Newbie In Touringcar Racing Questions

[Ernie1]

Hello to you all,

I normally drive buggy's but the last couple of weeks it has been freezing here in Belgium and if i drive outside my fingers fall off. So i thought of getting a touring car ready for driving inside in a local hall. Went there to take a look around but the guys there are all driving schumacher or xray. They are driving on a carpet and it is a short twisty track. I already have a ta05-ms chassis (don't know if that is any good, but it looks bling) that i got a while back in a trade, a spare brushless graupner evoII 6.0 turns motor and a spare no limit esc for brushed motors. Can i use one of these or do you recommend a silvercan or a sporttuned motor for a starter until my skills improve? The spurgear doesn't look original it says 64-104 kawada model made in japan. I need some recomondations for a good motor-esc combination, wheels and tires and a motor gear and the number of theeth on the motor gear. The mannual says from 34 untill 47 theeth. Went to my local hobby store where they sell Tamiya but they said just to pick one.

Thanks in advance and a happy new-year.

Regards Wim

[HereBeMonsters]

It depends what the rules are at your club.

I would start off in a "stock" class that requires slower motors and fewer hop-ups, then you can learn the basics without having to shell out vast amounts on a bling car only to find you can't drive for toffee.

Walk before you run!

[terry.sc]

I would find what motors are run at your local track first, if they run a stock motor class get a 27 turn stock motor, whichever one seems popular at the club. If they have no motor limits then again a 27 turn stock motor will be a good start. If they run a 540 motor class then go for that as the slower speeds make it easier to get used to racing.

The spurgear doesn't look original it says 64-104 kawada model made in japan.

The spur gear you have is useless for you, it's a 64dp gear which means the gear teeth are very small. It gives you a tiny bit more speed and efficiency but the first accident you have will damage the tiny teeth on the gears. You need to replace it with a 48dp spur gear, race chassis are different to most Tamiyas in that spur gears are an industry standard that every make of car uses, including the TA05. A 48DP spur gear from HPI, Associated, Trinity, Robinson Racing, Hot Bodies, Yokomo, RW Racing and Kimbrough with matching pinions, again from any manufacturer.

I need some recomondations for a good motor-esc combination, wheels and tires and a motor gear and the number of theeth on the motor gear. The mannual says from 34 untill 47 theeth.

I could say what motor/gear ratio/tyres work best at my local club, but none of that would necessarily be suitable at your club. The best people to find this information from are the other racers at your local club. Visit the club and ask for advice, they should tell you everything you need to know.

[qatmix]

The Ta05ms is a fantastic car. You can beat anything with that chassis. Its really nice for tight technical circuits. It can run 10.5 brushless motors well.

As Terry says, look at changing the wheel to a 48pitch one. I still have the tamiya std one (0.4 pitch) which is a 106t spur.

[yamita]

Ta05ms is excellent. For indoor running, your motor may be too much. Most people run 17.5 or 13.5 depending on the track size. 64 pitch gears are standard for indoor, but you may have to get a smaller one, because you need to gear up 17.5 motors very high. Sport tuned motor will be adequate until you get your driving down. Sport tuned motor will probably be geared around the same as 13.5. At any case, you're going to need a smaller spur, unless you can find a gigantic pinion to get tall gearing. I cant recall what the internal ratio for the 05ms is at the moment. For 17.5 motor, you want your gear ratio around 3.5-4 depending on the track size. Your final gear ratio=(spur gear/pinion gear)*internal ratio. Good luck.

edit: I just noticed you only have a brushless motor but a brushed esc.. In that case, you can run a 27t stock motor. Trinity or reedy brushed motors are very popular. Ask other people at your track for their gear ratio and go from there. 7-7.5 is pretty safe for a small track. You don't want your car to be maxed out on speed just yet. Start slow and get the handling part down first. Driving indoor carpet feels like driving on ice at first.

[highflyer]

Driving indoor carpet feels like driving on ice at first.

Jaco Foams do it for me.. Carpet is the best way to start out for tourers IMO.

TA05MS is a great chassis to start with. Can't think of none better Ernie 1.

[HereBeMonsters]

Jaco Foams do it for me..

I presume these are some super-expensive tyres? I'm looking for some tyres for running indoor on carpet, I thought it was only the F1 cars that ran foams?

[yamita]

Foam tires on touring cars is mainly a US thing. Theyre not expensive, but they require more maintenance and setup. Tires wear down substantially, so you have to constantly change your pinion gear to compensate and redo setup every other run. You will also need a machine to true your tires. They have their advantage in handling, but overall, it's not as fun as rubber in my opinion. Rubber tires with brushless and lipo is the best combo. They need almost no maintenance. Rubber takes more finesse to get your car around the track, whereas foam will keep you planted, and you can 'throw' the car into a turn more. I understsand most people run rubber in the UK, so other club members may not be happy with you running foams. Rubber tires will last alot longer than foams too. You will need extra stiff chassis to run foam tires effectively, or your car will bend and twist from excess grip. 05ms is very stiff imo, so you can give it a try.

[terry.sc]

I presume these are some super-expensive tyres? I'm looking for some tyres for running indoor on carpet, I thought it was only the F1 cars that ran foams?

F1, 12th scale, mardaves, worldGT and micro all run foams, touring cars is the only on road class that run rubbers. My club runs foams, the best available by far are Gecko foams (only available in the UK) as they grip well without any additive. We run foams on touring cars at my club, they give more grip than rubbers, the handling is much more positive and you will lap faster. A set of foams are half the price of rubber tyres and foams will give consistent grip as they wear, rubber tyres work best the first week then the edge goes off the grip.

But there's no point recommending foam tyres if you local club runs a spec tyre, which is quite common these days. As I said it's best to ask your local club which tyres are the best for their carpet and whether tyre additives are allowed to give you more grip. The drivers there will have experimented with all the tyres available and will have worked out what's best.

[Ernie1]

Hello guys,

Thanks for the info. Yesterday i went to the local track and it was great fun, some guy lend me a ta05 to try and i could drive just between the lines with the younger kids. Its a lot different than driving your cars up and down the street. Asked also about the tires and motors and stuff. They drive v-tec 30 tires and 10.5 Brushless or 19 turns Brushed motors. Just want to know a bit more about the gearing. Is it a trial and error thing or are there some rules to get it right ? Is there some good info somewhere ? Looked for setup-sheets for the ta05 ms but didn't find much.

Regards Wim

[bfst24]

i need some ta05 setup sheets too

[terry.sc]

For chassis setup the best place to start is the kit setup. It will give a good balance that's easy to drive, then tune it from there. There's too much reliance on setup sheets from the manufacturers these days and people have lost the ability to set their cars up to suit themselves. Now they just copy someone else's setup sheet and try and adapt their driving to the car instead of learning how to tune it to suit yourself.

For example unless you find a TA05MS setup sheet from someone running VTEC 30s on carpet with a 19 turn motor with the same servo any other setup is no more useful than the kit setup as the settings won't match the levels of grip and motor power that you will have. For example a standard servo needs a suspension setup with more bite into the corners, a high speed servo means you can suddenly have too much steering when turning in for the same suspension settings.

If others at your club have a TA05 ask them what springs and suspension settings they use as a starting point and tune it to suit yourself from there. I have a guide to what each suspension change does to the handling here

Gear ratios is also trial and error, it differs depending on the track size and even which particular type of motor you use. For example while most people at my club ran Trinity P2K2 stock motors I ran an Integy V10R stock motor and for the same spur gear needed a pinion 3 tooth less than the rest. Even using the same motors other drivers can use pinions 2-3 teeth bigger than I can due to differences in driving style.

As you already have a brushed motor ESC the easy and cheap option is a 19 turn motor. the most popular 19 turn at my club is the Team Orion Element V2, the V2 endbell and round brushes means it needs very little maintenance.