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Avante Using A Brushless Motor?

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As we are getting a re-re Avante in feb I have been thinking what engine to put in her and I’m thinking of going brushless but I’m a little lost on these

Am I right in thinking that an 8 turn brushless is the equivalent of a 14 turn brushed?

Also the running gear on the Avante. What is the max number of turns that it will take without tearing itself apart?

Is anyone on here running an Avante on a brushless motor? Please tell us what you think

Thanks

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I think it`s the other way around. A brushless motor is equal to a lower wind brushed motor because it is more efficient.

Brushless motors are more reliable as they have no brushes to wear out (obviously!). I think with most you can adjust the torque and/or rpm they deliver through their ESC - you don`t have to use all the power if it is too much for the chassis.

If I was buying a new motor and money was not an issue I would go for a brushless ESC/motor combo everytime. Sadly money is always an issue.

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As we are getting a re-re Avante in feb I have been thinking what engine to put in her and I’m thinking of going brushless but I’m a little lost on these

Am I right in thinking that an 8 turn brushless is the equivalent of a 14 turn brushed?

Also the running gear on the Avante. What is the max number of turns that it will take without tearing itself apart?

Is anyone on here running an Avante on a brushless motor? Please tell us what you think

Thanks

I would imagine that the re-re Avante will be engineered for modern components.. I have been club racing a DB-01 using a Novak 6.5T Ballistic motor for a while now and I am willing to bet that the re-re Avante could run the same motor with correct gearing.. I can't see any need to exceed a 6.5T for brushless motors, especially for bashing purposes.. It will be extremely fast even with a higher turn brushless..

I would probably start with a 13.5T brushless (similar to a 19T-27T Brushed depending on the manufacturer) and move up from there for the Avante.. Your other choices would be a 10.5T, 8.5T and 6.5T. The 6.5T is basically the same as a 13T Brushed, but you can't always relate a Brushless motors to a Brushed equivalent. Brushless motors have a higher torque curve than Brushed and their performance varies between the quality of engineering and design.. A cheaper quality Brushless motor can perform 20-30% worse than a higher quality motor with the same number of turns..

Hope this helps.

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The main problem facing the Avante would be it's lack of a slipper clutch. Even though it doesn't have ball diffs, it is still easy to destroy those 0.6mod alloy pinions. A steel upgrade pinion from robison racing would be best, but again you still put a lot of shock on the center diff and plastic gears. As for the comment on the car being engineered for modern motors, I seriously doubt they are going to change anything inside the gearboxes. It would be ideal to shim the individual gears to keep them from riding against the gearbox case provided there is clearance to add some. Some of the gears ride on 2mm shafts, while others are 3 and 5. That means you need to source a lot of shim sets.

In the drivetrains defense, I've run my Vanquish for 20 years now and I've never had a gearbox problem. I've even raced it on tarmac with a steel 18T pinion, Traxxas Anaconda tires, a super stock TZ and lipo.

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it is possible to go very fast with a brushed motor too.

it'll probably go pretty well with the motor that comes with it!

you'll get a good balance of run time / speed.

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Im all about running a brushless BUT remember it wont fit! Some filing of the upper deck will be needed to make a brushless fit.

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It looks to me like filing out the top plate to fit in a brushless motor will weaken the mount for the control arm significantly.

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It looks to me like filing out the top plate to fit in a brushless motor will weaken the mount for the control arm significantly.

Agreed, BUT that carbon looks thick and very strong, Ive got a few original upper decks, I might experiment with those. I dont think Ill be filing away on expensive graphite.

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Agreed, BUT that carbon looks thick and very strong, Ive got a few original upper decks, I might experiment with those. I dont think Ill be filing away on expensive graphite.

So who thinks we'd get an 2001 or Egress? Less aloy should equal less price. And now with the Avante out all the peices are available. Itll take a second to reprogram the Cad-Cam to make a Egress chassis, and the Egress/Vanquish Suspensions arms are plastic (molds are cheap).

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Just let's wait for the new Avante. We don't know what newer materials are used. The fragile materials from 25yrs ago are improved over the years by Tamiya. Remember they have a few World titles won.

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I have the new Avante 2011 - and would like to fit a Tamiya Brushless motor (10.5 or 15.5). Is there enough space for such a motor?

 

i do not want to modify the carbon body...

I have seen pictures of people fitting different brushless motors into the chassis - without modifications - but not sure about the Tamyia motors

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4 hours ago, Robert5000 said:

As long as it's a 540 size motor any brushless will fit. 

Sure? The top deck assumes the barrel of the motor is tapered - with a straight barrel the control arm mount looks like it will foul the motor.

 

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4 minutes ago, Howards said:

Sure? The top deck assumes the barrel of the motor is tapered - with a straight barrel the control arm mount looks like it will foul the motor.

 

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That's a good question, and my answer would have to be: yes? I simply plopped in another motor and it worked perfectly, but that might've been dumb luck more than anything else. 

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Same problem with our vanquish, even fitting some brushed motors caused us issues so we had to chop away part of the top deck otherwise it was impossible to get motors in or out which then weakens the rear trailing arm location area in the tub as there is no top plate to cross brace it. I much prefer Avante2001 and Egress as there is stacks of room around the motor. Converted all my Avantes to Avante2001 & Egress now. Far superior in all respects other than maybe looks.

If I had my way I'd convert the Vanquish to Egress too but sadly youngest daughter loves it the way it is :)

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34 minutes ago, Robert5000 said:

That's a good question, and my answer would have to be: yes? I simply plopped in another motor and it worked perfectly, but that might've been dumb luck more than anything else. 

Maybe with smaller pinions and hot motors (!) it's less of an issue as the motor is positioned further inboard. 

If I had mine with me at the moment I might try to drop a Tamiya brushless in it and see if it fits. 

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1 hour ago, Chris78AvanteNew said:

One more question: do you think the fan would fit on the standard ESC? Or too tight under the Cover?

I have a fan on my hobbywing esc under my avante and it is fine. It may be a problem if you use the driver. 

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3 hours ago, Chris78AvanteNew said:

One more question: do you think the fan would fit on the standard ESC? Or too tight under the Cover?

I asked a similar question a while back but didn't find a definitive answer. My plan is to use the new TBLE-04SR (41.5mm x 33.4mm x 27mm with fan) rather than the TBLE-02S (42mmx34mmx25mm without fan) as the former should run the Tamiya Brushless Motor 10.5T (54611) without overheating whilst only consuming the same amount of space. There is plenty of evidence of the TBLE-02S fitting without modifying the driver figure so I expect the TBLE-04SR to do so too. That said, I don't have one yet and still don't know if the Tamiya 10.5T fits without modifying the top-deck. If anyone knows, or can check, I'd be really interested to find out.

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23 hours ago, Robert5000 said:

As long as it's a 540 size motor any brushless will fit. 

I would advise against using a Tamiya TBLM-02S if that is the motor you are looking at. I have just built an Avante 2011 and am using the 10.5t motor and have found the suspension arm rubs on the can using the kit 22t pinion. It may just clear on a smaller pinion but I don't think the ratio would be ideal.

Also as the motor wires and sensor cable are rear connecting which makes it is an absolute pain in this chassis, I had to grind the top deck slightly to make it fit.

Having said that the performance on 2S was perfect and the car seemed to handle it well. I am about to swap it out with a 13.5t hobbywing with motor wire tabs on the top which will allow to me route the wires in a neater fashion.

Also no issues at all fitting the fan under the body even with the driver.

Avante 1.jpg

Avante 2.jpg

Avante 3.jpg

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1 hour ago, Prospek said:

I would advise against using a Tamiya TBLM-02S if that is the motor you are looking at. I have just built an Avante 2011 and am using the 10.5t motor and have found the suspension arm rubs on the can using the kit 22t pinion. It may just clear on a smaller pinion but I don't think the ratio would be ideal.

Also as the motor wires and sensor cable are rear connecting which makes it is an absolute pain in this chassis, I had to grind the top deck slightly to make it fit.

Having said that the performance on 2S was perfect and the car seemed to handle it well. I am about to swap it out with a 13.5t hobbywing with motor wire tabs on the top which will allow to me route the wires in a neater fashion.

Also no issues at all fitting the fan under the body even with the driver.

Thank you @Prospek, that is exactly what I've been looking for.

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