Original Subaru Brat - Any Good?

[GunnersRC]

Seen a couple of these floating around the bay and was thinking of picking one up. I am not really familiar with them, are they any good?

[twisty]

"Any good?" at what?

Question is a bit vague really fella,why not have a look through the Brat entrys in folks showrooms and read some of the comments left.

Link to all the vintage ones posted in members showrooms here

http://www.tamiyaclub.com/userrides.asp?id=38

[HereBeMonsters]

Seen a couple of these floating around the bay and was thinking of picking one up. I am not really familiar with them, are they any good?

Best to get a re-re if you're going to run it. Upgraded to Frog spec, comes with two bodyshells...

[trucknut]

Tamiya subaru brat was the top of line back in its day. The original used a 380s motor similar to the grasshopper and used the same chasis as the frog. It had injection mold hardshell body and a mechanical speed control. It had good traction on dirt since it had a "locked" diff and good tight steering. Every thing on the front suspension is adjustable, caster, toe, and you could tighten the torsion arms to adjust the suspension. I have the brat remake which is the same as the original except it uses a 540 sport tuned motor and esc which gives it more power than the original. The brat is a good investment, it has plenty of power and is a lot of fun to kick up dirt or sand, you will get a lot of fun out of it.

[gazwilts]

"Upgraded to Frog spec"

what does upgrading to frog spec entail. i just won a vintage brat on feebay and would be interested to know what i need to get it up to modern spec so i can run it. thx

[terry.sc]

"Upgraded to Frog spec"

what does upgrading to frog spec entail.

The comment above is regarding the rerelease Brat which is the Frog kit (with all the Frog parts) with a Brat body on it.

The original Brat was a really basic kit without any of the performance parts that were on the Frog. To upgrade an original Brat to Frog specification you need the Frog gearbox internals which includes three spur gears so you can adjust the gear ratio as well as a diff for decent handling. The Frog also has oil filled shocks instead of the dummy plastic ones on the Brat. The Frog also has a more direct steering setup that is much better than the original Brat. There's also a protective underguard under the front suspension which strengthens the chassis which is missing on the Brat.

If you want to update the Brat all the parts from the rerelease will bolt straight on. The rerelease also has pin drive driveshafts instead of the hex driveshafts of the original which didn't last long before wearing out.

[HunterZero]

I'll probably get flamed for this, but... I don't like the Brat. At all. I don't like the Brat bodyshell, and most of all I don't like the fact it says '4WD' on the side but it's only RWD. It's a good thing that the re-release Brat was upgraded to Frog spec, because the original Brat was pretty low spec... No diff, no ball bearings, no oil shocks on the rear, wimpy 380 motor...

Don't get me wrong - I love the ORV chassis. As a buggy. I love The Frog, although it does have a few shortcomings. I just don't like all the 'monster' incarnations of the ORV chassis.

Tamiya subaru brat was the top of line back in its day.

Top of the line??? Hardly. Even in its day it was down towards the entry level end of the market. Bruiser was top of the line.

It had good traction on dirt since it had a "locked" diff and good tight steering.

But the locked diff meant it wasn't so good on higher traction surfaces. You can always turn a diff into a spool, but you can't turn a spool into a diff (without buying extra parts, of course). New Brat has a diff though.

Every thing on the front suspension is adjustable, caster, toe

Well, not everything is adjustable. Can't adjust camber, for example. Or damping (bouncy bouncy). Or ride height (which it tended to lose over time at the front anyway as the white nylon buttons wore down). About the only novel adjustment it had was caster angle, when those screws weren't coming apart because you didn't threadlock them.

and you could tighten the torsion arms to adjust the suspension.

Errr.... No torsion bars on the Frog or the Brat (no matter what the Tamiya video said!). It has radius arms which just reinforce the front suspension. Making these too tight just hinders suspension action and wears the front arms against the aluminium.

The brat is a good investment, it has plenty of power and is a lot of fun to kick up dirt or sand, you will get a lot of fun out of it.

If you mean it's a good investment in terms of fun you can get out of the kit, I'd agree with that. Good investment for your retirement? Not really.

- James

[trucknut]

HunterZero brought up some points from my last post that I may need to explain. The brat used the same chasis as the frog so the chasis was high end but the original used a 380 motor which decreased its power. When I said the locked diff or lack of diff gave it better handling, it helps to reduce the slipping of the tires on dirt, I rock crawl with rc trucks and locked diffs give you better traction. And when I said it was a good investment, really only for your own personal enjoyment, they're fun to drive or use as a shelf queen, I drive all my rc trucks. The remake, which is what I own, is up to "frog spec" because it uses a 540 motor and ESC. Sorry for the vague response.

[zakspeed]

When the Brat was released it was always aimed at the entry level. It was quite unique at the time and a bold step forward for Tamiya. Just look at the list of Tamiyas available BEFORE the Brat - The only entry level buggy was the Holiday Buggy / Sand Rover. Both came with 380 motors for the main reason they gave longer run times on the available batteries back then.

In my opinion the Brat is a cracking starter off road buggy - and why would you want to put a diff in it ? it's meant for off road, if you run mainly on a grippy surface then fine but then why not buy a TT01 ?? The SRB's have managed without a diff and they were high end in the RC market. The Frog diff if not maintained is a troublesome unit anyway.

If you plan to do any mods, fit ballraces, 540 motor, esc and rear oil dampers and run it like that -- thats all i've done with mine and it runs great, tyres are so bald on mine that even on tarmac I can drift it no problem

[hedge]

HunterZero LOL.

[TAZ-NZ]

Seen a couple of these floating around the bay and was thinking of picking one up. I am not really familiar with them, are they any good?

Be careful your actually getting a vintage item, if you paying vintage prices on ebay, I've seen atleast a dozens re-release Brats being pass off by sellers on ebay as the originals items.

The sellers do little more that swap out the ESC for a MSC and mouting plate, trim the battery post to the vintage lenght and remove the under guard, some go so far as to source brat fiction shocks. If you know what to look for you can pick which are fakes and which are not, some seller use very carefull with their camera angles to hide parts that give away a re-release.

Personally I'd look around for original Brat that is a total wreck on ebay, just for the spool diff, and the do the same with a orginal frog just for the brass counter gear, then grab a re-release and build up a great runner.