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Please Turn On Ability To Change Topic

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Can you guys turn on the ability to edit the title of threads please? We can edit content of our threads but not the topic which is a PITA some times when a mistake is made.

Let me know.

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I believe there is a specific reason for not allowing title edits...although I cannot seem to find or remember what it was. :blink:

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Old thread but could this restriction be reviewed?

Not really a (obviously) valid reason for it.

Thanks in anticipation.

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i was thinking this the other night when i tried to amend it

im in support

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So that's two people in three years, not that much demand for it.

I can think of a valid reason for not allowing it, I'm not saying in case it gives some forum members ideas.

If you need to change the title please contact either Twinset or me and we will do it for you.

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It's impolite to be dismissive terry.sc, you're old enough to know this and we expect better of you.

So that's two people in three years, not that much demand for it.

I can think of a valid reason for not allowing it, I'm not saying in case it gives some forum members ideas.

If you need to change the title please contact either Twinset or me and we will do it for you.

I appreciated when I revived this topic that it is harder to change a TC rule than it is to change the axis of the Earth but I thought it worthwhile nevertheless. It has merit.

As a constructive response to your comment terry.sc I think you've interpreted our request as a complaint whereas I think rather you should appreciate it as a request based on convenience. We have no desire to pay homage to your position just to alter text we've entered, it's manifestly inconvenient (no doubt for all involved).

You offer some good insight:

  • In over three years you've not found reason to review the policy.
  • You agree that there's not any obvious reason to withhold the function.
  • You have a grave distrust of forum contributors.

Yes I've drawn some conclusions which I'm happy to evidence but I'd prefer to offer a pragmatic way forward. How about you levy a little trust in your user community and the concept of self moderation? How about you take a risk and simply monitor the level of impact? How about you prioritise convenience over tradition? How about you give us a reasonable break?

In all honesty both yourself and TWINSET demonstrate an astonishing lack of empathy when it comes to administration and moderation and all you ever offer is:

  • It's worked like this for ages, why change.
  • So only 2 out of 1m people want it, can't be important.
  • If you don't like the rule, leave.

You're both invaluable to this community but your alter egos are in conflict with the respect you have earned.

Yes, I expect to have a mature discussion about this, I won't let it be dismissed.

And yes, I fully expect common sense to prevail and for the ridiculous rule to be changed.

I'm sorry if my challenge disappoints or upsets you but your attitude needs challenging.

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It's impolite to be dismissive terry.sc, you're old enough to know this and we expect better of you.

I appreciated when I revived this topic that it is harder to change a TC rule than it is to change the axis of the Earth but I thought it worthwhile nevertheless. It has merit.

As a constructive response to your comment terry.sc I think you've interpreted our request as a complaint whereas I think rather you should appreciate it as a request based on convenience. We have no desire to pay homage to your position just to alter text we've entered, it's manifestly inconvenient (no doubt for all involved).

You offer some good insight:

  • In over three years you've not found reason to review the policy.
  • You agree that there's not any obvious reason to withhold the function.
  • You have a grave distrust of forum contributors.

Yes I've drawn some conclusions which I'm happy to evidence but I'd prefer to offer a pragmatic way forward. How about you levy a little trust in your user community and the concept of self moderation? How about you take a risk and simply monitor the level of impact? How about you prioritise convenience over tradition? How about you give us a reasonable break?

In all honesty both yourself and TWINSET demonstrate an astonishing lack of empathy when it comes to administration and moderation and all you ever offer is:

  • It's worked like this for ages, why change.
  • So only 2 out of 1m people want it, can't be important.
  • If you don't like the rule, leave.

You're both invaluable to this community but your alter egos are in conflict with the respect you have earned.

Yes, I expect to have a mature discussion about this, I won't let it be dismissed.

And yes, I fully expect common sense to prevail and for the ridiculous rule to be changed.

I'm sorry if my challenge disappoints or upsets you but your attitude needs challenging.

If I may address the criticism aimed at me, which I assume is based on your recent suspension - Nobody has ever requested any swear words rhyming with duck ever be allowed on this forum, and as such those rules won't be changed. Move on.

You recently 'threatened' a silent protest involving posting solely at oople.com - can we have more of that please, I quite liked that period of my life, it was better than discovering the internet.

Is that how one would spell rhyming? should there be another h?

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If I may address the criticism aimed at me, which I assume is based on your recent suspension - Nobody has ever requested any swear words rhyming with duck ever be allowed on this forum, and as such those rules won't be changed. Move on.

You recently 'threatened' a silent protest involving posting solely at oople.com - can we have more of that please, I quite liked that period of my life, it was better than discovering the internet.

Is that how one would spell rhyming? should there be another h?

Incorrect assumption but nevertheless a mature response, congratulations, really constructive, you've done yourself proud.

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Sweet - chalk me one up.

Have you got anything meaningful to contribute or are you just trolling on your own forum?

Seriously.

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Have you got anything meaningful to contribute or are you just trolling on your own forum?

Seriously.

My apologies, mature response, congratulations, really constructive, you've done yourself proud. ;) [/patronising tone]

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Guys - I feel like I should be able to lock this thread...

I tend to agree, I'd prefer to have a proper discussion in a new thread.

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As a constructive response to your comment terry.sc I think you've interpreted our request as a complaint whereas I think rather you should appreciate it as a request based on convenience. We have no desire to pay homage to your position just to alter text we've entered, it's manifestly inconvenient (no doubt for all involved).

Can you explain why wanting something changed isn't a complaint that you are not happy with the current status.

If you are anyone wants to change title then contacting any of the mods (not just Twinset and I) will get it changed. To 'pay homage' would infer that you feel we are acting like gods over Chris's domain and would decide ourselves whether to change the title or not, while you would prefer to have full control over whatever you want to post.

I presume your request was to enable you to edit whatever you have wrote on TC including the titles was as if it is some specific restriction limited to TC, while other forums have similar restrictions, so why do you think the level of access here is different?

You offer some good insight:
  • In over three years you've not found reason to review the policy.
  • You agree that there's not any obvious reason to withhold the function.
  • You have a grave distrust of forum contributors.

Yes I've drawn some conclusions which I'm happy to evidence but I'd prefer to offer a pragmatic way forward. How about you levy a little trust in your user community and the concept of self moderation? How about you take a risk and simply monitor the level of impact? How about you prioritise convenience over tradition? How about you give us a reasonable break?

We have prioritised convenience first. It is more convenient for us to have to edit any title corrections than it is for us to deal with changing the forum settings, remember we are r/c car fans, not computer/web experts . You have drawn conclusions based on your own personal opinion that we are deliberately preventing you from doing what you want, without considering that it is something that doesn't affect 99%+ of the forum members.

1) In 3 years there has been no demand to change from any other members, as can be seen by the gap between your posts and that no other threads have been started. I also haven't received any messages asking for the ability to edit title be turned on, although I have received the very occasional request to change a title. So why would we feel the need to review the policy.

2) There isn't an obvious reason that I can think of to withhold the function, conversely there isn't an obvious reason to change the function either. I would presume there are valid reasons to keep the staus quo as are the vast majority of forums won't allow you to change the titles. The only reason to change it is for your own convenience.

3) It takes a leap of imagination to understand "I can think of a valid reason for not allowing it, I'm not saying in case it gives some forum members ideas" as a grave distrust of forum members. There are one or two members who we have to keep track of and deal with privately who regularly push the limits of the rules to waste our time dealing with them when out time could be better spent doing more useful work.

This does not translate into a distrust of all forum members, in the same way having had one ebayer scam me doesn't mean I distrust every ebay member. I presume your conclusion from my statement might have something to do with your recent ban, it's hard to complain that we might not wholeheartedly trust every forum member when you have just been suspended for breaking the rules by deliberately bypassing the swear filter. It is hard to convince us to levy a little trust when you can't obey the current rules.

In all honesty both yourself and TWINSET demonstrate an astonishing lack of empathy when it comes to administration and moderation and all you ever offer is:
  • It's worked like this for ages, why change.
  • So only 2 out of 1m people want it, can't be important.
  • If you don't like the rule, leave.

You're both invaluable to this community but your alter egos are in conflict with the respect you have earned.

I can't comment on Twinsets empathy, although getting Andy to deal with anything seriously is difficult as has been shown above.

We aren't employed to moderate both the main site and the forums, much as we would love to be able to do it full time, so we have to prioritise what we do in our spare time and yes I would rather not have to deal with someone complaining about a function that isn't available on the majority of websites and isn't requested by other members of this forum when I could be spending my time helping other members r/c car problems. We have our own lives outside of TC and we have to fit everything in whatever time we have, which is why I'm replying to this after 2am here and I'll be up at 7.30.

1) We aren't computer experts and we don't have full access to the site, we are just moderators so we can't just switch on topic editing for all to please you, it's something Chris would have to do so we would have to convince him that there's a valid reason for the change. As you can probably guess yes it is easier just for us to edit the very occasional request for a change of topic. If you feel you can honestly convince Chris to turn it on the please feel free to contact him from his showroom page.

I would also have to ask if it has worked for ages why should we change when you have been the only member to request it, apart from you would feel it's more convenient for you personally. When was the last time you asked a mod to edit the topic for you and how much more inconvenient was it?

2) So only 2 out of 1m people want it, can't be important. So do you consider that because you are one of the two people it should be important and we should be spending our time dealing with the two people rather than all the others?

3) There are several websites I frequent that have rules that I'm not happy with. Like most people I just respect the rules while on those particular sites rather than spend my time complaining about them.

I don't have an 'alter ego' at all, unless you consider moderating on an impartial and professional basis as a representative of TC ensuring all members follow the rules as an alter ego, in much the same way I treat my customers at work on a more professional basis than my work colleagues. I know there are other forum members in the past who have felt I have been biased against them purely because I wouldn't give them preferential treatment over all other members.

Yes, I expect to have a mature discussion about this, I won't let it be dismissed.

And yes, I fully expect common sense to prevail and for the ridiculous rule to be changed.

I'm sorry if my challenge disappoints or upsets you but your attitude needs challenging.

We can have a mature discussion on this or any subject, but it is impossible to have a discussion, mature or not, when you are already entrenched in your conclusion that you want the rule changed whatever is said. If you don't accept that there might be a difference of opinion then we will just keep on going ad infinitum as you won't consider a change of opinion or middle ground, while with no leeway from you we won't be considering turning editing on just to appease you.

As for my attitude, my attitude is purely on a professional basis and I have no personal opinions either way on the subject as was seen by my clear reply earlier. I'm neither upset nor disappointed, there are rules we have that are imposed on us as well as the members, some rules I wish were different, but it is my job on this site to ensure the members stick to them whatever my opinion of the rules. I realise that this unemotional reaction can be hard to deal with but it ensures I treat everyone equally.

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terry.sc I am very grateful for your reply, thank you.

You've asked a lot of questions and they each deserve a response but I'm afraid I may drift away from the principle question at hand if I attempt to answer them all. If I have missed something important to you please point it out and I'll respectfully reply.

I was surprised and a little confused when I read your first reply. Perhaps it isn't representative of how you normally try to moderate and perhaps it was inappropriate of me to take that sample of one and extrapolate. For better or for worse I didn't feel the tone was suitable coming from a position of responsibility.

There is also a chance that we're both proceeding from a different premise. The ability to change titles is the default setting in ipboard, it has to be turned off. Most web forums do allow you to change your own topic titles, including but not limited to the following:

  • oOple.com
  • rcuniverse.com
  • rctech.net
  • tamiya.actieforum.com
  • xda-developers.com
  • androidforums.com

I presume your request was to enable you to edit whatever you have wrote on TC including the titles was as if it is some specific restriction limited to TC, while other forums have similar restrictions, so why do you think the level of access here is different?

Because it is different terry.sc... <_< You seem to be coming from the perspective that this isn't a typical function/request whereas my perspective is that, in this case, Tamiyaclub is atypical. I contest your claim that the "vast majority" of forums don't allow title editing. I'm just asking for "typical". I hope you understand now why I think the level of discussion required here is somewhat disproportionate to the request.

To 'pay homage' would infer that you feel we are acting like gods over Chris's domain and would decide ourselves whether to change the title or not, while you would prefer to have full control over whatever you want to post.

Yes, 100% correct. It does feel like that most of the time when it comes to matters of the site (this discussion is a point in case! - like dealing with a 1990's sysadmin) and of course we want to have control of the content we post... I'm not sure I understand the implication of your statements here? Asking for these things isn't wrong is it?

I don't think we need to discuss the level of demand, the change is trivial so it's not a matter of disproportionate effort. Actually, over time it would clearly save you some effort although as you say, not a lot. Net/net it would be more efficient unless it was abused... and the likelihood of that we know is very low.

On the matter of trust, relatively speaking (to other forums) Tamiyaclub is a nanny state:

Usage of the term varies by political context, but in general nanny state is used in reference to policies where the state is perceived as being excessive in its desire to protect (as a nanny would protect a child), govern or control particular aspects of society

You don't appear to be aware of this (not a criticism!), you seem to believe TC is pretty typical but it's not and however difficult it is to accept, this is a reflection of trust. Previous posts in this sub forum indicate a clear suspicion of the casual user of TC forums. This may not be a reflection of your personal attitude, I concede this.

Please understand this it's difficult for me to appear flexible on this, and whilst I'm not fixed in my ways I don't see much opportunity for me to vary my position... this one is sort of a binary equation. I thought I offered some flexibility in my suggestion above - try it and if it gets abused revert to the old way. I'd also like to state for the record that I didn't expect anyone to have to spend this much time on the matter, it has become disproportionate.

All said and done I think you've possibly hidden (not deliberately) the crux of the matter in your post and that appears to be that you're not empowered to make these changes and you don't relish the prospect of engaging with Chris to ask him to make the changes. If this is the case it's somewhat unfortunate but should have been stipulated much earlier in the thread. But because it's difficult or unpalatable doesn't make it irrelevant. Chris has lost touch with the community as one would expect when you disengage. We are eternally grateful for his contribution but he needs to realise and accept that he should shift some more control/influence closer to the community by empowering you to not only police but also to support.

In the interests of transparency this isn't the only constructive suggestion for improvement I have for the forum and I would be disappointed if we got distracted by the particular discussion at the expense of general improvements to the forum. My arguments for other changes aren't too different from the ones I present above. When you're happy to hear these I would be happy to share them.

I would like a mod to contact Chris on these matters. I think this is more appropriate than a direct approach from a member, it will have more influence coming from a mod and is probably more in line with Chris' expectations.

Hopefully I haven't come across too argumentative and again, thanks for your professional reply.

Respectfully,

David

---------------------

You have the same misconception TWINSET does about my recent ban:

1. In one case I deliberately circumvented the rules, 'fessed up and said I wouldn't do it again.

2. In the second case somebody interpreted my language as profanity when it was not, I didn't attempt to circumvent the rules because in my mind I wasn't breaking one.

These are fundamentally two different issues that were erroneously considered the same thing. The complete failure by TWINSET to recognise the difference undermined the impact of the ban and as a result I moved on and largely forgot about it until now. No, my reaction herein is not directly related to the ban, please don't draw that conclusion.

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For what it's worth.....

Most web forums do allow you to change your own topic titles

A lot of the web forums I'm involved in do not have this functionality. That the TC forums is one of these, is not a problem for me... as presented earlier, if there's something that I need in a forum, that's not readily available, I ask a mod. As a mod on another forum (with a similar setting), I have been asked a couple of times to rename threads/topics... no problem.

I don't think we need to discuss the level of demand, the change is trivial so it's not a matter of disproportionate effort. Actually, over time it would clearly save you some effort although as you say, not a lot. Net/net it would be more efficient unless it was abused... and the likelihood of that we know is very low.

The change is trivial IF you know where to make the change, and have the rights to. If you don't, then it's not trivial. As for the likelihood of abuse, well, that can ONLY increase with the change you are demanding... and it would also require more moderation, as giving everyone the ability to change the name of their threads means that they would have to be checked every time they are changed, just in case...

Please understand this it's difficult for me to appear flexible on this, and whilst I'm not fixed in my ways I don't see much opportunity for me to vary my position... this one is sort of a binary equation. I thought I offered some flexibility in my suggestion above - try it and if it gets abused revert to the old way. I'd also like to state for the record that I didn't expect anyone to have to spend this much time on the matter, it has become disproportionate.

That may be correct, in that either your wish will be granted, or it will not - a binary situation. You have been told that it is not going to be granted, but you choose not to accept this. Thus, it seems to the casual observer (ie me) that you may not stop until you get the outcome you want.

I would like a mod to contact Chris on these matters. I think this is more appropriate than a direct approach from a member, it will have more influence coming from a mod and is probably more in line with Chris' expectations.

So, you have put forth an idea to the mods, which they have (for whatever reason) rejected... so now you want THEM to take it forward to the board owner? I can't see how that will help you... you want them to argue a point FOR your idea, from a position where they are (for their reasons) against it? Seems a bit silly to me, and probably why they want YOU to raise it. It then becomes a place for you to express your argument for your idea, rather than have them extrapolate yours.

I hope that this may offer at least some help/ideas in the situation....

Alex

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Not going into above discussion, I'd just like to mention the slightly annoying automatic "second versal conversion" of the Topic line. I.e. DB01 -> Db01 and ESC->Esc.

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I use another forum with a similar layout where these questions are against the rules and must be asked by P.M

Topics questioning site moderation or the site rules are not permitted and will be deleted without notice. All such questions should sent to Admin only.

I think that is a fair rule to have. :)

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Not going into above discussion, I'd just like to mention the slightly annoying automatic "second versal conversion" of the Topic line. I.e. DB01 -> Db01 and ESC->Esc.

Im guessing its a function thats put in place to stop people posting in all capital letters, that unfortunately means unavoidable conversions happens too.

As for this daft ongoing discussion for allowing users to change topic titles.... Whats the problem? If you need it changing pm a mod or admin and it will be done, therefore getting what you want done, to quote the Meerkats "Simples". Why drag out something thats not going to change, its not exactly a life or death matter is it, to be quite honest its reminding me of my 3 year old grand kids behaviour when they dont get what they want either.

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Sometimes I am in awe of how molehills can transform into mountains. This one took over 3 years which might be a record.

So, yes, there are other mods here. If you need a topic change, feel free to drop any one of us a line. It doesn't always have to be Terry or Andy.

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I'm not sure why I'm being blamed for dragging this out but it's a simple question and still no straight answer, just lots of petty picking about asking the actual question.

The best answers so far:

  • Can't think of a reason to turn it on
  • Contact a mod to do it
  • Mods can't do it, contact Chris

None of which are a particularly helpful or direct answers.

I was hoping terry.sc was going to reply as I didn't feel that part of the discussion concluded and I'm not sure the subsequent comments really added anything useful.

Perhaps it's naive of me but I was hoping for something more. If I draw my own conclusion from above the answer is actually:

We can't think for a reason for turning it on or changing the status-quo and we find dealing with issues of the status-quo irritating and don't like raising them with Chris. Heck, we couldn't even do it if we could be bothered so if you want it, go ahead and ask Chris, we're not going to stand it your way but we're sure not going to get off our butts to help you either.

I will assume you all apply the same attitude to similar rules (e.g. the poor auto-capitilisation mentioned above) and that we'll never get a sensible response or straight forward answer from any of you on any of these subjects (other than 'no').

You talk about prioritising convenience and the only resolution you offer is the least convenient of all - contact Chris.

We all know what we can depend on you for now, thanks for the entertainment.

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I'm not sure why I'm being blamed for dragging this out but it's a simple question and still no straight answer, just lots of petty picking about asking the actual question.

The best answers so far:

  • Can't think of a reason to turn it on
  • Contact a mod to do it
  • Mods can't do it, contact Chris

None of which are a particularly helpful or direct answers.

I was hoping terry.sc was going to reply as I didn't feel that part of the discussion concluded and I'm not sure the subsequent comments really added anything useful.

Perhaps it's naive of me but I was hoping for something more. If I draw my own conclusion from above the answer is actually:

We can't think for a reason for turning it on or changing the status-quo and we find dealing with issues of the status-quo irritating and don't like raising them with Chris. Heck, we couldn't even do it if we could be bothered so if you want it, go ahead and ask Chris, we're not going to stand it your way but we're sure not going to get off our butts to help you either.

I will assume you all apply the same attitude to similar rules (e.g. the poor auto-capitilisation mentioned above) and that we'll never get a sensible response or straight forward answer from any of you on any of these subjects (other than 'no').

You talk about prioritising convenience and the only resolution you offer is the least convenient of all - contact Chris.

We all know what we can depend on you for now, thanks for the entertainment.

But thats it you have got a straight answer which was NO, not sure how much more straight forward that can be and why do you expect them to give a reason?

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thanks for the entertainment.

Indeed, it has been most entertaining, thank YOU. :)

Oh, you're being blamed for dragging it out because you refuse to accept "No" as a valid answer to your question.

It pays to remember one thing, this is a dictatorship, albeit a benign one, but a dictatorship nevertheless.

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We can't think for a reason for turning it on or changing the status-quo and we find dealing with issues of the status-quo irritating and don't like raising them with Chris. Heck, we couldn't even do it if we could be bothered so if you want it, go ahead and ask Chris, we're not going to stand it your way but we're sure not going to get off our butts to help you either.

I will assume you all apply the same attitude to similar rules (e.g. the poor auto-capitilisation mentioned above) and that we'll never get a sensible response or straight forward answer from any of you on any of these subjects (other than 'no').

You talk about prioritising convenience and the only resolution you offer is the least convenient of all - contact Chris.

We all know what we can depend on you for now, thanks for the entertainment.

Every request to change something on the forum is run by Chris - it's his forum and although I can change it, all changes I make are ok'd by him.

If you don't like how fast he responds, or how fast that response is posted up by one of us then you should get off your butt, contact him yourself and cut us out of the loop, not accuse us of doing nothing.

Stick to the facts eh chap? if we all start making assumptions my first one would be you got nothing better to do all day than moan on forums then complain because you don't get what you want, so let's not go down that road, it just leads to you being ignored.

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