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futureworks

4WD/FWD Upper Arm Set (53192): Is it inherently unstable?

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Hi everyone

I’ve been wondering about adding this ‘hop-up’ 53192 turnbuckle upper arm set to a fully loaded TA02 chassis project I’m close to starting. I suspect that this topic has come up before, but it strikes me, having seen some examples from built models (see pic) that whilst aiding adjustment of the camber angle, because this new part is fixed in place by ball connectors, it would create instability with lateral load meaning the front and rear hubs could twist slightly unless the lower suspension arm was incredibly rigid, i.e. alu rather than plastic. As such I’m wondering whether it’s really a hop up, or a downgrade from the standard and more rigid front and rear upper arm assemblies.

Any thoughts?

EF8B0F03-FC95-4F83-BD30-9B8E8B12114E.png

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26 minutes ago, futureworks said:

Hi everyone

I’ve been wondering about adding this ‘hop-up’ 53192 turnbuckle upper arm set to a fully loaded TA02 chassis project I’m close to starting. I suspect that this topic has come up before, but it strikes me, having seen some examples from built models (see pic) that whilst aiding adjustment of the camber angle, because this new part is fixed in place by ball connectors, it would create instability with lateral load meaning the front and rear hubs could twist slightly unless the lower suspension arm was incredibly rigid, i.e. alu rather than plastic. As such I’m wondering whether it’s really a hop up, or a downgrade from the standard and more rigid front and rear upper arm assemblies.

Any thoughts?

EF8B0F03-FC95-4F83-BD30-9B8E8B12114E.png

Can understand your thoughts, but in my eyes the possible trade of by flex is lower than the gain you get by being able to set up the camber to the likes of your setup.

At least in Tamiya Eurocup in the 90´s, every top TA02 used the adjustable links. I wouldn´t be afraid of the flex.

Br,

Matthias

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I've got them on mine and there must be about 5mm of forth and aft movement! 

To get even camber left and right then using adjustable arms is the only way, must be the manufacturing process on the gear cases as it can be a good few degrees out. 

Mine sits on a shelf you can't give you first hand experience but maybe the forward motion will keep the link arm in place!? 

I think for a shelf car then it's a must but to use then a custom solid arm maybe better

Sven 

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If you look at the way modern TC arms are setup then they're the same, with a ball socket at the top and a kingpin at the bottom. My TRF419 is a great example, there's absolutely 0 fore-aft play in the front or rear hubs when shimmed correctly. And they're plastic, not alu. 

image.thumb.png.e3b81856e8505024ffd8bbb30c422bb9.png
 

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I've thought about this for mine (really all you need are the ball connectors, adjusters and 4nr 3x18mm turnbuckles. In the end a lack of stock means I couldn't get the turnbuckles, so I'm going to assemble it without for now but following this with interest.

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14 hours ago, GooneyBird said:

If you look at the way modern TC arms are setup then they're the same, with a ball socket at the top and a kingpin at the bottom. My TRF419 is a great example, there's absolutely 0 fore-aft play in the front or rear hubs when shimmed correctly. And they're plastic, not alu. 

image.thumb.png.e3b81856e8505024ffd8bbb30c422bb9.png
 

Totally off topic but you posted a pic with carbon and blue! Is that a 419 with 420 arms and hubs?

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The lower arms on a modern TC are a fair bit stiffer than those found on a FF-01/TA-01/TA-02, which are made of a somewhat flexible rubbery plastic, so I can see the OP's reason for concern. However the stock flexible plastic upper arms on their step screw mountings don't really add much rigidity either, so I don't think that there is much stability being sacrificed here.

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10 hours ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

Totally off topic but you posted a pic with carbon and blue! Is that a 419 with 420 arms and hubs?

Nope, that's a bone-stock 419. @qatmix's TRF419 from his review of it, to be exact. 

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Agree with @svenb

If you want the best of this chassis then 5mm slop isn’t acceptable

If, like a lot of buyers ?, you maybe don’t care then it’s a safety margin to minimise stress / preserve parts ?

I’ve also yet to build (and fully shim) a TA02 race car but can’t help feel the front end is inherently over stressed from looking at the build manual ? 

To be honest, there looks to be only so far you can go ?

Ditto the other TAs / TTs - until you get to TA05 / TRF 

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