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3rd Party Hop Up Parts

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I'm just wondering what experience people have had with parts from 3racing, yeah racing (not always good from what I've read) and GPM, or any others I don't know about.

Do they fit well? Do they work well? Or are they fitted just because they're blue ally?

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I've used parts from GPM, 3Racing and Yeah Racing without problems. GPM seem to have the best reputation for quality out of the three, though the colour of their anodising varies. The parts I've bought have been mainly for CC01 and TA01/02 chassis and everything has fitted fine. None of them seem to have a great reputation for their dampers. The ones I have are ok, but don't expect TRF quality, y'know?

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i've used them all for various things.

i like yeah racing shocks over the other two. the rest of the stuff is just fancy looking.

the yeah racing ta01/df01 prop shaft is holding up well.

i have a dt02 with all the 3racing alloy bits, the shocks are awfull.

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Any body have any experience with the better aftermarket parts from companies like Square, Kose, Tech Racing, Pengiun R/C etc.

Antony

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All are good. Tamiya don't seem to have any trouble using Tech Racing parts, the TRF415 was a rebadged MY02 and a lot of Tamiyas alloy parts come from Tech.

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Any body have any experience with the better aftermarket parts from companies like Square, Kose, Tech Racing, Pengiun R/C etc.

Antony

I haven't yet thoroughly tested my Square parts for running, but the finish of the parts alone tells quite a story: Built to be scaringly light, attention for detail in design, and then also put into practice, and a very accurate matching blue anodizing.

I also had a set of front universals for the TA01 by Kose (K0810) once, these seemed alright apart from the fact that I clearly needed a ring and shimming to reduce play: It was easily more than one millimeter, which made the unit rather sloppy (I have to admit though I used them in another car but with the right uprights and bearings - where they otherwise fitted beautifully). Adding a single ring was enough to solve the issue though, and the play was present in a ' healthy', small amount. Again I didn't really test these for strength as I don't run my cars that hard (and this car was run just once before being sold).

I've so far stayed away from Yeah Racing and 3Racing aluminum parts,except ones for the GB01 dampers (I think I bought 3Racing ones). The finish is not really neat, the design not really balanced, and they feel rather fragile (but that may also be because they're not 1/10th scale dampers).

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Thanks for the responses, I'm not considering getting anything for my DB01 until something breaks, then I'll probably replace with ally parts so it's good to know they fit well enough, I was wary of the cheap ally dampers from other posts I've seen, so will stick with the plastic ones until they wear out or break.

Depending on how long things last I may even replace like for like, but I usually consider breaking something an opportunity (read excuse) to upgrade.

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i'm using yeah racing 1/8 buggy shocks on my clod and they are fantastic, much smoother then the 3racing, even though the 3racing look like they would be better.

at a recent monster truck race guys were amazed at the yeah shocks. not bad for 9.90 per pair with free shipping from our good friend dinball.

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There are some weaknesses to the stock DB-01 which can all be fixed with hop-ups. I've been club racing one for years now and love the car.. If you do decide to replace something, stick with the Tamiya brand hop-ups. They are more expensive than any of the aftermarket parts, but they are totally worth it due to their high quality.

Thanks for the responses, I'm not considering getting anything for my DB01 until something breaks, then I'll probably replace with ally parts so it's good to know they fit well enough, I was wary of the cheap ally dampers from other posts I've seen, so will stick with the plastic ones until they wear out or break.

Depending on how long things last I may even replace like for like, but I usually consider breaking something an opportunity (read excuse) to upgrade.

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There are some weaknesses to the stock DB-01 which can all be fixed with hop-ups. I've been club racing one for years now and love the car.. If you do decide to replace something, stick with the Tamiya brand hop-ups. They are more expensive than any of the aftermarket parts, but they are totally worth it due to their high quality.

Could you elaborate on what the main weaknesses are? I'm only bashing with mine at the moment, it's completely stock with a silver can motor, but it would be good to know what to look out for.

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Could you elaborate on what the main weaknesses are? I'm only bashing with mine at the moment, it's completely stock with a silver can motor, but it would be good to know what to look out for.

The front camber blocks can be a weak point along with the rear uprights. The stock ball diffs can be problematic if the screw is overtightened or too loose, and the stock plastic shocks will always be weaker than the aluminum TRF shocks. Don't get me wrong though, this car is super durable out of the box and parts are very hard to break short of having a head-on collision at top speed. The DB-01 is going to be ultra tough as a silver can basher due to the slower speed.. It's when you upgrade to higher speed brushless motors and lipo batteries that you will want to start adding a few hop-ups to toughen the car - mostly a slipper clutch (single or double), front and rear CVD's and more durable diff parts like the 501X outdrives and ceramic balls etc..

I went crazy with hop-ups once I started racing, learned a lot about perfecting set-ups and made the car good enough to go head to head with the best 4WD cars in MOD Class. I spent a lot of money to do it (probably too much), so it really comes down to how far you want to go.

The good news is I have experience with nearly every hop-up made for the DB-01. So I can give you very honest info about what is good, whats not so good, and what is not really necessary.

Since you are bashing, the first recommendation I can make is to check out the T-Bone Bumpers made for the DB-01: http://t-bone-racing.net/Durga-DB01-c168/

These are much more robust bumpers which will greatly improve the protection of your car. They are not ideal for track racing, but are excellent for bashing.

Hope this helps.

Dan

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Thanks for the link to the bumpers, I'll be ordering a front one as it does feel a bit exposed at the moment. Although the whole car does seem pretty solid and I'm really pleased with it. I'll take you up on your offer for advice when I feel the need to upgrade or I break something <_<

I could use a bit more speed maybe, but I'm happy enough with it for now and as you point out lower speed means I'm less likely to break it, a dirt tuned motor is starting to look attractive though. The handling is superb, very predictable, so I'm not surprised the car does well racing. It loves the mixture of mud/tarmac/gravel down the lane. Tends to eat battery packs in the sticky mud of the forest trails, different tyres would probably help there though as the tread on the standard tyres gets clogged very quickly. I have the Baldre body which does a good job of keeping everything inside it clean and dry even when it's completely plastered with mud outside.

There is a club which does electric off-road racing down the road from me, so I might take a trip down there when they start up again in the summer, but for now I'm happy enough just bashing about with my son and his rising fighter.

I've not had an RC car for many years, they've come a long way...

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The good news is I have experience with nearly every hop-up made for the DB-01. So I can give you very honest info about what is good, whats not so good, and what is not really necessary.

Since you are bashing, the first recommendation I can make is to check out the T-Bone Bumpers made for the DB-01: http://t-bone-racing.net/Durga-DB01-c168/

Dan

Dan is a bottomless pit of DB01 knowledge.. I will second that one! Always responsive to PMs too if needed.

Just in relation to the general direction of this thread, I also have the bumpers, leave the back one off it pushes the dork factor a little too far ;) Just a little other tid-bit, the TRF Aerated shocks are simply amazing compared to the stockers, even for a backyard basher. If you throw in a 5.5T brushelss motor, it is almost violent fast.

Enjoy!

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I'm just wondering what experience people have had with parts from 3racing, yeah racing (not always good from what I've read) and GPM, or any others I don't know about.

Do they fit well? Do they work well? Or are they fitted just because they're blue ally?

Any body have any experience with the better aftermarket parts from companies like Square, Kose, Tech Racing, Pengiun R/C etc.

Antony

Way back in the day GPM parts used to have wildly variable tolerances so your mileage varied. Some time ago they changed/updated their moulds and for a period (perhaps still?) had updated packaging with "new" somewhere on it. From then their parts have been great in my opinion. Tech Racing make some excellent parts, many are very short production runs and end up being quite sought after.

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Dan is a bottomless pit of DB01 knowledge.. I will second that one! Always responsive to PMs too if needed.

Just in relation to the general direction of this thread, I also have the bumpers, leave the back one off it pushes the dork factor a little too far ;) Just a little other tid-bit, the TRF Aerated shocks are simply amazing compared to the stockers, even for a backyard basher. If you throw in a 5.5T brushelss motor, it is almost violent fast.

Enjoy!

I only ordered a front bumper - my reasoning is that I only usually go forward fast - unless I'm doing J turns :D

What else would need to be upgraded with that hot a motor? I'm thinking at least:

  • slipper clutch (single or double?)
  • NiMH ->LiPo
  • diff balls
  • ???
  • whatever I break when I hit something

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If you plan to run something as fast as a 6.5T or 5.5T brushless then I would recommend:

Slipper clutch for sure. I have run both the single and the double.. I much prefer the double, but it is a bit more expensive.. Mainly the double will give you quicker traction and control after landing a jump.. Both slipper clutches are great and absolutely necessary to protect your drive train when a high speed motor is installed.

Lipo for sure.. NiMH cannot discharge at the rates that modern Lipo's can, so you don't get the full benefit of the motors potential without a Lipo.. Lipo's also outlast the life of a NiMH, they never have any memory issues, can be charged quicker than NiMH and don't require any cooldown/discharge time before a recharge.. I've been running the same Lipo for over two years and it still performs like it is brand new :P

Ceramic diff balls (and thrust bearings) are the best choice for a few reasons: 1 - they cannot flatten or warp under pressure of the diff, so your diff will remain smooth and require very little maintenance. 2 - Ceramic balls do not absorb heat under friction, so your diff parts will wear much more slowly by using ceramic balls. The ceramic nitride hardly wears down compared to steel or carbide metal balls, you will likely never need to replace them..

JeepNMike said it all with the TRF Shocks. They are smoother than smooth and by far one of the best hop-ups you can add to the DB-01 to improve suspension.. If you go with the TRF Shocks, its usually best to get the Atomic Carbon shock towers (http://www.nortechracing.com/ac/cfp.html) to take advantage of the additional suspension travel they offer.. You can also use the Team Associated shock springs if you require a little more tension than the Tamiya springs can provide..

Your front arms become more of a target in a high speed collision, so its best to carry a few spares.. Make sure to get some additional front hinge pins since these can tend to bend if a front arm breaks loose.

Upgrade your drive shafts and axles to the Standard CVD's or Wide Operating CVD's. They will provide quicker and smoother acceleration response and will also prevent the loss of a drive shaft if a front or rear arm should break.

Change out the Tamiya kit tires (medium compound) for something more suited to your driving surface.. Let me know what you drive on and I can make some suggestions..

----

If you really want to shoot the works then you can trade out your chassis for the High Traction chassis used with the DB-01R.. It is much more suited for Lipo's and allows you to install the under-chassis Heat Sink plate.. Add in the Tamiya Hop-Up motor mount and your motor temps will stay much cooler than with the stock motor mount..

Changing out all your bearings for high end sealed ceramic bearings can be an awesome upgrade as well, but the price can be sky high depending on the quality.. I did this and it was my most expensive upgrade by far..

I hope this helps.. Sorry if I got a little overboard with me response... I really enjoy optimizing car setups..

Dan

I only ordered a front bumper - my reasoning is that I only usually go forward fast - unless I'm doing J turns :)

What else would need to be upgraded with that hot a motor? I'm thinking at least:

  • slipper clutch (single or double?)
  • NiMH ->LiPo
  • diff balls
  • ???
  • whatever I break when I hit something

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A 13.5T Brushless is going to give you a bit more speed compared to the silver can motor (similar to running a 19T Brushed motor). From there your speed will increase in this order - 10.5T, 8.5T, 7.5T, 6.5T (what I run now) and 5.5T..

Running anything faster than a 5.5T on a 4WD becomes a little crazy.. The faster motors (4.5T and 3.5T) were designed purely for speed and typically lack enough torque for a 4WD on an off-road track.. Those motors are intended for on-road cars..

Dan

So without going for the insane 5.5T brushless, what would be a decent number of turns to give me a bit more speed?

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Thanks for all the advice. It's really helping.

I went for a bash down the lane today with my son and his rising fighter, it's considerably faster in a straight line and the battery seems to last forever. I realise this is because of the much simpler drive-train, I've ball-raced it too which will help loads, in fact the second time it was run the pinion came loose and it felt like there was nothing in the gearbox at all!

So, just how fast would a 6.5T (something like this) be compared to the silver can? And how long run-time could I expect a 5000 mAh LiPo battery to last?

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JeepNMike said it all with the TRF Shocks. They are smoother than smooth and by far one of the best hop-ups you can add to the DB-01 to improve suspension..Dan

Not to mention it can handle jumps from what seems like extreme more heights without bottoming out and feels "plush". Those shocks rock.. Expensive and seem to go together exactly as the stockers, but amazingly better so much that even an idiot can definitely feel.

To sort of reiterate what Dan said, something in the 13.5T range is a realistic motor for this buggy. I bought a 5.5T motor just to get a feel for what the difference is in speed and handling between a vintage buggy (Hotshot and Frog in my case) and an over-powered modern buggy. I realized that you can't really club race much with that much motor, but I wanted to spend the $ just to see how fast it can go. It really is borderline violent fast with that motor and the diffs and clutch snug - to the point of almost being dysfunctional. I fully plan to get a more mellow motor this summer for our new tracks in my area (assuming my wife and kids will let me escape).

If you are looking to 'wow' yourself with speed, consider getting an EZRun motor and ESC combo that way you can get a decent ESC and a stupid fast motor and not feel too guilty when you have to buy a slower motor if you ever want to hit a local track.

Mike

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The silver can motors are typically 21T Brushed motors.. The closest match to this in the Brushless world is a 17.5T (albeit the 17.5T will still outpace a 21T Brushed).. a 6.5T is horrendously fast compared to a 21T silver can - somewhere between 3 to 4 times faster depending on gearing, motor quality, battery quality and your ESC..

Proper gearing can be a big make-it or break-it in a brushless setup - and its one of the things I have noticed that several racers on the track overlook.. Undergearing and overgearing can both cause your motor to overheat.. Overheating = a drop in performance - and massive overheating can permanently degrade your motor.. With ideal gearing, you will be able to run a brushless setup non-stop without getting close to dangerous temps.. I studied this for a while to get it right and now I can run my Durga with a 6.5T, no chance of overheating and no loss of performance.. I can help target good gearing depending on the electrics you buy.. The easiest motors to target good gearing with is Novak (due to the technical information they provide).. Other good motor brands are Tekin, LRP and Team Orion to name a few.. At least here in the USA that is..

The EZRun/HobbyWing brushless kits seem to be really popular overseas.. I have not seen any one run these motors in California, so I don't know how they compare to our popular brands..

A 5000mah LiPo can give you about 30min of continuous driving [even aggressive driving].. I get around 20min of continuous driving with my 3800Mah Lipo on an off-road club track.. Cheaper Lipo's can underperform a bit, but are still far superior to a NiMH any day.

Thanks for all the advice. It's really helping.

I went for a bash down the lane today with my son and his rising fighter, it's considerably faster in a straight line and the battery seems to last forever. I realise this is because of the much simpler drive-train, I've ball-raced it too which will help loads, in fact the second time it was run the pinion came loose and it felt like there was nothing in the gearbox at all!

So, just how fast would a 6.5T (something like this) be compared to the silver can? And how long run-time could I expect a 5000 mAh LiPo battery to last?

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I've ordered a 13.5T ezrun kit and some lipos. I can't justify the cost of a more expensive motor at the moment and the ezrun comes in at around 1/3 the price of a Novak at 50 quid, which is why they're so popular I guess.

The kit comes with 2 pinions the larger is supposed to be for the dirt tuned motor, but I'm guessing that the 13.5T motor will be faster than that. How many teeth do you reckon would be best for the 13.5T (it's 2500kV)?

Ron

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Happy to help. I can help target good gearing for your EZ Run, but I cannot be sure how close I can get to 'great' gearing.. The problem with the EZ Run motors is that Hobbywing does not provide any gear ratio recommendations for their motors.. This is typical of most companies that likely contract out some of their engineering design and/or don't run detailed tests on their motor performance - basically they are not entirely sure what the ideal ratio's are..

I ran some numbers based more on the 2500kV of the motor as opposed to the turns.. The kV (RPM/Volt) rating was more accurate for gearing math..

Odds are, your ideal gearing is going to run between a 6:1 and 7:1 final drive ratio.. If you stick with the stock Spur gear in the DB-01 (91T) then your target pinion gears will range between 30T (aggressive gearing - more speed / less torque - hotter) and 27T (safer gearing - less speed / more torque - cooler).. It is tough to fit large pinion gears in the Durga without changing out the Spur gear.. Many people don't know that you can change the Spur gear in the Durga to any of the Associated Kimbough Spurs (http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/WTI0096p?&N=N&C=&P=7&S=0000000&F=LXWMG6&L=ASCC3994&S1=SPUR&S2=&S3=&S4=). Look at items LXEAK2 - LXEAK5 near the bottom of the webpage.. These spurs are 100% compatible with the DB-01, I have used two of them myself..

I will need to recalculate your gearing if you change spur gears, so let me know if you are interested..

If you decide to buy a separate pinion gear, make sure it is 48pitch.. That is the gear pitch used in the DB-01..

To test gearing.. Run you car for 5min (preferably off-road) and then measure the temp of your EZ Run motor.. It should stay below 160F with good gearing, if it runs hotter than this after 5min, then go down a tooth or two on your pinion gear and run the test again..

Hope this helps.

I've ordered a 13.5T ezrun kit and some lipos. I can't justify the cost of a more expensive motor at the moment and the ezrun comes in at around 1/3 the price of a Novak at 50 quid, which is why they're so popular I guess.

The kit comes with 2 pinions the larger is supposed to be for the dirt tuned motor, but I'm guessing that the 13.5T motor will be faster than that. How many teeth do you reckon would be best for the 13.5T (it's 2500kV)?

Ron

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Cheers, now I know what final drive to aim for I can sort out the combinations myself ;).

final drive = Ts * PR / Tp

where:
		 Ts = spur teeth
		 Tp = pinion teeth
		 PR = pulley ratio =~ 2.06 (37/18 diff pulley/centre pully)

I'm going to go for the less extreme. I'll get a 26T and a 27T pinion and see if they fit, that would give me around 7.19/6.92:1 final drive. If neither of them fit with the 91T spur, I'll get the 87T spur then I should have a choice of 6.87/6.62:1 respectively which is close enough.

I'm running at 11:1 at the moment so with, I reckon, around 30% higher revs and a significantly lower final drive ratio it should fly :D

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Well the 13.5T ezrun is in there with a 26T pinion and the kit 91T spur - it fits. I could probably just about get a 27T pinion on but I think that would be the largest with the 91T spur and it would be a real squeeze.

My LiPos haven't arrived yet so I did the five minute heat test with one of my 3800mAh NiMh packs. The motor stays cool, but the battery got pretty warm as did the tamiya plug (but not as warm as the battery) so I've ordered some TRX connectors off the bay ready for when the LiPos arrive.

Performance wise it's not ballistic but certainly a vast improvement over the silver can, I can tell when it uses the slipper clutch now too. With the silver can that was just an ornament. It gets some air over things which it used to just trundle over and the brakes work loads better, so I'm pretty happy :o. The performance suits the car better, although I can see it could handle a lot more than it's got now, just need to brush up on my driving skills before I put anything hotter in.

And I've still not got any hop-ups apart from the slipper clutch, but I'm sure I'll eventually get some TRF dampers, just need to wear the kit ones out some more first :P

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