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GTodd

Where have all the Juggernauts gone?

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I've been waiting for a Juggernaut to purchase for over a year. There haven't been any listed on sale for ever, not to mention in these threads! Just like then Ferrari 308 family and Air Cooled 911s it looks like I missed the bus again!

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That's the way it always is!  When you got the funds and your on the lookout the item you want never turns up! 

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Wow how'd I miss that one!!!! 350 us is a nice price!!!!!

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I didn't realise you were in the USA , some UK sales don't show up if they don't list as worldwide shipping , but there have been a lot for sale in the UK recently , some at knock down prices too , I've been tempted many times .

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It's one of those things that once people have it, they don't let it go.  

You've heard about Juggernaut 1? (I hadn't: this gear got stripped in the first 2 minutes and wouldn't mesh anymore--Tamiya USA back in 2002 was nice enough to send me upgrade parts to Juggernaut 2.  But those upgrade parts don't exist anymore, if it does, it could cost as much as another Jugg.) 

I see Juggernauts coming up on ebay. But half of them are Jugg 1s.  Not many people know about the flaw of bevel gears stripping.  

w4sOCjS.jpg

Below is Jugg 2.  The shaft got longer to resist bevel gears spreading part.  Gear ratio also changed to lessen the load.  

I would make sure to get Jugg 2.  

xKd56AO.jpg

 

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There are 4-5 of them NIB on Ebay US as we speak.  All listed for over $1k, but they're available if you really want one.  I would keep an eye on your local Craigslist & Facebook marketplace.  I've bought a few from there in the past couple of years.  It's hard to find a great deal on a Jugg, just not many of them out there and people tend to hang on to them.

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4 hours ago, Juggular said:

It's one of those things that once people have it, they don't let it go.  

You've heard about Juggernaut 1? (I hadn't: this gear got stripped in the first 2 minutes and wouldn't mesh anymore--Tamiya USA back in 2002 was nice enough to send me upgrade parts to Juggernaut 2.  But those upgrade parts don't exist anymore, if it does, it could cost as much as another Jugg.) 

I see Juggernauts coming up on ebay. But half of them are Jugg 1s.  Not many people know about the flaw of bevel gears stripping.  

w4sOCjS.jpg

Below is Jugg 2.  The shaft got longer to resist bevel gears spreading part.  Gear ratio also changed to lessen the load.  

I would make sure to get Jugg 2.  

xKd56AO.jpg

 

You can still get the upgrade kits both for the gearbox and the axles for affordable prices. My favourite shop has them in stock. ( He just doesn't ship abroad)

There should be Jug 1 around that have the upgrades, you could get them for free from Tamiya or distributor/shop.

Tamiya - 93021 Upgraded Center-Gearbox Juggernaut 1+2 € 27,99 € 

 Tamiya - 93020 Upgraded Diff-Parts Juggernaut 1+2 € 34,99 €

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I have hoped for a Juggernaut 2 rere for years.  I think it took until the TXT-1 for the revised gearboxes to begin to get a better reputation.  US prices can be high so I'll just hope for a rere.

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4 minutes ago, waterbok said:

You can still get the upgrade kits both for the gearbox and the axles for affordable prices. My favourite shop has them in stock. ( He just doesn't ship abroad)

There should be Jug 1 around that have the upgrades, you could get them for free from Tamiya or distributor/shop

Will the TXT 1/2 internals work? I just assumed that they would .

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Txt has thicker outdrives between gearbox and axle, think those are 6mm.

The TXT (printed with 2001) casing of the gearbox and axles can be used for the Jug2 and Mammoth.

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 The upgrade kits have 2000 printed on the casings.

pic.php?firm=Tamiya&best=93021&id=0120UV773C810541I7OQB219103AD

 pic.php?firm=Tamiya&best=93020&id=0120GM773C810541I7OQO2191037D
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9 minutes ago, waterbok said:

Txt has thicker outdrives between gearbox and axle, think those are 6mm.

They are 6mm on both sides, transfer case and axle input shaft.

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Having never driven one of the leaf spring trucks I cannot comment on the drive. TXT-2 on the other hand remains one of my favorite trucks with regard to performance and looks. The Jug is lovely, I have contemplated building another with the f350 body and some Imex puller tires to get closest to the look. 

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I'll start this out saying I love the way the Juggernaut 1/2 looks and would love to have one in my collection. That being said, I admit I was a bit puzzled by it on its initial release. Tamiya were obviously trying to replace the aging Clod Buster with Juggernaut. It looks very impressive and intimidating almost combining the Clod's gigantic size with a touch of Bruiser realism. The odd thing is despite all this, the Clod was probably the better performer. From what little I remember, they were slow, tipsy and bouncy (not that the stock Clod isn't bouncy). Still, beautiful to look at.

Then there's the durability issue (probably Tamiya's worst). Did they test drive it for more than five minutes before ramping up production and shipping them out? Aside from that, I found it curious that while the Juggernaut was much more realistic than the Clod, it was emulating a monster truck design from 10-15 years in the past from its production date. 1:1 leaf spring trucks were long gone by the time the Jugg came out. The TXT-1 would have been a more realistic portrayal from the outset. Not putting the Juggernaut down, just a bit perplexed by the whole model (which I still want ;)).

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13 hours ago, Saito2 said:

From what little I remember, they were slow, tipsy and bouncy

That's exactly how it is.  Typical of Tamiya, the suspension was way too stiff.  For them to work properly, it needed to be 10 pounds heavier. Which is why it was bouncy.  I wonder if Tamiya engineers included the tire weight when they designed the suspension.  The weight of tires are supported by the ground, not by the suspension.  

4 wheel steering didn't quite workout either for such a short wheelbase.  The tires don't meet the ground flat like the Clod.  They are round tires (front profile). Easy to turn, but less stable.  That was the reason why TXT-1 and TXT-2 tires look square from the front, I think.  Even with the rear steering fixed, it was always wobbly.  The axes needed something like Panhard or Watts rods, keeping the them in place. 

LMwYMsI.jpg

But to allow side to side movement, leaf suspensions had to have some slacks, which caused the axles to sway side to side.  That didn't help with the steering either.  There were some upgrade kits like Juggular kit, it helped a lot.  This got it to the TXT-1 level, but still with round tires.  

55tlF9Q.jpg

As a runner, I'd say the Grasshopper is a better runner than the Jugg in its stock form. 

If I do it again, I'd get a TXT-2 and try to find a way to mount a Juggernaut shell.  I wish Tamiya tried to eliminate the torque twist by turning one drive shaft backwards like Gmade.  TXTs always lift its left paw when it tries to stand up.  

Or....

Mount Juggernaut shell on MST MTX-1 like Matteo has done here.  

 

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3 hours ago, Juggular said:

If I do it again, I'd get a TXT-2 and try to find a way to mount a Juggernaut shell

Same, I will offer to make some If anyone on the east coast could loan me a f350 shell, I could model and print some bolt on body mounts for the TXT-2 for their trouble. Is the wheelbase close enough or would the truck have to be shortened?

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