Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Rob Buckle

Mission: Clod Buster

Recommended Posts

Dear All,

I thought I'd start a new thread, one that will hold details of any and all modifications I make to my original Clod Buster. As many of you know, I plan on (slowly) upgrading my stock Clod to something rather special. This will not occur over a short period of time. After much ado I have finally completed what you could call "Phase 1" of this ongoing project. Phase 1 has entailed:

1. Adopting LiPo battery power, bearing in mind that the previous time I drove the (NiCd powered) Clod in anger was as a young boy some 23 or so years ago;

2. Adopting an ESC, again having originally used an MSC;

3. Replacing the stock silver cans to Tamiya Sport Tuned motors for additional "oomph";

4. Installing a full set of ball raced AVID bearings, some of which are 'metal', i.e. metal shielded, some of which are 'revolutions', i.e. metal shielded on one side and plastic shielded on the other. Which type is installed where depends on likelyhood of dirt ingress. For example, the 'metals' are installed in the gearboxes where dirt cannot reach, whereas the 'revolutions' are pretty much everywhere else, with their plastic side exposed to debris (plastic shields are supposedly a superior barrier to dirt ingress than metal shields).

Okay, enough writing for now. A picture paints a thousand words, they say. Here's the Clod as of the time of writing:

_DSC8760.jpg

A close up, showing a necessary modification to the stock battery holder to allow for the non-"stick" battery arrangement of my 5000mAh, 45C Lipo. I am aware that 45C is overkill...at this stage, but it can't do any harm and, more to the point, it means I do not have to purchase another LiPo (at least in terms of the C rating) if/when I opt for more demanding brushless motors sometime in the future:

_DSC8762.jpg

Twin Tamiya Sport Tuned motors:

_DSC8763.jpg

Bodies. The red is my own, original, now some 23 year old body. The blue came to me through ebay while I was refurbishing 3 Clod Busters then selling them on:

_DSC8765.jpg

Clod with my original body:

_DSC8766.jpg

And again but this time with the spare blue body:

_DSC8767.jpg

The good thing about both bodies being a bit hammered is that I can happily punish the Clod when bashing without worrying about damaging anything. If the body snaps, so be it. Remember: everything being done to the Clod is intended to improve it bit by bit, while enjoying both running the Clod and going through the 'development' process itself.

"Phase 2" is intended to incorporate a Futaba S3305 high torque steering servo and Castle Creations BEC for it, both of which I already have. There are issues relating to steering 'slop' to be ironed out, but those will be addressed at that time. Watch this space!

References to threads for those unaware of them currently:

1) High torque servo.

2) Bearings.

3) ESCs.

Cheers!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi mate,

Looks like you've got a superb project there, I'm not familiar with the clod myself but it looks interesting with that twin motor 4wd set up.

I'll be keeping an eye open for this one, Very interesting.

Matt.

I've just been watching some of the footage on youtube for the clodbuster, They look incredible, I hadn't realised they were 4 wheel steering aswell, Amazing!

I want one now B)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Instead of the high torque servo, you might want to consider using 2 servos instead. I managed to fit 2 Futaba S148s into my 1st clod, between the axle guards and the gearboxes. I made some custom brackets to hold the servos in there, but it worked really well, and I didn't hav to ditch the standard axle guards. Not having the fore / aft steering rods also meant I could double the suspension travel without having to resort to a 4 link setup, and mount the battery in the bottom of the chassis to lower the CofG. I did this back in 1993 as part of a college engineering project. The fiddly bit was taking the servo to bits and resoldering the pot and the motor wires to reverse the direction of one of the servos. Now, with hindsight, I'd just buy a Y lead with a servo reverser built into one channel :0

If you're interested I've still got the technical drawing for the brackets, and some old pics of the installation from the project report I could scan in and post here.

Edit: Doh, just noticed your comments re twin servos in your other thread, so ignore this.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Edit: Doh, just noticed your comments re twin servos in your other thread, so ignore this...

Heh heh, no problem. As stated previously, it may yet come to mounting 2 servos directly to the axles. In any event, thanks for the offer. B)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

looks like clod builds are all the go . my first clod has been moded , and i went for a hi-torque servo on an axle mount with front steer only . i found with my driving and conditions i didnt need the rear steer so i put a steering cut out kit in it .

rccars024.jpg

the second clod is a clodzilla and with the longer wider chassis i have a massive servo centraly mounted and am running the rear steer as limited as possible so the rears just turn and no more just to help it turn due to the length . i might change this later on as its not being used as a crawler .

rccars010.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
...the second clod is a clodzilla and with the longer wider chassis...

I'd be interested to know the following:

1. What is the advantage of having a longer wheelbase? Less wheelies?

2. How much did you widen the wheel track by?

3. Related to (2) above, what motors/gearing are you using?

4. Related to (2) and (3) above, do you now find that you never flip the car when steering hard over at speed?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would also consider converting to 2WS by locking the rear, increasing the throw on the front axle and moving the steering servo to the front. Much more stability in the corners without having to change the dimensions of the car.

I'd also suggest making your own set of 4 links to dramatically improve the strength and suspension geometry of the standard car.

Largely of course, it really depends what your ultimate goal is. Do you want to improve the car whilst still maintaining its classic looks, or are you going for full on mutant?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Having now got 15.5" wheelbase on my Clod / Spider and with the rear steer locked i don't find the turning circle that bad - its not much use around the flower beds of the garden, but in an open park area/lightly wooded its fine.

I will be filing a little bit off the plastic stops of the C hub carriers E parts) to assist with a few more degrees travel on the steering though.

Nice work though Rob, and great to see it now electrically correct :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
...it really depends what your ultimate goal is. Do you want to improve the car whilst still maintaining its classic looks, or are you going for full on mutant?

Neither one nor the other but a bit of both. Sorry for being obtuse, but it's true. By and large I would like to keep the Clod looking like a Clod. However, there are impovements to be made and so some deviation from the look of the stock Clod is inevitable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Having now got 15.5" wheelbase on my Clod / Spider and with the rear steer locked i don't find the turning circle that bad...

Just to be clear, I'm not keen on retaining 4 wheel steering because it returns a tighter turning circle than 2 wheel steering (for the same knuckle throw); I'm keen on retaining it because it is a feature I like. It's something different that made the Clod unique.

Nice work though Rob, and great to see it now electrically correct.

Thanks. I've now run the Clod outdoors but under shelter of the roof of the sports hall shown in this photo. I find that I get 28 minutes of run time - albeit running only on a perfectly flat surface - from my LiPo (my charger tells me I have 6% battery capacity remaining). As far as I am concerned this is nothing short of fabulous...when you consider that my recollection was of something of the order of 5 minutes all those years ago with a NiCd. Very, very pleased.

Other thoughts/observations/questions:

1. My tyres are spinnning on their hubs. I am reluctant to glue them together so will first try the 'elastic band' method;

2. Top speed is good fun. It's certainly not slow, but I do find myself thinking how cool it would be to really see it fly; :P

3. If I turn hard left/right at full speed the Clod tips over. Therefore, given that an increase in speed may be on the cards, and that I'm hoping to further increase steering effectiveness by removing some slop, I think an increase in wheel track is inevitable. That said, I don't consider it mandatory that the Clod must be able to turn left/right fully at top speed without tipping. For example, at present, while the Clod tips at full speed, it does not at only a touch less speed than full;

4. Question: is it the case that replacing wheel hubs and gearboxes for metal equivalents does nothing to reduce the chance of tipping? My line of thinking is that yes, the additional mass makes tipping the Clod harder, but that countering this is the fact that the same mass increases the inertia that tends to tip the Clod than would be the case with stock, plastic, parts. is this argument correct, or not?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think elastic bands will work on tires this size, plus they are very squishy and deform easily, and that will likely break contact between the bead of the tire and the wheel channel [and therefore the elastic band...].

Personally, I'd use 3-4 drops of CA glue on each tire. You don't have to weld the tires to the rim forever and ever, you just want them to stop slipping. A few small drops of glue should do the trick, and you can always undo that later with minimal effort and little risk of harm. If the tires start spinning again because they've come unglued, well, it's an easy thing to add 4 more drops of glue later. The problem comes when you glue the bejesus out of the tires and then want to remove them - very difficult to do with a good result.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I doubt alloy gearbox and axle cases will add much in weight - nothing more than putting some lead tape on plastic ones would. Weight low down is good but ideally you want it low down and out at the corners, not centrally. Yuo could consider adding some lead tape/stick on weight to the plastic rims, but you'd need a uniform strip to go around the wheel diameter to save imbalances.

Wheel wideners will help - there are several available which work with the Clod rims - i think Fusion Hobbies still do soem that add about 0.75-1" per side.

Alloy rims generally come with a different offset - my RC4WD ones added 17mm per side. I think JPS ones are similar. there are also some on ebay with variable offset so you can set them to one of four positions; i'm sure someone here recentely posted about them during their Clod build. My Rc4WD rims are 277g each without tyres, ao appreciably heavier than the featherweight plastic rims. Helps stability no end, but its a lot more weight to get going, and a lot more to stop !

As to glueing tyres, i've used evostick / uhu contact adhesive without issues - you can coated the full bead of the tyre, it'll hold steady in use, but isn't too extreme that you can't remove tyres later.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't think elastic bands will work on tires this size, plus they are very squishy and deform easily, and that will likely break contact between the bead of the tire and the wheel channel [and therefore the elastic band...].

I have some bands coming to me this evening so it can't hurt to give them a try.

Personally, I'd use 3-4 drops of CA glue on each tire. You don't have to weld the tires to the rim forever and ever, you just want them to stop slipping. A few small drops of glue should do the trick, and you can always undo that later with minimal effort and little risk of harm. If the tires start spinning again because they've come unglued, well, it's an easy thing to add 4 more drops of glue later. The problem comes when you glue the bejesus out of the tires and then want to remove them - very difficult to do with a good result.

Well said, thank you. If the bands are found to be ineffective then I will do as you say. :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Alloy rims generally come with a different offset...

Interesting. So, is it true to say that you can widen the wheel track simply through the choice of rims adopted...without having to purchase wheel wideners separately?

As to glueing tyres, i've used evostick / uhu contact adhesive without issues - you can coated the full bead of the tyre, it'll hold steady in use, but isn't too extreme that you can't remove tyres later.

Ah, good. My old man has Evo-stik. The blue coloured bottle if I remember correctly. Is this okay?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Interesting. So, is it true to say that you can widen the wheel track simply through the choice of rims adopted...without having to purchase wheel wideners separately?

Absolutely ! although you also have to be careful with fitment, hence why i have 12-14mm hex adaptors to fit my RC4WD rims.

Commiedor has the Amoeba 2 rims - see post 12 of this thread.. http://www.tamiyaclub.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=60758

Ah, good. My old man has Evo-stik. The blue coloured bottle if I remember correctly. Is this okay?

Dunno about blue, it always used to be red/black from my memory, i have a tube of UHU presently - same stuff basically.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dunno about blue, it always used to be red/black from my memory...

Are you, by chance, colour blind? :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Are you, by chance, colour blind? :P

Evostik impact adhesive is in a red tin/tube, maybe its you that is colour blind or has amnesia :), mind you Evostick wood glue can be found in blue tubs but doubt the wood glue will work on plastic and rubber. Go with the suggestion of super glue, but use the thick stuff so it doesnt flow around bead.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Evostik impact adhesive is in a red tin/tube, maybe its you that is colour blind or has amnesia :), mind you Evostick wood glue can be found in blue tubs but doubt the wood glue will work on plastic and rubber. Go with the suggestion of super glue, but use the thick stuff so it doesnt flow around bead.

:P Okay, thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Neither one nor the other but a bit of both. Sorry for being obtuse, but it's true. By and large I would like to keep the Clod looking like a Clod. However, there are impovements to be made and so some deviation from the look of the stock Clod is inevitable.

Not so. You can still make the mods to dramatically improve the way car handles and performs without changing the way it looks. If you WANT to change its looks, then go right ahead, but it's not compulsory or "inevitable" just to improve its performance.

Looks like a standard Clod?

Clods009.jpg

But it sure isn't

Clods011.jpg

Clods008.jpg

ClodMods001.jpg

Clods006.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Looks like a standard Clod?...But it sure isn't

With all due respect the first image tends to conceal modifications that have taken place, for example the front axle-mounted steering servo and rear steer lockout.

I guess it comes down to what each person considers the point at which the Clod no loger resembles the stock look and, no doubt, that point is different from person to person. For the record, I am probably aiming for something along the lines of your own Clod. However, while I do agree that your Clod still looks like a 'Clod', ie stock, modifications have been made that are clearly visible, hence my previous use of the word 'inevitable'.

I hope you see where I'm coming from - I don't mean to offend.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Rob,

I thought I would post the details of my twin servo solution for you as might still be considering it as an option. Here's what I did

img33435_EYK75_1.jpg

I made 2 of the above brackets, one for the front, and one for the rear.

This is a rough 3d impression of the fitment (Don't forget I did this in 1992/3, when computers weren't great at graphics manipulation !

img33435_EYK75_2.jpg

And here is a couple of pics of it fitted to the truck. Excuse the quality, it's a photo of a photo, as I don't have a scanner handy !

img33435_EYK75_3.jpg

img33435_EYK75_4.jpg

It gives a neat solution without impacting too much on the look of the truck, and you can retain the original suspension and shocks, and with the centre steering rods out of the way the suspension travel can be doubled by fitting 100mm oil shocks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I thought I would post the details of my twin servo solution for you as might still be considering it as an option.

Thank you. I will no doubt be accused of being stubborn (come to think of it...!) but I would like to at least try reducing slop with a centrally mounted servo. If that turns out to be a complete waste of time then I will look to axle-mounted or, in your own case, bumper-mounted servos as the only possible solution.

It gives a neat solution without impacting too much on the look of the truck, and you can retain the original suspension and shocks, and with the centre steering rods out of the way the suspension travel can be doubled by fitting 100mm oil shocks.

Yes, I can see that. It's a novel solution. I like it. :o I take it what was a single, lower, tie rod linking the knuckles is now two separate rods from a servo horn (saver?)?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
With all due respect the first image tends to conceal modifications that have taken place, for example the front axle-mounted steering servo and rear steer lockout.

I guess it comes down to what each person considers the point at which the Clod no loger resembles the stock look and, no doubt, that point is different from person to person. For the record, I am probably aiming for something along the lines of your own Clod. However, while I do agree that your Clod still looks like a 'Clod', ie stock, modifications have been made that are clearly visible, hence my previous use of the word 'inevitable'.

I hope you see where I'm coming from - I don't mean to offend.

Right, I understand what you mean.

None taken :o

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...