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mooter

Nib Monster Beetle Body Set 5313 / 50313

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First off, I do feel sorry for you. It is never a good experience thinking you have found your Holy Grail only do discover it was merely a grail. I understand why you are upset and why others might want to flame the seller. However, like loaded suggested, please refrain doing so as it will ge you nowhere. But then again sometimes one might want to let off some steam...

While his tone is unacceptable there are some excuses on his part:

1. His photos are clear, he has laid out everything that was included. The parts that he included are all clearly visible, as are the scratches on the roof.

People who intentionally would try to ripp others off would not provide such clear photos. You did accept på buy what you saw at that given price. In that respect I would say that while I feel for you you still made an informed decision to buy.

When I look at his pictures I see some lenses but no lights to put them in. That would have made me use the "Ask a question"-feature to find out if there is something missing.

The stressmarks you say your body has might be due to poor packaging, which is never acceptable. I bought some wheels from a fellow TC member not too long ago. It took about a month for the package to arrive. When it did arrive it had been repacked in a plastic bag by the Post in his country. One wheel was totally smashed. While he did reimburse me it was of little comfort as I still have not found another rim. My point here is, even though it is over the top a humle request to have it carefully packed does not do any harm.

2. Plain ignorance. Not everyone knows what goes with what set.

Consider how many listings you see both on eBay as well as here where people list items as complete while they are not. The same goes for all the Monster/Blitzer Beetle parts passed off as Sand Scorcher parts. Not all sellers are scammers, albeit some are shady caracters. Some actually do believe the parts are the same. They might believe a body set to be complete. You see a body, decal, windows some other parts and a driver. Now, why would you asume something is missing? I can understand such a reasoning. That is why I always do my own research.

I have been in the hobby long enough to know that it is up to me alone to make 100 % sure that what I bid on is what I expect it to be. When I get a new model, I spend hours researching the parts for it so I will know what parts are supposed to come with what tree/packaging. This is particularly hard when you do find what appears to be the solution to world hunger, or at least that missing part for your Tamiya! But still, most stuff will show up if you wait long enough. If it is a Buy it now that ends, ask the seller to relist the item.

Not too long ago I thought too long and hard about buying a NIB Solar Eagle (there are six here on TC!). While I was busy contemplating somebody else bought it... Imagine my surprise when I contacted the lucky six here on TC and got three replies from people willing to sell! Needles to say I am eternally gratefull fo Heypas for letting me buy his! Lesson learned - yes, I missed the opportunity of a lifetime only to get almost as the same deal a few days later!

The only thing I can never be held responsible for is inadequate packaged items. But that is something that PayPal can help you with. Why do I mention PayPal and not the shipping party? Well, that is because in spite of what many sellers would have us believe, PayPal can and will hold a seller responsible even when you do not buy insurance. The buyers is not required to buy insurance as per PayPal rules. However, doing so will facilitate things as the shipping party will the be less reluctant to help.

With regards to your last post, if PayPal decides the seller will do a partial refund he will. That is no longer up to him unless he has closed his PayPal account. PayPal simply draws money from his account in such case.

Respecfully

Andreas

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As for the F-- bit...

It doesn't matter whether he used the F word or not -- The feedback is not deserved, therefore a candidate for being removed.

Read here: Feedback Policy

OCD - I did use my Credit Card yes, but if I chargeback then technically I will owe him one incomplete body set back! Do you think he would be honest if I sent it to him? No. He'll pretend that it didn't arrive, or god forbid, there are bits missing :D That's why I don't think PayPal will help either, if they tell him to issue a refund and tell me to send it back I certainly don't trust him enough to do that. Sure, I can prove a package has been received, but how do I prove what is in that package? He's already shown his true colours and is adamant that he wont accept a refund anyway, so sending it back doesn't sound like an option to me.

Screwed good and proper! Least I learned something, I wonder if he has?

I am not recommending a PayPal action, but rather a chargeback with your BANKING institution.

Yes, if your BANK returns the money, you would be required to send the item back. Fortunately PayPal has no control over this process (at this point) so you need not worry about CTY pulling a fast one on you. After you receive the chargeback credit, simply send the item back with a signature required. I've had to do this before and it was much easier than I had anticipated.

-S

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You you guys are a fountain of knowledge!

I've only been rc'ing for the last few months. I bought up an old MB a year ago with the intention of doing it up and it sat in a box until recently when I had 6 weeks gardening leave and needed something to do! I've only ever used ebay occasionally too, so the last few days have been an eye opener!

Lessons learned would include, but aren't limited to are

1. Always fully research what I'm buying

2. Always spend some time looking for what I want

3. Take negative seller feedback more seriously

I know they sound obvious but on the face of it I was looking at a sound buy. He had 15000 odd feedbacks, registered for years, lots of vintage stuff, and seemingly the only body set for sale! Sure, I saw his negative feedback but I figured there's always one dodgy customer kicking up a fuss.

Unfortunately the conclusion I've come to is that he is very experienced at pulling a fast one on unsuspecting buyers every now and then, not often enough for it to upset his trade but enough to shift those big ticket items that aren't quite what they might seem.

Hence the thread really, with any luck I might be able to save someone else the hassle in future.

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What a disgraceful reply email!

A parts tree bag was under the shell in most photo's, how are you supposed to know what's in that bag if you are not a seasoned MB NIB bodyset buyer? Guess? I would've though any/all parts would have been in either bag. Also, some of us dont have flash widescreen computers and are still using Commodore 64's with colour monitor's to access the internet, so seeing inside packets with light glare is nigh on impossible.

Granted research would have helped, but the auction did say 'Complete', and if it is anything but, then that is considered "False Advertising".

Also I noticed the decal sheet and/or manual were on top of the box in every photo, possibly hiding any damage to the top of the box?

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Well I thought that I would leave off replying since just whilst I was reading of your plight I had only just bought a used but very nice condition Technigold motor from this guy and my heart sank when I read your posts since I have not been having much luck with ebay lately.

Funnily enough though the replies that I got from the seller when I asked about postal insurance, customs fees, royal mail clearance fee, VAT, and value to mark it as etc. where curteous, polite, and very helpful indeed ;);) Maybe the seller has realised that he needs the support of customers who are part of TC as he needs to have good things said and good feedback spread around, after your own horrifying experience?

Or maybe the guy just had a lot of his sales dry up and really needs to charm the buyers?!

It's odd how the guy remembered me from buying a Kyosho LeMans 240S motor NIB which was more than a year ago I think! And again I actually had an excellent deal with that one too I was very pleased with it, the box was super condition as well which was important to me.

So now I don't know what to think. I do see that his prices are high IMHO but that's his right of course, nothing 'wrong' there. I for one will be a fair amount more cautious before buying again though, as reading things like this is always very thought provoking.

Thanks for sharing your experiences with us all on here, it makes our community stronger and wiser I think.

Just hope that the seller realises that customer service is very important. If it were me as the seller I would have definitely offered a partial refund for the missing bits, as I would consider it otherwise as fraud to obtain money for parts that you didn't receive after seller says it was a complete set? Just my personal opinion.

Here's hoping you get this resolved. You have my sympathies, especially after my Sand Scorcher body box set arrived crushed today :blink: but you can read about that in the re-release Sand Scorcher 2009 thread in the General section of the Forum.

Any news on any progress towards resolving this despute yet BTW?

Cheers,.

ARG

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It's heartening to hear that he *might* be learning his lesson, I'm not sure if I'm done teaching yet though ;)

Although like I said before, I think he's nice as pie to those people he's not knowingly ripping off :blink:

My first email to him was polite and to the point without being threatening or angry at all. He immediately came back with a short "couldn't care less" attitude and that was the last I heard dispite repeated emails back. That to me says it all. He was sitting there waiting for me to say something after delivery and got very defensive, very quickly. It's not the behaviour of someone who made an honest mistake. Besides, he basically blamed me for not knowing what complete was meant to be "look at the pictures, if it's not there you dont get it". He knew what he was doing, unfortunately I didn't.

I'm sure every one of his other transactions has been smooth as silk, until the next time he wants to flog something on to an unsuspecting buyer...

No progress what-so-ever with PayPal - still being reviewed, apparently. I am now writing to my creditcard company to sort out a chargeback though, maybe they will provide a swifter resolution than PayPal.

If it comes to it I'll have to split the box. If I sell the decals, shell, P parts, metal parts bag, d parts and even the empty box I might just make my cash back.

On the plus side I picked up some MB wheels with tires for £17 today and they are almost mint!

Win some, lose some. Learn in the middle. Off to read about your SS woes now.... :/

Pete

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So I heard back from PayPal today..... they have granted a full refund and I now need to send it back to CTY300.

:)

What I don't understand is why CTY300 has apparently shipped the item to me, again!? I got another email, automated from eBay, telling me that he has shipped the item to me (again - same item) along with a tracking number.

Eh?

Is this CTY300's way of getting the money back (again) or is he going to try and pull the old unpaid strike gag again? How can he ship something to me I already have and am due to send back? He sent it yesterday apparently.

The saga continues....

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So I heard back from PayPal today..... they have granted a full refund and I now need to send it back to CTY300.

:)

What I don't understand is why CTY300 has apparently shipped the item to me, again!? I got another email, automated from eBay, telling me that he has shipped the item to me (again - same item) along with a tracking number.

Eh?

Is this CTY300's way of getting the money back (again) or is he going to try and pull the old unpaid strike gag again? How can he ship something to me I already have and am due to send back? He sent it yesterday apparently.

The saga continues....

I think your right, he will use the unpaid item strike. I had the same with a seller from the states, although it was only for about £25. My item never arrived, sent them email and basically started calling me a thief, got paypal refund then they hit me with an unpaid item strike. Got onto paypal again with all the info, and got it removed. I will never use that seller again (i always add them to my favourite sellers list with a note to myself, thatway if they change their ebay username it automatically changes it in your favourites list ;) )

Colin.

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So I heard back from PayPal today..... they have granted a full refund and I now need to send it back to CTY300.

:)

What I don't understand is why CTY300 has apparently shipped the item to me, again!? I got another email, automated from eBay, telling me that he has shipped the item to me (again - same item) along with a tracking number.

Eh?

Is this CTY300's way of getting the money back (again) or is he going to try and pull the old unpaid strike gag again? How can he ship something to me I already have and am due to send back? He sent it yesterday apparently.

The saga continues....

Today I just got one of those e-mails to say that my Technigold has just been sent even though I already received it. So I think it's just an error on Ebay. I get a fair few messages from Ebay like that (repeated ones, after things already happened) from time to time.

Regards,

Alistair G.

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I got another email, automated from eBay, telling me that he has shipped the item to me (again - same item) along with a tracking number.

Eh?

Is this CTY300's way of getting the money back (again) or is he going to try and pull the old unpaid strike gag again? How can he ship something to me I already have and am due to send back? He sent it yesterday apparently.

The saga continues....

Then again thinking about it it could be something CTY300 has done?

ARG.

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It's interesting you got an email about a previous item the same as I did - did yours contain a tracking number too? I tried the number and it doesn't come up as a registered parcel so I'm not too worried.

Who knows what he's up to lol! At least I can now package it up and send it back for a full refund, minus the cost of sending it back of course. I just hope he doesn't try and play any games with the refund situation, although he wouldn't be doing himself any favours if he messed me around further and it seems PayPal are already well aware of how he behaves anyway.

Has anyone had experience of this situation with other sellers before? They refuse a refund but PayPal makes them refund? Did you send the item back and did you get your cash OK? I will of course send it signed for (I have to due to value anyway) but he could always pretend that there are items missing or there is damage or whatever just to drag it out and wind me up some more. Any thoughts on this greatly appreciated, thanks.

And LSM - was the technigold all it was meant to be?

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It's interesting you got an email about a previous item the same as I did - did yours contain a tracking number too? I tried the number and it doesn't come up as a registered parcel so I'm not too worried.

Who knows what he's up to lol! At least I can now package it up and send it back for a full refund, minus the cost of sending it back of course. I just hope he doesn't try and play any games with the refund situation, although he wouldn't be doing himself any favours if he messed me around further and it seems PayPal are already well aware of how he behaves anyway.

And LSM - was the technigold all it was meant to be?

Nope, no tracking number in that e-mail that I got at 05:46 GMT today from Ebay from / concerning member CTY300. I did use the guy's Postal Insurance option though.

Yes the Technigold was exactly as shown in the photo's. But...

I did however notice when I disassembled it that the bottom ball race bearing was nearly seized with some little signs of rust. I simply added a bit of 3 in 1 oil (a light general purpose oil) and kept trying to make it go round and after 15 mins or so I managed to get it nice and freely spinning, very unlike the stiff action it had before. Because of this I can't see how the seller can have used it much, but the seller said that they had put 4 or 5 packs of batteries though it in a car, I'm not entirely sure that I believe that personally. The brushes were in perfect condition as was the commutator and endbell and front plate. The condition of the can itself was just like the photo's showed (nice condition).

The LeMans 240S that I got last time was indeed NIB and just about perfect so I can't really complain a lot so far. Would still be cautious next time though, from yours and others dealings with the guy that I have read about.

Cheers,

Alistair G.

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that is good news . I just hope it doesn't drag on any longer for you. I have alwasy been very lucky with Ebay (touch wood of course as now I am bound to have a problem)

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I have had dealings with cty300 also. In fact i have spent several thousand with him. He does demand top dollar for his stuff but he does take a ton of pictures for you to look at. I dont think he is out to deliberately stick it to anyone. But he should be held accountable for false descriptions or misleading ones.

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Well I've just sat and read this extraordinary thread from beginning to end, and I really must pay more attention to these forums.

I can only say: this is despicable behaviour from CTY300.

It just shows that even sellers who regularly sell lots of nice vintage items, are not necessarily vintage enthusiasts who treat each other with respect. This could all have been resolved so incredibly easily because you can tell Mooter is a well-spoken, reasonable guy. But the way CTY300 has actually handled it is quite hilarious :)

As a seller, it's always in your best interests to keep the customer happy - where possible. As Loaded mentioned, in rare cases buyers can go too far and cannot be pleased. But by and large, it's incredibly easy to be fair and reasonable. If there's an obvious problem - give a little discount. Throw them a bone. Pay them back a little. Acknowledge your mistakes and don't make them again. Live and learn. You will still make a profit from your sale.

I've been on eBay for 10 years this November, and a few months ago I sold several hundred excess NIP vintage parts I didn't need. It was the most busy I have ever been on eBay - my entire dining room table was covered in vintage parts, and I would spend 2-3 hours every night printing invoices and ensuring that everything was packed safely and addressed, for postage the next day. It was hard work (nothing compared to the sellers who run businesses and do it all the time, obviously) but it all went off without a hitch. Post safely and quickly, be polite, answer questions, and throw in the occasional freebie or bonus. Heck, I even repaid little postage overcharges, where postage turned out to be a couple of dollars cheaper than I had invoiced. You just go into Paypal and click "refund" and type in the amount - takes 2 seconds. And the buyer will be surprised and happy that you made the effort or cared.

It's actually a lot of fun to sell to the Tamiya collecting community, and you can even make new friends and contacts. Anyway, my point is just that fair trading will earn you return business and happy customers. Duh! Blind freddy knows this. So why do so many sellers make life so hard for themselves?

Why CTY300 would risk his entire reputation on an obviously misleading auction title, and then go on the attack against an unhappy customer, is beyond me. He's no amateur, he's a Tamiya pro. He knows it ain't "complete" unless it's complete. I have always felt his items were priced higher than their true value (if offered at a no reserve auction). But now we all know he's unreasonable and rude, in addition to being overpriced. Very useful information :D

"Vintage Tamiya Town" is smaller than he might think, thanks to forums like this.

cheers,

H.

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I bought a NIB body set and it arrived today - a thing of (expensive) beauty. Well, it would be if it weren't for some of the 'damage' that wasn't listed in the auction and some potentially missing pieces! As far as I can work out a COMPLETE body set should also include the spot lights parts - the bag of metal bits that comes with it has the u-brackets in for attaching the spot lights to the bar, but no bar and no spot lights.

It is also missing the silver Q parts (the head/foglight parts)

What was included might be a better start:

Body Shell (some stress marks on the plastic means that it will have to be sprayed, I can't just leave it red)

P Parts - including nose cone, driver, other shell parts (the usual)

D Parts - window and head/foglight lens

Antenna

Bag of metal bits and pieces

Oh and decals

Now the bag certainly suggests that it should come with the spot-light bar/spot lights as it contains all of the screws and brackets to put this together. This image would also suggest that I am missing some bits - http://www.tamiyabase.com/parts/images/350/50313.jpg

My Understanding is that E and G Parts were never part of the bodyset... Look again at the photo someone provided a link to, he explains in the description that it came with extra NIP parts ie the E and G Parts... It's been sometime since I had a Monster Beetle Bodyset but I don't recall having E and G trees!!!!

Do some more research...

cheers

BeetleLover

Can anyone point me in the direction of further proof or are there any others who have bought a NIB body set themselves and if so, what did it contain?

I'm waiting for the seller to come back to me with his thoughts so I figured I'd ask the experts (yes, you lot) in the meantime! ;)

Cheers

mooter

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Sorry for the delay but heres a pic of my two bodysets:

PICT0001-4.jpg

And yes it's included!!!

Badboy

Here's my two NIB mB body sets!!!

It got it all!!!

Screws, head lights, front (xtra lights) body, body posts (front and rear), driver, antenna, decals etc...

Badboy

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It's interesting you got an email about a previous item the same as I did - did yours contain a tracking number too? I tried the number and it doesn't come up as a registered parcel so I'm not too worried.

Who knows what he's up to lol! At least I can now package it up and send it back for a full refund, minus the cost of sending it back of course. I just hope he doesn't try and play any games with the refund situation, although he wouldn't be doing himself any favours if he messed me around further and it seems PayPal are already well aware of how he behaves anyway.

Has anyone had experience of this situation with other sellers before? They refuse a refund but PayPal makes them refund? Did you send the item back and did you get your cash OK? I will of course send it signed for (I have to due to value anyway) but he could always pretend that there are items missing or there is damage or whatever just to drag it out and wind me up some more. Any thoughts on this greatly appreciated, thanks.

And LSM - was the technigold all it was meant to be?

I didn't see this in time, but if it's not too late, you could always take some pictures or even film your packaging process. I hope to god you don't have to do this, but since the seller has demonstrated such dishonesty from his part...

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I've bought from CTY300 in the past....but I don't think I will again. Bad form.

Thanks for the heads up too. I was just about to buy the Nissan King Cab that he has for sale! Lucky I saw this first, eh? Imagine the trouble I would have had with him if anything was wrong with the kit!

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Mooter, good luck with this one and keep us informed of the outcome. I will definitely avoid your seller as ultimately, people buy from people, and I would rather my money went to someone else.

Look fwd to seeing pics off the MB build!

28

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Well, the body set has just been posted back to CTY300 and he should have it shortly. I sent it well packaged (better than he sent it to me!), fully insured and signed-for, obviously.

Now let's see if he'll accept defeat graciously; with any luck PayPal will authorise my refund within the next week or two. I have a feeling we're not done yet but I don't know enough about the PayPal dispute resolution process to work out what happens next. I'm still worried that he'll pretend it's INCOMPLETE ;);)

BruiserBrew - I thought about taking pics or filming, but what would it actually prove? I couldn't work it out so I left it.

In other news, my COMPLETE body set arrived from Kalsh today safe and sound and I'm pleased to confirm that everything that was meant to be included was in the box! Three cheers to Kalsh!

I'm just waiting on the J parts tree to arrive from Switzerland and I'll have everything I need for my new build :o The only used parts will be the wheels (but I have some mint ones) and the front axle stubs. They come with the blister pack originally so I'm having to reuse some. Everything else will be brand spanking new!

/excited

(oh, and for those following, the alu G1 parts are now officially in production!)

:P

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In other news, my COMPLETE body set arrived from Kalsh today safe and sound and I'm pleased to confirm that everything that was meant to be included was in the box! Three cheers to Kalsh!

Glad to hear! :D

I wish you all the best for the outcome of the CTY300 escapade mate.

Also, I accidently deleted you from my "happy to be associated with..."

went to look at your showroom and hit the 'x' instead of your name :rolleyes:

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