Sliver can v brushless

[southy 6]

I keep seeing on this forum when people compare brushed vs brushless they state that a silver can brushed is = to 13.5T brushless. I don't know what brushless setup they are talking about but a 13.5T should smoke a 540 silver can. Since the 540 silver can race class was opened up to allow 21.5T brushless the silver can has become extinct in racing a most places I know off because they can't even compete with 21.5T.

I know people with compare there rated RPM but comparing brushed RPM with brushless RPM is comparing apples to oranges. The torque output of the brushless is so much higher it will pull much taller gearing. Add to this adjustable timing advance for even more speed out of the brushless. Really, does the rated free revving RPM of a motor count for anything once they are fitted to a car.

I can only think if you have a silver can 540 with the same power as a 13.5T brushless than you either have one awesome 540 or a dude 13.5T.

[DooBeDooBeDo 0]

I agree. I went from a silver can to a 13.5T brushless system and there is no comparison.

[WillyChang 1814]

silvercan is NOT same as a 13.5

13.5 BL is a full 540-sized motor... it used to be 'equal' to a racetuned 27T brushed but now with improved BL technology

the 17.5 is now the 'stock' 27T equivalent. The 13.5 now replaces the 19T or 23T classes - if they still exist.

some racing classes like M03 Mini, the EZYRUN 13T is used as equivalent to a Sporttuned.

E's 13T is a smaller 380-size motor and with good drivers running back-to-back there is negligible difference

... however they're comparing with a 'good' Sporttuned (after buying a few cases & dyno'ing the lot).

With a 13T BL at least you've got a decent chance it'll perform decently unless you're really unlucky.

A racetuned 27T would outrun any Sporttuned or silvercan without even trying.

[PaPeRo 30]

Silvercan is more like 17T brushless...zero timing on ESC.

[southy 6]

silvercan is NOT same as a 13.5

13.5 BL is a full 540-sized motor... it used to be 'equal' to a racetuned 27T brushed but now with improved BL technology

the 17.5 is now the 'stock' 27T equivalent. The 13.5 now replaces the 19T or 23T classes - if they still exist.

some racing classes like M03 Mini, the EZYRUN 13T is used as equivalent to a Sporttuned.

E's 13T is a smaller 380-size motor and with good drivers running back-to-back there is negligible difference

... however they're comparing with a 'good' Sporttuned (after buying a few cases & dyno'ing the lot).

With a 13T BL at least you've got a decent chance it'll perform decently unless you're really unlucky.

A racetuned 27T would outrun any Sporttuned or silvercan without even trying.

I agree Willy, a silver can will never be equal to a 13.5T unless there is something wrong. I started this thread to see others opinions as I have seen this comment made on a number of occasions now and would like to know how people have come to the conclusion that 540 = 13.5T BL.

Even in M chassis racing a good sports tuned will be able to compete with the Ezrun 13T (380 rotor) but I think this is only because of the limited gear ratio used in M chassis. Put them in another car with open gearing and the Ezrun will pull much taller gearing than the sports tuned. I personally have not had one of these good Sports Tuned but have seen some quick M03's over the years fitted with them.

I have run a 13T Ezrun in my Xpress mini and it will smoke a M chassis in a straight line. The Xpress normally has a Superstock TZ fitted and the Ezrun is quicker even than this motor. Corners are another thing, I have never been able to make the Xpress turn well .

[WillyChang 1814]

might not be an Xpress-only issue... afaik none of the 4WD minis seem to handle as well as an M03

from HPI RS4 Mini to today's ABC Genetic & CupRacer, sure they've got more traction

to better put down the power but FWD catches them in the corners

even my DIY TB EvoIII with 165mm track 225mm wheelbase doesn't handle great

yea BLs have a lot more torque than brushed, if gearing can utilise then its way ahead.

Jack up the volts and it'll spin even faster... haha a 13T on 3s?

Brushed racing 'stock' motors used to be optimised for either torque or RPM

and (when allowed to) you'd gear your car accordingly.

[PaPeRo 30]

3s with a 13T is not as bad as one would think especially if you're just bashing. Throttle curve on the Tx helps to put down the power as well as having a AWD chassis.

5.5T + 3s now that is wild but still fun when using big tires and driving on grass.

[dan12 1]

3s with a 13T is not as bad as one would think especially if you're just bashing. Throttle curve on the Tx helps to put down the power as well as having a AWD chassis.

5.5T + 3s now that is wild but still fun when using big tires and driving on grass.

Yer, but a silvercan on 3s isnt that bad and costs a fraction of the price!

I actually think that the silvercan is very efficient compared to lower wind mod motors, long run time and great parformance when geared right, maby some volts aswell!

[TA-Mark 195]

Yer, but a silvercan on 3s isnt that bad and costs a fraction of the price!

I actually think that the silvercan is very efficient compared to lower wind mod motors, long run time and great parformance when geared right, maby some volts aswell!

There's no comparison...

540 silvercan (Mabuchi RS540SH) on 9.6v (8 cell) is 20,000rpm and 64.9W.

A 13.5 turn brushless is ~25,000rpm and 500W on 7.2v (6 cell). On 8 cell it's ~36,000rpm and still 500W. Almost double the rpm and 8 times the power on the same voltage.

Not to mention that after 2 years of using the silvercan motors at higher than the recommended voltage which shortens their life and you've replaced it 10 times (or more), the brushless motor is still running with the same power as the day you bought it.

[dan12 1]

But £90 for a motor/esc combo...too expensive man!

I can get a silvercan for around £5 and a 7-8cell battery for £25 and stick a fan on my old teu101bk esc and there we have it...awsome speed for around £30!

Thats a 1/4 of a brushless system.

I do however see your point about brushless, but for a basher like me a silvercan + high voltage makes one badword of a combo! Ask Mike_0.

If i could find a bl combo for under £50 then i would snap it up, but its impossible!

I also think a johnson on 8 cell would hit 25,000rpm when breaken in properly.

[DooBeDooBeDo 0]

If i could find a bl combo for under £50 then i would snap it up, but its impossible!

Search ebay for 'Ezrun Combo 35A ESC'. Cheapest on there at the moment is a 13T system for £24.99 free post

[TA-Mark 195]

You can get a Castle Sidewinder SV2 for £65. Brushless are not as expensive as they used to be. Over a year or so running it ends up cheaper than buying a new silvercan every few months.

[digitrc 0]

But £90 for a motor/esc combo...too expensive man!

I can get a silvercan for around £5 and a 7-8cell battery for £25 and stick a fan on my old teu101bk esc and there we have it...awsome speed for around £30!

Thats a 1/4 of a brushless system.

I do however see your point about brushless, but for a basher like me a silvercan + high voltage makes one badword of a combo! Ask Mike_0.

If i could find a bl combo for under £50 then i would snap it up, but its impossible!

I also think a johnson on 8 cell would hit 25,000rpm when breaken in properly.

I know you are very enthusiastic about your high-voltage experiments but it's not the solution for everyone. I'm a little concerned that in your enthusiasm you are starting to hand out bad advice.

Most RC cars are built around a standard stick pack. Most of the electrics are designed for that amount of voltage. And the easiest solution for most people is to find a faster motor/esc combination, rather than forcing extra volts through the system.

[TA-Mark 195]

I know you are very enthusiastic about your high-voltage experiments but it's not the solution for everyone. I'm a little concerned that in your enthusiasm you are starting to hand out bad advice.

Most RC cars are built around a standard stick pack. Most of the electrics are designed for that amount of voltage. And the easiest solution for most people is to find a faster motor/esc combination, rather than forcing extra volts through the system.

And to add to this... strapping a 8.4v 7 cell pack ontop your DT01 chassis doesn't do great things for the handling. A faster motor (brushless), and a regular 6 cell pack (or 7.4 Li-Po) will achieve higher speeds and more power without messing up the balance of the buggy.

[dan12 1]

Sorry if i was giving bad advise, i was just giving my thoughts.

My buggy is now solved, it was that the shocks were to stiff, you know what that does to a solide rear axle and ver light chassis.

I cant efford brushless and a few troubles at home with my dad saying no so i have to make do with voltage power.

It works for me, i actually have fitted a 9.6v 4500mah to a ansmann clash 21t and she flies!

Im probely wrong as usual.

[Live Steam Mad 17]

I cant efford brushless and a few troubles at home with my dad saying no

I remember what that feels like. Sorry, off topic I know.

To get back on topic, Very glad to see brushless prices have fallen. The brand name ones from UK sellers are still VERY expensive for what they are IMHO. Just a pity that I can't seem to buy a sensored motor without going over the import (VAT) limit. Don't wanna be hit for 8.50 GBP Clearance Fee and VAT on top of motor + postage, on top of a pricey motor and no warranty and a 3 week wait...

Cheers,

Alistair G.

[Live Steam Mad 17]

Sorry if i was giving bad advise, i was just giving my thoughts.

Well I for one thought it was interesting to hear what silver cans do when you push high volts through them LOL.

ARG

[dan12 1]

Well I for one thought it was interesting to hear what silver cans do when you push high volts through them LOL.

ARG

Yer, it was great fun! fast on 3s! However i can now efford brushless as i done a few rc's up and sold them.

I have had lots of insolts and digs over shairing my opinions, so thank you for not insolting me.

[Bigwheels_inc 11]

Yer, it was great fun! fast on 3s! However i can now efford brushless as i done a few rc's up and sold them.

I have had lots of insolts and digs over shairing my opinions, so thank you for not insolting me.

Dont worry we all start somewhere and I used to run a 10x1 motor with the std msc and 7.2v stick pack when I started (trashed the gears in the grasshopper though LOL)

you can pick up an Ezrun brushless system on ebay for £50 posted from japan (I got a 60a esc and 5.5T motor with program card etc ready to run for £50 posted)

Pete