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Help with Brushless setup for Hotshot!

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I just purchased a Hotshot re release kit and haven't put it together yet. I'm brand new to this hobby and know very little, but from what i've read brushless is the way to go. I would like a well rounded setup as I'll be using this car on-road and off-road, but on fairly flat terrain. I think that most novice like my self are a little intimidated with the whole brushless setup. Could someone explain to me what is meant by 9T,13T, ect....and the kv that is associated with these motors as well as the 13T,14T and 15T associated with pinion gears.I've been told that the EZrun 9T Brushless/4300kv +35A v2 ESC 3 in 1 combo is the way to go. I'm open to all suggestions,I just don't wont a setup that is going to rip my car apart the first time out as this is only for fun,I'm not racing it. Thanks guys I'm just needing a little guidance.Also does anyone know of any good R/C books for beginners.

Thanks!

Items purchased for Hotshot so far:

RC Channel multi-function metal suspension kit (TA95500)

RC Channel 85 mm shock set (OP95850)

Bearing Set

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I just purchased a Hotshot re release kit and haven't put it together yet. I'm brand new to this hobby and know very little, but from what i've read brushless is the way to go. I would like a well rounded setup as I'll be using this car on-road and off-road, but on fairly flat terrain. I think that most novice like my self are a little intimidated with the whole brushless setup. Could someone explain to me what is meant by 9T,13T, ect....and the kv that is associated with these motors as well as the 13T,14T and 15T associated with pinion gears.I've been told that the EZrun 9T Brushless/4300kv +35A v2 ESC 3 in 1 combo is the way to go. I'm open to all suggestions,I just don't wont a setup that is going to rip my car apart the first time out as this is only for fun,I'm not racing it. Thanks guys I'm just needing a little guidance.Also does anyone know of any good R/C books for beginners.

Thanks!

Items purchased for Hotshot so far:

RC Channel multi-function metal suspension kit (TA95500)

RC Channel 85 mm shock set (OP95850)

Bearing Set

The lowdown on brushless lingo...

T or turns - the way the motor is wound, refers to the number of turns in the stator. Useful for comparing motors of the same type - not all motors are of the same type though (more later)

KV - a measurement of the motors RPM per volt. NOT a measurement of power.

T or teeth - on gears, a smaller pinion gives more acceleration, less top end and is a bit easier on the motor (generally)

Other important lingo...

Sensored/sensorless - the way the ESC reads the motors position. Most if not all racing ESCs are sensored which gives better low-end feel. Sensorless ESCs have rougher throttle feel and can sometimes "cog" or even run backwards unexpectedly, but are generally fine for bashing.

540 - the standard size for a 1/10th RC car.

Now, the EZRun system you mention is very popular and very good value. Bear in mind that it is sensorless so won't have the nice low speed feel of the more expensive sensored systems. Another thing to bear in mind is that the 9T motor they supply with the EZRun is actually a small 380 size motor in a large case, so doesn't have as much power as the 540 size motors (which are referred to as an x.5 motor by Hobbywing).

Couldn't say whether this is a good balance of power for a Hotshot - others will have direct experience of upgrading the motor. My personal feeling is that the old Tamiya cars are well suited to the kit motor or maybe a Sport Tuned, and that much more power than that will start to rip the car apart. The Hotshot is 1985 technology - the fastest modified motors at the time were barely any quicker than a Sport Tuned is now!

Hope this helps.

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Ive got an ezrun and find it a very good system, fitted in my traxxas slash and its great (60amp, 8.5t) as for cogging, ive never suffered, but been looking at a setup that looks like an xerun system, so sensored with a 60amp esc and 8.5t motor, might be worth a look as there about the same price as the same spec ezrun, search for INIX Racing - 60A ESC with 8.5T Combo on ebay.

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What does the 32 dp mean that is associated with the pinion?I know it says gear pitch but what does the dp mean?

dp means diametric pitch. It's an SAE (imperial) measurement for the size of a tooth on a gear. Most Tamiya models use metric sized teeth on their gears. Metric is measured as a module (mod).

The Hotshot has a 0.8mod aluminium pinion in the kit. Sadly there is no one making 0.8mod metric pinions in steel. A 32dp pinion is so close to the same size teeth it is hard to measure the difference so they make a suitable replacement for 0.8mod.

I have Traxxas E-Maxx 32dp steel pinions replacing the kit 0.8mod aluminium pinions in all of my models that use this size. The steel pinion will last 100 times longer than the kit aluminium pinion, especially when the extra power of brushless is added to the equation.

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dp means diametric pitch. It's an SAE (imperial) measurement for the size of a tooth on a gear. Most Tamiya models use metric sized teeth on their gears. Metric is measured as a module (mod).

The Hotshot has a 0.8mod aluminium pinion in the kit. Sadly there is no one making 0.8mod metric pinions in steel. A 32dp pinion is so close to the same size teeth it is hard to measure the difference so they make a suitable replacement for 0.8mod.

I have Traxxas E-Maxx 32dp steel pinions replacing the kit 0.8mod aluminium pinions in all of my models that use this size. The steel pinion will last 100 times longer than the kit aluminium pinion, especially when the extra power of brushless is added to the equation.

I just ordered a couple from modelsport Thanks. So these are pretty much just a replacment for the hotshot kit supplied 13T pinion? Would it work on a brushed setup as well? Should right

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I went ahead and ordered the EZRUN 9T/4300kv + 35A Esc 3 in 1 kit. I also orderd a 13T/3000kv motor by it's self. The 13T motor should be able to work with the 35A ESC and program card from the 9T motor right seeing as though it looks like the same thing for both motors or is it specific? Also when I bought the hotshot kit I also bought a Futaba 2DR 2-channel AM/2 S3003 SERVOS A3 Kit. Will this work for now? I realize I should have bought a better one now, but I really cant afford to now! I will eventually upgrade when $ allows.

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I'm in a similar situation. I have built a super hotshot with the GT motor and ESC that came with the kit. I'm now considering taking it up a notch. Would this be too much? https://www.modelsport.co.uk/absima-brushless-combo-set-thrust-bl-eco-1-10/rc-car-products/404844

Or would a BZ 23T motor be a better option? Then again would an ESC upgrade be worthwhile? I'm using Nimh batteries at the moment. Is this brushless kit available with the right type of connector?

Many thanks.

 

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5 hours ago, Apollo11 said:

Then again would an ESC upgrade be worthwhile?

If I was going for a brushless esc, these are hard to beat.

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/index.php?product_id=425021

And then any of these motors, although I'd be tempted with the, speed passion 10.5t motor. Not too wild, and if you wanted a bit more go later, you can get a lower turn speed passion, and it'll just plug right in.

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/index.php?CategoryID=9920&SubCategoryID=992015&MSAttributeID[25]=576&&MSAttributeID[110]=1246

5 hours ago, Apollo11 said:

I'm using Nimh batteries at the moment. Is this brushless kit available with the right type of connector?

Modelsport do a soldering service , the price is listed on the ESC listing, they'll solder on the battery and the motor connections (if you're buying the S/Passion motor too).

If you're referring to the ,Tamiya plug (molex) ,then they struggle with anything over 5amps of power (if I remember right), I used to melt those things with a mild modified brushed motor bitd. 

So in terms of power handling, you'd be better changing the battery connections to a 60 amp plug, be it deans or XT60 (I prefer deans 🤷‍♂️) , you can get adapters as a short term fix, or until the tamiya plug melts.

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/etronix-male-tamiya-to-female-deans-adaptor/rc-car-products/39231

 

I'd give them a phone and get their take on it, and also see if the S/Passion motor comes with a sensor cable, if not, you'll need to order one too.

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8 hours ago, Apollo11 said:

I'm in a similar situation. I have built a super hotshot with the GT motor and ESC that came with the kit. I'm now considering taking it up a notch. Would this be too much? https://www.modelsport.co.uk/absima-brushless-combo-set-thrust-bl-eco-1-10/rc-car-products/404844

Or would a BZ 23T motor be a better option? Then again would an ESC upgrade be worthwhile? I'm using Nimh batteries at the moment. Is this brushless kit available with the right type of connector?

Many thanks.

 

Agree with everything @Wooders28 said above. The one thing I would add - i have a brushless system installed in my re re hotshot. Granted, it has the mono shock setup as opposed to the shocks at all 4 corners however, I rarely have the end point of my throttle set above about 60% as too much speed and power will be too much for these old chassis designs to handle. It won't break them (the gearboxes are very robust) but the handling becomes very, er vague 😁

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36 minutes ago, Silver-Can said:

the handling becomes very, er vague 😁

That's one way to put it!! 😂

Yeah, they weren't designed for brushless power, mechanically they're sound (as long as they're fully ballraced and running a steel pinion), but don't be expecting it to turn on a dime at full speed!! 😳

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On 10/26/2020 at 5:31 AM, Wooders28 said:

 

So in terms of power handling, you'd be better changing the battery connections to a 60 amp plug, be it deans or XT60 (I prefer deans 🤷‍♂️) ,

Thank you, that's most informative. I did a search and found a few other comments about the the Tamiya connectors melting. Also Modelsport have removed that connector from the options, which is telling. I'd rather stick to Nimh as that is the type of charger that I have, rather than moving over to Lipo also as I understand that means further considerations. However, I don't seem able to find a 7.2V battery with a Deans connector that is 5000maH. The highest is 3000. I reckoned that a drop in capacity would limit the run time further if the ESC is going to draw more current. Any ideas why that would be please?

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1 hour ago, Apollo11 said:

I'd rather stick to Nimh as that is the type of charger that I have,

My recommended starting to switch over to Lio, is the charger, £40 gets you one that'll charge Nimh and Lipo (12v /240 input etc) and also discharge options, which can breathe life into an old Nimh too. (Different charge lead options look to be extra)

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/skyrc-e680-ac-dc-80w-charger/rc-car-products/440716

 

1 hour ago, Apollo11 said:

However, I don't seem able to find a 7.2V battery with a Deans connector that is 5000maH

Personally,  I would (and have) just fit my own plugs. If you cut one lead, then solder the new plug to that lead, then cut the other and solder that, it'll mean no  chance of shorting the battery. 

I use these - 

 

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/t-style-connector-male-female-with-insulating-caps-10-pairs.html?___store=en_us

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I ordered a Hobbywing Quickrun ESC and a Speed passion V3.0 motor, which arrived today, along with a sensor cable20201118_194235944_iOS.heic. Thing is these connectors don't look like they are supposed to go together. Am I missing something?

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10 hours ago, Apollo11 said:

I ordered a Hobbywing Quickrun ESC and a Speed passion V3.0 motor, which arrived today, along with a sensor cable20201118_194235944_iOS.heic. Thing is these connectors don't look like they are supposed to go together. Am I missing something?

Looks to me like the connectors on the end of your esc (female) are designed to connect with male 'banana' plug connectors - which aren't fitted to your motor. Pretty sure the gold coloured bits sticking out the end of your motor are actually connectors. If you used a pair of pliers, they should come off. The idea would be to remove the female connectors off your esc and then solder the wire ends to the connectors that fit directly onto your motor.

You would solder the wires horizontally (relative to the end of the motor) and it is much easier (imo) to solder the wires with the motor connectors/plugs in situ.

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On 10/26/2020 at 5:31 AM, Wooders28 said:

If I was going for a brushless esc, these are hard to beat.

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/index.php?product_id=425021

And then any of these motors, although I'd be tempted with the, speed passion 10.5t motor. Not too wild, and if you wanted a bit more go later, you can get a lower turn speed passion, and it'll just plug right in.

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/index.php?CategoryID=9920&SubCategoryID=992015&MSAttributeID[25]=576&&MSAttributeID[110]=1246

 

Thank you. I got both of these: the ESC with a Deans connector, a 10.5T speed passion v3.0 plus a 5100maH Nimh battery to go with the ESC. It has a Deans-Tamiya adaptor so I can still use the slow charger. My fast charger came with a multitude of connectors, so that's not a problem. The issue I have now is it's not clear to me how to connect the ESC to the motor? Do those connectors pull out of the end of the motor for soldering to the ESC cables? Do I need anything else, as I need to refer back to modelsport anyway as I have realised the sensor cable I chose it too short anyway.

Bit disappointed the motor doesn't come with even the most basic of manuals or have even a website to refer to (unless I am mistaken?). But such is a challenge.

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2 hours ago, Apollo11 said:

Do those connectors pull out of the end of the motor for soldering to the ESC cables?

Yes, if i remember right, they're 3mm bullets.They just unplug, but are colour coded to A B C, if you look on the ESC, it should have corresponding A B C, so solder A to the A bullet etc, keeps things a bit easier. 

2 hours ago, Apollo11 said:

Do I need anything else,

Just the sensor cable, you can get the programmer for under a tenner, but you can set the ESC up off the button.

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On 11/21/2020 at 5:45 PM, Wooders28 said:

Yes, if i remember right, they're 3mm bullets.They just unplug, but are colour coded to A B C, if you look on the ESC, it should have corresponding A B C, so solder A to the A bullet etc, keeps things a bit easier. 

Just the sensor cable, you can get the programmer for under a tenner, but you can set the ESC up off the button.

Wow, thank you for confirming. I thought that might be the case, but as you can imagine, didn't want to pull on the connectors and risk damaging the motor. As you can see from the photos, having taken one off, it's much easier than I feared. The connector comes off to reveal a male bullet connector that the female end of the ESC cable fits on to. So no soldering required at all. 

My main concern now is the vent holes on the motor. Clearly they're there to aid cooling, but I'm concerned about grime getting in. Would it be a bad thing to cover them with stickers? Failing that, the super stock motors came with sponge boots that covered the end bell. Is something like that available separately?

20201123_085021690_iOS.heic 20201123_085041591_iOS.heic

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1 hour ago, Apollo11 said:

So no soldering required at all. 

Your pics won't open on my phone, but you'll need to solder the plugs onto the ESC cables? (I needed to with mine), unless you've paid Modelsport to do it, in which case, aye, just plug in. (A to A etc) 

1 hour ago, Apollo11 said:

Would it be a bad thing to cover them with stickers?

I would say it wouldn't be ideal, but depends on how stressed the motor is, if you're going for tall gearing then heat will be an issue, but if it's low geared, then not so much an issue. I'd try and fit the motor in such an orientation,  that debris is less likely to be ingested, and check temps, if you can't touch it, it's too hot.

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