Brand new brushless motor smoking

[Jonathon Gillham]

Is it normal for a brand new out of the packet brushless motor to smoke when run for the first time? I'm just testing the motors that I recently bought and one of them is smoking and feels hotter than I would expect after a quick run up the driveway. The other motor did more runs and didn't smoke or smell, and while warm wasn't as warm

Motors and ESC are Speed Passion and all brand new

21.5T

FDR is 3.7

TA07

I asked earlier about the endbells as they are both 21.5T motors but one endbell says 10.5T on it. I'm 99.99% sure they are both 21.5T motors as performance was very similar (back to back test in same car, battery etc but had to swap the motor out so a 10min gap). Funnily enough its the 21.5T endbell motor which smokes.

I'm thinking they shouldn't smoke, but then it may be that they are burning off some glue or something and its normal? Pretty sure none of my other have, but my experience is limited to 3 Trackstar motors before these.

[LongRat]

Definitely not normal, and needs to be investigated before it fails completely and takes out the ESC with it.

[Effigy3]

3 hours ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

Is it normal for a brand new out of the packet brushless motor to smoke when run for the first time? I'm just testing the motors that I recently bought and one of them is smoking and feels hotter than I would expect after a quick run up the driveway. The other motor did more runs and didn't smoke or smell, and while warm wasn't as warm

1

Smoking is bad.  It's likely the bearings if it's smoking but still going after some running time.  If it smoked and then stopped working, then it'd likely be the sensor board.  Regardless of why it's smoking, you definitely need to send it back for service/replacement! If it were me, I'd send back the wrongly labeled motor as well.  Where did you buy them from?  I've only ever bought directly from SP and have never had an issue. 

[Jonathon Gillham]

11 minutes ago, Effigy3 said:

Smoking is bad.  It's likely the bearings if it's smoking but still going after some running time.  If it smoked and then stopped working, then it'd likely be the sensor board.  Regardless of why it's smoking, you definitely need to send it back for service/replacement! If it were me, I'd send back the wrongly labeled motor as well.  Where did you buy them from?  I've only ever bought directly from SP and have never had an issue. 

They were from RCMart so I'm not worried about the return, other than the time it will take. I have emailed them to ask if they will send more before I return them so Imhave a chance of racing in a week.

Thanks for the answers, its what I expected but always good to get confirmation from those who know more than me!

[Backlash]

Did you tell RC mart that both motors have issues?

If the motor that has the end plate that is marked 10.5 is OK other than the 10.5 markings, have you considered swapping the end plates over, and then returning just the smoky motor with the 10.5 endplate........ At least you will be able to race.....

[Jonathon Gillham]

8 hours ago, Backlash said:

Did you tell RC mart that both motors have issues?

If the motor that has the end plate that is marked 10.5 is OK other than the 10.5 markings, have you considered swapping the end plates over, and then returning just the smoky motor with the 10.5 endplate........ At least you will be able to race.....

Thats a very good point, I hadn't thought of that. I have told them about both motors now.

Had to send them a video of the smoke, its pretty funny how much smoke comes out from everywhere so quickly. Apparently that is with the manufacturer now to review

[Jonathon Gillham]

Ok stupid question time (I haven't asked one on here for at least a week so its fine right?). To change the timing or remove the end bell my Trackstar motors have little hex bolts on the end bell which you loosen, move end bell, tighten. The Speed Passion don't have these but appear to have really long screws through the entire motor, with the hex head at the pinion end of the motor. I take it these are the only ones and the wayto both remove the endbell and adjust the timing? Just checking as with a warranty claim i don't want to run into problems...

[Jonathon Gillham]

Also, what is the chance that the end bell is causing the smoke? Thats just a metal plate right so couldn't be causing the problem? I'm just thinking if I swap them over then will I run into problems

[Wooders28]

2 hours ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

The Speed Passion don't have these but appear to have really long screws through the entire motor, with the hex head at the pinion end of the motor. I take it these are the only ones and the wayto both remove the endbell and adjust the timing?

I've not removed the end bell, but thats how you alter the timing.

Have you tried the 5.5t yet? 

[Wooders28]

2 hours ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

Also, what is the chance that the end bell is causing the smoke? Thats just a metal plate right so couldn't be causing the problem? I'm just thinking if I swap them over then will I run into problems

I'm not 100% sure of the witch craft that's in a sensored motor, but if the pair are new, and not right, wrap them and send them back.

[Jonathon Gillham]

26 minutes ago, Wooders28 said:

I've not removed the end bell, but thats how you alter the timing.

Have you tried the 5.5t yet? 

So that will be how you take the endbell off then too, ok easy enough.  I guess when I take it off I can see if there is anything attached to it or if its literally just a round bit of metal.

 

I haven't tried the 5.5T yet, I've just got the cars working (although the F1 needs raising as the wheels are too small for the setting I have it on) and I haven't even given them a decent run.  I'll need to take the TA07 to the local school and use their courts.  My driveway isn't good enough and is too short and narrow, and my road is a coarse chip so not ideal either.  I won't try the F1 until the race meet (there is about an hour or so of practice time and I have enough batteries to do a lot of testing in that time) as I don't want to scratch up the chassis or ruin the tyres.

The 5.5T will be far too quick for around here, but should be ok for the school courts.  I could of course put that in and make my first race meet mod class...

[Wooders28]

9 minutes ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

The 5.5T will be far too quick for around here, but should be ok for the school courts.  I could of course put that in and make my first race meet mod class...

If the other motors are away getting replaced,and it means you get to race! 

Drop the epa a smidge until you get the feel for it. 😎

[ncpantherfan71]

My advice is to not take them apart,  that way you can not be accused of screwing them up just return and get what you paid for.   Even the wrong endbell isn't acceptable for a new out of package motor.   Sounds like it was assembled with whatever spare parts they had laying around.  Unfortunately that has been my experience with speed passion gear,  kind of hit an miss.  I had to replace an esc after about a month at the track because it decided to let the magic smoke out,  and this was in a 21.5 mini Cooper,  absolutely no stress on it.   I sent email to speed passion and never got a reply.  Electronics is an area you get what you pay for.   In my race cars all I run is Tekin now.   Yes it is expensive but the customer support is outstanding.   I had a 2 day conversation through email with the president.  How many other companies would do that with someone who is just an average hobbiest. 

Just to FYI,  I am not in any way sponsored.   My actual racing skills are limited,  I'm the rolling chicane at the carpet track.  

 

[Jonathon Gillham]

2 hours ago, Wooders28 said:

If the other motors are away getting replaced,and it means you get to race! 

Drop the epa a smidge until you get the feel for it. 😎

Or ask to run it in stock and just promise not to go too fast?

I would run it in allcomers with the 5.5T rather than mod, as I would destroy the car trying to keep up.

2 hours ago, ncpantherfan71 said:

My advice is to not take them apart,  that way you can not be accused of screwing them up just return and get what you paid for.   Even the wrong endbell isn't acceptable for a new out of package motor.   Sounds like it was assembled with whatever spare parts they had laying around.  Unfortunately that has been my experience with speed passion gear,  kind of hit an miss.  I had to replace an esc after about a month at the track because it decided to let the magic smoke out,  and this was in a 21.5 mini Cooper,  absolutely no stress on it.   I sent email to speed passion and never got a reply.  Electronics is an area you get what you pay for.   In my race cars all I run is Tekin now.   Yes it is expensive but the customer support is outstanding.   I had a 2 day conversation through email with the president.  How many other companies would do that with someone who is just an average hobbiest. 

Just to FYI,  I am not in any way sponsored.   My actual racing skills are limited,  I'm the rolling chicane at the carpet track.  

 

I agree you get what you pay for, these are an upgrade from my other gear which is Trackstar (they are in my offroad buggies). I think of Speed Passion as middle of the road rather than cheap though, and with good reliability rather than top performance, similar to hobbywing. And if you believe the RRP then it should be the same as Tekin, but it could be that its always discounted. I'm happy with how they perform and the ease of setup so far, and loving those little bullet plugs, those are enough to make me adopt speed passion for everything!

[ncpantherfan71]

1 hour ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

Or ask to run it in stock and just promise not to go too fast?

I would run it in allcomers with the 5.5T rather than mod, as I would destroy the car trying to keep up.

I agree you get what you pay for, these are an upgrade from my other gear which is Trackstar (they are in my offroad buggies). I think of Speed Passion as middle of the road rather than cheap though, and with good reliability rather than top performance, similar to hobbywing. And if you believe the RRP then it should be the same as Tekin, but it could be that its always discounted. I'm happy with how they perform and the ease of setup so far, and loving those little bullet plugs, those are enough to make me adopt speed passion for everything!

The bullets are a neat idea and it does give easier mounting options than the tabs at times.  I really wanted them to perform.  Maybe I was one of the unlucky ones and I got a couple duds.   I still use the last esc and motor,  but they are not in my race cars.   I guess I really got turned off when they didn't bother to answer my email.  With stock blinky racing,  like mini, I have the motor timing cranked up to 45-50 degrees and speed passion motors require separate end bells to adjust more than 10 deg. with the version   I had,  and I was always way down on power.

I don't know how serious your group is,  but here I am running against guys with hand built $150-$200 motors and $800-900 awsomatix touring cars.   Even with me using Tekin esc and off the shelf Trinity motors I still don't have the horsepower. 

[Jonathon Gillham]

19 minutes ago, ncpantherfan71 said:

The bullets are a neat idea and it does give easier mounting options than the tabs at times.  I really wanted them to perform.  Maybe I was one of the unlucky ones and I got a couple duds.   I still use the last esc and motor,  but they are not in my race cars.   I guess I really got turned off when they didn't bother to answer my email.  With stock blinky racing,  like mini, I have the motor timing cranked up to 45-50 degrees and speed passion motors require separate end bells to adjust more than 10 deg. with the version   I had,  and I was always way down on power.

I don't know how serious your group is,  but here I am running against guys with hand built $150-$200 motors and $800-900 awsomatix touring cars.   Even with me using Tekin esc and off the shelf Trinity motors I still don't have the horsepower. 

The clubs here all have a group who will spend a fortune and are constantly upgrading.  I like to buy the gear off those people when its 6 months old.  I'm not sure about the indoor club as this will be my first race meet, but from what I have seen there are some who have all the expensive gear (including Awesomatix) and then most who have a mix of good chassis with cheap motor etc.  I tend to be in the latter group, my buggies are Kyosho and among the best, but with Trackstar motor and ESC.  My F1 car is a TRF102 with Speed Passion gear, but my touring car is a TA07 which I chose based on price and bang for buck really.  It will be good enough for my ability for a while, and if I find that I'm consistent but can't get to the front then I'll look at an upgrade.

From what I can tell here the 21.5T blinky class is chequebook racing, so I'll probably work out what I'm doing then move to Super Stock which is 13.5T but ironically appears to be more fun and cheaper than the slower class because people have moved to it to get away from having to spend money for the slightest advantage.

[ncpantherfan71]

4 minutes ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

The clubs here all have a group who will spend a fortune and are constantly upgrading.  I like to buy the gear off those people when its 6 months old.  I'm not sure about the indoor club as this will be my first race meet, but from what I have seen there are some who have all the expensive gear (including Awesomatix) and then most who have a mix of good chassis with cheap motor etc.  I tend to be in the latter group, my buggies are Kyosho and among the best, but with Trackstar motor and ESC.  My F1 car is a TRF102 with Speed Passion gear, but my touring car is a TA07 which I chose based on price and bang for buck really.  It will be good enough for my ability for a while, and if I find that I'm consistent but can't get to the front then I'll look at an upgrade.

From what I can tell here the 21.5T blinky class is chequebook racing, so I'll probably work out what I'm doing then move to Super Stock which is 13.5T but ironically appears to be more fun and cheaper than the slower class because people have moved to it to get away from having to spend money for the slightest advantage.

I wish we had a class like the 13.5.  We have a class called usvta,  25.5 Binky spec tires and old American muscle car bodies. I picked up a used evo6 to replace my 417 when I get the time to go.  Like you,  my F1 is a 102 but I do use Tekin escs and Trinity motors.  The only class I keep up with the latest and greatest is mini,  and that's because it's my favorite, but no mini class now.... 

[Wooders28]

4 hours ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

Or ask to run it in stock and just promise not to go too fast?

I would run it in allcomers with the 5.5T rather than mod, as I would destroy the car trying to keep up.

Our club is pretty much , RWYB , it's just your heat pace that decides which final you're in. I'm sure you'll have a practice session? Start @ 50% epa on the throttle, see how it feels , then ramp it up.👍

[Prescient]

Don't forget, speed passion ceased trading / production in real terms for a fair period. It's still not overly clear on what basis they are operating and managing production although they are up and running again.

I wonder if portions their stock, as certainly the motors remained plentiful during this period were either reconditioned returns or parts bin specials for want of a better term.

A couple of their new motors I have received recently have looked less than perfect. They work ok though.

[Jonathon Gillham]

So RCMart have said to semd it back and they will send it to Speed Passion for repair. I know if I had bought locally they would have just replaced it from their stock and then sent it back. Has anyone had experience with RCMart in a case like this? (I know supporting local and all that and then you don't have these problems, but buying locally would have cost 3 times as much so worth a bit of hassle now and then to save that much!)

[Jonathon Gillham]

Just an update, they have now said they'll send a new one as soon as they receive the old one, can't ask for much more I guess.  A bit annoyed I have to pay the shipping to return it though when its faulty, will argue that point once I have my new motor.  And I asked if I could swap the endbell and they said to go ahead, so no issues voiding the warranty or anything and I now have 1 working motor which will be acceptable to the club.

[Effigy3]

I've only ever bought from SP directly.  Their warehouse I think is in Illinois?  Everything I've ever gotten has been picture perfect as well.  It's c r a p p y that you had this experience. 

[Jonathon Gillham]

4 hours ago, Effigy3 said:

I've only ever bought from SP directly.  Their warehouse I think is in Illinois?  Everything I've ever gotten has been picture perfect as well.  It's c r a p p y that you had this experience. 

Its a pain to deal with but not the end of the world. I still like speed passion and it hasn't put me off them. I only have trackstar to compare with and its definitely a step up from that. The ESC setup was so easy and I'm a big fan of those connectors, Wooders sent me a 5.5T motor too so its great being able to swap between the 2 without having to solder.

[Effigy3]

Those end bell bullet plugs are what sold me on them as well.

[Jonathon Gillham]

They have confirmed that the faulty motor has arrived. I don't understand how I can send it at 4pm on Thursday and it arrives there 5 days later, including the weekend. I bet the replacement takes 2 weeks to get here, like all my orders. Also bought new spurs and pinions for my TRF102 as I got the last lot wrong, now running all 48p gears in both onroad and offroad so hopefully I build up a decent range