The Hobby Of Actually "building Stuff"

[Hibernaculum 933]

This isn't a new topic, but rather....an ongoing sense of sadness that an important part of the "hobby" world is dying off, and may disappear completely in the future...

Model building.

Do we think modelling/building, whether plastic or RC models (or any other kind) will eventually disappear completely?

Will it die off with our generation? Because if kids aren't growing up now enjoying the construction aspect, what will they pass on to their kids?

Will everything eventually be pre-made disposable toys? Will it get to the point where even Lego and Meccano sets come pre-made and glued together, setting a new low in can't-be-botheredness?

Hobby shops these days are increasingly filled with pre-built objects of every kind, so that they look more like toy shops.

The other day I noticed even train set accessory companies are forced now, after decades of producing fine kits, to released lots of pre-built houses, buildings and stuff. Yet when I was a kid, the toy shops, supermarkets and even newsagencies would sell plastic model kits. And that was the 1980s - long after the actual peak period of model building (the 50s and 60s). But try finding a single model kit in those places now.

But I still grew up with an appreciation for putting things together myself. So I'm just amazed that so many people these days seem to think that building something is a chore, rather than actually part of the fun or of learning. A bit of effort = satisfaction. Even if your modelling skills aren't the greatest, the fact that you built it yourself (whatever it is - wooden model, plastic, car, ship, train, plane - whatever) is an aspect of the hobby world that appears to be being discarded. Delayed gratification cannot be "sold" as easily of course, but now it appears that a lot people haven't even heard of such a preposterous idea.

Yet isn't building stuff at the core of the whole hobby world? Without it, everything just becomes toys, doesn't it? Not that toys are bad. It's just that building them before playing with them, doubles the fun

Last weekend I visited a hobby shop. The owner of this particular one has been in business for 30 years. The shop used to carry hundreds of plastic models, but I was shocked to find that now his model shelf carried only maybe 20-30 kits. Just as I noticed this, I overheard him say to another customer that the plastic model market is "dead". Meanwhile, he had a large aisle of dolls house type paraphernalia, which is obviously what a lot of women are into. But it's pre-built too - you just set it up and look at it. Just like a lot of those Christmas train set systems like this one that have become very popular. Shoddy looking, but easy to set up. Anyone can do it. No skills required - or gained.

A week earlier I also bought some old stock from another hobby shop that was closing down, after nearly 30 years (yet another hobby shop closing). They still had many plastic models, unsold for many years. This weekend I will visit another shop and see what they have.

Recently I watched James May's Toy Stories DVD. http://www.jamesmaystoystories.com/

Highly recommended if you haven't already seen it, as it's really good fun. But while RC cars are not one of the segments, you really must watch the Airfix segment. James' love of Airfix models and the disinterest that kids have for building models these days, I think parallels very much the way RTR RC cars are replacing RC kits, and the way many of us feel.

In fact, I think you can watch the whole thing here on Youtube, as is often the case ...

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=3E...p;v=e433yczzEPU

On the bright side, I do still know of one shop that specialises in plastic models, and is still doing well. But their customers are mostly older collectors I guess.

Will kit building eventually make a comeback? Will the children of the world wake up and realize how pointless video games are, and how empty their lives are, for the lack of ever building a Tamiya or Airfix kit? Sometimes things do come back.

Or perhaps model construction is already bouncing back in some niche way I don't know about?

H.

[Champ85 609]

Do we think modelling/building, whether plastic or RC (or both), will eventually disappear completely?

With the way things are going, yes. It will take another 20 years to completely disappear, but it will be gone. Only scratch builders will be left.

Will it die off with our generation? Because if kids aren't growing up now enjoying the construction aspect, what will they pass on to their kids?

Advanced ADD? Seriously...

Will everything eventually be pre-made disposable toys? Will it get to the point where even Lego and Meccano sets come pre-made and glued together, setting a new low in can't-be-botheredness?

No, these types of toys will be like the old tin cars of yesteryear: No longer used, wished-for, and forgotten.

In this "me, me, me", "it's not my fault", "I want it NOW" society, building kits and toys will disappear.

Have you seen how Traxxas has totally exploded in popularity with their RTRs over the past 5 years? They used to be a so-so brand with unexciting (at least to me) products. Now they have lots of very interesting and good quality cars and trucks all ready to go. Why would a kid spend time building when they can get it all ready to go? Building.... what a waste of time! Gimme my truck so I can race!

It used to be that a RTR meant a Radio Shack or Nikko type of vehicle. You *had* to build from a kit to get the speed and control you wanted. Now RTRs are so advanced that a kit is only there to appease the few that actually want to build it themselves.

No more Legos (Expert Builder series was my favorite), Rivetron, Erector Sets, Tinkertoys, Lincoln Logs, Loc-Blocs, Girder and Panel Sets, Capsela..... all of these I grew up with and loved. So many hours spent building, trying, testing, playing, designing.

Now only fleeting moments are spent by kids with these toys. Too much time spent on the phone and texting and XBox and Facebook to play with toys anyway.

Do I sound bitter? Yeah, a little. I finally have the luxury of being able to afford to buy kits as I like but the choices are becoming fewer and far between. How I wish it was 1985 again in terms of R/C kits.

Tamiya's re-re's are really catching my interest. I am so happy I can finally get some of the kits I always wanted as a kid.

[jkyamog 18]

Hopefully it would not die. I think its up to us as parents to pass it on. I am a modeler when I was a kid, couldn't afford the Tamiya RC cars as I bought my models from the hobby shop back then. Its only recently I got them as I also wanted my son to gain some skills. I picked RC cars lately as it was something that me and my son can do together and he would learn mechanical and electrical stuff. Also he has always had an RC car since he was 3. Here he is doing something everybody is familiar w/

To be honest its hard to keep him in the hobby. As none of his friends are interested in it for the following reasons:

- after the parents find out how much the RC cars cost, they loose interest

- kids are not into building

- kids don't want to maintain and/or study the cars

- there are other forms of entertainment and sometimes cheaper like gaming consoles

So most of the time we are at the park, some kids coming to us... however that is pretty much it. It seems 1/10 electric is not alive in our area, only hardcore 1/8 nitro which we have to travel far. So you have a few people w/ big budget that started long ago, there is little way for people w/ limited budget to come in.

For me I am very happy to enjoy something I always have loved to do, and a son who loves to do it. Winter time is coming so hopefully next summer he would still be interested. In the mean time we might be racing inside the house w/ hotshot and buggy champ q-steer

[Champ85 609]

And another thing...

Back when we were kids there was no such thing as the internet.

The IBM PC was brand new and the best computer games and graphics were on Atari, Commodore64 and Amiga computers.

The best console video games were the Atari 2600 and Colecovision. My parents never got me one, so I had to find other stuff to do. I did have a Fairchild system and finally got an Atari 5200.

Cell phones were rare and only installed in cars.

The biggest TVs were 32 inches and they cost a fortune.

In short... entertainment was what we could find... and R/C car building and racing was a great (though expensive!) thing to do.

Today, kids have so much more "stuff" that is vying for their time and attention. R/C cars is just not as popular and building a kit even less so.

[TamiyaDan 8]

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[spaint2k 0]

I think that within the 'hobby of actually "building stuff"' there are many, many different elements. RC cars are just one part of the hobby, and to be honest has always been a fairly expensive part of the hobby, so perhaps it's not really representative of the rest of the model world.

As an alternative example, take Warhammer miniatures. While the building aspect of RC seems to have decreased over the years, the building aspect of wargame miniatures seems to have increased. Warhammer miniatures for example. There was a time when wargame miniatures were only available in metal, each model with a single pose (not quite RTR, but certainly not very customizable without razor saws, pinning, epoxy putty, and no small amount of skill). Nowadays, the trend is increasingly toward multi-part plastic kits that offer a wealth of modeling and customization possibilities. Furthermore, the wargaming hobby seems to be going from strength to strength and so while companies like Airfix have seen better days at least it can be said that kids today are still building and painting plastic models.

In the end, the most important part is not whether or not people are playing with RTR kits or scratch-built models made from pieces, but rather that the hobby as a whole will continue. RTR kits have value in bringing new blood into the hobby. They are priced low and being ready-to-run means that a lot of the barriers to entry into RC are done away with at one stroke. There's no need to worry about receiver, controller, servos, ESC, etc... And at least some of the people who buy an RTR vehicle will realize that they could have even more fun if they learned a little about how to repair, tweak and modify their model, so there'll always be a market for hop-ups, spare parts and full kits.

Ironically, with RC I prefer the kind of models that require assembly and an understanding of the kit, while with Warhammer I'd much prefer a return to the old days when many different single-pose metal models could be bought with ease as I really don't enjoy the hassle of cleaning and assembling multi-part plastics and I'd rather get on with the painting and playing. But for me, I'm just happy to know that both of these hobbies are still being enjoyed in one form or another, and I can leave and return to them whenever I like.

[TongueTied 56]

Not where I am, it seems as society develops, more and more people are getting into doing things themselves. Talking to some LHS here they are finding that the pre built and ready to go segments of the market are really building on top of the kit markets. The financial crisis has hit everyone but generally, the whole industry is growing. The kit industry may not be growing as fast but it is still growing (according to the LHSs I have asked about this).

[DCLXVI 3]

When I go into toy stores to look for toys for my sons (especially my 2.5 year old) I see alot of toys are are self-playing, like for instance Flexi-Tracks, at first I thought the idea was brilliant but then I realised that if you don't have loads of track and two IR-cars, the entire point of the toy is to build the track and then the car goes around and around... I saw a "simmilar" toy that was even worse at a 3 year birthday party for one of my sons kindergarden pals, it's a Cars (Pixar) figure 8 track in hard plastic that is foldable and has two places where rubber wheels accelerate the car and a small ramp where you drop the car in...so you just drop it in and the little toy (quite simmilar to a MatchBox or Hot Wheels, alittle wider) car will go around and around until the batteries are dead...sounds like fun?

[Tamiya1/10 382]

We are in a period where we all don't have enough time of day. Look at all the time saving devise we now have, even the computers are 100 times faster than a few years back and we still say is not fast enough. With limited time we all want instant gratification or do things quick and easy from making money to loosing weight or quit smoking. We just don't accept putting the time and effort in, everything has to be quick and easly if possible. Depending on your age group, one still appreciate careful cutting, painting and assembling, but most of us are multi, multi tasking and just don't have the time or patience to put the stuff together. I am still amaze how people could work without computer, email, cell phones, photo copiers before. Just think only slightly over 20 years ago type writer, carbon paper, fax if you are luck (tel-lax)... spread sheet, autocad, word processor, photoshop to help you at work, what are they??

[WillyChang 1814]

Perhaps toy building is another antiquated skill isn't necessary anymore for life in tomorrow's digital age?

Once upon a time you'd have needed to be able to hunt & skin a wild animals if you wanted to eat meat,

not that long ago you'd need to know how to knit & dye if you wanted coloured socks ("History's Worst Jobs").

Besides these days, if a kid spent too many hours playing by himself in a corner... they'd label him socially deficient

& try test him for autism which he'd pass (fail?) for some autistic flavour - if not they'll just invent a new category.

Then they'll put him on some prescription medication that our international phamaceutical behemoths need to sell

so they can get their forecasted ROI on their drug research for the 25yrs or so they have a valid patent for.

Is cynicism electronically transmittable?

[loaded 4]

If it is, then we are all screwed, 'cause you have a raging clap of cynicism running through you today

Paul.

[NJhopper 0]

I just turned 19 and I still build all of my kits. RTR is no fun!!!!!! Hopefully my kids will feel the same way.

[Kokuzu 5]

I think it depends on what you choose or prefer to be. A consumer or more the builder type of person.

And it is about passion, patience and the little maniac in all of us.

Yes, consume and having fun have become rather easy these days.

RTR, out of the box, drive ready, pre-built etc...

I appreciate the reasoning behind it - companies looking for additional market share selling pre-built kits to those who prefer driving over building or simply do not have the skills or patience to built a kit.

In a way we builders even benefit from it - parts are being produced in larger volumes and this may keep the spare part price under more control...

Looking at my childhood days 20+ years ago, we learned to be patient about a lot of stuff. In order to purchase something, we had to save the money for it over a little while. We could not enter the store next door and afford to buy a bicycle just like that. And if so, most of the times, the stuff we needed did not exist so we had to buy the components and start assembling.

Times have changed since then. While I was happy about a pair of socks and some chocolate eggs these days around Eastern (and i am still today), today's kids (my wife is a teacher) get I-phones, I-pads and bicycles...

The young generation is growing up in a world largely driven by consumption, fashion, trends and brand awareness.

To be cool, you have to wear cool stuff. and you better hurry up to buy it now because next month these trousers will be already uncool and out of fashion.

Most known example are computers, but we find this everywhere - car manufacturers release model upgrades every second year whilst 20 years ago, one new model was released every 5 years.

Personally I always enjoyed to customize and to modify - even to built toys on my own. To be honest, when the car is finished and ready to go I lose interest. It is the building itself which satisfy my. it's the challenge forming in my head creating an image of how it should look like, it's is the patience not to rush to the end but to take the time to finish every detail to an acceptable quality level. It is my desire to make my models perform reliable but with a unique touch.

and sometimes it is the challenge to make it on my own rather than to go around the corner and to buy it there or in the web-shop.

I think builders will not die but it will get harder to find people with the skills and patience and time(!) required. Luckily I learned a lot on metal machining watching my dad... With most children aiming at high school and university - they will not be in a situation which requires them to cut threats, weld metal or fill and paint bodies?

[WillyChang 1814]

on a different tangent... have always wondered abotu the economics of kit vs RTR

must cost plenty extra to do a kit (labour to design manuals, pack & QC separate components, etc)

vs selling a factory-built RTR with minimal user manual, all built & tested before L'iL Johnny unboxes it

Let's face it, our Tamiya RCs aren't really good value when compared to other RTR-only offerings.

RTR Traxxas Slash, HPI Blitz, Kyosho Ultima SC or Losi Strike for under US$200?!

Slash 4X4 RTR with brushless and 2.4GHz for US$400? (heck they even give ya battery & charger!)

Losi Ten-T nitro with onboard electric start activated by a button on your TX?! under US$500

I don't mind building kits, but don't like "paying extra" to get to do the work.

Any RTR can still be hopped up to personalise it.

[WillyChang 1814]

If it is, then we are all screwed, 'cause you have a raging clap of cynicism running through you today

been a long loooong week, where even sniffing PS paint over Easter ain't helping perk things up

might need to go try some of that czech Pear brandy

[loaded 4]

I can't ship that, it has 67%, it is very flammable

Paul.

[lucasan 28]

on a different tangent... have always wondered abotu the economics of kit vs RTR

must cost plenty extra to do a kit (labour to design manuals, pack & QC separate components, etc)

vs selling a factory-built RTR with minimal user manual, all built & tested before L'iL Johnny unboxes it

Let's face it, our Tamiya RCs aren't really good value when compared to other RTR-only offerings.

RTR Traxxas Slash, HPI Blitz, Kyosho Ultima SC or Losi Strike for under US$200?!

Slash 4X4 RTR with brushless and 2.4GHz for US$400? (heck they even give ya battery & charger!)

Losi Ten-T nitro with onboard electric start activated by a button on your TX?! under US$500

I don't mind building kits, but don't like "paying extra" to get to do the work.

Any RTR can still be hopped up to personalise it.

But I think you hit the nail on the head. What we're paying for are the stringent controls in the factory. I guess it's also a matter of, they can set up an assembly line for the building of the cars pretty easily and push loads through every day. I'm willing to pay extra for building my kits if that's it takes to ensure it's built exactly how I want it. I would hate to see this aspect of the hobby die out.

[loaded 4]

That is just it though, unfortunately. Every built car I have ever used, I have taken apart to the gearbox to ballrace and set up properly. Same with some of the bodies, the Mazda 787B, it was lazily put together and needed 30 minutes of careful re trimming decals etc to get it looking right.

I don't really like ready built cars that are also available as kits, they often have lousy dampers as well!

Paul.

[Snakehands 124]

Building models won't ever die out. Basically, kids love to make things, then, a few decades later, they like to make things with their own kids. And so it will go on until the sun burns out.

[Shodog 1835]

Building models won't ever die out. Basically, kids love to make things, then, a few decades later, they like to make things with their own kids. And so it will go on until the sun burns out.

My son doesn't totally share my same enthusiam for building rc cars but he does like to cut up his nerf guns and build different combinations of them.

[Saito 5]

To be honest, the road today's kids are going down (for the most part) terrifies me. The most important thing we as parents can do is to at least expose our children to the world of hands on building and fixing things. I'm born out of my time for sure. I'm not that proficient with a computer. I don't give a **** about Ipods IPhones or I-whatevers. I work with my hands. Its what I've always done. Young adults today could run rings around me with technology, but if they have a broken lamp, leaky pipe or simply need to change a tire...well they're lost. Nobody tears into things anymore to see how they work.

A word about gratification. Kids seem to want it immediately as others have stated. Sadly its very hollow gratification, where as model construction is of the lasting type. There is a good bit of pride in it too when all is said and done. As adults people do jobs that aren't concrete anymore. There is no direct outcome or tangable object to their day to day toiling. Did you know that in the states there are "camps" men sign up for to get together with other men to learn what it means to BE a man? What the badword is that? I never have any question as to what that means. These men lack purpose in their lives. As a mechanic, I see the results of my work everyday. Something comes in broken and leaves fixed. I never question my purpose as I always see my accomplishments firsthand. Model building is like that. What does a child really accomplish when they beat a video game?

[Sayer 742]

Personally I always enjoyed to customize and to modify - even to built toys on my own. To be honest, when the car is finished and ready to go I lose interest. It is the building itself which satisfy my. it's the challenge forming in my head creating an image of how it should look like, it's is the patience not to rush to the end but to take the time to finish every detail to an acceptable quality level. It is my desire to make my models perform reliable but with a unique touch.

and sometimes it is the challenge to make it on my own rather than to go around the corner and to buy it there or in the web-shop.

This.

[Crash Cramer 617]

I think my wife will really need to read this post so she can understand me a little more. I get no more satisfaction in anything than to admire my day's or hour's work. In our rental, I don't like fixing broken things, but it sure beats waiting on the stupid landlord's goons to show up and scratch their behind and leer in her general direction and try to fix something. I can't wait to have our own house later this summer, but it won't be needing my time as we move in, just some thought in where everything goes. With some luck I will have more time for my hobby when we move as I will know where everything is and there won't be 20 other things begging for my attention every hour.

I BLAME TV, LOL, not really, but think of how many channels we grew up watching and how many are on these days. I had 5 channels available to me at age 8-17(BORN 1971), call my dad ANAL or cheap or whatever, but we didn't get cable in any house he bought. He does have a satellite dish now, but I was already gone from home when he moved into this house. If we didn't find anything on TV, we did something constructive indoors or out, depending on the weather.

I have built models out of plastic and wood and metal and legos and puzzles and had a Colecovision and Atari 2600 and an Apple IIe along with a TI 99. All seemed fun for a while, but I still liked the mechanical wonders of an RC car and making it work by my command. I guess I like being in command. Perhaps we need to instill that in the young generation, THEY NEED TO BE IN COMMAND of what their age and responsibility levels can tolerate. Want to know what I was in command of then, and somewhat now??? Getting the trash out so it didn't stink up the house and earn me a tanned hide, picking up after the family dogs so the mess wasn't stinking up the house, cleaning my room so it wasn't stinking up the house, is there a trend going on here??? LOL

I think all folks need a level of responsibility given to them so they can learn what they are capable of. IF you know what you can do, then you can try things you didn't know you could do. Thanks for posting that You Tube bit, another wasted hour as I never can leave that site after the first clip. LOL I will have to watch the rest of that man's series of shows. I love shows like that, watch Factory Made, How it is Made, MythBusters, several DIY shows on the House channel, C.S.I.(they build models sometimes), OverHaulin.

I don't think I am too out there on my interests and hobbies, I just spoke with a 20 something at work, he is getting excited about his first car purchase, a 2002 Lexus IS300!!!!!!!! I am blown away, my first car was a run down Chevy Nova, but he is excited because he will actually work on this car himself. I don't think he will totally RICE it out, but time will tell, but the fact that he is going to be working on it and has and interest in it is good to know. Some folks around this little suburb I live and work in are very much the ENTITLEMENT clan. I want everything handed me on a silver platter and will gripe if it isn't done that way. I was thinking, there is some hope in these folks, we just need to give them a little credit at times.

Kit building, guess it really boils down to how big the kit or RTR is, as a real car is just as much a project as an RC, maybe it will spark the interest the other way around as it is less greasy and sweaty working on a 1/10 size versus the real thing.

[Origineelreclamebord 45]

Well, people are lazy, that's for sure But building stuff, die out? Not as long as I'm still around!!! If there will be no unbuilt (RC) Car left in the world I'll just disassemble it - By the time that is necessary, I'm probably at the age and in a state of mind where I can't seem to keep a lot of memories... And well, you could also build one yourself? I won't say always, but let's say for a couple thousand more years there will be enough to either exploir from mother earth or recycle than we can build something from

[SteelRat 46]

I think the aftermarket parts industry will help keep the kit building aspect of RC alive. Is it not fair to assume that even if the majority of joe public that buy an RTR car just run that, break it, get bored of it shelf it / ebay it, there will still be some that want to hop up their car? For that you need to take bits off, or change bits. From there someone might think "hey this is cool, I wonder if I could build the whole car from a kit", and then maybe later on someone sufficiently inclined might then go on to scratch builds.

As far as I know Tamiya, Axial and HPI are probably the foremost manufacturers of RC car kits, and they seem to be doing alright