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DeadMeat666

M-chassis confusion

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At the risk of being too agreeable...

I just agree with the group!! 😜 I'm in the process of building a M05 Kit. Just PIECEMEAL, because I couldn't find a kit anywhere when I had the rare cash to do so... 

The M05 seems very well designed, engineered and TOUGH! Everyone I know with one claims they're nearly bulletproof!! Seems to be the obvious choice for a fun Basher - that's not a Toy. 

I'd really LOVE to try a M07 at some point. I like FWD! Currently, I can't even afford the remaining parts Trees D and F, to finish my M05. 😖😞 

But I think you'll really enjoy the M07!

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I bought the M05RA kit to get the Renault R5 body.. darn you Tamiya. 
 

I had no intentions of building the M05 as I already have way too many kits.  But boredom set in and I built it, slapped a Mini Montecarlo body on it, dropped a 17.5 Old Novak I had lying around.. and set a new goal... which was, how quickly I could make the 55D radials bald..  

I live in a cul de sac and the car goes like a fart 💨 back and forth ... hilarious to watch and good fun 

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Well I've done it. I've ordered an M07 Concept with a small set of goodies alongside (couldn't help it). I'll try to set up a build thread for it, but I've never done a build thread so be gentle when I do so lol.

Thanks for all the advice guys! I just hope RCMart doesn't get back to me in a couple of days to tell me they're out of M07's as well :lol:

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2 hours ago, Raman36 said:

I bought the M05RA kit to get the Renault R5 body.. darn you Tamiya. 
 

I had no intentions of building the M05 as I already have way too many kits.  But boredom set in and I built it, slapped a Mini Montecarlo body on it, dropped a 17.5 Old Novak I had lying around.. and set a new goal... which was, how quickly I could make the 55D radials bald..  

I live in a cul de sac and the car goes like a fart 💨 back and forth ... hilarious to watch and good fun 

I added to mine also the speed gears and it has a FDR of 4.99 and a Carson 10T ad it goes on 2s 67kmh. So very capable little projectile.

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2 hours ago, Fabia130vRS said:

I added to mine also the speed gears and it has a FDR of 4.99 and a Carson 10T ad it goes on 2s 67kmh. So very capable little projectile.

I tried it with a 13.5.. car was fine..but the TBLE02S started to cough and stutter lol.

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7 hours ago, DeadMeat666 said:

Well I've done it. I've ordered an M07 Concept with a small set of goodies alongside (couldn't help it). I'll try to set up a build thread for it, but I've never done a build thread so be gentle when I do so lol.

Thanks for all the advice guys! I just hope RCMart doesn't get back to me in a couple of days to tell me they're out of M07's as well :lol:

GOOD!!! 😁😁😎

You're really going to enjoy it. Looking forward to the Build Thread.

Hopefully if I can get the last of the parts, I'll start one too! 😉

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While this discussion is going on, can somebody tell me the wheelbase of the M06? Is it adjustable? And what wheelbase is the Type 2 Kombi? 

P.S. I guess I could easily measure my WR02 :blink:

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On 7/4/2020 at 8:40 PM, DeadMeat666 said:

Well I've done it. I've ordered an M07 Concept with a small set of goodies alongside (couldn't help it). I'll try to set up a build thread for it, but I've never done a build thread so be gentle when I do so lol.

Thanks for all the advice guys! I just hope RCMart doesn't get back to me in a couple of days to tell me they're out of M07's as well :lol:

Shipped! Now the wait for it to arrive begins...

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On 7/5/2020 at 1:52 AM, mtbkym01 said:

While this discussion is going on, can somebody tell me the wheelbase of the M06? Is it adjustable? And what wheelbase is the Type 2 Kombi? 

P.S. I guess I could easily measure my WR02 :blink:

Yes, it’s capable of 210, 225 and 239

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On 7/5/2020 at 8:52 PM, mtbkym01 said:

While this discussion is going on, can somebody tell me the wheelbase of the M06? Is it adjustable? And what wheelbase is the Type 2 Kombi? 

P.S. I guess I could easily measure my WR02 :blink:

Think the M06 Kombi, and the WR02 Kombi are two different bodies? So not sure if they are the same wheelbase? Could be wrong...

Also, may or may not, have a M-08 enroute 😬

 

 

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38 minutes ago, berman said:

Think the M06 Kombi, and the WR02 Kombi are two different bodies? So not sure if they are the same wheelbase? Could be wrong...

Also, may or may not, have a M-08 enroute 😬

 

 

I’ll measure my body, soon I guess 😂

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Yup, the M06 Type 2 Kombi body is completely different to the WR02 Type 2 Kombi body (M06 body is 1/10 scale, WR02 roughly 1/12). The WR02 body is too narrow and the wheelbase is too short for a M-chassis.

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32 minutes ago, IBIFTKH said:

Yup, the M06 Type 2 Kombi body is completely different to the WR02 Type 2 Kombi body (M06 body is 1/10 scale, WR02 roughly 1/12). The WR02 body is too narrow and the wheelbase is too short for a M-chassis.

Well that’s pretty clear then, have a spare WR02 body that I was thinking about options for, back to the drawing board

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Does anyone have the wheelbase & body width of the M06 Kombi shell?

I've had a project in mind for years, but have been unable to find a suitable Kombi shell to suit.

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21 hours ago, Falcon#5 said:

Does anyone have the wheelbase & body width of the M06 Kombi shell?

I've had a project in mind for years, but have been unable to find a suitable Kombi shell to suit.

Wheelbase is 239mm.  I don’t have exact width but I know it’s wider than traditional M body.  I recall the beetle being 165mm and would estimate bus to be ~10mm wider.

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So main difference between M07 and M08 is the handling, due to front vs rear mounted motor? In respect of this question about motor mount position, what's the difference that the wheelbase makes on these chassis? Is there a 'best' option for a 210mm wheelbase car for example? 

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The difference between the M-07 and M-08 is less about motor position, and more about which wheels are driven and braked. Both cars have their motors between the axles, and while one is closer to the front and the other closer to the rear, once you add a battery, servo, etc their weight distributions are not that different.

I find the differences especially noticeable under hard acceleration and braking. The FWD M-07 is slower off the mark because weight is transferred rearward, away from the driving wheels which tend to spin as a result. The same effect benefits the RWD M-08 under acceleration as the rear wheels are driven and the weight transfer helps them grip better.

The reverse happens under braking when the weight transfer goes the other way. The FWD M-07 is easier to control as front grip is enhanced, whereas the RWD M-08 can spin out more readily as the weight is being transferred away from the braking wheels at the rear. It is as if every turn is a handbrake turn. 

Wheelbase affects stability. A longer wheelbase will typically be more stable on the straights, a shorter one will be more nimble in the corners all else being equal. Thus a long wheelbase can be used to help calm a RWD car while a shorter wheelbase can liven up a FWD one. 

As for a "best" option, that is hard to say as it depends on a variety of factors, including but not limited to track layout, track surface, tyre choice and personal driving style. You may want to build your chassis and try it in each of the potential wheelbase configurations, then pick a shell to fit the one that suits you best. 

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@TurnipJF That was very well explained Sir!! 👍👍 

I still have a couple of questions that over the years I've been bashful to ask... I've been in the Hobby since early 1984. Raced Buggies from 1987-92. Never at the top levels. Just to qualify myself, because nobody really knows me..... 

So I discovered that FWD RC Cars were a LOT of fun, and much more stable than RWD Cars. (More predictable in turns, because it always understeered about the same every time). 

I had a M03 Mini Cooper (and MISS it!). Good, BASIC Chassis, that I was able to tune out much of the Understeer by adding Negative Camber up front, and fitting a Rear Swaybar... Then sticky Yeah Racing Front Tires.

Anyway.... I've been TRYING for the past few months, to build a M05 Chassis Kit, PIECEMEAL! (Yes, stupid, but I never have a lot of money at one time. I'm a Disabled Veteran)

I'm missing Parts Trees D and F, and Parts Bag A and B. Just can't find the money... 😞

I've also already got Tamiya Adjustable Upper Links, 60mm Shocks and Front CVDs. Aluminium Servo Mount and 25kg Servo, and Aluminium Ball Raced, Steering Components.

Again, I'm no Pro! Just was Fun, Durable and Strong. Would Aluminium Lower Arms be too much? The Stock Plastic looks like it gives just enough "give" to not break easily.

And.... I'd like to run a 3S Batry. If any of you run 3S, please, what fits?? 

Have a great Weekend!

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I wouldn't go alloy. If you want to upgrade the arms, go for the one piece reinforced ones #54606.

Was hoping to make a start on the M-08 today, but unfortunately a family member had a heart attack so the build can wait. 

nFrUQ9U.jpg

 

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Indeed. Alloy suspension arms are typically not a good idea on a runner. They have no give, so pass collision forces directly to the chassis, increasing the chances of breakage in a collision. They also have virtually no springiness, so if bent in a collision, they stay bent rather than resuming their original shape like plastic ones would. 

When looking at materials for hop-ups, I look towards top end no-expense-spared kits - the sort that don't need any hop-ups and can win championships in box stock spec. If plastic arms are used on such models (which they are), it follows that this is the material I should be using on my models too.

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@TurnipJF Couldn't agree MORE!! 👍👍

I raced, semi-pro, in the 80's and 90's. The Chassis Skeleton was engineered to be as stiff as humanly possible... But with Control Arms, always Nylon/Plastic blend, occasionally fused with Fibre. 

.... For the exact reasons stated above. ANY component, anywhere, will always break at the weakest point. You want that point to be cheap and readily available. With Tamiya, it's definitely Control Arms!! 😉 

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Having just been hooked to my MF-01X (due to its smallish, silly speed and nimble handling) and I just took another look at M chassis. I now understand that even numbers are RWD and odd numbers are FWD.

However, I noticed M05 and M06 do not have damper shocks. 

M07 and M08 have damper shocks, ball bearings and universal drive shafts all included, minus ESC & body but I think they are much better value for money in comparsion with M05/M06 kits above?

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07/08 are designed more for competing. So they come with these bits. 05/06 are more for hobby / fun. 
 

07/08 are a better value. You will spend less in hop ups 

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The M-07/08 chassis are very well engineered and extremely capable, but they are not simple or straightforward to set up, being far more adjustable than the M-05/06. If you know what you are doing, this is a good thing as you can get them dialled in exactly how you want them. However without a thorough knowledge of car setup and ideally a setup station to help with accuracy, it is possible to make them handle very badly indeed. 

In contrast, there isn't much to adjust on a M-05/06, therefore there isn't much to get wrong. The stock settings work under most circumstances and make for a quite forgiving drive with which it is easy to be consistent. I find that I can manage some very fast laps with my M-07 if I concentrate, but it is hard to maintain the concentration required for a full race. My M-05 on the other hand is so easy to drive that I can deliver slightly slower but more consistent laps with very little effort. If I overcook it through a corner, the car just diffs away the excess power and carries on going where I tell it to. It has often been the case where I have beaten faster cars with it by simply not crashing.

The M-05/06 don't come with bearings or oil-filled shocks, but they do come with bodies and tyres, and often an ESC too. You'd need to buy these separately for the M-07/08, so either way you'd need to spend a bit more than the kit price. And let's face it - if hop-ups are your thing, you'll want to add carbon and alloy to whichever chassis you choose. There is no lack of choice for all four - M-05/6 and M07/8.

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