Jason1145

Tamiya Club Official Top 10 Fastest RC'ers List

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The Clod is the only car we haven’t really tried with yet, it was my excuse for getting a second 4300kv goolrc set but I didn’t ever put them in it. I did stick twin regular ESCs in it with a Y lead (after melting the original single ESC in a stupid accident). With the same big 2s lipo & silver cans it ran a lot faster & was a real handful, very hard to stop it wheeling. However when I checked properly it was only actually doing about 9mph so I didn’t bother even entering it! I’m flat out busy rebuilding 1:1s at the moment so haven’t got time to play with it right now nor had a chance to look on here - sorry, but glad to see you have all been getting some great runs in, was fun catching up! 

I did pick up a new 120A goolrc ESC that can run up to 6s (& it came with programming card that works on the 60A ESC too). I found time to stick a new diff in Blackfoot & made a proper detachable wing for Thunder Shot for some testing last weekend, unfortunately the weather was very bad so we didn’t have much time for running or trying the other cars with 4s, but we got it running in Thunder Shot, I post up the official entry later when I’ve up loaded the video. 

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Official entry:

 Thunder Shot (Super Dragon body)

4x4

17t pinion 

5200kv 4 pole & GoolRC 120A esc (you could warm your hands from the heat being kicked out by the big ESC fan!)

Boomerang wheels & tyres all round. 

4s lipo (2 regular 2s in series) 

61.1mph or 98.3kph

 

It was good to see how the wing really made a difference, last time I bodged one on & fitted a high torque servo & saver at the same time so didn’t know which made the massive difference to keeping it under control.

Previous best on 3s with 4300kv was 50.3 mph & with 5200kv was 57.4. The talk of KV ratings & batteries over the last few pages was very interesting. My 3s is a little 2200 but 65C/130C where as the two 2s batteries are 4000 30C/60C.

We started out back with the 4300kv motor as its max voltage is listed as 12v & the 5200kv is only 9.6v so I was worried about killing the 5200kv. But we only got 56.8mph with 4s on the 4300kv so I put the 5200kv in & nothing melted! Looking at their ratings sheet it seems they just listed the max voltage to give the 50,000rpm no load limit:

VU73Nzy.jpg

Its the first few rows (3650 motors). 

I had just been going for bigger is better & just try it up to now but thought a bit more simple  , (if slightly backwards) maths could be used, please correct me if I’m wrong:

So I measured with Thunder Shot that the motor does 25 revolutions per meter.

Then at 1m per second it will do 25 rps, or more usefully x 60 = 1500rpm

1mps is 2.2369mph so

33mps = 73.8mph

So at 73.8mph the motor should be doing 33 x 1500 = 49.500rpm

So even with a bit of wheel spin on the sand & ballooning tyres it’s not going to be far off max RPMs. 

 

However Blackfoot with its 19t pinion from the Frog gear set is only doing 18 revolutions per metre, so works out at just about 100mph at 50,000rpm, but with the same 3s & 5200kv motor has only managed a best of 49mph when Thunder Shot got 57mph with lower gearing. 

Unfortunately Blackfoot rolled & snapped a new wheel axle on 3s before we could try 4s. But I think I should probably drop down to an 18T or even 16T pinion before trying again. Or just shove in one of the 3674 motors! (Though I think my batteries may be the limiting factor) But all the longer motors have a 5mm shaft so would need the Tamiya pinion drilling out to fit it & I don’t think that would fit with the rules?

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On 4/24/2019 at 6:46 AM, Jason1145 said:

Ive just basketed a 75t spur and 25t pinion for this car and then added some other little bits for another car and now I'm looking at a £70 basket... this is why I'm cash poor!

 

Hey there

Any news regarding the Rat speed runs? :)

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8 hours ago, DK308 said:

Hey there

Any news regarding the Rat speed runs? :)

Both the spur and pinion have arrived... just need the time machine now to freeze everything so I can install it and go run it :)

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Lists Updated ;)

@Andyrt200 nice runs with the TS, it's shifting now!

Yeah you can't mess with drilling out the pinion gears ;)

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On 5/5/2019 at 7:08 AM, Jason1145 said:

Lists Updated ;)

@Andyrt200 nice runs with the TS, it's shifting now!

Yeah you can't mess with drilling out the pinion gears ;)

Great thanks! Slowly creeping up, not sure it will get much faster now. I may try running on an empty road now it drives much better just to see if sand slows it at all, but I’m not sure it will make any difference. 

Thanks for confirmation on BF pinion drilling, I’ll try a smaller one on the 5200kv then :)

Good luck with the Rat, I still love that car! 

Let me know when you have finished the time machine, I could really use one too ;)

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On 5/5/2019 at 4:08 PM, Jason1145 said:

Yeah you can't mess with drilling out the pinion gears ;)

Doesn't appear to be anything special about the standard pinion though? How's drilling the standard one any different to finding an aftermarket one that would fit the bill?

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1 hour ago, nbTMM said:

Doesn't appear to be anything special about the standard pinion though? How's drilling the standard one any different to finding an aftermarket one that would fit the bill?

What will you use to drill that pinion with? I've seen several people try to drill pinions on both drill presses and by hand. They all had the same issue. The new hole was not concentric. To get proper mesh and no bind, the pinion needs tp be drilled quite precisely. Sure if you have a lathe, then it's much easier. But drilling it by hand or with a press? In 25 years of RC'ing, I've yet to see it being done well.

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6 hours ago, nbTMM said:

Doesn't appear to be anything special about the standard pinion though? How's drilling the standard one any different to finding an aftermarket one that would fit the bill?

You can't question the rules... without rules there'd be chaos.

On a serious note though, it's just the rules ;)

From day one of this thread it's just been the rule to keep the gearing unmodified to a degree, you can change the motors and ESC's and radios and servos and batteries... we have just left the gearing alone... atleast that part will remain Tamiya, if Tamiya gears fit great but there hasn't been any modding of Tamiya gears... unless you go accept your entry will be moved into the modded category of course, so it's available if anyone wants :)

 

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4 hours ago, Jason1145 said:

You can't question the rules... without rules there'd be chaos.

On a serious note though, it's just the rules ;)

From day one of this thread it's just been the rule to keep the gearing unmodified to a degree, you can change the motors and ESC's and radios and servos and batteries... we have just left the gearing alone... atleast that part will remain Tamiya, if Tamiya gears fit great but there hasn't been any modding of Tamiya gears... unless you go accept your entry will be moved into the modded category of course, so it's available if anyone wants :)

 

Quick question regarding the rules. Does the install of a Yeah Racing motor mount in a TT02B equal a gearbox mod? What about the metal diff gears from GPM? They equal the stock gearing, they are just made of metal rather than plastic :)

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On 5/3/2019 at 12:53 AM, Andyrt200 said:

Official entry:

 Thunder Shot (Super Dragon body)

4x4

17t pinion 

5200kv 4 pole & GoolRC 120A esc (you could warm your hands from the heat being kicked out by the big ESC fan!)

Boomerang wheels & tyres all round. 

4s lipo (2 regular 2s in series) 

61.1mph or 98.3kph

 

 

Over 60mph is a massive achievement! Well done 👍

On 5/3/2019 at 12:53 AM, Andyrt200 said:

But all the longer motors have a 5mm shaft so would need the Tamiya pinion drilling out 

Can you not get 32dp pinions (if that's the pitch) in 5mm bore? 

On 5/3/2019 at 12:53 AM, Andyrt200 said:

Looking at their ratings sheet it seems they just listed the max voltage to give the 50,000rpm no load limit

If you go for a castle motor, they've double that rating, rated at 100,000rpm...🙄

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19 hours ago, Jason1145 said:

From day one of this thread it's just been the rule to keep the gearing unmodified to a degree, you can change the motors and ESC's and radios and servos and batteries... we have just left the gearing alone...

We have? It says that "aftermarket internal gears that fit in stock Tamiya gearboxes and on stock gear shafts are also allowed". By drilling a tamiya gear, it has become an aftermarket gear. Though, I think the line should be drawn at regular pinion/spur gears with a grub screw or bolt hole pattern. If it's a tamiya-specific gear (e.g. a gear in a Bruiser 3-speed transmission) then it shouldn't be allowed to be replaced with an 'aftermarket gear' since it will almost certainly have to be custom made to suit and that's outside the capability of most members.
Imo if you're modifying an existing gear (tamiya or otherwise) by drilling the bore or bolt pattern to be the same as a regular pinion/spur gear that you could find off-the-shelf then that's just being thrifty. 

Would also be good to have some clarification on the yeah racing TT02 mount (which almost everyone in this thread would be using if not using 0.6mod gears) and also aftermarket diffs which are TT01/TT02 specific

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9 hours ago, Wooders28 said:

Over 60mph is a massive achievement! Well done 👍

Can you not get 32dp pinions (if that's the pitch) in 5mm bore? 

If you go for a castle motor, they've double that rating, rated at 100,000rpm...🙄

 

Loads of 5mm bore mod 0.8/32P pinions out there. Robinson and others make them. I use them in my Arrma Raider XL.

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3 hours ago, nbTMM said:

We have? It says that "aftermarket internal gears that fit in stock Tamiya gearboxes and on stock gear shafts are also allowed"

My interpretation, is to try keep things in the spirit of tamiya, to stop cars becoming a, triggers broom, yeah it's the same car, it's got a different chassis, gearbox,  front and rear arms, shocks, wheels and tyres, but it's still the same car 🤔

Saying that, there are some tamiya cars out there, you could replace everything with upgrades and bling!

My view, if it's an off the shelf pinion, then it can be used, I don't think all of us have used tamiya specific pinions anyway.

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4 hours ago, nbTMM said:

We have? It says that "aftermarket internal gears that fit in stock Tamiya gearboxes and on stock gear shafts are also allowed". By drilling a tamiya gear, it has become an aftermarket gear. 
Imo if you're modifying an existing gear (tamiya or otherwise) by drilling the bore or bolt pattern to be the same as a regular pinion/spur gear that you could find off-the-shelf then that's just being thrifty. 

If you drill a Tamiya gear then to me you have modified it and then your entry will go into the modified section.

The rules have been pretty clear for the first 100 pages of this thread and for the  umpteen members already on the lists so far, however,  if something in the rules needs to change and if it's accepted by a few other members to show it makes sense, then yes it can be changed sure so all comments welcome.

We all rely on honesty from the posters anyway to say what gearing they use, and the knowledge of members will point out something fishy if it's not true.

This whole thread is only a bit of fun, I don't want it turning into a heavy reading section ;)

Thoughts on the current rules wording and possible changes welcome.

Cheers guys

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19 hours ago, DK308 said:

Quick question regarding the rules. Does the install of a Yeah Racing motor mount in a TT02B equal a gearbox mod? What about the metal diff gears from GPM? They equal the stock gearing, they are just made of metal rather than plastic :)

The rule was meant to stop people cutting away sections of the actual gearbox housing to fit larger gears than were designed to fit in there... the Yeah Racing motor mount from the TT02B should be ok.

Same goes for aftermarket gears. If they all fit in the stock Tamiya gearbox housing all good. 

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On 5/6/2019 at 3:58 PM, DK308 said:

What will you use to drill that pinion with? I've seen several people try to drill pinions on both drill presses and by hand. They all had the same issue. The new hole was not concentric. To get proper mesh and no bind, the pinion needs tp be drilled quite precisely. Sure if you have a lathe, then it's much easier. But drilling it by hand or with a press? In 25 years of RC'ing, I've yet to see it being done well.

Interesting, thanks! I’m lucky my uncle gave me his old lathe when I was a teenager, but I probably wouldn’t have thought about using it for that without you saying. Though I won’t be doing it for speed running!

17 hours ago, Wooders28 said:

Over 60mph is a massive achievement! Well done 👍

Can you not get 32dp pinions (if that's the pitch) in 5mm bore? 

If you go for a castle motor, they've double that rating, rated at 100,000rpm...🙄

Thanks, we were pleased! It is kind of a Triggers broom of a car but it’s been rebuilt using all stock Tamiya parts (less the shocks) so still really the 30 odd year old car in design at least so chuffed it can cope so well with going that fast, with the wing on at least. It’s a shame you can’t get the proper Thunder Shot bodies any more it would be interesting to see if the wing on that actually worked. 

I’ll stick with the proper Tamiya pinions in Blackfoot for now at least, would be interesting to see how fast it can go on 3s first, I’m sure the 19t just too tall. Also I think we may have cooked the new 120A ESC already, we were only bashing on 2s & it was smelling nasty. I stuck an old 60A & it ran much better. 

The Castle motors sound good, but we’re not even getting to the 50k limit of ours, I think I’d need some special batteries for that & I don’t want to spend that much! 

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15 minutes ago, Andyrt200 said:

It’s a shame you can’t get the proper Thunder Shot bodies any more it would be interesting to see if the wing on that actually worked

I'm sure, Team bluegroove , had one, though there seems to be nothing listed on their eBay store atm 😳

 

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9 hours ago, Wooders28 said:

I'm sure, Team bluegroove , had one, though there seems to be nothing listed on their eBay store atm 😳

 

It would probably be easier to just pick up another used car with a body really. It took a couple of old cars to build it in the first place, I never actually had a proper body, it was a mates car I swapped for a swamp boat I made back in the day. It was just a basher that turns out to be good at speed running. Of course speed running had lead to it being rebuilt a couple more times with all new parts by now! 

Looking a pictures of Thunder Shots there seem to be quite a few with big extra wings on very much like the one I stuck on but the instructions don’t show it. I don’t think the one that is integral to the original body would do much.

On a different note, out of interest are those Castle motors 2 pole? I imagine the 50k limit of the GoolRC ones is the electronics pulsing the magnetic field round the can. Its vaguely interesting to see every one of their motors has the same 50k limit & they are all 4pole. 

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15 hours ago, Andyrt200 said:

Looking a pictures of Thunder Shots there seem to be quite a few with big extra wings on very much like the one I stuck on but the instructions don’t show it. I don’t think the one that is integral to the original body would do much.

I looked at a few for some of mine, quite liked the Schumacher carbon wing for a tenner, but ultimately, you only need one if the car is wanting to swap ends (there's a thread somewhere on wing effectiveness, and in a podcast, Schumacher said that they tested cars in a wind tunnel, and the wing did little for down force, more just to keep it in a straight line), and all mine seem to go straight (kiss of death.....😬)

15 hours ago, Andyrt200 said:

On a different note, out of interest are those Castle motors 2 pole? I imagine the 50k limit of the GoolRC ones is the electronics pulsing the magnetic field round the can. Its vaguely interesting to see every one of their motors has the same 50k limit & they are all 4pole. 

All my castle motors are 4 pole, 100k limit, I had a look at esc info a while back (can't find the link now 🤬) and the esc's where good for 250k rpm (can't remember if that was 2 or 4 pole through, even if 2, it's still enough for a 4 pole). This is the motor I'm running 3s with.

 

https://www.castle-center.com/Car-BL-Motors/1406-Series/Castle-Brushless-Motor-1406-7700KV-4-Pole-Sensorless/

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6 hours ago, Wooders28 said:

I looked at a few for some of mine, quite liked the Schumacher carbon wing for a tenner, but ultimately, you only need one if the car is wanting to swap ends (there's a thread somewhere on wing effectiveness, and in a podcast, Schumacher said that they tested cars in a wind tunnel, and the wing did little for down force, more just to keep it in a straight line), and all mine seem to go straight (kiss of death.....😬)

All my castle motors are 4 pole, 100k limit, I had a look at esc info a while back (can't find the link now 🤬) and the esc's where good for 250k rpm (can't remember if that was 2 or 4 pole through, even if 2, it's still enough for a 4 pole). This is the motor I'm running 3s with.

 

https://www.castle-center.com/Car-BL-Motors/1406-Series/Castle-Brushless-Motor-1406-7700KV-4-Pole-Sensorless/

That motor looks nice obviously get what you pay for, but a bit out if my price range, you can get 3 separate sets of 3s safe GoolRC motor & ESC combos for the price of that motor alone. It would be interesting to see what difference there was when hooked up to the same battery in the same car, but I’m not spending that much to find out!

 

Interesting about the wing I was thinking it’s probably more the sides of it stabilising the air flow than the rear tires being pushed down, out of all the cars I have in first page (about 8 I think from memory) it was only the Blackfoots that’s went straight every one of the others were a nightmare! 

The wing I stuck on this time is a 58416 from a Rising Fighter, I checked my back order history, @Jason1145 you’re right speed running does cost a lot in parts :wacko:

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1 hour ago, Andyrt200 said:

That motor looks nice obviously get what you pay for, but a bit out if my price range

I've never bought a new one! 😳

I paid £50 for a 3800kv 4 pole with a Sidewinder esc, and £60 for the 7700kv with a Mamba Max pro esc (6s - no turn limit), still could have had 2 new Goolrc, but half as capable so 🤷‍♂️ 😂

 

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All this talk of running Clodbusters, I'll throw down the gauntlet with a stock run.

 Not quite enough speed to blow the dust off it but a blistering top speed of 9mph.....

2 x 540 silver can 

Standard gearing 

6 cell nimh pack 

New category Jason?

 

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13 hours ago, Hyperlite said:

All this talk of running Clodbusters, I'll throw down the gauntlet with a stock run.

 Not quite enough speed to blow the dust off it but a blistering top speed of 9mph.....

New category Jason?

 

I'm thinking that wasn't 3s?! 

Category wise, my bullhead slotted into 2, the silver can and the 4wd (somehow at the bottom ,with a 15.5, even though there's a 12 and a 13.7 above me 🤔🙄

I've dug out the 2 x 15t firebolts,  so hopefully get them nailed in soon and take it for another run 🚀😎

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14 hours ago, Hyperlite said:

All this talk of running Clodbusters, I'll throw down the gauntlet with a stock run.

 Not quite enough speed to blow the dust off it but a blistering top speed of 9mph.....

New category Jason?

 

Can't believe you did that on a public road you maniac!!

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