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TurnipJF

Racing by post - Round 44 track is up. We're going back to Vålerbanen!

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1 hour ago, TurnipJF said:

On the extremely tight courses, I simply crank the steering rate to maximum and run the car as I would normally. Also, I find that slower is sometimes quicker - keeping the speed relatively low and concentrating on precision around the corners can give surprisingly good results. In round 1 I drove my M-07 and M-08 with rapid acceleration and hard braking, making the most of their 13.5t power and taking a racing line around the markers. Loads of fun! But then I took my M-03 out and did almost as well with far less speed but tighter, straighter lines.

Yup, I noticed that on the first track with my M05. As is has the speed gears and a 10T brishless, going full throttle even on the exit of corners does more harm then good. So finding a  nice cornering line and keeping decent speed without sending it was the way to go.

the second track layout could have been good for ful throttles but it was raining and now for the third layout it still is not going to stop raining.

 

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2 hours ago, Carmine A said:

I agree!! My M05 is not the Corner burner I hoped for, but it's at least miles better than bog standard. 

I LOVE the FWD Minis - and I'm hoping that the M07 will be as good as others say. Sure can't afford it yet, but I'm going straight to the Pro!! 😊  Might as well have the goodies up front, right?

I can only tell you how I have found the M07, it is a great chassis and if you can go for it. If you like your M05 then you will fall in love with the M07. I was thinking of using mine a sticking to FWD for this challenge only thing is I'm thinking the TT02 might be more suited for this time, I pulled out theT'Tuned motor and put it in my M06 and the TT02 has a sliver can in it because it's not about too much speed on this one but I'm open to some advice and tips. Hopefully I might have the M05 back running, making a n order for part tomorrow.

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7 minutes ago, DayRider said:

I can only tell you how I have found the M07, it is a great chassis and if you can go for it. If you like your M05 then you will fall in love with the M07. I was thinking of using mine a sticking to FWD for this challenge only thing is I'm thinking the TT02 might be more suited for this time, I pulled out theT'Tuned motor and put it in my M06 and the TT02 has a sliver can in it because it's not about too much speed on this one but I'm open to some advice and tips. Hopefully I might have the M05 back running, making a n order for part tomorrow.

It's best it get the pro chassis because you will buy all them hop ups any way so it will work out cheaper. I did it the other way round and purchased the parts after. And for me it's a dream with a 225mm wheel base. Also up grade the diff, don't get me wrong the one it comes with is ace but they are really good up grades out there for around $40. Give me a shout any time mate

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2 hours ago, TurnipJF said:

On the extremely tight courses, I simply crank the steering rate to maximum and run the car as I would normally. Also, I find that slower is sometimes quicker - keeping the speed relatively low and concentrating on precision around the corners can give surprisingly good results. In round 1 I drove my M-07 and M-08 with rapid acceleration and hard braking, making the most of their 13.5t power and taking a racing line around the markers. Loads of fun! But then I took my M-03 out and did almost as well with far less speed but tighter, straighter lines.

Would softening up the springs help?

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17 minutes ago, DayRider said:

I can only tell you how I have found the M07, it is a great chassis and if you can go for it. If you like your M05 then you will fall in love with the M07. I was thinking of using mine a sticking to FWD for this challenge only thing is I'm thinking the TT02 might be more suited for this time, I pulled out theT'Tuned motor and put it in my M06 and the TT02 has a sliver can in it because it's not about too much speed on this one but I'm open to some advice and tips. Hopefully I might have the M05 back running, making an order for part tomorrow.

My intention is to absolutely get the M07 Pro. With the added goodies, great value for money at $220.00 USD! 

I'm almost getting the impression that the M05 is like the ******* stepchild between the M03 and M07!! Both seem to perform better.... The M07 just seems superior in every way - especially the Pro. Of COURSE I'll add upgrades from there. SOME Alumininium - but not the whole Suspension. I've learned over the years that having a sacrificial Plastic part on each corner is good insurance for not destroying your Car in a major mishap!! 😖  Don't ask me how I learned THAT!! 😜  I'm sticking with Yeah Racing for the Ball Raced Steering Bellcrank Kit.... Half the price of Tamiya, and does exactly what I need.

Currently my TT-02S SM RRRR GT4 has a LOT to prove!! Absolutely little to no cost upgrades, except for the Steering, Tuned to near perfect as I can on no Budget and some help from my Friends!! 😊  But I have no idea how it will run - YET!!

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8 minutes ago, DayRider said:

Would softening up the springs help?

...... It actually helped my M05, fitting softer Rear Springs. 😉

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1 minute ago, Carmine A said:

...... It actually helped my M05, fitting softer Rear Springs. 😉

Yeah I was thinking mine was set for faster track and you don't want a lot of body roll but I think in this case more would be better. Nice one

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6 minutes ago, Carmine A said:

My intention is to absolutely get the M07 Pro. With the added goodies, great value for money at $220.00 USD! 

I'm almost getting the impression that the M05 is like the ******* stepchild between the M03 and M07!! Both seem to perform better.... The M07 just seems superior in every way - especially the Pro. Of COURSE I'll add upgrades from there. SOME Alumininium - but not the whole Suspension. I've learned over the years that having a sacrificial Plastic part on each corner is good insurance for not destroying your Car in a major mishap!! 😖  Don't ask me how I learned THAT!! 😜  I'm sticking with Yeah Racing for the Ball Raced Steering Bellcrank Kit.... Half the price of Tamiya, and does exactly what I need.

Currently my TT-02S SM RRRR GT4 has a LOT to prove!! Absolutely little to no cost upgrades, except for the Steering, Tuned to near perfect as I can on no Budget and some help from my Friends!! 😊  But I have no idea how it will run - YET!!

Yeah racing gear fits so well, they do a steering kit plus a few other things for $50 mate and it's worth every cent heat sink and other carbon bits steering rod etc, check it out there is two types top and bottom, you'll see what I mean.

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..... The Body is FINALLY Painted!!!! But I'm going to make you have to go to my TT-02 Build Thread to see it! 😜

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9 minutes ago, DayRider said:

Yeah racing gear fits so well, they do a steering kit plus a few other things for $50 mate and it's worth every cent heat sink and other carbon bits steering rod etc, check it out there is two types top and bottom, you'll see what I mean.

I cannot WAIT to find all that out for myself! When I finally get there, I'll be looking for input from you and everyone who has experienced the M07! 👍👍

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7 hours ago, Collin said:

May I ask about the origin of this word? I understood its your daughters (or females in general) but I cant find anything in the dictionary about this word. Sonds funny to me and as I am non-nativ english it suprise me much.

LOL

I have an American friend who we've known for many years, he refers to our kids as mudlets because of my username 'Mud4fun' which is often shortened by people to just 'Mud', and hence my children (regardless of sex) would be 'Mudlets:) (and our home is referred to as Mudville)

I guess it just started as a term of endearment many years ago and has just become part of the language of our house, especially when referring to the kids on internet forums where we don't always mention their actual names.

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@TurnipJF is quite correct, it seems 'slow is the new fast' :D

After ditching the 13T/19T motor options in my Thundershot in favour of the 22T mag mayhem with a larger pinion, the stupid amounts of wheelspin every touch of the throttle have now gone and instead the buggy is more controllable on tight tracks. It  still accelerates quite well but the whole driving experience is smoother - sadly this is actually less fun BUT it may work better for the round 3 layout. My usual setups and driving style suits faster tracks I think.

I have fitted carpet tyres (schumacher cactus fusions)  to the front which we found grips really well on our rough tarmac/concrete car park and the buggy turns sharply with far less understeer than before under power. I couldn't use the cactus rears because they gripped TOO well and where causing me issues, I think I was getting wind up in transmission due to lack of centre diff and getting random wheelspins on top of the transmission making a horrible whining sounds when corning!!! EEK. The Venom rears are less grippy and allow a little bit of wheelspin and rear end slide and thus more forgiving.

I have added more negative camber to the rear end too.

Going to try my first serious attempt at round 3 tonight if weather remains dry - sods law it will now rain as I've changed all my setup to dry.....:lol:

tarmac_tyres.jpg

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I'm actually expecting my youngest daughter with her bog standard silver can to do well on this track, her smooth driving style likely to get much closer to faster cars?

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7 hours ago, mud4fun said:

I'm actually expecting my youngest daughter with her bog standard silver can to do well on this track, her smooth driving style likely to get much closer to faster cars?

Smooth is good, and if that is her style, she should do well!

 

15 hours ago, Carmine A said:

I'm almost getting the impression that the M05 is like the ******* stepchild between the M03 and M07!! Both seem to perform better....

I wouldn't say that - the M-05 has superior steering geometry and the ability to adjust Ackermann, as well as a lower centre of gravity than the M-03. I enjoy my M-03's rugged simplicity, but as a track weapon I prefer my M-05. The M-07 is indeed superior to both, but it is a far newer design aimed at a different category of user, so I am not sure it is a fair comparison. The wet ground is tempting me to take a rally car or two to my next session, and one of the cars I am strongly considering is my M-05 Suzuki Swift on rally blocks.

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5 hours ago, TurnipJF said:

Smooth is good, and if that is her style, she should do well!

She did do well :D

She actually beat her elder sister (who is now in a strop) using a brand new silver can in her base model thundershot on pin spikes!!! AND she came pretty close to me on a couple of her runs. I managed to get a cracking set of laps in on my 3rd attempt (sadly it all fell apart on the 4th and 5th attempts as I tried to push too hard)

Spent 2 hours this afternoon doing that damned track, it is a flipping nightmare with buggies.

I actually got my best lap times by allowing the back end to slide around (almost like a handbrake turn) while the super grippy silver compound (super soft) front fusions held the car in place, this gained me a full second per lap over trying to slow down and drive around properly.

Middle daughter struggled in her Reedy 19T equipped Terra Scorcher, pushed too hard and then went wide on every marker.

The trick with the thundershots was to hard accelerate out of a marker, lift off 3 feet before the next and the front would bite in and go tight round the marker with the rear semi-floating. Youngest daughter had this down to a fine art. I only beat her because I had bags of torque to catapult me away from the markers towards the next. 

We're all shattered, a REALLY tricky track for a buggy, far too tight really, we'd need at least 5-6m wide instead of 4m to be comfortable.

I will go for some more attempts over the weekend but I think I'm at the limit of what a buggy can do on this even with a super lightweight and lowered one.

PS. The rear venom tyres despite being a dedicated tarmac tyres are useless, they have very little grip even in the dry partly due to them being too wide for such light cars, mine especially so. The carpet tyres proved to be the far superior tyre on this tarmac.

round3 (1).jpg

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PS. All thundershots returned home safely without a single bit of damage, not one roll over and none hit a curb either although middle mudlet did nearly destroy my LapMonitor again :)

PPS. We GPS measured the top speeds of all three cars as they all had either new motors or smaller pinions fitted for round 3 and all three were very closely matched:

  • Thundershot 'Stig Eater' 22T Kyosho Magnetic Meyhem and 14t pinion= 20mph
  • Terra Scorcher Reedy 19T spec and 13t pinion = 19mph
  • Thundershot silver can and 15t pinion = 18mph

These speeds are roughly 3-5mph down on the setups we ran for round 2

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1 hour ago, mud4fun said:

PS. All thundershots returned home safely without a single bit of damage, not one roll over and none hit a curb either although middle mudlet did nearly destroy my LapMonitor again :)

PPS. We GPS measured the top speeds of all three cars as they all had either new motors or smaller pinions fitted for round 3 and all three were very closely matched:

  • Thundershot 'Stig Eater' 22T Kyosho Magnetic Meyhem and 14t pinion= 20mph
  • Terra Scorcher Reedy 19T spec and 13t pinion = 19mph
  • Thundershot silver can and 15t pinion = 18mph

These speeds are roughly 3-5mph down on the setups we ran for round 2

Are those top speeds the top speed the buggy can reach, or the top speed they reached on the track? I'm not surprised if its on the track with the limited space but they seem too close for them to be the top speed of the buggy. Its making me think a 17.5T powered buggy or 21.5T touring car may be about right. Quick acceleration 

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6 minutes ago, Jonathon Gillham said:

Are those top speeds the top speed the buggy can reach, or the top speed they reached on the track? I'm not surprised if its on the track with the limited space but they seem too close for them to be the top speed of the buggy. Its making me think a 17.5T powered buggy or 21.5T touring car may be about right. Quick acceleration 

No, they are the top speeds doing three runs each up and down a 150 foot straight bit of tarmac using a SkyRC GPS unit. Remember they are geared specifically to give acceleration for round 3 and to sacrifice top speed.

  • My Thundershot when running its Reedy 19T and 8.4v NiCd and a 14T pinion is 25mph and with a 15T pinion is 28mph
  • Middle mudlets terra scorcher also normally hits 23-25mph even on 7.2v

I just figured there was no point in having high top speed for this layout, acceleration and braking being far more important, small pinions are better for both those characteristics in the thundershots. Well at least that was the theory. We'll have to wait until the results are published to see whether that turned into reality :lol:

 

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@Jonathon Gillham I chose to run a smaller 4000mah LiPo for weight saving (it is nearly 200g lighter than my 8.4v NiCd!!), sadly it has nowhere near the punch of the 8.4v Sanyo and gave pretty poor performance really BUT the weight saving and lowering made a huge difference today, at long last I could hammer around, turn sharply at speed on tarmac and NOT roll, instead the back end just lost traction if I pushed to hard and swung around. :)

Also worth noting, the 4000mah LiPo gave me over 30 mins race time in my thundershot, compared with barely 5 mins with the 8.4v NiCd so it is all swings and roundabouts, lost a bit of punch but gained oodles of runtime. I think the runtime is probably more important for us than outright speed these days.

Curiously and to my benefit the Schumacher Venom rear tyres lost traction a lot sooner than the Schumacher Cactus Fusion carpet tyre'd front end so I actually got so used to it in the end I could get it to spin 180 almost on the spot, so my best lap times were made up of a series of straights with a tail slide at each end rather than driving around markers LOL :ph34r:

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I actually think I've over-lightened the thundershot, it is now just 1387g, not much more than a touring car? in fact looking at the last results table I see that my Thundershot is now 100g lighter than Turnips FF-03, mine was also fitted with a transponder (not sure about his). It is too light to have big wide tyres as I get less traction. I think I now need to run narrow front tyres on the rear?? sounds crazy but my experience over last two days suggests that may be the way to go?

 

I'm thinking of ordering another set of fusion fronts and fit them on spare front wheels to the rear and re-run the track next weekend. The fronts are not much wider than touring car tyres. I think I can also improve turning circle by fitting a longer horn onto servo? Seem to be a bit more to gain in steering, only limited by travel of horn it seems?

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Great thread, and idea. I'll joining the fun :)

I've spot in mind where I can set up a gravel & tarmac course, the first cars I'm going to use are a Konghead, DF-03 and XV-01.

Now I've got to decide whether to buy a LapMonitor system.

 

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14 hours ago, TurnipJF said:

Smooth is good, and if that is her style, she should do well!

I wouldn't say that - the M-05 has superior steering geometry and the ability to adjust Ackermann, as well as a lower centre of gravity than the M-03. I enjoy my M-03's rugged simplicity, but as a track weapon I prefer my M-05. The M-07 is indeed superior to both, but it is a far newer design aimed at a different category of user, so I am not sure it is a fair comparison. The wet ground is tempting me to take a rally car or two to my next session, and one of the cars I am strongly considering is my M-05 Suzuki Swift on rally blocks.

Right... I do agree that compared to my old M03 Mini Cooper, this does have better Steering Geometry and far more adjustability! 👍👍 

I also forget that I've managed to remove nearly ALL bump steer from mine. Also, I think I need to dig up a 16T Pinion Gear. That in itself might turn the tide.

Mate.... I'm just frustrated. I need to revisit it after the TT-02S SM RRRR GT4 is done. In my experience, the FIDDLIEST Decals I've ever done!! IMG_20201016_234912.thumb.jpg.453f85715501255cac8747654f03515b.jpg

It's not just that there's 78 of them - it's that most fit into deep pockets! Remind me NEVER to do a Rally Car!!! 😜😂

I also forgot about one Track Weapon that I didn't fit to the M05 yet.... ADJUSTABLE Upper Arms!! 😲  There's a whole lot of Camber I haven't even touched yet.

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23 minutes ago, IoWBasher said:

Great thread, and idea. I'll joining the fun :)

I've spot in mind where I can set up a gravel & tarmac course, the first cars I'm going to use are a Konghead, DF-03 and XV-01.

Now I've got to decide whether to buy a LapMonitor system.

 

We love our LapMonitor :wub:

I just need to construct some form of armour plate protection for it to stop my daughters errant buggy from hitting it, it seems putting bright red cones all around it is still not enough to deter her :lol:

Because it measures the race for you and allows you to finish the last lap before declaring the race finished I managed to get pretty much a free lap because I crossed the line just 0.5 seconds before the 5 minutes was up, was well chuffed.

From our experience yesterday I think 2wd cars or cars with centre diffs will do best on these super tight turns. Middle mudlets buggy had good traction on her tyres (and had the heaviest car) but with no centre diff it tended to push her wide around the cones and she ended up with the slowest lap times, youngest mudlet on part worn pin spikes had enough wheel slip to get tight turns combined with her smoother, more consistent driving style on the silver can meant she beat her sisters more powerful car by quite some margin.

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Thank you Mud4fun, loving your nicknames for your nippers.

Anyhoo, after watching some vids etc on the LapMonitor and what has been written in this thread about it, I've just ordered one.

Plan is to have a play tomorrow morning, and then hopefully the LapMonitor system will be with me in time to do some recorded runs next weekend.

I'm looking forward to this ;)

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24 minutes ago, IoWBasher said:

Thank you Mud4fun, loving your nicknames for your nippers.

Anyhoo, after watching some vids etc on the LapMonitor and what has been written in this thread about it, I've just ordered one.

Plan is to have a play tomorrow morning, and then hopefully the LapMonitor system will be with me in time to do some recorded runs next weekend.

I'm looking forward to this ;)

The only problem (other than being a mare for buggies) with this round 3 track layout is that the lapmonitor has to go perilously close to where cars are driving. You can't mount it facing towards the track from the safety of the rostrum area because it has such a long range of detection that it actually picks up the cars when they are driving around the centre marker! Not a problem on larger tracks because there is normally a safe place to put it on a straight etc but that centre marker was too close for comfort and middle mudlets car seemed to be magnetically attracted to it.... 

It is absolutely superb bit of kit. We have used it for many hours now and other than it having too good a range of detection (so placement is important to avoid that) it has been totally accurate and never missed a car going past regardless of speed, it even counted my Avante crossing the line during a barrel roll...... :lol:

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