Newbie Looking For Some Advice- Tl-01 Hop-up's

[Graymo]

I recently bought a second hand Subaru WRC TL-01. I know this is a very basic model but didn’t want to spend a lot considering I’ve spent a lot on my last couple of cars which I must admit haven’t been used for a while and are now in a sorry state (Tamiya Porsche GT2 Taisan StarCard (TA02SW) and a Schumacher Nitro off-roader), although I’m sure I could bring them back to life.

In the meantime I want to concentrate on the TL-01. I’m not planning on racing it competitively but just for fun. I’ve never upgraded any cars with hop-up parts so am looking for some advice.

For example can I simply put a more powerful engine in it with the stock parts or will this mean having to also upgrade to an ESC, ball bearings, sport gears etc..

I don’t really want to spend a fortune so I guess what I’m asking is... what is the fastest motor I can fit in the car as it currently is (stock parts e.g. MSC) ?. Also, will it reach higher top speeds if I take out the drive shaft and make it rear wheel drive only (currently 4WD)?

I would be very grateful for any advice anyone could offer me.

Thanks in advance.

[Gruntfuggly]

The best upgrade you can make - even before changing motor, is to add a full set of bearings. You'll get more speed, better battery life and it will last longer. Make sure you remove any grease around the old bushes too...

[Graymo]

The best upgrade you can make - even before changing motor, is to add a full set of bearings. You'll get more speed, better battery life and it will last longer. Make sure you remove any grease around the old bushes too...

Thanks for the advice. I just ordered a full set of abec 9 bearings so hopefully they will help. I would still like to get a faster motor though if anyone has any suggestions (preferably one I can use with MSC unless there are cheap ESC's out there)

[taliesin]

Since you are disassembling to change out the bearings anyway... add speed tuned gears for higher top end speeds. Like this: http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/item.php?product-id=53342

Commonly available for around $5-6. You will lose some low end torque by doing this so it won't start out as fast.

I think a 23t motor would make the car fly and work ok with the MSC. Like this: http://www.tamiyausa.com/product/item.php?product-id=53697

Normally costs around $25 US.

Oil shocks are a must or the car will just be on its roof all the time.

That's about all you would need to go faster: motor, shocks, bearings, optional speed gears. Not a pile of cash but a huge improvement. You might find just bearings and the speed gears will do more than you think and the investment is pretty minimal. You could add shocks and motor later if you want more speed and better handling.

[TA-Mark]

Don't forget to throw the butter soft alloy pinion in the bin and fit a steel one.

[taliesin]

Don't forget to throw the butter soft alloy pinion in the bin and fit a steel one.

Amen!

I can totally understand pogo sticks and MSC and even crummy bushings, because - and let's be honest here: the kit will run just fine without oil shocks, ESC and bearings. It allows people to buy a kit at a lower price point and choose whether to upgrade it or not. If it came with those upgrades, the base price would reflect that. Nothing is ever free. Besides, most of us like to tinker and upgrade or we wouldn't be in this hobby anyway. So speed costs money - how fast do you want to go? I like the fact that you can start with a basic kit and spend as little or much as you like - I just have to bite my tongue and remind myself of that once in awhile when it seems like none of the goodies come standard in the kit.

But those pinions ... grrrr. Why not just put some stress cracks in the gearing, or use defective plastic so the gearbox falls apart while your at it? I mean, if the blasted thing is going to be ruined by shoddy materials why bother? It just seems like such an un-Tamiya like failure in quality that it leaves me wondering why? Who really checks their gearbox and pinion gears every 5 or 6 battery packs to see if the pinion has disintegrated yet? Really?!

On the other hand, at least the electronic throttle doesn't stick on most Tamiyas!

[Graymo]

Amen!

I can totally understand pogo sticks and MSC and even crummy bushings, because - and let's be honest here: the kit will run just fine without oil shocks, ESC and bearings. It allows people to buy a kit at a lower price point and choose whether to upgrade it or not. If it came with those upgrades, the base price would reflect that. Nothing is ever free. Besides, most of us like to tinker and upgrade or we wouldn't be in this hobby anyway. So speed costs money - how fast do you want to go? I like the fact that you can start with a basic kit and spend as little or much as you like - I just have to bite my tongue and remind myself of that once in awhile when it seems like none of the goodies come standard in the kit.

But those pinions ... grrrr. Why not just put some stress cracks in the gearing, or use defective plastic so the gearbox falls apart while your at it? I mean, if the blasted thing is going to be ruined by shoddy materials why bother? It just seems like such an un-Tamiya like failure in quality that it leaves me wondering why? Who really checks their gearbox and pinion gears every 5 or 6 battery packs to see if the pinion has disintegrated yet? Really?!

On the other hand, at least the electronic throttle doesn't stick on most Tamiyas!

When you say steel pinion which part do you mean... please see here.

I decided to buy all your suggestions (with the exception of the pinion gear- still trying to work out what I need) but have decided that I would quite like to go for an ESC. Any idea what the cheapest ESC I can use with the Tamiya super stock RZ is?

Thanks in advance

[Nitrocrushy]

Hello

The Carson CE-4 costs 8 USD and is a little faster stan a stock Mabushi 540

http://cgi.ebay.de/Carson-Tamiya-CE-4-Elek...=item5ad6b3e628

27 turn will be sufficient (47 instead of 38 km/h) -23 turn will get 55 km/h

greets

nitrocrushy

[Graymo]

When you say steel pinion which part do you mean... please see here.

I decided to buy all your suggestions (with the exception of the pinion gear- still trying to work out what I need) but have decided that I would quite like to go for an ESC. Any idea what the cheapest ESC I can use with the Tamiya super stock RZ is?

Thanks in advance

Just a quick note: I decided to go for a MTRONIKS VIPER ECO20 ESC because it seemed cheap and cheerful.

JUst the pinion/s to get now then?!

[tamiya monkey]

instead of spending cash on a faster brushed motor and esc, why not buy a ezrun 9t and 35amp esc brushless combo, for little money and im sure would give you all the power/torque that a tl01 could handle.

[TA-Mark]

Just a quick note: I decided to go for a MTRONIKS VIPER ECO20 ESC because it seemed cheap and cheerful.

JUst the pinion/s to get now then?!

Modelsport.co.uk has RW Racing 0.6m steel pinions. (The gear on the motor). You will need to count how many teeth are on the current one and get the same tooth count in a 0.6m size.

Tamiya only make 1 steel pinion in a 0.6m, so you must look at other brands. It's for the DF02 Rising Storm buggy. All the rest of Tamiya's AV 0.6m pinions are the soft butter alloy.

[Graymo]

Modelsport.co.uk has RW Racing 0.6m steel pinions. (The gear on the motor). You will need to count how many teeth are on the current one and get the same tooth count in a 0.6m size.

Tamiya only make 1 steel pinion in a 0.6m, so you must look at other brands. It's for the DF02 Rising Storm buggy. All the rest of Tamiya's AV 0.6m pinions are the soft butter alloy.

Thanks Mark. I just checked and couldn't find any though. Can you confirm they are still on the site?

Edit** I found it (doh). How do I know that this one will fit? I think the TL-01 chassis can only take three sizes 19/21/23 but I have also heard that Tamiya sizes are different to other manufacturers. I was planning on going for the 21 with a super stock RZ engine and tamiya race gears. I'm still new at this so not really sure if this will work.

[TA-Mark]

Thanks Mark. I just checked and couldn't find any though. Can you confirm they are still on the site?

Yeap. Search Link. Search string was RW .6 pinion.

[TamiyaDan]

.

[Graymo]

in 2000 i raced a Tl-01 for a season. I would have to go through the old Focus box to remember all the modifications i made. Due to the chassis Age hopup parts are going to be very hard to locate but:

1) bearings. most bang for the buck. Tamiya (#53292) - Tamiya TL01 Ball Bearing Set <-- if you find this set it came with a lighter weight gearbox shaft set.

2) the speed tuned gear set, changes the stock ratio gives you a taller ratio. Tamiya (#53342) - Tamiya Speed-Tuned Gear Set TL01

3) there was an aluminum motor bell heat sink and re-enforcement for the motor mount. If you put a BIG engine on that chassis you run into major heat issues that cause melt the chassis. this would be the hardest to find, you might find an aftermarket one.

4) hard coated pinion or steel one from tamiya, remember the gears in tamiya are a METRIC 48 pitch, and not a regular 48 pitch gear.

The biggest problem with the Tl-01 chassis is handling, its a twitchy chassis.Tamiya put out a number of modifications over the chassis run to try and help its Squirrelly nature.

The best would be the Long Suspension arm conversion kit, for the Tl-01.

4) Tamiya (#53467) - Tamiya Long Suspension Arm Set TL01/FF2 This will vastly improve handling on that chassis.

Following that you going to want to lighten the car as much as possible.

There was a lightweight chassis.

Tamiya (#53331) - Tamiya Lightweight Chassis/Frame TL01

and carbon shaft set for the car

Tamiya (#53323) - Tamiya Carbon Prop Shaft TL01

Tamiya (#53322) - Tamiya Hollow Carbon Gear Shaft TL01

Those are the basics.

There are a lot of other hopups that came out at different times, however some newer hopups replaced older ones. There was a Caster block hopup and a sway bar setup that got replaced by the Long suspension Arm set.

there was also a front one way diff that got replaced by a center one way setup, but then you couldn't use the speed tuned gear set so that got kicked out from the hopups, and you went back to the front one way setup.

There was also a carry over upgrade from the ta01/02 days for a rear ball diff upgrade, addition to this was a aluminum center and drive cup upgrade which reduced rotational mass of the drive line at the cost of reliability.

If it help i can post up pics and show some of the hopups. and it might remind me of other things.

In my opinion the tl-01 ran best with a high end Stock motor, better torque, less heat on chassis.

I went a little insane on my racer and even changed out all the steel hardware for Titanium which was another hopup tamiya offered at the time to further reduce the overall weight of the car.

Thanks for all the information.

So far I have bought a Super stock RZ motor and MTRONIKS VIPER ECO20 ESC (probably should have gone for the brushless Ezrun setup as suggested by Tamiya Monkey but ordered before I saw his suggestion- bought on ebay so can't cancel), the Tamiya speed tuned gears, the alloy oil damper shocks, a 19t &21t steel pinion as suggested by TA Mark and finally a full set of abec 9 bearings. I plan to run all other parts as stock.

I have already spent much more than I wanted to (prices in the UK are practically double those in the US) and probably should have just spent it on a new car but oh well.

Have I missed out anything fundamental ?!(do you think the motor heat sink is vital?).

In the future I will upgrade the prop shaft to carbon and maybe add the long arm suspension set (v. expensive though £50-60) and the other weight reduction parts you suggested. I would appreciate it if you could post some pics of your car if its not too much trouble.

But thanks for your advice and to all the others who have assisted me.

[TA-Mark]

Just for your knowledge on the TL01, here are the FDRs (Final Drive Ratios) with each pinion and compared to the Speed Tuned gearset.

Pinion Gear..... Normal Ratio...... Speed-tuned Ratio

19T ................. 7.96 ................. 5.95

21T ................. 7.20 ................. 5.39

23T ................. 6.57 ................. 4.92

Tamiya RZ manual recommends 7.0 - 6.5 FDR. You may get away with as tall as 5.5.

Overheating the motor in a TL01 will melt the chassis (I've done it). Luckily replacement chassis are not too expensive.

[Graymo]

Just for your knowledge on the TL01, here are the FDRs (Final Drive Ratios) with each pinion and compared to the Speed Tuned gearset.

Pinion Gear..... Normal Ratio...... Speed-tuned Ratio

19T ................. 7.96 ................. 5.95

21T ................. 7.20 ................. 5.39

23T ................. 6.57 ................. 4.92

Tamiya RZ manual recommends 7.0 - 6.5 FDR. You may get away with as tall as 5.5.

Overheating the motor in a TL01 will melt the chassis (I've done it). Luckily replacement chassis are not too expensive.

Mark,

Does this mean that I can only use the 19T Pinion gear with the speed tuned gearset and the RZ motor? (as using the 21T will take the ratio below 5.5?). What does the information in the table mean for my setup? Also, how can I cool the motor so it doesn't melt the chassis?

[HunterZero]

Mark,

Does this mean that I can only use the 19T Pinion gear with the speed tuned gearset and the RZ motor? (as using the 21T will take the ratio below 5.5?). What does the information in the table mean for my setup? Also, how can I cool the motor so it doesn't melt the chassis?

I've seen it recommended for the TL01 not to use the speed tuned gearsets with lower turn motors, because the gear ratios are too steep. The lower the ratio, the taller the gear, which means higher potential top speed but less acceleration and the motor has to do more work, eg it gets hotter.

23T with the standard gear set ratio seems to be the correct ratio, but since the car is quite light, you might be able to get away with 19T on the speed tuned gear set for a bit more top speed. Gearing it any higher you would risk heat problems, possibly burn the motor or melt the chassis.

- James

[TA-Mark]

I've seen it recommended for the TL01 not to use the speed tuned gearsets with lower turn motors, because the gear ratios are too steep. The lower the ratio, the taller the gear, which means higher potential top speed but less acceleration and the motor has to do more work, eg it gets hotter.

23T with the standard gear set ratio seems to be the correct ratio, but since the car is quite light, you might be able to get away with 19T on the speed tuned gear set for a bit more top speed. Gearing it any higher you would risk heat problems, possibly burn the motor or melt the chassis.

- James

James sums it up nicely.

When using the RZ motor:

21T pinion with normal gearset = good acceleration and poor top speed (Grass/Dirt running).

23T pinion with normal gearset = balance between acceleratin and top speed.

19T pinion with speed tuned gears = high top speed with poor acceleration (only use on smooth/flat surfaces with little resistance).

The paper gasket that goes between the motor and chassis should help with heat transfer between the two. The DT02 buggy heatsink fits on a TL01 perfect, alternatively Himoto/HBX make a very cheap replica.

[taliesin]

You know, I've been thinking about this for awhile: I think the TL-01 actually handled better with a stock silver can motor, 19t pinion and the speed gears than any other combination.

With just the regular gears and the RZ ... or ... with the silver can and speed gears it runs good. But the RZ with speed tuned gears the car just bogs down. I never tried a 23t pinion though and maybe I should have?

I've been reluctant to change the gears because its a pain to do, and I'm tempted to just go back to the silver can or maybe a sport tuned motor. Or even better yet, change the pinion.

[TA-Mark]

You know, I've been thinking about this for awhile: I think the TL-01 actually handled better with a stock silver can motor, 19t pinion and the speed gears than any other combination.

With just the regular gears and the RZ ... or ... with the silver can and speed gears it runs good. But the RZ with speed tuned gears the car just bogs down. I never tried a 23t pinion though and maybe I should have?

I've been reluctant to change the gears because its a pain to do, and I'm tempted to just go back to the silver can or maybe a sport tuned motor. Or even better yet, change the pinion.

The Speed Tuned gearset is mainly aimed at the silvercan/27T/25T GT Tuned or Sport Tuned (black can) motors. Using it with the RZ 23T motor maybe just that bit too tall for anything but smooth very low resistance surfaces like concrete with lots of high speed running (flatout around a carpark).

If you had it around a circuit with quite a bit of accelerating each lap it could overheat things with the motor being under constant load. Better to go for the recommended RZ ratios for this type of driving. 21T/23T pinion with the normal gearset.

It's not a bad thing to cover all ratios with both gearsets and the 3 pinions, I do it.

[Graymo]

Thanks for help guys. Ordered a 23T pinion and will use the stock gear set with this. I could always give the tuned gears and 19T a try at a later stage.

[yellowscott]

Great to see people talking openly & unashamedly about the unloved TL-01! My first 2 cars. Don't see much about this model on here!! I agree with the other guys in that you can't run a low turn motor on this chassis, especially with the speed tuned gear set. One thing I do with this chassis is dremel out & drill some holes in the chassis around the motor to get some air to it to try & cool it a little. Have also considered running some type of bonnet scoop with flexible electrical conduit attached directing air onto the motor. Have the parts but haven't tried so don't know if it would help. Never did get them to handle/steer very good but have never run decent tires on it either.

[PaPeRo]

From the looks of the exposed motor can, I'm pretty sure you could fit a small clip-on heatsink.

[TA-Mark]

From the looks of the exposed motor can, I'm pretty sure you could fit a small clip-on heatsink.

The DT02 heatsink fits on them perfectly. I have them on my TL01 and TL01bs.

Or for a cheaper solution, search eBay worldwide for himoto heat sink, $2US and a copy of the DT02 heatsink. They also fit great on TA01/02 and DF01.