Silver cans for USA-1 (same as Clod)

[pizzachaude]

Hi, forgive me if this is in the wrong section, wasn't sure where this belongs. I have a runner Kyosho USA-1 which has 2 550 size Mega 360 motors and the stock mechanical speed controller. They are 22 turns, so the thing is pretty darn fast and drains batteries like you wouldn't beleive. I want to replace the MSC with an electronic one, but it seems that the only ESC that will handle dual 22T is the Super Rooster and its quite expensive. I was thinking of replacing the stock motors for 2 regular 27T silver cans, but one of them has to be reverse rotation. Can I just put in a regular one and reverse the wires? Cause if I can then I would just get the stock ESC that comes with the Super Clod. I would get some longer run times, more control, a little less speed which is fine, and it wouldnt cost too much.

Oh, one last thing, I have plenty of Tamiyas, and I know the USA-1 is terrible so dont go too harsh with the poor thing

[-=Jeff=-]

You could use the Silver Cans with a Traxxas XL5 ESC. I am running a pair of Sport tuned 540 with the XL5 with no issues on my BFX and the dual motor setup is the same essentially as the Clod

[pizzachaude]

I'm into the vintage stuff, so I really know nothing about Traxxas, Lipos and such. Although the XL5's price looks right, it doesn't mention in the specs that it'll support dual motors, I'll take your word if you say you have no problems with yours. Althought the specs are pretty much the same as the original Novak Rooster, I have one, think it'll support 2 silver cans?

And what about those silver cans, can I just reverse the wires on one motor so it'll be reverse rotation? Thanks for the quick reply!

[-=Jeff=-]

Yes just wire one motor in reverse of the others.

The XL5 does not specifically state it will support dual motors but it will support down to ta 13T I think so 2 Silver cans parallel wired is around 13-14T

I had read on the clod forums that many people used this or stepped up to the EVX-2. I don't know much on Vintage, my vintage stuff was all MSC.

Hope that helps

[pizzachaude]

Great, gonna try those silver cans as I have a few lying around!

The Rooster has a 16 turn limit, and the XL5 is 15 turn limit. Close enough I guess, worst that can happen is I'll fry the poor thing, Anyone have an opinion on this? And thanks for the help Jeff

Oh, the vintage stuff is MSCs for the shelfers, the runners get ESCs

[B.M.T.]

Something to consider, the USA1 uses Big Brute gearboxes, which were geared to suit smaller tyres. By dropping back to 540's, you might find that they struggle in the torque department. You might be better off finding generic sealed can 550 motors. We have an electronics outlet here called Jaycar that has them, I wonder if they exist over in Canada? That'd make things easy.

Also, any decent ESC can run dual motors (talking brushed here). I ran my Jug 1 on two 5 degree 27 turns on a Nosram Runner (I think? the really inexpensive reversing unit) and then a pair of 19 turn 550 AYKs in my TXT 1 on a single M´troniks Evo 15. You just have to solder up a y harness for the motor wires.

The easy way is to run two complete wires from motor to motor, and then remove a ring of insulation near where your esc is, and solder the motor wires there and insulate with electrical tape. Don't worry if that junction is not dead center, one motor will not get any more power than the other, the voltage drop over a few inches of silicone wire is pretty much nothing.

[Rockcrusher]

Wow, I'm surprised Kyosho didn't alter the gearing to compensate for the bigger tires. I guess that explains why the Clod could out-pull a USA-1 back in the day despite its 550 motors.

[B.M.T.]

From what I can tell, they MAY of dropped a tooth or two on the pinion, that's it. Considering this: The Clod is geared 30:1. A Blackfoot is 14:1, and the Big Brute was as fast as the Foot with a lower revving motor (I have found that the old LeMans 05 is slower than a RS540, but hs more torque). The USA is going to on the tall side of gearing to start with

[pizzachaude]

The USA-1 pinions are 32 pitch 11 tooth, I couldn't find anything about the Big Brute pinion. I will try the 2 silver cans and the Novak Rooster and see how it goes and will let you know how it turns out.

I had no idea the Clod could outpull the USA-1, really? The Clod is on my wish list, just got to find one at the right price

[Rockcrusher]

Yeah. In RC Model Cars magizines they even hooked a Bullhead (same as Clod) bumper to bumper with a USA-1 and it dragged it all over the place. The USA-1 was quicker in the drag race though.

[B.M.T.]

Same results in the RCCA Monster truck shootout of 89. Clod just bettered the Bruiser, who's torque limiting clutch packed it in on a 40lb dead weight pull.

[B.M.T.]

Double post - still having trouble with this forum version and Firefox

[billg4]

Weight has a lot to do with the clod out pulling the USA1

A castle sidewinder even with out a fan will easily run 2 22t kyosho motors, I ran 2 19t in a clod with a sidewinder.

2 silver cans on 3s lipo was loads of fun, faster than 2 19's

[pizzachaude]

Well I've got 2 weeks vacation from work so I had some time to check the USA-1. First of all, the silver cans wont fit!! The 360 Megas that are there are 550 size and they have 4 holes to screw the motors in, to screw them in and meshing with the 11 tooth pinion requires you to use 2 offset holes on the can . Silver cans only have 2 holes so its impossible to reach the gears. The only way to do this would be to install a bigger pinion gear (say 13 or 14 tooth) so that you could use silver cans, but since the gearing is already tall I dont think its a good idea. This confirms the theory that the Big Brute/Big Boss/Hi Rider have a bigger pinion gear since they use a regular lemans stock 05 motor which has 2 mounting holes only. Since they also have smaller tires this works out fine.

So today I just reinstalled the mega 360 motors (22 turns) and wired them to my Novak Rooster and gave it a try. It works fine so far, but I could only drive it in my basement since there is way too much snow outside. The Rooster does get warm, but not dangerously so. I guess I'll wait till spring to give it a try outside and see how hot the Rooster gets. Do you guys think the Rooster, which has a 16 turn limit, will survive? Should I install a cooling fan?

The 2 motors are wired in parralel, if I wired them in series this will make it much easier on the ESC right? I know the truck would be slower, but this is fine with me. Any opinions on this. Thanks for the help!

[neverfollow]

Cooling fan wouldn't hurt..how about trying the Traxxas 21T Titan motors? They make a forward turning motor, and they offer a reverse turning motor.

I picked up the pair for my Twin Detonator. Haven't installed them yet though. I have Traxxas 12T 550's in it now, with one wired backwards. Waiting til they burn up, and then I'll put the others in.