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mcvwuk

Bush Devil to Frog conversion

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Hi,

I've been reading that the Bush Devil has the best/revised suspension in terms of gearbox and driveshafts of the ORV chassis's and I was wondering how difficult (if it's possible that is) it would be to convert a Bush Devil to a Frog?

Thanks,

Mike

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I haven’t tried this myself but it’s been on my list to try a Super Frog build with a SBF tranny.  As such, I look forward to pix of your build!

For the front, all you need to do is remove the front shock plate and use 3rd party frog shock plates. You might need shorter shocks, ie I’m using 50520s on my Bushy D, and 50519s on my Frog.

I suspect you only real issue will be the rear shocks.  The Frog wants the horizontal layout, while the SBF rear requires vertical shocks.  I think you’ll have to trim the body around this, and fit a wing mount somehow on the rear shock plate.

Terry

 

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First step would be to very carefully remove the blue chassis and ship it off to me. I'll swap you an ultra-rare-totally-out-of-production red version in it's place :D

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Hi,

@terry, unfortunately I don't have a Bush Devil (nor a Frog), but I really want a Frog so have been scouring ads for Frog/Brat parts etc, and that's how I came across the Bush Devil possibility. I have no idea if building a Frog from old Devil/Brat parts is efficient or practical, but thought it would be an alternative route to trying to get hold of a used Frog.

@isomer1, is the blue chassis hard to find then? If so I might just have to buy this one that I've found then :)

Is the gearbox/transmission of the BD very different to the Frog? I'll have to check out the manuals and see what's what.

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The blue chassis is rare. It has yet to be reproduced by tamiya.

Terry

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I'm going off mental-memory right now as I have almost every ORV to date - but I think aside from the obvious issue with the rear suspension, you may also have issues with the height of the transmission and where the motor sits.

The top of the transgression may sit higher, causing issues with the Frog body sitting properly on the rest of the chassis.

You also lose the ability to bolt-on the ORV original trailing arms, so you'd have to use the SBF rear suspension and find a way to get some mini-shocks tucked in there some how...

Honestly, if you put a good differential and good shocks on the back of the Frog I'd argue that the front end is the performance-limiter more than anything...

But as I always say: your money, your mess - do what makes you smile!

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I have a box of pieces that I've been collecting for a similar project. This is the best I know:

(1) As Frog Jumper mentioned above, the blue chassis is quite rare. If you can get it for a decent price that rarity will up your cool factor. But... it may also be fragile due to age. Personally I'd build out around a new frame, either the red from the monster beetle, or gray from the brat.

(2) I've only owned the Monster Beetle, and the frog front suspension is pretty meager by comparison. In fairness it is older and built for much smaller wheels. One way to build out the front suspension (without going as long as the monster beetle) would be to look at these 3rd party shock towers (other, shorter models around, just googling for 'Frog ORV suspension' etc.)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/254215249078?hash=item3b3068dcb6:g:UosAAOSw8bdcx0h~

(3) You may find you like the looks more than the driving experience. It might be worth running the chassis as-is a few times before investing in the rework.

 

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The bush devil parts I have seen for sale are basically just the space frame, gearbox housing and some odds n ends. It's in no way complete, which is why I was thinking of building it up as a Frog. But considering the points raised I think its unlikely to be straightforward, or worthwhile so perhaps I should drop the idea?

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5 minutes ago, mcvwuk said:

The bush devil parts I have seen for sale are basically just the space frame, gearbox housing and some odds n ends. It's in no way complete, which is why I was thinking of building it up as a Frog. But considering the points raised I think its unlikely to be straightforward, or worthwhile so perhaps I should drop the idea?

I don't think you should drop the idea.  But if you do, you should sell me your blue chassis for cheap...

In fact, I think you should build towards it, ie build a standard BF/Frog first, then upgrade it to SBF/Frog when you find the additional parts you need.  This will give you time to fix the front end how you like, and will allow you to experience the full click-click-click glory of the standard ORV tranny!

:P

Terry

 

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I'd love to build a frog - and I guess this would be a good starting point. However, are all parts available - and if so, is it going to be the most expensive frog ever built!! Lol!

What price is reasonable for the bush devil space frame? £25?

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20 minutes ago, mcvwuk said:

I'd love to build a frog - and I guess this would be a good starting point. However, are all parts available - and if so, is it going to be the most expensive frog ever built!! Lol!

What price is reasonable for the bush devil space frame? £25?

The last NIB blue chassis I saw was in Australia Ebay, and AmPro bought it after I pointed it out to him.  I don't remember how much it listed for, but it was not cheap.  You can ask him, but I bet he paid over $50 for it... 

As for building a Frog, all the original Frog and Blackfoot parts are available as Re-Re.  Many of the special SBF parts can be had via Shapeways, or by patiently waiting on ebay and/or selling a kidney...  I've spent over 4 years collecting Original rear end pieces for the SBF, and I'm down to the last few bits (kidneys intact)...

Terry

 

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9 hours ago, Frog Jumper said:

The last NIB blue chassis I saw was in Australia Ebay, and AmPro bought it after I pointed it out to him.  I don't remember how much it listed for, but it was not cheap.  You can ask him, but I bet he paid over $50 for it... 

As for building a Frog, all the original Frog and Blackfoot parts are available as Re-Re.  Many of the special SBF parts can be had via Shapeways, or by patiently waiting on ebay and/or selling a kidney...  I've spent over 4 years collecting Original rear end pieces for the SBF, and I'm down to the last few bits (kidneys intact)...

Terry

 

The chassis I've seen is no way NIB (pics below) - it's literally just the centre space-frame section. The gearbox housings are available as are some front suspension pieces - but not complete (I think) and considering these are different for the frog, I don't think they would be useful.

I've got three young kids - all still at school/college - so I can't really spare the other kidney on buying parts for a frog build. I think my best scenario would be to keep looking for a good 2nd hand frog (that's complete).

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For those that are interested, this is on UK eBay 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/324658554001

 

 

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