A different kind of shelf queen

[markbt73]

So I've been doing a lot of thinking about this hobby recently, and trying to determine where I want to go from here. I'm kind of in a rut, in some ways, and kind of overwhelmed by too many things I want to do, and even my recent workshop cleanup didn't clarify matters in my mind any.

Am I a collector? No, not really; I don't have anything terribly rare or valuable, and I'm not a stickler for originality in most cases. I have spent copious amouts of time and money on certain models (Optima), lots of time but not much money on others (Blackfoot), and many others have gotten sold or traded without getting the proper chance they deserved. I hate to see things sitting there languishing, but I also feel bad about scratching them up.

But why? I'm not "defiling" anyone else's collector items by using mine. It's not like there's some symbiotic relationship between models; a scratch on mine doesn't show up in the same spot on somebody else's NIB. I don't "owe" anyone keeping them pristine. I owe myself the proper enjoyment of them, as I see fit.

Which got me thinking: okay, so what does that look like? I like the idea of having a display shelf full of old RC cars in my room, but who says they have to be shiny and new to be displayed?

So here's what I'm planning: I hereby give myself permission to drive all my cars. As much as I want. But with two conditions:

1. I have to start from a nice clean restoration (or new build), and get some photos of it in that condition first. I also have to get a decent action photo of it, early on, before that first scratch if possible.

2. I use those photos to make up a little show placard to display with each car. Sort of a reverse Dorian Gray situation: the photo stays pristine, as the car gets used and worn and scratched. When something gets really worn out, or broken, and I can't get parts for it, then it gets retired to the shelf permanently, in that condition. Cleaned up a bit, but not restored again. Just preserved in the condition at which I last drove it.

Eventually, I will have a whole collection of well-loved RC vehicles, documentation of how they got that way, and memories of fun afternoons. And that idea appeals much more to me than a shelf full of shiny baubles that are too precious to use, or selling something because I'm scared to "ruin" it.

[Mad Ax]

I actually really like that idea

What might also be nice - if you really had the time and the inclination - would be to make a short journal for each car. Maybe just a document on your computer that you update each time you drive, clean or repair it - maybe for every time, maybe only if something interesting happens (a crack in the shell, a piece of irreparable damage).

I look forward to seeing how this works out

[Saito2]

Interesting thoughts, ones which I always grapple with too. I like the plan. I always take pictures of a finished new build or fresh resto. I like the placard idea too. Here's a couple things I've considered in your shoes.

1. spare body/tires/wheels. I've found these 3 things (sometimes just the body and tires) take the worst wear and tear. I overhauled a Frog 10 years back but bought those spares. When it was time to retire it (or at least give it a rest for awhile) it looked great as a shelfer with a new body tires and wheels. Having these spares really take the "cringe factor" out of a rollover or wreck. Go sliding 10 feet down the street on its lid? No problem, Ive got a "pretty" body safely packed away.

2. You're right about "scars". Those scratches and such make the vehicle "yours" and totally unique. I have a Vanquish I raced back in the day. I thought long and hard about gathering up the bits to restore it to "new" status. I decided to display it with the worn tires and original shell because those things made it "mine". It brings me a smile when I look over it, reminiscing how it got that way.

In the end, (and I ALWAYS have to remind myself this) life is short and we're dealing with little model cars meant to provide us with enjoyment. However we decide to do it, we should do it.

[Pintopower]

I like your spirit. They are just toys after all and deserve to be played with (wasn't that the premise of toy story 2?). All of my cars are runners. They are used heavily but not abused. That is the difference. If you aim to take care of a car and preserve the looks, then drive careful. If you dont trust yourself, buy a second body that you wont be crushed over if it is damaged. The shell is the main thing I am always concerned about.

I am a bit of a strange one when it comes to how I drive my cars. At lunch I have a Hornet at the office that I drive nearly every day, just to get me out of the place. There is a park I go to and a put a shell together that wont be easy to hurt. Simple and robust. Perfect runner but it looks great on my office shelf too. Then when I am at home, I like to go on long walks with my wife. We always take a pair of cars and walk all over the trails. Normally it is all about making the cars hold the water, food, and other misc that we don't want to. I even have a wagon that I hitch to a car on Saturdays so that when er go to the farmers market, the car carries everything home. Not like those suckers that need to use their hands...pffff.

I say drive them and dont worry about wrecking them. Drive nicely and they will last forever. My best example is this.

Painted in 1996 and driven so much that the back tires (which are original) are down to less than 2mm of tread on those chevrons. 19 year old paint on that guy.

Let those cars into the wild!

[markbt73]

Now THAT is some impressive driving, to wear the tires down that far and not have a scratch on the body!

I thought about the journal idea, but I don't think I have that kind of discipline. In fact, I know I don't. So just a "before" pic will do, I tihnk.

[taffer]

or maybe do as I do, if you check out my runners in my showroom I list a maintenance record which I keep updated when something happens while out driving

[Hibernaculum]

Eventually, I will have a whole collection of well-loved RC vehicles, documentation of how they got that way, and memories of fun afternoons. And that idea appeals much more to me than a shelf full of shiny baubles that are too precious to use, or selling something because I'm scared to "ruin" it.

I really like the level of thought you've put into this, and especially the rules.

It goes to show that even if we come to different conclusions about the best way to enjoy vintage models, if we've at least thought things through, we have a good chance of each being happy with the outcome. There's nothing worse than spending all that money on vintage toys, over a period of years, and then having regrets at the end one way or another.

My approach ultimately tries to achieve the similar things as yours, just at excessive cost, via the collecting route. But after a very long time in the game, I'm still happy.

H.

[matman]

So I've been doing a lot of thinking about this hobby recently, and trying to determine where I want to go from here. I'm kind of in a rut, in some ways, and kind of overwhelmed by too many things I want to do, and even my recent workshop cleanup didn't clarify matters in my mind any.

Am I a collector? No, not really; I don't have anything terribly rare or valuable, and I'm not a stickler for originality in most cases. I have spent copious amouts of time and money on certain models (Optima), lots of time but not much money on others (Blackfoot), and many others have gotten sold or traded without getting the proper chance they deserved. I hate to see things sitting there languishing, but I also feel bad about scratching them up.

But why? I'm not "defiling" anyone else's collector items by using mine. It's not like there's some symbiotic relationship between models; a scratch on mine doesn't show up in the same spot on somebody else's NIB. I don't "owe" anyone keeping them pristine. I owe myself the proper enjoyment of them, as I see fit.

Which got me thinking: okay, so what does that look like? I like the idea of having a display shelf full of old RC cars in my room, but who says they have to be shiny and new to be displayed?

So here's what I'm planning: I hereby give myself permission to drive all my cars. As much as I want. But with two conditions:

1. I have to start from a nice clean restoration (or new build), and get some photos of it in that condition first. I also have to get a decent action photo of it, early on, before that first scratch if possible.

2. I use those photos to make up a little show placard to display with each car. Sort of a reverse Dorian Gray situation: the photo stays pristine, as the car gets used and worn and scratched. When something gets really worn out, or broken, and I can't get parts for it, then it gets retired to the shelf permanently, in that condition. Cleaned up a bit, but not restored again. Just preserved in the condition at which I last drove it.

Eventually, I will have a whole collection of well-loved RC vehicles, documentation of how they got that way, and memories of fun afternoons. And that idea appeals much more to me than a shelf full of shiny baubles that are too precious to use, or selling something because I'm scared to "ruin" it.

This is a true shelf queen vintage , if it's a vintage RC of course .

Some RC'S should stay the way it is , with scratches , 80's style fix's ( most didn't have alot of money ) , Paint different in some cases .

To me that is true vintage , if you restore it . It's not that same RC now , the bones are gone . As that car has a history & that's what i like . If it's striped down , replaced parts the history is gone ?. Not too say you should not do that , as it's yours & we all have different

a pinions . I do like to restore as well , But some i find . I just can't , as theres some thing about it that ! i want too keep it as is .

( not sure why ) . I did see some one got a grasshopper SRB mix & that i would have keeped as is , as that's 80's Vintage in it's

prime . Some one had some great fun & spent some time on it , as you would have Markbt73 .

Great thread Markbt73 , i like the way you are thinking .

[Theibault]

RC cars are like shoes. When you have a new pair of kicks, you don't want to scuff them. However, you wear them, because that's what shoes are for, and after time, they get scuffed. Same with RC cars. They are toys made to be driven. When they are brand new, you don't want to scratch them, but it happens after they get driven. I love your idea. Go for it. I know in the long run it'll make you happy.

[Nitomor]

Sounds good to me.

I like to document the modifications I've done also. A build thread is a good way to capture it and eventually each car will have a spec sheet listing the ESC, Motor, Servo and any other mods as well as a photoshoot post build. I also try and keep a file of all the invoices for items purchased. I pretty much have them all just not organised it all yet, at the moment most of the invoices for each are in their original boxes along with the packaging/paperwork of any mods/hop ups they had.

It's a bit like an O&M manual for the model. I've just written on the back of the Bruiser manual, all the Transmitter settings (channel assignments/end points etc). It's good to keep a record of what you've done because you will forget through the passage of time.

A couple of years back I dusted off my TA02 Supra, it had been converted to Rally spec running a Cosworth Repsol shell. I couldn't remember all the mods I'd done, shockingly nearly 20 years ago (doesn't it go by in a blink) and pleased to find it fully ball raced, adjustable arms etc, I couldn't remember doing any of it.

I was just looking at configuring the LED's for my Mountain Rider, thankfully I'd previously documented all the settings for the Bruiser which made light work of it. So for someone looking to carry out a repair in years to come, it would be nice to have the notes to go with it.

For me the documenting is part of the whole process. My thoughts on the Placard was to *******ise those mini scale box art boxes that were on here a while back and maybe overlaying a picture of the actual car on it with the inside of the box containing a basic spec list of hop ups/finishing parts including paint colour code, servo, esc, receiver, hop ups and the like. I've also started numbering my shells as I complete them with a signature and the year they were substantially completed.

Enjoy it. Provenance and natural patina is where the value is on many original 1:1 cars. If it's a race car then it looks good with battle scars, same for bashers I guess. I don't like it when the shells get ripped/cracked/broken, maybe retire a shell when it gets to that stage and have a display of battle damaged shells, still very cool, like rally cars fresh off the rally stage mud, dents, missing bodywork and all!

Problem is having the space to display it all. It's no use tucked away in boxes for me.

Cheers

Nito

[njmlondon]

I have arrived at exactly the same conclusion and have sold all my pure shelf-queens.

I now only buy hard bodies and as they get used I gently weather them using pigments etc to blend in the aging. I think I got this idea from Wyoming whose amazing trucks just get better and better with use and age.

I have limited display potential so I give each car a little turn for a month or two then rotate them.

I am definitely feeling more Zen now I have cleared out the workshop and have a vision of what I am working towards.

[Mad Ax]

Some really great and inspirational ideas in this thread

[markbt73]

I really like the level of thought you've put into this, and especially the rules.

It goes to show that even if we come to different conclusions about the best way to enjoy vintage models, if we've at least thought things through, we have a good chance of each being happy with the outcome. There's nothing worse than spending all that money on vintage toys, over a period of years, and then having regrets at the end one way or another.

My approach ultimately tries to achieve the similar things as yours, just at excessive cost, via the collecting route. But after a very long time in the game, I'm still happy.

H.

I just wish I had made the mental jump from "old toys" to "vintage collector's items" much sooner. I bought, trashed, tore apart, and completely ruined more old models in the late '90s and early 2000s than I care to think about... when they were $25-50 on the consignment shelf at the local shop, I didn't even think in terms of historical value. It seems like you have always been more of a historian and curator.

[chevelle]

https://youtu.be/7VLeCg0kJTg

[chevelle]

https://youtu.be/7VLeCg0kJTg

[Hibernaculum]

I just wish I had made the mental jump from "old toys" to "vintage collector's items" much sooner. I bought, trashed, tore apart, and completely ruined more old models in the late '90s and early 2000s than I care to think about... when they were $25-50 on the consignment shelf at the local shop, I didn't even think in terms of historical value. It seems like you have always been more of a historian and curator.

For me, I think it was born from having such limited access to R/C in the 1980s. I ended up treating everything with almost this sense of "reverence", very early. You really appreciate stuff when you don't have it.

I was obsessed with R/C cars in the 1980s. But the cost was so prohibitive. I would literally sit all day sometimes, reading catalogues and magazines, wishing I had all the cars I wanted. The ones I did have, I drove endlessly. I would also log details about them in a notebook, writing their specs and dimensions down and comparing them with one another (like a frustrated future blog writer perhaps? ). Plus write lengthy lists about the others you could buy, and their specifications. I was around 10-12 years old at the time. What a geek.

By the early 1990s, I'd spend every spare cent saving up for used vintage models that were out of production, or the few newer kits that still reflected the aesthetic of the 80s models. And it was about actively "collecting" them even by then, because in 1992 I remember being acutely aware of the models that had been dropped from that year's Tamiya catalogue. And I developed a fussy appreciation for things too - I began restoring a Hotshot in 1993 and if I installed a NIP spare part, I'd keep the header card and bag afterward, in a box. I even kept used speed controllers and put them in labelled parts drawers, with the date of replacement.

I remember buying a NIP set of oval block tyres one time from a hobby shop (one of the last pairs), and just thinking "wow...I found this vintage buggy part from the 80s". And this was in 1993. Still well before the web. So I was a crazy vintage diehard even by then

Of course I had no idea the Internet was coming. To me at the time, it was inconceivable that any unbuilt kits of those older cars still existed in the world. When ebay came, well... #mindblown. Joined 1999 and started buying.

I still have regrets though

I mean, back in the 1990s, I bought what I could, but the little disposable income I had as I began working, was not enough. Many hobby stores still had swathes of old parts stock I should have bought up. I bought a fraction of what they had. I remember leaving parts on the shelf thinking I would never need them because the particular cars were SO rare I would likely never own a decent one. For example, I held NIP Wild Willy tyre sets in my hands at a hobby shop in 1995, thinking I would never have the car. They were maybe $30ea? I put them down, and left them.

On the bright side, I did buy a lot of other things that same day with my limited cash, mostly cheaper NIP parts, and about 20 decal sets for 80s buggies, that were $1ea.

We all have regrets though, so don't feel bad Mark. What matters now is the amount of 'awareness' you have going forward, for how to approach your vintage enjoyment in a way you'll be happy with when you look back in another decade. By then, perhaps today will seem like "good old days" as well.

I'm already nostalgic for the early days of the internet

[beefmuffin]

I totally get your thinking Mark... but for me it's weird b/c the real magic is having a physical connection back in time to that period in my life. In order for it to really click - the illusion or whatever - it needs to look brand new. Whether it's a built model or NIB.

At the same time I still love playing with and driving around my runners, and there's magic in seeing the really nice vintage ones run also. But as soon as the "time portal" ones get all banged up they loose their time-portal-iness. So when it comes to straight-up running and bashing I'm no stickler. I love my Mad Bull and my weird mutant Frog and Monster Beetle and DF-02 runners. But it's a totally different kind of value to me than the vintage collecting side of things.

Collecting up sealed vintage NIB kits is sort of like the closest I can get to stepping into a holodeck projection of my dad's shop in the 80's.

[Wez-li]

Collecting up sealed vintage NIB kits is sort of like the closest I can get to stepping into a holodeck projection of my dad's shop in the 80's.

If an nib kit is sealed, how do you know the kit's actually in there?

I'm not a massive fan of nibs as it is, but a "sealed" kit is worthless IMO, need to at least open it up and check out the goods inside once in a while!

[markbt73]

I totally get your thinking Mark... but for me it's weird b/c the real magic is having a physical connection back in time to that period in my life. In order for it to really click - the illusion or whatever - it needs to look brand new. Whether it's a built model or NIB.

At the same time I still love playing with and driving around my runners, and there's magic in seeing the really nice vintage ones run also. But as soon as the "time portal" ones get all banged up they loose their time-portal-iness. So when it comes to straight-up running and bashing I'm no stickler. I love my Mad Bull and my weird mutant Frog and Monster Beetle and DF-02 runners. But it's a totally different kind of value to me than the vintage collecting side of things.

Collecting up sealed vintage NIB kits is sort of like the closest I can get to stepping into a holodeck projection of my dad's shop in the 80's.

Thiinking about yours and H's responses, it's striking how much someone's childhood can influence their thinking later in life... when I was growing up, my dad had several friends with hobbies involving old/vintage/classic vehicles. There was the Jaguar restorer, who campaigned an XK140 in vintage races, and the husband/wife wing-walker team who did airshows in their vintage Stearman biplane, and all the folks he played tennis with, all of whom seemed to favor 20 year old sports cars. I grew up surrounded by old machines being put through their paces regularly, and I guess that's why I don't like to see something on display that is capable of moving.

Go to Oshkosh or another big airshow, and you can walk around old WWII fighter planes. But you don't really understand them until a P-51D does a low flyby at 250mph, that exhaust and propeller noise shaking you to the very bones. A 1958 Corvette is an item of great beauty sitting in a garage, but it's an absolute beast when you're wrestling it around bends on a country road. (But oh so much fun.) A vintage machine doing what it was designed to do is a totally different experience than sitting roped-off on display.

I understand the desire to keep them pristine and captured in a bubble of time. But I just can't do it. Don't get me wrong; I'm not going to go out tomorrow and jump my Blackfoot over a house or anything. But if it isn't used-up by the time my hands are too arthritic to work a transmitter, I will have felt like I did something wrong.

[beefmuffin]

Thiinking about yours and H's responses, it's striking how much someone's childhood can influence their thinking later in life... when I was growing up, my dad had several friends with hobbies involving old/vintage/classic vehicles. There was the Jaguar restorer, who campaigned an XK140 in vintage races, and the husband/wife wing-walker team who did airshows in their vintage Stearman biplane, and all the folks he played tennis with, all of whom seemed to favor 20 year old sports cars. I grew up surrounded by old machines being put through their paces regularly, and I guess that's why I don't like to see something on display that is capable of moving.

Go to Oshkosh or another big airshow, and you can walk around old WWII fighter planes. But you don't really understand them until a P-51D does a low flyby at 250mph, that exhaust and propeller noise shaking you to the very bones. A 1958 Corvette is an item of great beauty sitting in a garage, but it's an absolute beast when you're wrestling it around bends on a country road. (But oh so much fun.) A vintage machine doing what it was designed to do is a totally different experience than sitting roped-off on display.

I understand the desire to keep them pristine and captured in a bubble of time. But I just can't do it. Don't get me wrong; I'm not going to go out tomorrow and jump my Blackfoot over a house or anything. But if it isn't used-up by the time my hands are too arthritic to work a transmitter, I will have felt like I did something wrong.

Totally agree with all that. I love seeing cool machines doing what they do. I love your plan and glad I get to see the results of you and others running their models! For me it helps enrich the experience of seeing the untouched one sitting on a shelf too. Carry on good sir!

[Hibernaculum]

On the good subject of seeing vintage things run...

Despite my love of NIB vintage, I fully support the idea of running vintage models (even if I don't do it enough, and everything I am about to write is "do as I say not as I do" ).

I'm not talking about stuff that just looks vintage, like reissues. That's the cheap way out (anybody can buy a reissue kit and run it guilt-free).

I'm referring to building and/or running true vintage kits.

And I know many of you do run - with your vintage runners. But I also hear a lot of people say "Oh I would never build a NIB vintage kit" or in particular "I would never run a NIB vintage kit".

My personal goal has always been to try to collect multiples of every car I like. (Please don't begrudge me...it's been a lot of hard saving, over a long time!). The idea was to at least give myself the option to do whatever I want, over time. I love vintage Tamiyas. And I want to build many of them, from kits, and run them. Guilt free. Not all of them. But at least some of them.

After all, you are getting older every second. If you really appreciate the classic Tamiya models, don't you owe it to yourself to indulge, and build a NIB vintage kit one day? And run it? How can you go your whole life being a huge Tamiya fan, yet never build and drive at least one true vintage kit?

Of course, this whole concept is very much "finances allowing". I fully respect it is not an option in many cases. But not all cases.

On that note, I guess the real question might be: who has built a NIB vintage kit lately? And who has built and run one lately?

(I'm exempt from answering, because I asked the question )

[beefmuffin]

Personally, I've never built a complete vintage NIB kit. I always do something like the Fox project I'm selling currently - collect up all the parts. I've built plenty of vintage body sets... but so far never a vintage kit. Don't think I could bring myself to do it if the parts can be assembled without sacrificing the integrity of an 'artifact'! Just my own feeling on it... in no way do I think my way is the only way or the only right way.

[emory70]

Me, I'd never want a really valuable vintage rc. I love all the rereleases. When I was a teenager, my first hobby rc was a Monster Beetle. It lived in the trunk of my 1968 Oldsmobile 4-4-2. See a cool place, stop, charge run, leave.

Now I have the money to build and play with whatever I want. I spend when I have to, save when I can. I don't believe in shelf queens, but I try to not beat on my junk too hard.

I like the idea of documenting all the specifics of my rides, but I don't know if I'd go that far with it.

[Nobbi1977]

I don't believe in shelf queens, but I try to not beat on my junk too hard.

That almost sounds like it could be from a totally different type of forum...

[emory70]

Thou hast gotten me.