Unexpected Marui Hunter and what to do with it

[Yalson 514]

Recently I went back to my parents' house to have a look through all my old RC gear from the late 80s and early 90s, as I'd got into a conversation with a friend who I did not know was an RC racer and wanted to know what I still had and what sort of condition it was in. It was all pretty much as i remembered it except for one rather bedraggled but complete chassis which I did not remember at all and could not even recognise.

After some research it turned out to be a Marui Hunter and it appears to have been a drunk eBay purchase from some years ago, as I don't remember having bought it and had no clue it was there. It seems to be in reasonably good condition and lacks usable electronics, although it must have been kept in a garage or shed before I bought it as it needed a clean, some TLC and a modern radio, ESC and motor loadout.

I have started buying the electronic components (ESC and servo so far) and have sourced a repro shell and wing for it, as well as a scrap Marui Galaxy chassis for spares, as I gather the Hunter and Galaxy share a basic chassis and some parts.

The rebuild looks pretty simple and painting the shell will be no problem as that used to be my favorite part of a build, but i do have some queries about the type as I have never owned a Hunter before and had never remembered even setting eyes on one, although it clearly didn't get into the attic on its own. Thank you in advance if anyone has the knowledge and expertise to answer any of these.

1.) The Galaxy and Hunter share a chassis and the scrap Galaxy chassis I bought still has all the independent suspension parts in place. The Hunter chassis has its monoshock at the rear and it seems to work, but is it worth the effort of transferring the oil shocks from the Galaxy to the Hunter, or would the results not be good enough to be worth the hassle?

2.) The Hunter instruction manual I saw online indicated that the kit originally came with three pinions: 18T, 19T and 20T. The chassis I have only has one, which is attached to an ancient-looking 540 motor, although I haven't removed it yet to find out which one is fitted. Does anyone know what pitch these gears are, or have a way of working it out?

3.) The monoshock at the back of the Hunter rather unsettles me, partly because it looks like a very peculiar layout and partly because it seems to cause an alarming amount of positive camber on the rear wheels when it is sitting still. Does this just mean the shock needs recommissioning or is this the car's natural stance and it will settle down when it is moving? Also, would fitting the rear shocks and mounts from the Galaxy cure this tendency, as it looks horribly wrong to me, having come from lovely flat-stanced, double-wishboned Kyoshos.

4.) Way back in the day I briefly owned a Marui Toyota Land Cruiser before a friend crashed it and broke the chassis beyond repair. I cannibalised the car for usable parts, including the rear wheels and adaptors (which are the same as those originally fitted to the Hunter). These fitted perfectly well on to my Tamiya Grasshopper I, so given that the Marui wheels and adaptors fitted on the Grasshopper, does this mean that adaptors intended for the Grasshopper will fit on the Hunter, allowing me to have a wider choice of wheels and tyres?

Thanks for reading and any help would be appreciated. I am rebuilding the Hunter as my daughter is getting to an age where she is becoming really interested in machines and I would love for us to be able to use it together. That said, I recently looked in our garage and found two other long-forgotten eBay purchases: a pretty decent-looking Tamiya Grasshopper II and a very sorry-looking Super Sabre chassis in need of a lot of care and attention. So it looks like I have a lot of work and hunting down spares on eBay in my future.

[yogi-bear 2321]

6 hours ago, Yalson said:

1.) The Galaxy and Hunter share a chassis and the scrap Galaxy chassis I bought still has all the independent suspension parts in place. The Hunter chassis has its monoshock at the rear and it seems to work, but is it worth the effort of transferring the oil shocks from the Galaxy to the Hunter, or would the results not be good enough to be worth the hassle?

I had a Marui Galaxy as a kid and loved it. My own biased opinion is that the Marui setup is better.

 

6 hours ago, Yalson said:

2.) The Hunter instruction manual I saw online indicated that the kit originally came with three pinions: 18T, 19T and 20T. The chassis I have only has one, which is attached to an ancient-looking 540 motor, although I haven't removed it yet to find out which one is fitted. Does anyone know what pitch these gears are, or have a way of working it out?

I don't know the pitch, but I have heaps of spare pinions. I'll have a look and send some photos, to show all three.

6 hours ago, Yalson said:

3.) The monoshock at the back of the Hunter rather unsettles me, partly because it looks like a very peculiar layout and partly because it seems to cause an alarming amount of positive camber on the rear wheels when it is sitting still. Does this just mean the shock needs recommissioning or is this the car's natural stance and it will settle down when it is moving? Also, would fitting the rear shocks and mounts from the Galaxy cure this tendency, as it looks horribly wrong to me, having come from lovely flat-stanced, double-wishboned Kyoshos.

My dodgy memory says it will settle down at speed. I only really had two issues when running my car as a teenager, the mounts at the rear for the shock was prone to breaking and the where the idler gear sits in the chassis would wear out. But I do recall have lots of fun with it too.

 

6 hours ago, Yalson said:

4.) Way back in the day I briefly owned a Marui Toyota Land Cruiser before a friend crashed it and broke the chassis beyond repair. I cannibalised the car for usable parts, including the rear wheels and adaptors (which are the same as those originally fitted to the Hunter). These fitted perfectly well on to my Tamiya Grasshopper I, so given that the Marui wheels and adaptors fitted on the Grasshopper, does this mean that adaptors intended for the Grasshopper will fit on the Hunter, allowing me to have a wider choice of wheels and tyres?

Yeah, I have many Marui Galaxy now and one I bought as a project had Hornet II rims and tires on there, so options are good.

 

6 hours ago, Yalson said:

Thanks for reading and any help would be appreciated. I am rebuilding the Hunter as my daughter is getting to an age where she is becoming really interested in machines and I would love for us to be able to use it together. That said, I recently looked in our garage and found two other long-forgotten eBay purchases: a pretty decent-looking Tamiya Grasshopper II and a very sorry-looking Super Sabre chassis in need of a lot of care and attention. So it looks like I have a lot of work and hunting down spares on eBay in my future.

Parts for at least the Grass Hopper should be readily available. Pictures would be great 😀

[Yalson 514]

17 hours ago, yogi-bear said:

I had a Marui Galaxy as a kid and loved it. My own biased opinion is that the Marui setup is better.

I only really had two issues when running my car as a teenager, the mounts at the rear for the shock was prone to breaking and the where the idler gear sits in the chassis would wear out.

Parts for at least the Grass Hopper should be readily available. Pictures would be great 😀

Thanks yogi. Just to clarify, when you talk about the 'Marui setup', do you mean the Hunter or the Galaxy, as they are both Marui cars?

I presume you mean the mounts for the shock on a Hunter. Would putting the Galaxy shocks on the Hunter cure this?

I can do pictures. Do you want them now or after the rebuilds?

[yogi-bear 2321]

3 hours ago, Yalson said:

Thanks yogi. Just to clarify, when you talk about the 'Marui setup', do you mean the Hunter or the Galaxy, as they are both Marui cars?

oops, I meant the Galaxy. I think there is the same issue on the Fox with the mono shock at the front and hotshot with the mono shock at the back. You get a better suspension setup when its dual and independent.

 

3 hours ago, Yalson said:

I presume you mean the mounts for the shock on a Hunter. Would putting the Galaxy shocks on the Hunter cure this?

Both the Hunter and Galaxy use the same shock mount to the chassis, so they both have the same problem. When I get a chance I'll take some pics, but that might be a day or so.

 

3 hours ago, Yalson said:

I can do pictures. Do you want them now or after the rebuilds?

either, I just like to see pics 😀

[yogi-bear 2321]

apologies for the delay, these are the 3 pinion gears. I don't know the pitch and was going to measure and work it out, but I haven't had anytime this week. If you need some I am happy to send you a set.

 

This is where there shock tower can break. I don't recall it ever happening to me, but a number of restoration projects I've bought had this issue. The Hunter and Galaxy share the same chassis, only the colour is different.

 

This issue happened to me at least twice, the idler gear shaft would wear out the socket it sits in, causing the gear to skip. I'd often repair with epoxy resin, but it eventually I'd just get another chassis.

 

Apart from that, the Galaxy was a fun car to drive, very stable and not bouncy. My only regret is not taking any pics of it.

 

[Yalson 514]

Thanks for that, Yogi. I will bear all this in mind. I am currently looking for either another Hunter or another Galaxy so me and my daughter can have one each. Of course, it would probably be easier to rebuild one of the Tamiya or Kyosho cars I have in storage, but I have always been been drawn to the unusual and eccentric choices.

Here is the Hunter as it is at the moment.

 

[yogi-bear 2321]

that looks to be in pretty good condition. 

Cars come up every so often, so I don't think you'll have too much trouble finding another Hunter or Galaxy. If you weren't too far away I could do a good deal on one (I have about 11 of them, sad but true), but freight out of Australia is ridiculous.

If you want to replace the wing, you'll get a decent reproduction body from Team Blue Groove on ebay.

[Yalson 514]

Yeah, it all looks pretty servicable. It's just been left for a long time and needs refettling. I already bought a new Blue Groove body and wing, so that is in the car's future. I am currently trying to source another chassis so I can build two decent cars out of three donors. I know how prohibitive postage from Australia is, but I am hopeful I can get one from somewhere in Europe.

[Yalson 514]

There are cars out there, as this shows, but £100 is too much, even if this one looks like it has been someone's shelf queen. Why is it that everyone seems to paint them in box art colour schemes?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Marui-Hunter-2wd-In-Amazing-Condition-Very-Rare/282978255586?hash=item41e2d182e2:g:uvsAAOSwp41bBUW4

[yogi-bear 2321]

yeah, that is a bit dearer than I'd want to pay too. I'm sure with bit of patience something better will come along.

What paint scheme are you thinking? I've been tempted to paint a chassis and body in a yellow and black combination.

 

[yogi-bear 2321]

I bought this body a couple of months ago. I'd probably never normally paint one like this, but at least its different.

[Yalson 514]

Ha ha! Flames are always nice.

I will be painting it in some variation of the black/orange/white combination that used to be my racing colours BiTD. I am thinking maybe partially replicating the box art with white on top and black below, but with a thin orange randomly edged band between the two which will make it look like ripped paper. I did a Mid body in a similar style (only diagonally across the body) years ago and it looked great, but I sadly don't have any pictures from back then.

 

[Yalson 514]

Similarly treated but older Peugeot 405 T16, which we used to race on a Mid chassis on tarmac.

 

[Yalson 514]

Gradually acquiring parts for the rebuild. Already got the ESC, a servo and just bought the radio gear. Now I have just got back from my local model shop with this. 15T, apparently. Longer can than a regular 540, so it might hang out the side of the body a bit. I was only after a 27T stocker, so this is a bit of a change of tack. Cheap, though, so I can always replace it later if required.

 

[Static Age 65]

I've got a Hunter runner, its a great fun buggy. However even with a stock 540 motor on a modern battery the spur gear will fail pretty quickly. The spur is the only part that you cannot fit bearings to. Seems mad that it would be made that way. 

You can buy a spur gear on shapeways that has bearing recesses. I've been using one for a while & its holding up well. 

Regarding the pinion, I'm sure they are 0.6 mod. 

Looking forward to more of your pics, your hunter will really fly with that 15T 550 motor. Mines nippy enough with a 21T 540. 

 

[Yalson 514]

Ha ha! That's what I was afraid of, Static. If you consider the two parts of your post, I fear the second half will contribute greatly to the first. I will hunt down one of those spurs, though, as that sounds ideal for my purposes.

I am actually a bit annoyed with myself over the 550. I wanted a fairly low-powered brushed motor and specifically asked for a 27T stocker, but then the chap said they didn't have one in stock (Hah!) (I'd arrived the day before their next consignment), but they did have a 20T 550 instead, which sounded reasonable to me. Then I got it home and found that it was in fact a 15T and not what I wanted at all. Not the chap in the shop's fault – I've known him for years and he wouldn't mess me about. I just wasn't clear enough about why I wanted what I wanted and he picked up the wrong motor. I may keep it for one of the other cars I will be rebuilding after the Hunter, as given the Marui's previously noted weaknesses in the gearbox department and the 25-year gap since I last picked up a transmitter, I fear for the safety of both the car and the general public if I fit it straight away.

[Yalson 514]

Also, for those who may be interested, this arrived in the post yesterday. A brand new 3ch radio system with model memory and microscopic receiver, £25 all in, including postage from China. I cannot understand how there is any margin in that for the manufacturer at all. Unless they are playing a very long game and attempting to slowly bankrupt all of their competition in the free world so they can then charge what they want. But who would willingly make a loss for that long without a guarantee that it would work? Unless they are being subsidised by the Chinese state for reasons unknown. But I am not going too far down that geopolitical rabbit hole, as that way madness lay.

Still, nice radio.

 

[Yalson 514]

7 hours ago, Static Age said:

You can buy a spur gear on shapeways that has bearing recesses. I've been using one for a while & its holding up well. 

Regarding the pinion, I'm sure they are 0.6 mod.

 

Hey Static, is this the gear you are referring to?

https://www.shapeways.com/product/XQXJRV5N4/hunter-galaxy-idler-gear-20t-48t-for-ball-bearing

I would be glad if they were .6 Module as that was what the Optima Mid originally used and I have loads of them.

[Static Age 65]

That's the spur gear. As I said its held up to a fair few runs so far which is more than I can say for the stock spur.

I'm pretty sure that they are 0.6 mod, same as the tamiya sand scorcher. I'm using the 19 tooth pinion, seems spot on for decent acceleration & a good turn of speed. These old hunters are a little fragile & spares are not easy to come buy so you only want to go so fast with it.

Handling isn't the best although it is slightly better than some entry level buggies from the era. Not to bad off road but they understeer very badly on tarmac as the front end is very light. 

[Yalson 514]

So it doesn't have bearings in the original kit? I wonder why not. Fitting it with plain bearings is cheap, but understandable industry practice. But not fitting any at all just seems dumb.

The suspension set-up on the Hunter has been baffling me since I sat down to look at it. The car was supposedly seen as a rival to the Frog, but the specs - 540 motor, oil shocks at rear, friction dampers at front - suggests it might be closer to the Hornet. The inboard shocks at the front and odd monoshock rear concern me, so I may replace them with the fully independent oil shock suspension from the Galaxy chassis I bought.

 

[yogi-bear 2321]

My Galaxy came with brass bearings for the rear drive train and maybe plastic bearings for the front (they might have been brass as well, can't quite remember). But that spur gear setup was very dodgy and caused me grief quite a few times. But then again I think a lot of cars at the time has less than optimal setups, maybe in part because RC was in it infancy and maybe in part because the cars where probably rushed to market without a lot of testing. Maybe it was Marui, that Big Bear also has some horrific design choices.

I think the Galaxy RS was the model that was the competitor to the Frog, and price wise it sat just under the Frog but dearer than the hornet or grasshopper, which is why I bought might. I don't remember seeing the Hunter on the shelves, but it must have been priced closer to the hornet or grasshopper. 

[Yalson 514]

11 hours ago, Static Age said:

That's the spur gear. As I said its held up to a fair few runs so far which is more than I can say for the stock spur.

What material is your spur/idler made out of, Static? It has three plastics available here, as well as steel. Steel seems a bit like overkill to me and might chew up all the rest of the gears, but is there a benefit to one plastic over the other, or did you just go with the default?

[Yalson 514]

1 hour ago, yogi-bear said:

My Galaxy came with brass bearings for the rear drive train and maybe plastic bearings for the front (they might have been brass as well, can't quite remember). But that spur gear setup was very dodgy and caused me grief quite a few times. But then again I think a lot of cars at the time has less than optimal setups, maybe in part because RC was in it infancy and maybe in part because the cars where probably rushed to market without a lot of testing. Maybe it was Marui, that Big Bear also has some horrific design choices.

I think the Galaxy RS was the model that was the competitor to the Frog, and price wise it sat just under the Frog but dearer than the hornet or grasshopper, which is why I bought might. I don't remember seeing the Hunter on the shelves, but it must have been priced closer to the hornet or grasshopper. 

The CJ-7/Land Cruiser was also not ideal in many ways. I had one briefly and even at that early stage of RC ownership I could tell that a lot of compromises had been made in the design. The materials were too brittle, the servo saver was too soft, the receiver batteries had a tendency to work loose and the ABS body, while very handsome, was totally unsuited to the task. But then, you could say that about any car with an ABS body. I can't honestly understand why companies used to mount them on their more basic models, as they must be more expensive to make and they certainly aren't any more resistant to damage.

The Grasshopper 1/Hornet were about as perfect as a basic RC car can get. The GH1 was basically indestructible. Before I started racing and when I was therefore perhaps less invested in the longevity of my car, me and a friend – having subjected the poor machine to just about every indignity we could think of, including driving it down a long flight of concrete steps – decided to see how strong it really was. So on one occasion when my parents were away, I engineered a ramp and drove it out of a second-storey window on to a concrete patio. It landed on its nose, bounced and eventually ended up on its roof in a flower bed. After recovering it, we discovered the only damage was that the battery cover had come off, the ABS body had shed another few chips and the central one of the three mounting points on the front bumper had snapped. I stopped trying to hurt it after that.

The Optima Mid used to eat idler gears fairly frequently, which was annoying as it meant you had to take the whole rear gearbox apart to replace it, which was a pig of a job if you were at a race meeting. We got round this by always having an entire spare car to hand in case replacing it took longer than we had available before our next race. The LWB Mid also understeered a lot, as when Kyosho extended the wheelbase, they just moved the front axle forward by however much it was. An after-market spares company called Racecraft – who were more famous for making repro bodyshells of popular cars with air scoops over the spot where the ESC was mounted – made their own LWB Mid chassis which was the same length as Kyosho's, but they added half the length to the front and half to the rear, which apparently balanced the car a lot better. They were hard to come by, though and you had to use a Racecraft shell with it, as the original Kyosho one wouldn't fit over it very well. The Mid also used to break front suspension arms very easily as they were very exposed. The mounting points for the front bumper were hopeless, meaning that anything bigger than the tiny one which came with the kit was frequently as sacrificial as the front arms, only with the added possibility of also pulling the threads out of your front diff casing, as the screws from the bumper mount also held the front of that on. I think the idea was that if you were a Mid driver, you should be good enough not to crash into things which would break your car. Nice idea, but hopelessly naive. The anti-roll bars on the Mid were also completely useless and just made it more difficult to work on. I don't know anyone who had one who didn't throw them straight in the bin as soon as they'd run it once.

I can't think of a single thing wrong with the Lazer ZX-R, though. That was a lovely car. Like a Mid with all the bugs ironed out. The front bumper was still rubbish, but I'd learned not to hit so many things by then.

The Galaxy RS being the competitor to the Frog is an odd thought, since the RS was released after the Hunter, which was seemingly a competitor to the Hornet. The Frog, however, came out before the Hornet, so Marui clearly had some weird release schedules going on.

[Static Age 65]

12 hours ago, Yalson said:

What material is your spur/idler made out of, Static? It has three plastics available here, as well as steel. Steel seems a bit like overkill to me and might chew up all the rest of the gears, but is there a benefit to one plastic over the other, or did you just go with the default?

I don't recall having any option when I bought one, so I guess the default plastic. I agree, steel would be overkill. 

[Static Age 65]

18 hours ago, Yalson said:

So it doesn't have bearings in the original kit? I wonder why not. Fitting it with plain bearings is cheap, but understandable industry practice. But not fitting any at all just seems dumb.

The suspension set-up on the Hunter has been baffling me since I sat down to look at it. The car was supposedly seen as a rival to the Frog, but the specs - 540 motor, oil shocks at rear, friction dampers at front - suggests it might be closer to the Hornet. The inboard shocks at the front and odd monoshock rear concern me, so I may replace them with the fully independent oil shock suspension from the Galaxy chassis I bought.

The Rest of the kit has brass bushings. These are easily replaced with 1150 size bearings, same as most tamiyas. The inboard front shocks are quite unique for the time, the rear mono shock sort of works if you set it up quite soft. No doubt twin oil shocks at each end will be an improvement. I've done no mods to mine except bearings for reliability. Its fun to drive but it will never be a racer. Enjoy it for what it is.