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Reedydriver

Turbo Scorpion driving characteristics

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Hello guys,
I have a Kyosho Tomahawk and I am now playing with the idea of expanding my collection with a Turbo Scorpion. My main interest is driving. Now my question to you: Is the driving characteristic of the Turbo Scorpion different from the Tomahawk? If the two buggies are too similar, I would rather wait for a new buggy from the legendary series. I am looking forward to your answers :)

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I don't own either but there will be an obvious difference with the characteristics between the two in terms of performance. The Turbo Scorpion uses gear diff, and battery placement is longitudinal as opposed to the Tomahawk's side placement.

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I imagine the Turbo Scorpion would be more stable with longer wheelbase and wider track. I would consider Ultima re-re instead.

With my Beetle, I have been thinking if I should get the parts to convert it to Turbo Scorpion's long wheelbase and wide track. :D 

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Thanks - we had the same thought. I have now also converted the Tomahawk to long wheel base. Also carbon shock towers, rear shocks from the Turbo Scorpion, front and rear wheels from the Turbo Scorpion. I love to optimize buggies. Improving the handling of the buggies has always been my goal. And with the Tomahawk I was honestly not satisfied as it was. I have to wait for better weather, then I can try it out.

With the Ultima I am completely satisfied. It stays as it is.

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I have a regular re-re Scorpion. It drives nice with the normal on-power push that all cars of the era have. I like to drive in in loamy areas. Hard tracks are not where a buggy like this works well.

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This is a good hint. It really depends on the surface on which you are driving. The old buggy concepts should also be driven with moderate power in order to guarantee driving pleasure. It is dangerous if you expect a Tomahawk or Scorpion to behave like a RC10 B4. You should not expect that at all. Nevertheless, you can modify a model to increase the driving pleasure. There are option parts that cost a lot of money, but some of them really pay off because they make a respectable difference. My Tomahawk was treated with the same improvements as the Turbo Scorpion. Nevertheless I ordered a Turbo Scorpion and I am looking forward to compare the two buggies.

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Curious to see what you discover between the Turbo Scorpion and the Tomahawk chassis.  I just finished the Tomahawk build over the weekend and made a few changes to improve the handling:

Suspension:   Under the stock set-up, using a standard 2s lipo hardcase battery, the car would bounce up and down a few times when "drop tested" after bottoming out in the rear while the front suspension hardly compressed at all.  I addressed the front/rear weight balance later, but for starters..

- Added thicker oil in the rear shocks and moved the preload clamps down.  Thinner oil in the fronts.  <<After doing this, the rear was much more smooth when dropped and only compressed once to absorb the load the returned to ride height smoothly.  The fronts compressed a little, but adding more weight would even them out.

 

Weight Distribution:  Under the stock set-up, the front end was very light and would understeer under any level of acceleration.  

- Added stick-on weights to the metal plate where the servo is mounted and and on the front plate where the servo saver is.  When "drop testing" the front end compressed a bit more (still not as much as the rear as the weight is still rear-biased).  Pushing the car down and allowing it to rise up showed even suspension rebound rate front/rear.

 

Steering:

I moved the steering arm pivot ball outward one hole on the steering servo to allow for more steering travel per movement of the servo.  This also allowed for a more direct angle for the steering servo rod to travel as opposed to a bit of an angle.  The result was more steering "feel".

 

The overall results were pretty good.  Handling has improved a lot and Jumps are more balanced as well.  I'll try a "shorty" lipo pack next to further centralize the most mass and call it a wrap.

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Here is my version of the Tomahawk. It has long wheelbase, 2.2 wheels front and rear, carbon shock towers front and rear, turbo scorpion rear shocks and Dex410 front shocks. These are fantastic! Furthermore it has a RB5 ball diff. This also is really great. Additionally, I have modified the lipo position for the use of a shorty. Finally, I had to cut the body in the rear to fit the long wheelbase.

The turbo scorpion will arrive in about 2 weeks. Looking forward to my new legendary series buggy :)

 

IMG_20201106_104448.jpg

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Good news and bad news...

 

The good:  Kyosho provided an extra plastic battery holder which I used to secure a "shorty" lipo and mount length-wise.  Along with added weights up front, steering response was very good, much tighter turning radius without as much back end "kick-out".  Still a wee bit of on-power understeer, but I think this is the sweet spot for chassis balance.  Any more weight forward will disrupt balance when jumping and cause the front end to reach bottom travel upon landing.  Now I can take a jump at mid to 75% acceleration and the front end stays level.  Yay Kyosho!  

Tomahawk4.jpg

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And now for the bad..   during said test of jumps and balance and whatnot..  I managed to bottom out on the street once.  Not by much mind you.. the scratches left are very mild.. however the car came to an instant halt about 30 seconds later and seemed locked up.  I stopped and went inside for a closer look to find that a screw on the factory assembled differential had backed out and gouged the diff cover plate, leaving metal shavings everywhere and seizing up the gearbox.  Boo Kyosho.  and boo for my own use of Tamiya anti-wear grease as I now had a nice gummy, crumby mess to clean with an old tooth brush.

I suspect that the diff is a bit of an issue in terms of quality control, as even the manual suggests one "hit" the bearing onto the diff shaft to seat it properly.  Meh..:huh:

I took everything apart and cleaned it all up, then used thread locking gel on the screws holding the diff together.  I sanded the gouged diff cover flat and used two thin (can see washers in photo from previous post) washers behind it when re-installing to get the necessary clearance for the differential to spin freely.  Not sure why this was designed to be such a tight fit but.. oh well..  Will test again tonight after work to verify all is well.

 

InkedTomahawkDiffProb2_LI.jpg

TomahawkDiffProb3.jpg

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Happy to report that all is well now.  I tested last night thoroughly, full blast acceleration from a start..  snapping full fwd from rolling reverse..  high speed down open road (on a 13.5T it's pleasantly fast) and no more diff issues.  

After reassuring the differential was fine, I went back to assessing the handling.  Prior to the added weights/longitudinal battery placement would wheelie on aggressive starts and probably flip backwards if I continued to squeeze the trigger.  Now?  Only on high bite occasions the front end lifts up.  Both front wheels come off the ground, but holding full fwd can't keep the wheelie going past 1 meter or so.

High speed handling is very good, low speed turns while decelerating are handled very good as well.  The only slight issue is a push from accelerating out of a turn from a standstill or at low speed.  On a track, assume the car will slide over one or two car widths if you were to try to power out of a turn too early.

 

I now see why the Turbo Scorpion has increased track width and slightly larger bore shocks along with the battery mounted length-wise and think I have reached similar results with these mods.

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@Killajb Interesting experience on the Tomahawk. I remember reading/watching a couple of runs with a similar chassis and I thought I noticed some understeer and bottoming out after jumps but I might be mistaken. I haven't run my Scorpion so it'll be interesting. But that 13.5T motor seems quite fast for the chassis? 

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Yes, it is quite fast for this chassis Which is why I put it in there :rolleyes:.  I only use that much burst on wide open pavement.  On dirt I am more controlled and when taking on jumps. I have the rear shock spring clamps almost at the lowest point but will still bottom out on occasion on larger jumps if I get a bit too much air.  I've tried thicker shock oil but the rebound is "mushy".  Tamiya #900 pink is what worked best and will do for now.  At some point I may pick up a pair of larger Turbo Scorpion rear dampers but not really necessary if I don't plan on hitting big jumps (which I really don't).

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Today I mounted the wide front arm shaft on my Tomahawk. This was the last modification of the Tomahawk. Now it has the same dimensions as the Turbo Scorpion. This weekend it will be tested :)

The Turbo Scorpion kit has arrived today...I will assemble it for christmas :)

IMG_20201124_142853.jpg

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Christmas is only a few days over and the Turbo Scorpion is already built and ready to go. This buggy looks incredibly great! Once again I had the great experience of building a legendary series buggy.

IMG_20201227_135737.jpg

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Hi all new here.  ,, just got the tomahawk found the same thin bit light over the front

 and moved a few things around to get a little more on there,,  really happy with the kit 

1610017012564911130712.jpg

Edited by bartman77
misspeel

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hi found a turbo scorpion top swing arm  plate SC 253 fits in with std gearbox plate   , was able to move the rear wheels back around 10mm  but gear box and motor is still in original position , and was able to fit without cutting the shell set of tubo scorpion shocks fitted with a small backet made ,,, happy as it steers under power 

IMAG0345[1].jpg

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