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Juggular

DT03. Dog bones or a Sway bar?

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I was looking at @ThunderDragonCy's thread on DT03.  Which was a stead dig into a deep rabbit hole. ;) 

I want to stay shallow.   

All my "backyard bashers" get the "standard care package": full ball bearings, CVA shocks + Sport Tuned motor.  For DT03, I'll include some nose weight and differential clay as well.  I like how some of the weights are cleverly wedged in!   

 

Having gotten basic things out of the way... if I were to treat DT03 with just one thing, what do you think it should be? 

I'm attracted to two things; dog bones and the sway bar. But other suggestions are welcome.  

As @ThunderDragonCy noted, the plastic drive cups bind.  But only when the bottom of the tire goes up to the bottom of the chassis.  The chassis would hit the ground before binding becomes an issue.  

It seems many buy the sway bar set, but don't use them.  

So, what do DT03 drivers think?  

 

 

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3 hours ago, Juggular said:

if I were to treat DT03 with just one thing, what do you think it should be? 

Metal out drives (Tamiya 9804237) although that does mean new driveshafts too, I went for 3racing Heavy duty ones (about £15).

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3RACING-DT02-03-HD-Universal-Shaft-Heavy-Duty-For-1-10-TAMIYA-DT-02-DF-03/183815718206?hash=item2acc45453e:g:rioAAOSwVK5c38JB

Adustable turnbuckles help tweak set ups, but that means a set up tool , found this one works quite well, for £3!

https://www.modelsport.co.uk/index.php?product_id=412594 

An alloy servo mount helps stiffen up the front end (mainly as it's tapped holes , not the self tappers,  so a bit more purchase 💪

Apart from shocks (which you've got) and wheel/tyre options (meant running 8mm wide 12mm hexes on the rear for truck wheels) thats all I've got on mine, and it does everything I ask from it. 

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8 hours ago, Juggular said:

I was looking at @ThunderDragonCy's thread on DT03.  Which was a stead dig into a deep rabbit hole. ;) 

I want to stay shallow.   

All my "backyard bashers" get the "standard care package": full ball bearings, CVA shocks + Sport Tuned motor.  For DT03, I'll include some nose weight and differential clay as well.  I like how some of the weights are cleverly wedged in!   

 

Having gotten basic things out of the way... if I were to treat DT03 with just one thing, what do you think it should be? 

I'm attracted to two things; dog bones and the sway bar. But other suggestions are welcome.  

As @ThunderDragonCy noted, the plastic drive cups bind.  But only when the bottom of the tire goes up to the bottom of the chassis.  The chassis would hit the ground before binding becomes an issue.  

It seems many buy the sway bar set, but don't use them.  

So, what do DT03 drivers think?  

 

 

Ah Rabbit Holes. If you only knew how much i loved them..... 😉

I wouldn't bother with sway bars. I never used more than one and now don't use any. 

If you are still on the kit springs, i would recommend much stiffer rear springs. It supports the weight better and reduces unsersteer. I use the 53927 DF03 gold rear springs which are 47g/mm or 2.7lb rate. The whole set is about 15 quid but you get three sets of springs. If you want to just get one set of springs i would suggest Core RC CR179 2.8 Big Bore springs. They should go straight on the rear shocks, but if they don't quite retain on the collars Traxxas part 3768 for a couple of quid gives you some collars that will work. 

I don't use turnbuckles on the front as it has good camber anyway and the arms are much stiffer which is good for the truck wheels i use. The rear tutnbuckle is 3x38mm which are easy to buy as a pair so if you have some ball nuts and adjuster ends you can make your own. Adding camber at the rear does improve grip. 

Red o rings for the dampers. 

In my opinion the kit tyres are junk. If you get anything, get some good tyres appropriate to your most used surface. 

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Drive shafts definitely as the plastic out drives rub on the wishbone on full compression which is magnified by the soft rear springs inability to hold the back end of the car up. You can't really pop in to lighter oil as all that does is allow the rear to slap the deck repeatable. @ThunderDragonCy is right about the DF-03 spring set there bang on for the DT-03, I use those with 60w oil. 

I've got turnbuckles on mine front and rear and ended up very near the angles if I'd just left the plastic upper arms on so not sure I'd bother with those. 

The sway bars are so loose in their mounts that any effect they have is pretty minimal so I've left mine in as it's bit of a job to remove them.  

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Adding sway bars are really just going to reduce traction on a off road vehicle used on low traction surfaces. We would typically only reach for them if we want more steering push, we wanted to increase rotation ability or we wanted to reduce traction overall to stop rollovers. 

As others have suggested beefing up the rear suspension may be more useful and will improve rotation/initial steering in a similar way to adding a rear sway bar, but with the bonus of improving rear clearance and reducing bottom out. 

Lots of options there. The dogbones really suck on the TT02B but I think less of a issue on the DT03. If your only using CVA dampers the dogbones don’t interfere that much. Only only when you try to get more suspension travel with a longer stroke shock (like df03 set or trf set) that you see a lot of binding etc. 

 

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12 hours ago, ThunderDragonCy said:

Ah Rabbit Holes. If you only knew how much i loved them..... 😉

lol... yes, sometimes that's true!  That's because you went all out, and all the way through.  I've got some projects that's not showing me the light at the end of the tunnel.  

3 votes for beefing up the springs was rather unexpected. I'm glad I asked. Thank you.  

In hind sight... mine came with relatively deep scratched on the bum.  It looks like it happened only once or twice.  Other than that, it's pretty much new.  Damper moves slowly thanks to the DT03 shocks.  But the springs are weak indeed.  This is a rather unusual combination.  Slow moving, but weak.  Speed and Strength are two different things!!! ("That's elementary, Watson.")  

I like how Tamiya went soft this time.  Since the 80's, Tamiya springs were too stiff.  This change of a direction might mean proper springs for the future.  

I think I'll get the DF03 springs.  I should have some red o-rings already.  

I was curious about the sway bar, but I'll let go of that.  But 3racing universals look good. I'll abuse the plastic dog bones for a while. When that develops an issue, I'll get the 3racing ones + Tamiya cups.  

 

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On 7/16/2019 at 9:00 PM, Wooders28 said:

Metal out drives (Tamiya 9804237) although that does mean new driveshafts too, I went for 3racing Heavy duty ones (about £15).

I ended up ordering the drive cups and 3Racing shafts.  I wanted to thank you for pointers, @Wooders28.  

As I was putting on tires, I discovered quite a bit of wobbling on one wheel.  I found that it's kicked up. (how?)  

U4mtoZH.jpg

I took out a big hammer (which I don't often associate with RC tools).  After quite some banging (with a folded business card to protect the thread), the wobbling got reduced. 

But the binding issue didn't go away.  Whenever one wheel is at the lowest point, it was effectively putting some brake on it.  With both wheels slightly up, I spin one wheel.  The differential would spin both wheels for 5 seconds.  With wheels all the way down, it lasts only 1 second.  Even a silver can is strong, so it's not a big deal.  But it still is noticeable a drag.  I suppose this is what @ThunderDragonCy discovered?  If this was my 3rd buggy, I wouldn't even have noticed it.  But I can't let this one slide.  I could put few extra red O-rings under shock pistons to reduce the length of the shocks. 

VTadSU3.jpg

But few mm might not help.  Also that still left the wobbling issue (which could be the wheels too).  

I hope 3Racing shafts could reduce the wobbling and the binding at the same time.  (But I'll consider myself lucky if I can just take care of the binding issue)  

On the other hand, I temporarily solved the spring issue.  There was one extra loop.  I stretched them in both springs to equal lengths.  That kinda took care of it for now.  Instead of bottoming out at 3 inches of height, it bottoms out at about 10 inches.  I wouldn't have thought extending one loop added that much force.  The spring set is still in my ebay shopping basket.  When I get it, I'll compare them with my ghetto mod.  

 

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I have bent axle shafts in crashes, but they shouldn't do that in regular running. I get a bit of binding like you have observed at full droop, but i have TRF piston shafts which are a couple of mm longer than the kit ones, and my 3 deg toe it rear uprights which don't catch on the arms so i have about 8mm more droop travel capability on mine compared to the kit. I am really surprised there is binding on the kit setup, but that said i barely ran the plastic driveshafts at all and i don't think much of them. Metal driveshafts will solve issue. Even on mine with a bit of binding right at full droop if you compress the suspension just 3-4mm it goes away, and that is with dogbones. With universals it would almost certainly be smooth throughout its travel. 

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