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Tamiya Racing Buggy

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For touring cars I've always run Associated. Tamiya for me has been about what I had as a kid. My M-03 and M-04 are spec cars that really cannot compete with the touring cars but are great for what they are.

Lately I've been thinking about getting a 4wd buggy to run around the local dirt track with my Slash. Of course my first thought was to get an Associated B44. To give Tamiya a chance though I'd like to know what Tamiya makes that matches up in terms of performance, tuneability, and cost, to the Associated buggy.

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TRF511X but that might cost a bit more than the B44. They also have a club racer DB01, with some hop-ups it's very durable and raceable.

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In no particular order...

TRF-501X

TRF-501X Worlds Edition

TRF-511X

DB-01 (Durga & Baldre)

DF-03 (Dark Impact, Keen Hawk, Avante MK2)

DF-03 MS

Personally I would go for the DB-01. It's really an amazing car...

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Lately I've been thinking about getting a 4wd buggy to run around the local dirt track with my Slash. Of course my first thought was to get an Associated B44. To give Tamiya a chance though I'd like to know what Tamiya makes that matches up in terms of performance, tuneability, and cost, to the Associated buggy.

Do you prefer shaft drive or is belt OK?? I ask because the 501X/511X and the Durga/DB01 chassis are belt drive. For fun, the Durga is great out the box and can be hopped up like crazy. Also if you are running stick LIPOS they would fit in the Durga, unlike the B44 and 501/511 pure racers. I own a 501X and if I were to get another 4WD it would be the Durga/DB01 chassis machines.

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hallo

can someone help me

I'm new in RC hobby

But I don't know, which gear ratio ( 20T / 21T /......) must I choose if I use tamiya TRF transpeed motor brushless 3.5T motor....?

thanks

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new to RC and your going 3.5T brushless!!!!!! crazy person!!!

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new to RC and your going 3.5T brushless!!!!!! crazy person!!!

Thinking the same thing. Since I got back into RC last November I've seen a few people build themselves some very fast (and expensive) touring cars. Eventually, most will slow the thing down to where they can control it or just get frustrated with running into the boards and breaking the thing and quit.

Of course this is coming from the guy who just built a car with a 9T brushless because I had collected enough spare parts to build one. The thing is way to fast for me to race with, my average lap times are actually faster with my 17.5T car, but I have enough control to have fun with it, which is what really matters.

I would like to thank everyone for their comments and advice. I'm wondering why the TRF cars cost as much as they do. I'll give the DB-01 a look and see if I can find someone to let me drive theirs to see if I like it before buying anything.

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Like any custom built race car, the TRF cars spare no expense. the best quality materials throughout, extensive testing and R&D with some of the worlds best drivers.

this all costs cash, hence the higher price. as an example the new Team Durango buggy will retails at about £500!!

the benefit for us is that the hard work put in by the factory teams in areas like drive trains and suspension geometry filters down to the mid level buggies like the durga, HPI's cyber 10b and Yokomo's b-max.

oople did a good review of the durga, check it out here: clicky

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Pretty much any brushless motor 4.0 and below is only meant to run on 5-cell (6volts) or less in on-road touring & pan cars. In off-road, you would never find a motor that powerful.

Did you know that if you rev a brushless motor like that @ 7+ volts without load on it, the rotor will explode!!! My buddy found that one out the hard way. The even the sintered magnets cannot hold together at 70+ thousand rpms... lol Also, the ball bearings don't last very long at those speeds. You will have to replace them often. When they say meant for experts, they MEAN it. Get yourself a 7.5 or maybe even 6.5... Off-road doesn't use more than this anyways as there is not enough traction...

As for gearing, you must have many options because it will vary depending on track condition. With brushless, you must make sure your gearing is short enough to keep the motor from getting too hot. If it overheats, the rotor will loose it's magnetism and need replacing. A temp gun is a must with expensive brushless. Never over 160* I think...

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hallo

can someone help me

I'm new in RC hobby

But I don't know, which gear ratio ( 20T / 21T /......) must I choose if I use tamiya TRF transpeed motor brushless 3.5T motor....?

thanks

I will help :D .

What R/C model are you running? I need to know for the gear ratio.

Since your new to the hobby, I would buy a 13.5T or 10.5 brushless. Speed is fun only if you can control it :D ..

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I will help :D .

What R/C model are you running? I need to know for the gear ratio.

Since your new to the hobby, I would buy a 13.5T or 10.5 brushless. Speed is fun only if you can control it ;) ..

I would say the first post was while waiting for the batteries to charge. They charged, he put the car down hit the accelerator and promptly whatched as the rear of the car went through the front and slammed against the curb . end of :D

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Tried posting earlier but for some reason it never showed up. Thanks again to everyone for the advise. I just ordered a DB-01 Baldre. The decision came down to, for the most part, I'll be bashing the thing around more than I will ever race. Now I have a new set of questions.

First, I'm not even going to bother with the stock 540 motor/ESC (everyone keep an eye out on eBay.) I'll probably put a 17.5 or 13.5 brushless in the thing since those are the two motors I have sitting around right now. What pinion should I run for a 17.5 or 13.5 as a starting point? I'll have the IR thermometer to see how hot I'm running but need an idea of where to start. Also, are the pinions "standard" 48P or do I have to deal with the Tamiya specific stuff like on the M-03/M-04?

Second, what should I look at upgrading for running brushless? I ordered the slipper clutch already. Researching on the net, it sounds like I would also need to change the out drives from the plastic to the metal ones for the TRF501X. What else do you think I should replace on the drive line?

Third, what should I get for spare parts? Looking around the tracks I go to and the people I know, there are not many running Tamiya buggies, I'll be stocking my own parts. I'm figuring front a-arms as a minimum but would like to be more prepared. Nothing is worse than planning a day of playing with the "toy" car only to have it cut short by breaking something you don't have with you and can't buy because there is no hobby shop near by or the shop that is there is out of stock because everyone breaks the things and the're sold out.

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We run a cheap 15T in my buddies durga. Your 13.5T should be comparable in performance. With the higher torque of the brushless I would say give the bigger kit pinion a try, but keep an eye on heat the first few runs. If the motor heats up, the smaller kit pinion will cover you. The good news is that this car runs 48 pitch pinions...

As for upgrades, none are really necessary. In kit form our Durga is GREAT fun and only suffered minor breaks that have to require the purchase of any replacment parts. The slipper is wise, and TRF shocks would make it handle all terrain better. Those plus some front U-joints and the 501X metal outdrives would really make the drivetrain bullet-proof. Metal suspension mounts help to make it crash proof, but nothing is perfect. Typically with metal suspension mounts, you are replacing a-arms instead of mounts when you wreck. That's good for racers who need quick changeouts, but not much help to bashers when broken = broken...

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Tried posting earlier but for some reason it never showed up. Thanks again to everyone for the advise. I just ordered a DB-01 Baldre. The decision came down to, for the most part, I'll be bashing the thing around more than I will ever race. Now I have a new set of questions.

Congrats on a WISE purchase :) . I see too many people on this site going for the DF03 over the DB01, the latter is superior! I raced my 501X and never broke an A-arm (BEEFY), me think the DB01 shares the same arms.

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We run a cheap 15T in my buddies durga...Metal suspension mounts help to make it crash proof...

What pinion are you running? The stock silver can comes with a 19 so I was thinking about putting a 23 or 25 on the 13.5 motor to start with.

Are the suspension mounts a weak point? I know for a fact that when racing you never have enough time to fix anything, or even if you're not racing and just tuning, you will find yourself tinkering and adjusting more than running. When I'm just out for the fun of it, I want to have fun driving, not fixing (something Traxxas got right with the Slash.) Would replacing the mounts be something I would want to do?

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What pinion are you running? The stock silver can comes with a 19 so I was thinking about putting a 23 or 25 on the 13.5 motor to start with.

Are the suspension mounts a weak point? I know for a fact that when racing you never have enough time to fix anything, or even if you're not racing and just tuning, you will find yourself tinkering and adjusting more than running. When I'm just out for the fun of it, I want to have fun driving, not fixing (something Traxxas got right with the Slash.) Would replacing the mounts be something I would want to do?

The car comes with two pinions and we use the smaller one w/ the 15T. With brushless gearing is different (usually larger pinions) and really depends on motor temp. Therefore it is wise to get yourself a temp gun if going brushless (O'donnell TGX-1 is great and cost around $30us).

13.5T brushless is more like a good racing 19T brushed motor. The 23T/25T brushed would be closer to 17.5T. Personally I would rather go with a 7.5T in the Durga for bashing. It's sounds like a lot, but really it should be perfect w/ a slipper and maybe some upgraded shocks. If geared properly it won't kill your nimh packs (keep an eye on pack temp though). Lipo would add even more power to that and be even more effecient...

As for the suspension mounts, they certainly do help. In a wreck, the plastic suspension mounts allow the plastic balls to pop out of place. Then the small plastic spacers, balls & dog bone go flying. I lost one plastic ball and had to replace it with a metal touring car one, which is actually longer and didn't fit quite right with the stock spacers. If we had metal mounts, the ball wouldn't have popped out, and all would be well. Of course we may have broken the arm instead, but it's hard to know for sure. If you crash with the car facing the forward direction, you will need metal mounts on the foward side of each suspension. If crash facing rearward (spin-out), you will need metal mounts on the rearward side of both suspension. Definitely worthwhile upgrades if funds permit. Probably moreso than universals or even shocks... :blink:

The standard kit arms are actually plain ABS or fiberglass resin (I can't remember) so they do allow more flex than the 501X couterparts. This should help make them more durable in a crash and help numb the cars response a bit making it easier to drive.

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The standard kit arms are actually plain ABS or fiberglass resin (I can't remember) so they do allow more flex than the 501X couterparts. This should help make them more durable in a crash and help numb the cars response a bit making it easier to drive.

Hey numbskull :o , the 501X and DB01 share the same composite :)

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Hey numbskull :o , the 501X and DB01 share the same composite :P

The parts look identical, but the DB01 has flexier non-carbon versions.

DB01 rear arms: 51313

DB01 front arms: 51311

501X rear arms: 51279

501X front arms: 51275

:)

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The parts look identical, but the DB01 has flexier non-carbon versions.

DB01 rear arms: 51313

DB01 front arms: 51311

501X rear arms: 51279

501X front arms: 51275

:)

Had to pull the part numbers out :o , meh you win (as usual)!

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Well I got the thing built over the weekend and just need to free up some time to run it. Some random thoughts/details...

Ended up putting the 9T EzRun setup in it with a 27T pinion. Will have to keep an eye on the temp but I believe this should work. Assuming that I did the math right the final roll out is a little less than what I had in the touring car with a bigger pinion but smaller tires. I decided to cut the suggested hole in the body in front of the motor, and put another 9 small ones in an approximately 2cm square above the ESC.

Didn't use any of the supplied phillips screws and went to stainless hex drive for everything going into plastic. Only exceptions are the front-rear and rear-front suspension mounts. Got 7 of the 8 screws in but ended snapping the head off of the 8th. It's from that point on (step 1 in the assembly instructions) that I switched to the hex screws and everything went very smooth. Will be getting the aluminum mounts in the near future so those will soon be hex.

The ball/cups for camber adjustment links do feel very loose. Didn't measure them out but I think the spare set of camber links I have for a Slash can be adapted to the DB01.

Had to build the rear shocks twice. First time I picked the wrong parts tree and used the internal damper for the front shocks in them. The diameter of the disk was way too small and there was no dampening. Didn't notice this until I put the front shocks together. Does anyone know what weight the oil that comes with the kit is?

Was kind of supprised to not see any thread lock included for the screws holding the motor mount.

Also supprised to see almost no details on how tight you want to have your front and rear diffs. Being a "lower end" kit I would expect Tamiya to expect more newbies that would need help with this.

Still have to throw it on the setup board to make sure nothings out of wack. May spend the time to balance it out with a 5200 LiPo installed.

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Kit supplied shock oil is 900 (clear).

The kit rear dampers are pretty aweful even when built correctly. I use an extra 3mm washer atop the piston to get the piston snug between the two e-rings. Otherwise it has tons of play which translates to un-damped suspension for the few mm of travel. Even when using the correct piston, it's not a great fit for the cylinder leaving with less than optimal pack. This is why Tamiya now uses super thick 900 oil for both DB01 & DF03. Al least the kit shocks last a good while and don't leak...

As for the thread lock, it shouldn't be a problem. If you torque the screw head properly (don't over-do it), nothing is going to fall out. I find that even the Tamiya thread-lock makes some screws imposible to remove without destroying them or the part...

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Finally got the buggy out to the track for a few laps and have to say I like it. The lower CG and 4wd platform is much faster than a Slash for the track I'm running on.

Did run into a few problems. Started out running the 27T pinion. After 4 minutes the temp was at just over 180F. At this point I was just getting used to buggy and was not even pushing it hard. Decided to put the 25T in and see what happens. Another 4 minutes and find the temp goes up to 200F. I'm attributing the increase in temp because I started running the car faster. Instead of changing pinions again I cut the rear of the body to the higher cut line. This solved the heat problem although I have to admit that I liked the way the body looked before better. I may put in a 23T to get more acceleration. The thing never gets up to top speed so I don't think I'd be loosing anything.

For some strange reason (most likely because I had a dumb *** attack) I did not have the rear diff cover completely tight and got dirt in it. I can feel it in the action of the diff. Took everything apart and cleaned it up as good as possible while there but I should really completely rebuild the thing now that I'm at home. I was tempted to just let it go and have an excuse to get the one way for the front and move the front diff to the back.

Also ran into a problem with the motor shifting and did some damage to the spur gear. It still works but a replacement is already on the way. This was just sloppy work on my part when going to the 25T.

Had something strange happen to the receiver. I have standardized with Futaba 3PM radios and R603FF receivers. Found that the antenna was not connected to the receiver. Everything still works, and I'm not noticing any reduction in range, which I find kind of strange. I had a spare receiver with me, but as long as it's working I see no need to mess with it.

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If your not hitting top-speed, then your definitely overgeared. For good performance you want to be at max speed before the end of the main straight. This will keep the motor cool and give you more punch...

Every track is different so many gear options is ideal. Unfortunately changing gears is not the easiest thing on this car.

BTW: To fully seal the drivetrain, you have to cover the motor set-screw hole with tape, the two belt stabiliser mounting holes with tape, and use some of that rubber cement to seal that weird bottom chassis plug piece to keep dust out. I just used some cheap masking tape to cover the motor mount holes cause I change gears all the time...

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Finally got the buggy out to the track for a few laps and have to say I like it. The lower CG and 4wd platform is much faster than a Slash for the track I'm running on.

Did run into a few problems. Started out running the 27T pinion. After 4 minutes the temp was at just over 180F. At this point I was just getting used to buggy and was not even pushing it hard. Decided to put the 25T in and see what happens. Another 4 minutes and find the temp goes up to 200F. I'm attributing the increase in temp because I started running the car faster. Instead of changing pinions again I cut the rear of the body to the higher cut line. This solved the heat problem although I have to admit that I liked the way the body looked before better. I may put in a 23T to get more acceleration. The thing never gets up to top speed so I don't think I'd be loosing anything.

For some strange reason (most likely because I had a dumb *** attack) I did not have the rear diff cover completely tight and got dirt in it. I can feel it in the action of the diff. Took everything apart and cleaned it up as good as possible while there but I should really completely rebuild the thing now that I'm at home. I was tempted to just let it go and have an excuse to get the one way for the front and move the front diff to the back.

Also ran into a problem with the motor shifting and did some damage to the spur gear. It still works but a replacement is already on the way. This was just sloppy work on my part when going to the 25T.

Had something strange happen to the receiver. I have standardized with Futaba 3PM radios and R603FF receivers. Found that the antenna was not connected to the receiver. Everything still works, and I'm not noticing any reduction in range, which I find kind of strange. I had a spare receiver with me, but as long as it's working I see no need to mess with it.

Uh oh! 180F, then 200F.. Those temps are beyond the breaking point for most brushless motors (even the best max out at around 175F). Hopefully yours is OK.. Monitor your motor closely for problems...

I agree with 94eg!, your motor is overgeared. It should not build up temps higher than 130F-150F after an average run.. The EZ Run brushless motors are a bit of a mystery since I have never been able to find any on-line specs for them; making it difficult to target the ideal gear ratio.. Is there any documentation provided with the motor to help target the gearing? I will be happy to run the numbers for you if you have the motor specs...

Info needed for gearing ratios:

Spur: (stock spur is 91T)

Pinion:

Wheel Diameter: (usually 85mm)

Motor RPM or Kv rating:

The transmission ratio for the DB-01 is 2.055. This is the same for all DB-01's

Estimated gear ratio per the motor manufacturer (usually included with the motors documentation)

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