Vintage thunder dragon with new ESC?

[kenno 0]

Hi there all, i am fairly new to tamiyas in general and so my question may sound really noobish lol.

So i have 3 cars at present all vintage, a thunder dragon, a thundershot and a hornet (not re re) i have stripped repaired and rebult all 3 yet there all running old stock motors and MSC, i want to upgrade them to modern ESC and probaly change the motors at the same time, so my question is can anybody recommend a ECS and motor setup?

I dont currently plan on racing them and money is always an issue for me so im not looking for expensive pro racing items just good all rounders really, as i said im a total noob to all this at mo in regards to even the differences in the t on the motors etc ie 23t n so on, lol.

also if i start changing motors will i have to change the gearing etc etc or is there a nice limit on motor i can go 2 without changing gearing?

Thanks in advance for all help and hope to hear back soon,

Kenny

[dan12 1]

Hi there all, i am fairly new to tamiyas in general and so my question may sound really noobish lol.

So i have 3 cars at present all vintage, a thunder dragon, a thundershot and a hornet (not re re) i have stripped repaired and rebult all 3 yet there all running old stock motors and MSC, i want to upgrade them to modern ESC and probaly change the motors at the same time, so my question is can anybody recommend a ECS and motor setup?

I dont currently plan on racing them and money is always an issue for me so im not looking for expensive pro racing items just good all rounders really, as i said im a total noob to all this at mo in regards to even the differences in the t on the motors etc ie 23t n so on, lol.

also if i start changing motors will i have to change the gearing etc etc or is there a nice limit on motor i can go 2 without changing gearing?

Thanks in advance for all help and hope to hear back soon,

Kenny

Hey, i would reccomend the teu101bk tamiya stock esc, it runs motors down to 23t and 6 cell. Many people run then on 19t and even 3s lipo! I run mine on 21t and 7 cell and it barely gets warm! Tamiya quality for ya!

[tamiya monkey 243]

The tamiya teu101bk or newer teu104bk is a nice easy to use esc, a massive improvement over the msc's of old. motor wise either stick with a 27t (stock tamiya silver can) or a 23t.

how about modelsport's rv20 waterproof, and prob cheaper than a tamiya esc and takes down to a 20t motor

ive used these hpi motors for some time and find them reliable for a budget motor.

27 turn

20 turn

[kenno 0]

Thanks for the info guys, so if I decide to junk the standard silver can and go down to a 23 or even 20t motor will I have to do anything with gearing?

Looking at the tamiya esc's the teu101bk goes down to a 23t but the teu104bk only goes down to a 25, so I would be better off getting the older 101 right?

Also what options do I have for a decent battery? I have a 2700 pack at mo, will I be able to go higher without risk of heating problems?

Thanks again guys

[steve997 0]

I bought a Neo Falcon 2 yrs ago. I used the silver can with the Teu101bk for a while then I upgraded the motor with a 23 t Tamiya RZ motor which was fun (lots of torque for a brushed motor). No need to regear as the motor has so much torque and revs about 50% higher.

However........ in retrospect I should have just bought a cheap brushless combo.

The RZ motor was £35, the Teu101BK is about £20 = £55 for a brushed combo that produces circa 23,000 rpm and the motor would need to be serviced, replaced over time due to brushes wearing out etc.

I ended up choosing to buy a Fusion Exceed 10.5t brushless motor and esc for £89. It revs to >32000 rpm on 7.2 v and even comes with a tamiya battery connector. Brushless motors are more efficient than brushed motors and I had more run time from my standard 3000mah nimh batteries than I did with the slower 23t brushed motor!

Alternatively there is a 13.5t brushless combo for £79 (which is prob about the same performance as a 19t - 23 t brushed).

What ever you choose an electronic speed controller will offer you more run time and more than 3 forward speeds!

Regarding batteries - I have had no problems with standard 3000mah nimh batteries which can be bought for less than £20 for just bashing. I get about >20 mins run time from one 3000 mah battery.

[TA-Mark 195]

Looking at the tamiya esc's the teu101bk goes down to a 23t but the teu104bk only goes down to a 25, so I would be better off getting the older 101 right?

Both the TEU101 and TEU104 are the same spec ESC in forward, 60A. The only difference between them is the TEU104 has 50% reverse power and has a built in cutoff for Tamiyas Li-FE packs (not a suitable cutoff for Li-Po). Both are rated for the same motors. Motors with higher timing advance will suffer on the 50% reverse power of the TEU104.

Tamiya recommends using the TEU302 for the 23 turn RZ/TZ/BZ motors. The Tamiya 23 turn RZ/TZ/BZ motors are more powerful and higher rpm than some cheap brand 19 turn motors (Venom etc). A 4WD vehicle has more load on the motor/ESC than a 2WD. The vehicle weight also has an effect on load. The Hornet is a very light vehicle compared to the other two.

For the cost of upgrading both ESC and motor, it's cheaper to step up to brushless and no more worries about motor performance drop off with brushes and coms wearing.

I would recommend changing the pinions in either case. Toss the Tamiya aluminium pinions in the trash and fit steel RW-Racing 32dp pinions

[kenno 0]

Ok so im considering going brushless as seems it will be better in the long run, I have seen a package deal in eBay within my price range that consists of a eZRun-35A-SL brushless ESC and a 13T sensorless brushless motor, is this any good? Combined with a 32dp steel pinion will this work alright?

[steve997 0]

Ezrun are well regarded combos. However the 13t motor I believe is 3000kv (it revs at 3000 revs per volt). Therefore it will rev to about 21000 on 7.2 volts.

I would go for their more powerful 9 turn (4300kv) option in preference.

[kenno 0]

and where wil this leave me in regards to gearing?

[TA-Mark 195]

and where wil this leave me in regards to gearing?

In the Hornet, the 18 tooth pinion will be fine. You may need a pinion with one less tooth in the 4WD buggys. It's trial and error. Run with the standard ratio first. If the motor, ESC or battery are getting excessively hot, then fit smaller pinions. Always monitor the temperatures with a new setup to make sure it's running happily in the chassis.

Full bearings are a must! Brushless will melt plastic bushings.

Also, look at better battery connectors. The Tamiya plug is rated at 7.5Amp. The 35Amp EZ-Run systems can draw more than the Tamiya plug can handle, and the plug becomes a bottleneck, gets hot and melts, or worse, shorts (I've had that happen).

[kenno 0]

nice one thanks for the help mark, i laready have full bearign kits installed so no problems there, any battery plugs you can recommend?

[steve997 0]

Traxxas plugs work for me.....

[kenno 0]

Ok Seems traxxas plugs have been added to my shopping list lol, so with me getting a ezrun 35a 13t brushless setup new pinion traxxas plugs the dragon is going to be running alot faster so I'm looking at getting the terra scorcher g parts to change te front end to a 2 shock setup for better handling, I'm assuming I will want to change the steering arms to further help in control any recommendations on some hop ups I can get tht will fit strait on? Something of a more modern model that is the same sizes etc etc?

[tonysmini 19]

if you haven't already, fit a steel or alloy A5 (the pins for the front lower arms pass through it). Probably he most important hop up on this chassis.