First Rally Car...

[Chutneypundit]

Hi Folks,

It's been a long, cold winter up here in Scotland, but the snow and some hard frosts, coupled with a dry spell for the last three weeks has resulted in the RC track at the bottom of the garden being made of lovely, loose, dry, dirt (can't believe this hobby has given me a dirt fetish ). Nothing better than having a good thrash, then shaking all the dirt off a relatively clean chassis.

Anyhoo, I have an TA-02/03 F150 truck (see my showroom), a CC-01 Touareg, and a Hummer, all of which have taken my love of the hobby away from the more dunebuggy-ish kits I have. There's something about a scale model, a little slower than a race buggy, but with plenty of torque kicking up dirt as it scrabbles over rough terrain, or hauls its bulk around a corner

So I'm considering a rally car for my next project and here's the conundrum: I really want a Mini! I guess my first question would be, are these kits any good for off-road rallying? And then, which chassis - M03, M05..?

I am braced for an 'opinion barrage'!

[arh21]

Hi Folks,

It's been a long, cold winter up here in Scotland, but the snow and some hard frosts, coupled with a dry spell for the last three weeks has resulted in the RC track at the bottom of the garden being made of lovely, loose, dry, dirt (can't believe this hobby has given me a dirt fetish ). Nothing better than having a good thrash, then shaking all the dirt off a relatively clean chassis.

Anyhoo, I have an TA-02/03 F150 truck (see my showroom), a CC-01 Touareg, and a Hummer, all of which have taken my love of the hobby away from the more dunebuggy-ish kits I have. There's something about a scale model, a little slower than a race buggy, but with plenty of torque kicking up dirt as it scrabbles over rough terrain, or hauls its bulk around a corner

So I'm considering a rally car for my next project and here's the conundrum: I really want a Mini! I guess my first question would be, are these kits any good for off-road rallying? And then, which chassis - M03, M05..?

I am braced for an 'opinion barrage'!

I wanted to do the same thing, but after speaking to a few people it seems that the M03 and 05 chassis's are no good for off road. There is too little ground clearance and you can't adjust the suspension enough. Unless others know otherwise?

[Origineelreclamebord]

I wanted to do the same thing, but after speaking to a few people it seems that the M03 and 05 chassis's are no good for off road. There is too little ground clearance and you can't adjust the suspension enough. Unless others know otherwise?

I think the rally/touring cars in general don't have enough suspension stroke for really rough terrain anyway. The rally cars are meant for fine gravel and compacted sand/dirt that has a clean top surface, no twigs, rough gravel and such stuff If you want something that has big suspension stroke, take a buggy, or even better, a Monster Truck.

If you want more suspension stroke out of an M-chassis, you will need longer suspension arms - it's as simple as that. Member Wrc Action made a nice example of this; His M04 based Schlesser-like 2WD rally car/scale buggy.

It's not an M-chassis anymore as you can see, if you want an M-chassis with big suspension stroke, I think you'll need to make a full custom built car. Something with a Live axle at the driven end will allow more suspension stroke than double wishbone as the whole unit along with the diff goes up and down - there are no M-chassis width live axles though, and ground clearance will be limited with a live axle - in fact the M-chassis wheels will give low ground clearance with any suspension system. For the non-driven end you can use trail arms or double wishbone suspension, as you have no worries with driveshafts.

[Chutneypundit]

My track is mostly compacted/loose dirt - the only 'rough' bits are patchy grass/moss or the auxiliary routes that are the reserve of the Touareg. I've seen a few vids on YouTube that seem to be Df-03-style rally cars (some TT's too?) and they seem to manage similar terrain. Of course the other option is the 240Z (drool). It's like Tamiya know exactly how to break my 'no more RC kits' pledge - "I have enough... more than enough... There's no reason why I shou- OOoo! a 250Z! And an Intergrale! AND they've re-released the Sand Scorcher!"

Tamiya = Evil Empire

[Origineelreclamebord]

My track is mostly compacted/loose dirt - the only 'rough' bits are patchy grass/moss or the auxiliary routes that are the reserve of the Touareg. I've seen a few vids on YouTube that seem to be Df-03-style rally cars (some TT's too?) and they seem to manage similar terrain. Of course the other option is the 240Z (drool). It's like Tamiya know exactly how to break my 'no more RC kits' pledge - "I have enough... more than enough... There's no reason why I shou- OOoo! a 250Z! And an Intergrale! AND they've re-released the Sand Scorcher!"

Tamiya = Evil Empire

Completely True But Tamiya is a heavenly Evil Empire...

Anyway, if you want a good rally car, go for the TB01 or the DF03RA.

The TB01 is the older car, but has my preference. It has gearboxes from the TG10 (A Nitro Powered Tourer, and those very same gearboxes I believe were used on the TGX, a 1/8th scale tourer, this shows how tough those gearboxes are), a very thick tub chassis and every part when looked at seperately would suggest it comes from a Battle Tank. Some people see this as a disadvantage, in my opinion it just makes the car reliable and the weight gives nice pressure on the tires, keeping the grip up. The spares and hopup availability is not sublime but good enough (if you even need any), and the only weak parts on the car are it's small shock towers (they often crack but often then still are perfectly useable. If they do break you can also screw the shocks straight to the gearboxes) and te body mounts (they don't break, but do bend easily as they are a little soft).

The DF03RA is the tourer sized brother of the DF03. It's a pretty recent car, much lighter than the TB01 and has loads of spares and hopups available. The car performs well, but I don't know up to what motor the car can handle (in particular the diffs), and some people have experienced trouble with the soft aluminum main gear (rear gearbox). It sometimes wears extremely quick and destroys the plastic gears as well. This however is the start of the trouble. When you want to replace these parts, you need to buy several bags because every gear you need for the rear gearbox is in a different bag - costing a lot more money than it should. And if you have a slipper clutch, you may find it hard to find a slipper clutch shaft with main gear seperately (I doubt they are sold seperately).

Some people drive TT01's as well for rallying, but they do not have a chassis cover available, it's not as reliable as a TB01 and not as well performing as a DF03RA...

[TA-Mark]

I use a TA02 as a rally car (#58176 Repsol Escort). What was available before the TB01 came along. With TA01 rear arms it makes the shorter wheelbase for the Corolla WRC body. Fully sealed gearboxes and only really needs the AV pinion and plastic motor mount replaced with better parts.

The DF03RA will take any motor you want to throw at it with the available gear ratios (upto 13.67:1 FDR). In the dirt you don't need that much if you want reasonable control to manouver around a set course. 4600Kv is plenty of speed (if not too much for a tight course). I've had nothing but trouble with mainshaft wear in my three DF03s. When I can buy a decent mainshaft I'll consider the DF03RA.

The M03 and M04 can be lifted in ride height with some mini CVA dampers. Traction is always a problem with 2WD offroad, but that's half the fun isn't it. With a ball diff fitted they do get the power down ok. I've run my M04 around my track without any troubles. I did put a touch of silicone in the any unfilled hole into the gearbox and sealed the two halves together with silastic. I have seen M-Chassis rally block tyres for sale before which would increase the wheel diameter a bit and increase ride height slightly. I was just using some cheap 3Racing M-Chassis wheels for a bit of 2WD rally fun, dampers borrowed from a TA03F.

[Origineelreclamebord]

I use a TA02 as a rally car (#58176 Repsol Escort).

I completely forgot about the TA02... It does make a really nice rally car, it's also very tough but has no cover like the TB01 does...

[Chutneypundit]

I use a TA02 as a rally car (#58176 Repsol Escort). What was available before the TB01 came along. With TA01 rear arms it makes the shorter wheelbase for the Corolla WRC body. Fully sealed gearboxes and only really needs the AV pinion and plastic motor mount replaced with better parts.

The DF03RA will take any motor you want to throw at it with the available gear ratios (upto 13.67:1 FDR). In the dirt you don't need that much if you want reasonable control to manouver around a set course. 4600Kv is plenty of speed (if not too much for a tight course). I've had nothing but trouble with mainshaft wear in my three DF03s. When I can buy a decent mainshaft I'll consider the DF03RA.

The M03 and M04 can be lifted in ride height with some mini CVA dampers. Traction is always a problem with 2WD offroad, but that's half the fun isn't it. With a ball diff fitted they do get the power down ok. I've run my M04 around my track without any troubles. I did put a touch of silicone in the any unfilled hole into the gearbox and sealed the two halves together with silastic. I have seen M-Chassis rally block tyres for sale before which would increase the wheel diameter a bit and increase ride height slightly. I was just using some cheap 3Racing M-Chassis wheels for a bit of 2WD rally fun, dampers borrowed from a TA03F.

Thanks Mark - I was even considering trying to find a rally body for the F150 - now it's hopped-up (including rear anti-roll bar) I've been loathe to up its speed for fear of costly crashes. Only prob is that the rear GPM bits have lengthened the wheelbase to about 263mm, which actually suits the F150 body better, but I haven't got my head around all these slightly different body sizes on offer...

[Chutneypundit]

Completely True But Tamiya is a heavenly Evil Empire...

Anyway, if you want a good rally car, go for the TB01 or the DF03RA.

A TB01, eh... Hmmm, my range of choice appears to be expanding

[TA-Mark]

Thanks Mark - I was even considering trying to find a rally body for the F150 - now it's hopped-up (including rear anti-roll bar) I've been loathe to up its speed for fear of costly crashes. Only prob is that the rear GPM bits have lengthened the wheelbase to about 263mm, which actually suits the F150 body better, but I haven't got my head around all these slightly different body sizes on offer...

Sounds like you fitted TA02 rear GPM alloy arms? The F-150 rear arms are TA01. The TA02 ones will fit, but they extend the wheelbase. #58161 F-150 is a bit of a stange animal, it's a mix of TA01 and TA02 parts.

[Chutneypundit]

Sounds like you fitted TA02 rear GPM alloy arms? The F-150 rear arms are TA01. The TA02 ones will fit, but they extend the wheelbase. #58161 F-150 is a bit of a stange animal, it's a mix of TA01 and TA02 parts.

Yeah, it's been one long magical mystery tour

I think... I think... I'm going to go for the Mini and try to make it rally-able. You mentioned, above, something about M-Chassis rally block tyres - won't the 'usual' Tamiya rally blocks fit, that I've seen advertised on most sites?

[Origineelreclamebord]

Yeah, it's been one long magical mystery tour

I think... I think... I'm going to go for the Mini and try to make it rally-able. You mentioned, above, something about M-Chassis rally block tyres - won't the 'usual' Tamiya rally blocks fit, that I've seen advertised on most sites?

You have M-chassis size wheels and touring car size wheels. Most Rally Block tires are for the touring car size wheels, although there is a manufacturer that makes Rally Block tires (with the same pattern as Tamiya uses for their rally tires) for M-chassis cars. With slightly different gearing and posisbly slightly trimming the wheelarches out further you could fit touring car wheels and regular rally block tires though - this will also give sufficient ground clearance on the M-chassis.

[Chutneypundit]

You have M-chassis size wheels and touring car size wheels. Most Rally Block tires are for the touring car size wheels, although there is a manufacturer that makes Rally Block tires (with the same pattern as Tamiya uses for their rally tires) for M-chassis cars. With slightly different gearing and posisbly slightly trimming the wheelarches out further you could fit touring car wheels and regular rally block tires though - this will also give sufficient ground clearance on the M-chassis.

Aha! Thanks. I've found this site too...

http://www.tam.ne.jp/nic/minirally/rally_e.html

[bjr250]

Aha! Thanks. I've found this site too...

http://www.tam.ne.jp/nic/minirally/rally_e.html

Grahoo does some great builds and gets cars to do things that they were never meant to. You can see his show room here.

He also did another mini rally page here that has some good close up photos of the mods that he has used.

As for mini sized tyres I have heard that the Tam-tech gear buggy champ rears will fit.

[Matt_N]

Might I suggest something really different... An SC10 kit with the body of the 1/8th Kyosho Subaru Impreza! Seen it done before, looks awesome

Matt

[Chutneypundit]

Might I suggest something really different... An SC10 kit with the body of the 1/8th Kyosho Subaru Impreza! Seen it done before, looks awesome

Matt

I think I'm sold on a Mini! All I have to do is cut up a perfectly good set of rallyblock tyres...

[Origineelreclamebord]

I think I'm sold on a Mini! All I have to do is cut up a perfectly good set of rallyblock tyres...

Search M-chassis Rally on ebay There are some M-chassis rally tires around at this moment from the Brand 'Square.'

(@Mods: I hope I am not breaching rules here by referring to an ebay search in detail?)

[TA-Mark]

M-Chassis Rally tyres at RCMart.

[Butler]

If you go with M03..here is another approach, although full sized wheels want work with a mini shell, but I thought they looked ok on the Swift.

http://www.tamiyaclub.com/forum/index.php?...844&hl=jwrc

With the mini pin type types it was really quick on grass and hard packed mud. 2wd on gravel is always going to be a lot of wheel spin.

[Chutneypundit]

Wow, thanks for the tips, guys. Now all I need is to get a new kit - ho hum, life is hard

[Skottoman]

TB01 is the battle tank of the tamiya rally lineup. Discontinued, but you can still find them out there...

It's possible to beef one up to all TG10 driveline spec, which means you can push a lot of brushless power through them if you want, and they will stand it.

I'm putting 9.6v and a 4600kv Castle Sidewinder setup on my street TB01, and it's a monster. No need for more power than that for sure. Especially on dirt.

*I'm a TB01 fan if you can't tell.....*

CHeers,

Skottoman