have them anymore

10) Having detailed driver cockpits with a proper driver in it, which takes time to paint and care has to be taken over it which enhances the whole experience more and more

11) Getting the older catalogues (1982 Tamiya RC catalogue or something) and getting mesmerised over the wonderful older models THAT HAD INDIVIDUALITY AND CHARACTER, not like today's vague looking rubbish

12) Going racing with vintage buggies with like minded friends to an awesome track where you can meet everyone, race the cars, and KNOW HOW TO FIX THEM SINCE YOU DIDN'T BUY IT RTR AND ARE THUS NOT AFRAID TO GET YOUR HANDS DIRTY AND ROUGHED UP IN FIXING THE CARS. LOL.

However I have to remember that there are upsides to things as they are now. Kits galore in the RC 1/14 lorries (trucks) of Tamiya, tanks are nearly all RC kits, box art still reigns there (mostly), and that's wonderful to see. Also heartening to see is the relatively new phenomenon of "Drift", with a huge emplasis on DETAIL AND REALISM. Yes, realism, now there's a shock. This can only be a good thing. Also the release of the Hilift and rerelease (sort of) of the Hilux, they are gorgeous looking car kits. Pity they didn't go with box art for those. Oh well.

I miss those things too. probably like you, i grew up spending endless hours driving, making and fixing cars deep into the night. It was fun repairing and rebuilding kits and even more fun discovering chassis similarities that eventually led you to 'convert' once car to another (ie super champ to sand scorcher, frog to brat... etc) Painting was half the fun and I don't believe there's nearly enough hardshell kits out there anymore. I too am surprised by the attention to detail drift racers make, like mufflers and functional signal lights. I thought scale realism was 'destroyed' by race regulations which by the requirement of a shell, dominated the market with spartan and functional buggy and truggies that retained nearly no imagination.

I go into my local Hobby shop and see almost nothing but RTR and vague lexan. God it's depressing. Shaun of Vulcan Hobbies my LHS refused for the last many years to become a Tamiya dealer, I asked and begged and pleaded with him but alas, nothing doing.

I noticed that too. There's not a local hobby shop near me anymore so I mostly do mail order nowadays. on a day off I trek off to the next town to buy paint and their RC section is abysmal (and overpriced) with RTR kit boxes stacked like pyramids right inside the front door as if it were the pinnacle. However that's a half truth. There's an all RC shop in another nearby town that is JUST R/C: planes, helis touring cars, electric and i believe 60% of the shop is nitro. It may sound like heaven but I find it VERY hard to leave without getting $500 USD worth of merchandise ON IMPULSE! So I don't go there for other reasons as I've already paid 4 visits already this year.

9) Decalling, yes I am one of those maschokists (spelling? LOL) that gets a real kick out of decalling, I can't get enough of it, I really love those old Vintage decals because they have all kinds of wonderful trade names on them that Tamiya will NOT buy the licenses for anymore, so the modern cars / rereleases of the old cars don't have them anymore

Huh? are you talking about Ford, VW, Mercedes, Mazda, Toyota Nissan etc? or are you talking about the parts sponsors like Gumout, Valvoline, Champion, Simpson, KC Daylighter, Pennzoil and STP? I did notice they don't provide the latter anymore Those were always fun.

[Saito]

Wow! This topic has certainly hit some issues. I'll put it this way. I want very badly to purchase the RTR Buggy Champ (baby Rough Rider) but cannot bring myself to do it and because it is not available in kit form, Tamiya will lose a sale on me. Its a great little buggy, but when you get it, what do you do? There it is. Done. Just stick batteries in it and go. Maybe good for me at 5 but I learned very very quickly (like age 6) of the joys of kit constuction. BUT, you know what? I'm a minority. I'm willing to bet that the majority of potential tamtech buggy buyers on Tamiyaclub probably got the car without too much reservation about its RTR status. And of all places, Tamiyaclub is likely a haven for RC kit builders. I have to admit, its a Tamiya, its little and cool, its got a vintage vibe and looks fun as can be. Most Tamiya fans will scoop them right up. But for me and a the few like me, we'll pass unless we get a kit version.

[Live Steam Mad]

Wow! This topic has certainly hit some issues. I'll put it this way. I want very badly to purchase the RTR Buggy Champ (baby Rough Rider) but cannot bring myself to do it and because it is not available in kit form, Tamiya will lose a sale on me. Its a great little buggy, but when you get it, what do you do? There it is. Done. Just stick batteries in it and go. Maybe good for me at 5 but I learned very very quickly (like age 6) of the joys of kit constuction. BUT, you know what? I'm a minority. I'm willing to bet that the majority of potential tamtech buggy buyers on Tamiyaclub probably got the car without too much reservation about its RTR status. And of all places, Tamiyaclub is likely a haven for RC kit builders. I have to admit, its a Tamiya, its little and cool, its got a vintage vibe and looks fun as can be. Most Tamiya fans will scoop them right up. But for me and a the few like me, we'll pass unless we get a kit version.

For me, that crystallised a lot of my thoughts about the XB series of models, well said.

There would be no question in my mind, I could not buy an XB of any sort, I just can't bring myself to do it.

Cheers,

Ali. G.

[secretasianman]

Wow! This topic has certainly hit some issues. I'll put it this way. I want very badly to purchase the RTR Buggy Champ (baby Rough Rider) but cannot bring myself to do it and because it is not available in kit form, Tamiya will lose a sale on me. Its a great little buggy, but when you get it, what do you do? There it is. Done. Just stick batteries in it and go. Maybe good for me at 5 but I learned very very quickly (like age 6) of the joys of kit constuction. BUT, you know what? I'm a minority. I'm willing to bet that the majority of potential tamtech buggy buyers on Tamiyaclub probably got the car without too much reservation about its RTR status. And of all places, Tamiyaclub is likely a haven for RC kit builders. I have to admit, its a Tamiya, its little and cool, its got a vintage vibe and looks fun as can be. Most Tamiya fans will scoop them right up. But for me and a the few like me, we'll pass unless we get a kit version.

Well, this is the next best thing:

GB-01 chassis kit (Buggy champ base) :

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti00...=LXPXS1&P=7

and apparently parts are available : however I'm not sure readily available on all shelves. These don't threaten to take modelers out of the picture.

http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/rcpss.php...mp;kit_id=56707

Personally, I'm still interested in the GB-03 Hotshot. It's not like I'm loading my wishlist full of Tam-techs. Even though I was impressed by the speed and agility of the Associated RC-18B, you don't see me loading up mini (and inherently rtr) at all. RTRs are just novelties. And like all novelties, people will lose interest.

[Hibernaculum]

Wow! This topic has certainly hit some issues. I'll put it this way. I want very badly to purchase the RTR Buggy Champ (baby Rough Rider) but cannot bring myself to do it and because it is not available in kit form, Tamiya will lose a sale on me. Its a great little buggy, but when you get it, what do you do? There it is. Done. Just stick batteries in it and go. Maybe good for me at 5 but I learned very very quickly (like age 6) of the joys of kit constuction. BUT, you know what? I'm a minority. I'm willing to bet that the majority of potential tamtech buggy buyers on Tamiyaclub probably got the car without too much reservation about its RTR status. And of all places, Tamiyaclub is likely a haven for RC kit builders. I have to admit, its a Tamiya, its little and cool, its got a vintage vibe and looks fun as can be. Most Tamiya fans will scoop them right up. But for me and a the few like me, we'll pass unless we get a kit version.

Personally, I'm still interested in the GB-03 Hotshot. It's not like I'm loading my wishlist full of Tam-techs. Even though I was impressed by the speed and agility of the Associated RC-18B, you don't see me loading up mini (and inherently rtr) at all. RTRs are just novelties. And like all novelties, people will lose interest.

I understand where you guys are coming from. I'm a big fan of kits, like I said. I'm even one of those NIB obsessives who gets as much fun out of admiring unbuilt parts, as building, displaying or running.

But while I started this thread after speculating about the XB 1/10th scale re-releases, the truth is that in my personal opinion I've already 'approved' the Tamtech buggies and am more than comfortable buying them as RTRs. They don't have a kit option (at least, not one that provides everything for a particular car). I have three so far, all NIB never to be run, and I hope to collect them all. They really are cute, nice to drive, and nicely put together little guys, including decals and paintwork.

For the Tamtech Frog, I even made an exception in the fact that I upgraded it Normally I don't like doing upgrades, preferring to keep everything stock (just a thing with me). But there are some optional parts for the Tamtechs that really should have been included in the cars as standard - the obvious example being the bumper set and aerials. But in the case of the Frog, I have also added all the pink anodised parts as well. Being pink, they are so obviously for the Frog only, so I decided to add them. Makes the car look even better. Tamiya were just being clever by making them option parts.

Only other thing I can say about the Tamtech buggies, is that the packaging is nice too. I consider them nice collectors items all round, and I think they would look cool sitting alongside their bigger brothers in a showroom. Aside from the re-release vintage kits, the Tamtechs are the only recent Tamiya buggies that have interested me. Give me them anyday, over such unfaithful sequels as the Avante II or the Neo Falcon

cheers,

H.

[value]

I bought for my bro a Mini Cooper Montecarlo, XB and it looked very nice, well done and with good decals. I had this opinion untill I had to buy a new body shell, with new decals and details because my brother distroyed it, smashing it into the wall. I admit that I didn't paint the shell because I am not good with colors and sprays, so I let this work to the owner of the hobby shop. Then I put the decals and I arranged the details like the fog-lamps and the "bumpers".... and there is no comparison between the two. The one I realized is much better than the XB one, with everything more precise and accurate! (the only negative aspect is the color, that on some parts was not properly given).

Anyway, being sincere, is cheaper to buy a XB version than buying the kit and then the ESC, the transmitter, the receiver, and so on! In fact I prefered to buy a tt-01d in the XB pack... even considering that you can easily hit a drift car, wasting the shell! (and so happened with my Nissan Silvia).

In my opinon, everything depends on the final use you want to do with your car, and how much you are good with paint and decals!

[Floyd]

I must admit .... errr , well Ive never been afraid of saying that I hate anything prebuilt . Give me a kit or give me death . Though I think I'm probably worse than Alistair as I wont even consider buying a kit if it has a pre painted body packed in . I don't care if I'm just using it as a basher or something I plan on just sticking on the shelf ( not that they ever stay on a shelf for long ) if I cant build it and paint it the way I want to I wont even consider buying it no matter what it is . Have I missed out on some neat RC's the past few years because of this ? Not really because for me personally the neatest thing about the RC's I get into is building and detailing them the way I want and then seeing it come to life . Then figure out what I did wrong , fix it , and watch it come to life again . To me , though I know its not the case , XB's and pre painted shells is like someone telling me I'm not smart enough to know how to put it together or paint it .

[zulu69]

Second time posting here.....I feel all along here ...nobody likes the XB's...my opinion as said is that I can accept the XB's buggies from all vintage models and maybe buy one of each also the Tamtech's as said since there is no kit ,you can do little with them...I also bought a Tamtech frog with all pink upgrades...it looks fantastic...if you have the bug of making things ,impoving them ,taking them apart just to see whats inside I have no problem buying something and do it the other way around...unbuilding it....Have in mind that since you buy an XB and start using it ,it will come a point that you should take it apart and rebuild it ,replace parts,upgraded it or just clean it.I have build more than ten Frogs and I dont mind buying a ready made I also like the Frog's package in XB.Personally I only like the vintage re-re XB buggies and Tamtechs nothing else...