Soldering advice

[Axeboy 297]

Guys

After a bit of advice, im having real trouble soldering a deans connector to a new lipo.

Im using flux, tinning both the deans and the wire beforehand but when it comes to actually joining the two, it never takes.

I think the iron isnt powerful enough at 25 watts.. but any other advice? Im thinking its not heating both quickly enough for it to take.

The wires are quite thick so I dont know if thats playing a part?

Its a real PITA!

[dyahipfakta 50]

I think you got it in one buddy your soldering iron just isn't up to the task. You can get cheap 60w ones which seem to do the trick. I find it helps to rough up the tabs on the connectors too to help get a stronger bond.

[SteveU30 1011]

25W should be enough to solder a deans connector. What tip are you using? You're best with a wide flat tip rather than a needle point tip in order to get enough heat transfer. Is the tip in good condition i.e. does solder coat the tip when you apply solder to it?

[Axeboy 297]

Its a flat wide tip.. and yeah the solder does coat the tip fine.

It struggles to keep the heat when it comes to contact with each other i think

[GregM 1109]

Flat wide tip & at least 40 W are recommended for soldering Deans connectors to those thick battery wires.

[SteveU30 1011]

Yeah actually 25W is a bit on the mild side, just checked my iron and I have it set to 40W for when doing Deans.

[Axeboy 297]

Thanks guys, i'll bag a new iron and hopefully that will help me finish the **** things

[SteveU30 1011]

If you can afford it get one that you can adjust the power on as it makes it much easier to tailor the heat of the iron based on the job you're doing.

[Champ85 609]

When soldering deans plugs, I always try to use two sets of "helping hands" to hold onto the wire and the plug (1 helper for each). One helping hand usually cannot hold both the wire and plug due to the distance between the alligator clips (too long so the alligators cannot get close enough to each other).

I wrap the wire in a thin but long strip of paper (wrap it like 8 times to make it thick) to protect the insulation from the "helping hand" alligator clip from digging in and damaging it due to heat (cheaper wires don't use real silicone for insulation and so the alligator teeth permanently deform the insulation if it isn't wrapped). Then I set it up so the deans plug is held such that the blade I want to solder is horizontal and the wire I want to solder to it is above it. Grab the deans by the plastic, not the blade (it won't deform at all). You don't want the alligator clip to act like another heat sink. I always pre-tin both the wire and the plug before putting the wire on top. I make it so the helping hand holding the wire "presses down" in the deans plug blade (no air gap between the wire and blade). Then I hold the soldering iron tip under the deans blade. Heat rises, and the contact between the plug blade and wire, plus a tiny amount of additional solder applied to the blade from the top right next to where the wire and blade are touching will melt and jump to the solder on the wire, which then also melts and finally makes for a very solid and good bond between the two parts. The pressure from the helping hands pressing the parts together allows the wire to get closer to the blade once the solder on both parts melts. Don't forget to put the heat shrink tubing on the wire first! Just slide it down the wire as far away as possible (all the way to the battery itself) so it doesn't shrink prematurely due to your soldering efforts. Once it cools, do the other wire and blade the same way. Then slide both heat shrink tubes down and heat gun them into place (or use a lighter).

[Shodog 1835]

Gregm is right you need at least 40w. I use a set of needle nose vise grips to hold the plug stable then use a x-acto hobby knife to hold the wire on the contact after I've solder it.

[WillyChang 1814]

it's not just the wattage, you need some heat mass too... big chunky lump of metal to store enough heat

so when you touch the work area it just doesn't all drain away & gets too cold to work.

Worst is when doing NiMH cells - it's one big metal can, gotta work fast.

Thin skinny pencil tip won't have as much heat mass as a thick chisel or hammerhead.

Higher wattage only helps to recover up to temperature faster, any good iron

should have a thermostat to turn the heater on/off... higher power doesn't

necessarily work any hotter than a lower watt iron.

Also check what solder you're using.

Modern ROHS lead free rubbish melts at higher temp.

Get some oldskool rosin core tin+lead and it will flow much smoother at less heat.

Yeah clamp down the Deans plug where it won't move.

Rubberband around pliers or I've got haemostats.

They're great too for handling the wire.

Have never bothered with helping hands gizmos. Fella over at RC10tech had a good idea,

he uses a giant washer held in a vice. Clip 2 wires to be joined at 9 & 3 o'clock

with tinned tips overlapping and solder thru the hole of the washer.

[danb1974 93]

+1 40w iron + wide tip + lead solder (the standard 60/40 SnPb used before all that lead free thingie) + some practice

[berman 5315]

Then slide both heat shrink tubes down and heat gun them into place (or use a lighter).

I always strip, solder and heatshrink one wire before even touching the other, wires have a natural tendency to straighten out and it is too risky to have the negative and positive wires touch while soldering the other. Even moreso when using highly conductive "helping hands". I also recommend using a rubber band around the second wire to be soldered and putting it around the wire and battery case as a precaution.

An ancient Weller 40w and rosin core solder is enough for me and a pair of vice grips for the plug. I haven't used flux since high school.

[mr crispy 2293]

Erm... well I do only use a 25w iron with a small tip and I've not had any probs with Deans plugs. I wonder if it's down to good quality solder and flux? I tried some lead free, vegetarian ecomental stuff years ago and it just wouldn't stick to anything!

Here's the quick guide to how I solder that I put on another thread

----------------------

Started fitting the Deans plugs last night and found like some had mentioned they are actually labeled + & - which I hadn't noticed before. Now I'm no soldering expert but it actually went pretty easy. I know some people have issues fitting these so I thought I'd show what I use.

I have an old basic soldering iron that's rated 25w still with its original tip, I must've had this for over 10 years at least. The solder and separate flux is from a store called Clas Olson in the UK. It wasn't the cheapest but is very good and lasts for ever.

The method I follow is I usually file the surfaces I'm about to solder a little and then wipe them with the flux and heat it on the tip until it burns off. Then add some solder to the tip and bring the surface to it until the solder flows and covers it nicely. Do the same with the wire, removing the insulation and tinning the ends first as described above. Then I add a little more solder to the tip and bring both the wire and surface (in this case) together onto the tip and hold it until I see the solder freely flow into and over both. Careful remove from the tip and watch it cool before letting go and putting any stress on the joint.

I should say between every section I wipe the tip with a damp sponge and I usually clamp the tip in a vice so it's the work that I'm holding. Unless I need to get into somewhere fiddly I find that's the best way for me. Took me about 5 mins to do a complete pair of male and female Deans plugs, taking my time. I even remembered to slide the heat shrink onto the wires first ! And my fingers were only "mildly warmed" by the whole experience Now to do the rest of my stash of batteries and ESC's. Actually I'll make up a few Deans to Tamiya conversion leads with some of the connectors I remove, should come in handy.

[94eg! 834]

At least 40w (60 is better).

Use some needlenose pliers with a tiny hair rubber band around the handles. These will clamp/hold the tinned deans connector while you hold the tinned iron in one hand and the tinned wire in the other.

This is the best way to do Deans.

Here is a pic I found on google to give you an idea. Though I don't shove the pliers into the connector like this:

[Axeboy 297]

Well, new solder gun came today... not much better, doh!

Im wondering if i should now try new solder (old style) or if it could even be something to do with the thick battery wire.

I just dont think I have the patience

Same issue more or less as before, both wouldnt take. Tried on another set of deans, filed the surface a little and dropped a touch of flux on the plate but the solder then wouldnt take at all. I might just order the **** things with the right connector next time

[danb1974 93]

Don't be shy with the flux, it helps heat transfer

[94eg! 834]

What new solder gun did you get? Gun type irons are useless for this type of soldering. Usually they are rated to be on for only 30 seconds followed by 5 minutes of cool down. This means there is no chance of it doing any work on heavy gauge wire.

[SteveU30 1011]

Agreed, guns are generally not a good way to solder a broad spectrum of components. You'd be better off with a standard iron, one that it adjustable is even better as you can adjust the power to suit the job. Maplin sell a relatively cheap one which I have used for years without problem and it solders Deans a treat: http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/50-w-solder-station-n78ar

[WillyChang 1814]

I've just started using a china clone of Hakko 936, its HALF the price of above!!

(methinks Maplin is making a motza...)

Amazed how good it works - rewired 5 ESCs including tricky PCB wire replacement,

brazed sockets to motor tabs, replaced some scruffy wires to Deans etc.

Didn't miss a beat, warms up from cold in about 1min.

(Power base unit says it draws 1A... wow that's like 200W+ no wonder )

After being on for about 5-8hrs... tip is starting to pit. Oh well, considering a

new Hakko sparepart cost more than whole clone unit... Hmmm...!

[Axeboy 297]

I'll bag a solder station like the one above and give it a try.

Doh

[Axeboy 297]

Finally got it.

Failed on deans but managed to a good few XT60's without much issues. Still found it trouble getting the XT60 to tin, but the edges around the connectors helped a lot.

[danb1974 93]

The one thing you should not overlook when soldering is use of a good flux (I like no-clean type flux - because, it does not burn and you don't have to clean it afterwards) and not be shy about it

The flux has two major roles, it helpes _a lot_ the heat transfer and it cleans the surface

Oh, and it keeps the solder in place and makes those nice shiny solderings

No, the thin flux core that is contained in the solder is not enough

[SB_Aust 42]

I use 80w soldering iron (same iron past 5 years) and the Hobbyking soldering aid 'Mr Jig'. Perfect job with Deans every time.

https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__17626__Mr_JIG_Soldering_Aid.html

They also sell adjustable soldering irons too (country voltage types available)

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=24790

[WillyChang 1814]

^^^^ guilty... that's same type of Hakko 936 clone I've acquired.

Can't find any sign of spareparts on HK though, had to source elsewhere.

Unit itself seems to work ok. Iron cable is a bit stiffer than Hakko original I suspect.

Finally got it.

Failed on deans but managed to a good few XT60's without much issues. Still found it trouble getting the XT60 to tin, but the edges around the connectors helped a lot.

Sometimes it helps to scuff the spot you're trying to solder to.

Nail file, rough sandpaper, hobbyknife tip, Dremel sanding drum - all good.