ABS body painting - primer ? clear ? airbrushing ?

[Mark_C 198]

I have a bunch of ABS bodies to paint (lunch box, pumpkin x2, monster & blitzer beetles).

They are most likely to all go with the box art colours - so is it worth priming them or go striaght to paint ? how many people use clear after the colour ?

I've read split opinions on stickers under or over clear - underneath will prevent peeling I guess but will cause more work to get a smooth finish ?

I do have an airbrush, but its very fine and I'm thinking I need a much bigger spray pattern to do bodies of this size. Maybe I'll just use that for detail - window frames etc.

If I go with TS paints and will probably colour sand between coats will I get one shell done out of a single can ?

Some bodies already have stickers on (applied by previous owners), which I will replace - any tips for removal ?

Thanks

 

[TurnipJF 9192]

I'd say the appropriate approach depends on whether the shells are for runners or shelfers.

Primer then paint followed by decals then laquer gives the superior finish so is great for shelfers, but if it is dinged it is a right pain to repair.

TS paint straight to plastic, polished rather than laquered, with decals applied last won't look as good as the first approach, but still looks quite good if done skillfully, and is a lot easier to repair if it gets dinged, so is a good way to go for a runner.

Some TS paint colours cover better than others. You might need one or two cans per shell, but I have yet to need three.

I find WD-40 to be a good remover of sticker residue, followed by a good wash in Fairy liquid and warm water to remove the WD-40 prior to paint.

[Juggular 4964]

In my case, I hardly use primer because I don't like sanding. 

Each layer could add little bit of rough spots, and they can add up.  If you use primer the chance of having to sand increases.  The only time I would prime is when the shell is in dark colors.  For example, if you want to paint the black shell of Midnight Pumpkin in bright yellow?  You MUST use a primer.  Or else, the yellow paint over black body will look gray.  [On the other hand, I would never use a primer on a dark body like Wild Willy. I sprayed green on green.  Or else, every chip will be white, that'd be so ugly]   

If the body is free of (oily) fingerprints, TS paint should chip only when it scrapes on hard surfaces.  

I do 3 coats.  I do need 1 more can about 1/4 of the times.  But 75% of the times, 1 can is enough.  Lunchbox is a big body, so I would have 2 cans ready.  If you get left over, spray it upside down when you are done.  That will clear the tube inside, and you can use it months later.  

I am also too lazy to clear coat.  Tamiya stickers last 30+ years without clear coats.  But I do 3 things to make them really stick.  1) Never use scissors. I cut out stickers with the sharpest hobby knife. Scissors work by crumpling stickers between 2 metal surfaces. That leaves chewed edge, microscopically.  

2) Use a hair drier to "melt" the sticker (only heat it to warm, not hot enough to bend the shell).  That helps the sticker to contour around uneven surfaces.  3) Rub the entire sticker with the back of your fingernail to remove air after putting them on.  That leaves no loose ends to peel from.  Just by doing these 3 things, the stickers almost never peeled on me.  

Here are the stickers I put on a completely matte surface almost 20 years ago.  Instead of peeling off, they would scrape off.  

I didn't know about the hair drier method back then.

But I still put the sticker around the contour, pressing down with a fingernail as I put it on.    

Below, I rubbed it with the (back of) my fingernail, leaving no air bubble.  

If these stickers won't peel on a matte surface for 20 years, you can see how I would not really bother with a clear coat if the TS paint already gives you a gloss surface. But that's just me. 

Some static model builders do a clear coat. They lightly sand the portion that decals raise and clear coat again to make the surface completely even.  I fully respect the dedication, but I am not that patient.  

 

[Mark_C 198]

Thanks to both. maybe what I'll do is get the stickers off and check for scratches/damage and then decide to use primer.

I think the other bodies will be ok, but there are quite a lot of lines and detail to a lunchbox, so sanding might take a while...

Might do some reading on airbrushes too, see if I can change the needle and get a wider fan, but likely to still use cans on the lunch box I think.

[OCD 514]

5 hours ago, Mark_C said:

I do have an airbrush, but its very fine and I'm thinking I need a much bigger spray pattern to do bodies of this size. Maybe I'll just use that for detail - window frames etc.

I've found that no matter how wide you adjust the spray pattern the volume of paint makes it impossible to apply even/smooth coats. Of course my experience is with Tamiya's Spray Works set, which is really designed for static models that would get buried by bigger airbrush, although YMMV.

2 hours ago, Juggular said:

Never use scissors. I cut out stickers with the sharpest hobby knife. Scissors work by crumpling stickers between 2 metal surfaces. That leaves chewed edge, microscopically.  

Interesting. I find using a blade to do the tight radiuses will snag inside corners and often overshoots when making two lines meet inside a v-cut. Typically I use blades for straight edges and larger radiuses, and very sharp teflon coated scissors for everything else. I've been using them for years and find they can't be beat when trimming Tamiya's rather thin decal films.

 

2 hours ago, Juggular said:

Rub the entire sticker with the back of your fingernail to remove air after putting them on

Can only add that an appropriately sized embossing tool does a fantastic job of pushing air pockets out of body lines and finer details. Also a bit of insurance against making scratches or cuts in the deeper crevices. They're relatively cheap and easy to find on the internets

[Juggular 4964]

On 5/16/2020 at 3:56 PM, OCD said:

I use blades for straight edges and larger radiuses, and very sharp teflon coated scissors for everything else

I suppose the sharpness is the issue.  While I say never use scissors, I do use them for masking tapes Tamiya supplies. Not the best when it comes to cutting stickers.  My wife has a pair of shiny scissors for cutting fabrics (which she never uses), but I'm not allowed to use them.  Seeing as decal scissors have the pin close to the blades (like body scissors), they look like they'd give good control.  I should give the decal scissors a try.  

I don't use Xcto knife. After 5 minutes, Xcto gets as dull as Olfa after 5 hours. It's not like it can cut steel, so the difference might be small but noticeable. I just haven't found anything sharper than Olfa. I'd say the Japanese know their blades (including the scissors).  

 

[mtbkym01 4008]

Yep, OLFA blades in my Tamiya Craft Tools Hobby Knife only thanks 

[jonboy1 2943]

Well I'm going to throw the cat amongst the pigeons (whilst maintaining social distancing measures of course) and say always use a primer coat. The primer creates a good bond between the plastic and the paint that the paint can't do on it's own.

I personally use a scotchbrite pad to create a key on the plastic body for the primer. Not only does it reach parts other sandpaper can't but it is also way quicker (and less messy than wet sanding) 

Agree on the qty of paint for the Lunchie - have 2 set aside for that, but pretty much everything else should be possible with 1. 

The amount of sanding between the coats really depends (imho) on the conditions you spray in. I use a homemade spray booth that I wipe down inside before every job to eliminate as much dust as possible and just doing that will save loads of work sanding. I can often just go from coat to coat with just a very quick and light sand inbetween. 

Wet sanding and polishing the colour coat can get you a very glossy finish, but it will never keep it's shine like a clear coat will give it, plus the clear protects the colour coat and makes it easier to buff out light scratches as they should largely kept in the transparent coat. 

Clear coating over Tamiya decals takes practice, as the surface of the Tamiya decals are very glossy so the paint doesn't like to stick. So the clear coat application needs to be done very carefully. If you use MCI Racing decals they offer a matt finish option which works much better (however, I think the print quality can suffer with this option.) If you use the hairdryer method of applying the decals you can get a very smooth and strong finish which can look superb, but you do run the risk of scratches.

Scissors vs Knife - depends on what you're doing as to which is easier, I use both. The key thing, as already stated, is that it is super sharp. Blunt scissors will leave a crumpled edge, a blunt blade will rip and tear the decal. I use a brand new blade for every sheet (sometimes several if it's a big one) and will sharpen my scissors regularly too.

Hope that helps  

 

[Mark_C 198]

do you use tamiya primers @jonboy1 or just plastic primer from halfords etc ?

[jonboy1 2943]

I use Tamiya primers as I personally find that the Halfords cans don't spray as delicately as the Tamiya cans and the primer itself can be a bit heavy. For some bodies this isn't really an issue if there isn't much detail, but bodies like the Lunchie and Beetle that have gutters and fine panel lines can get swallowed up if the primer has a lot of 'body' to it.

The way I see it, Halfords primer is designed for 1:1 scale cars with 1:1 scale detail. Tamiya is designed for 1:24 scale and up.

[Problemchild 2149]

Wash the shell

I always primer and wet sand 

light TS coat first and then get heavier towards the end 

lacquer needs to go on quite thick 

it’s not easy at all to get good finish on the hard shells 

wet application of the decals 

squeegee the water out with finger or soft tissue and then heat where needed

and enjoy - nothing is unrecoverable 

JJ

[Mark_C 198]

Thanks for the pointers, immediate problem is that B&Q appear to no longer sell de-solv-it graffiti remover and there is still some paint to remove from the pumpkin body

I'll look around at other options, would rather not use brake fluid or oven cleaner

[Problemchild 2149]

The oven / bbq cleaner works if they still sell that 

JJ