Does it matter to you if Tamiya's mid to high end RCs are made in Japan?

[Mechanic AH 579]

I had started a thread somewhere and I noticed someone mentioned bringing the cost down—I guess in order to compete with other brands. And I've read many times about people being upset with how Tamiya prices their kits and products compared to what you can get from other brands. I agree that Tamiya can get expensive but I'm rarely bothered when it comes to their mid-range to high end kits because they're still made in Japan (and some of the hop-ups). Sometimes "made in Japan" can be the selling point for me. I can't think of prime American RC brands that are still made in the US. Team Associated and Losi may be designed in the US but then they can be made in China (even the re-re RC10), and this goes for crawler/truck brands. There might be aftermarket brands (like MIP) that are made in the US but they're relatively expensive. I recall my re-re Cat XLS and I don't think there were markings as to where it's made and I'm sure if it was made in the UK it would've proudly been noted—but also more expensive (is it made in the UK?). And then the Kyosho re-res that are now made in Taiwan instead of Japan. I think they had to upgrade the components to justify the price point and for people to be ok that it's not made in Japan anymore. Made me think that if the Egress or Avante re-re was made in China, obviously with a lower price point, would I desire it as much or care as much? Would it still be unique? I always felt that part of the novelty of Tamiya is that it can be made in Japan. How about for the rest of you? Do you care about the mid to high end Tamiya RCs (including hop-ups) being made in Japan?

[Fabia130vRS 2091]

To be honest… I want them

ONLY to be made in Japan.

 

God forbid they start producing in lets say… UK. 

[Willy iine 17939]

@Mechanic AH I care very much that the higher end kits and parts are made in Japan.  There is obvious quality differentiation there.  And I do not mind spending premium price for vanity purposes as this is a hobby.  If it makes me feel good owning a special car, then it's all worth it to me.

If can fit a Willy or Billy in the Egress I'd own one today as I love CF deck chassis.. but he won't fit, and right now I'm not focused on buggy's so have not bought one.  It's a good looking car for sure.

As for made in China and cheap parts.. I'm also okay with those if they are functionally sound like my no-brand 20kg digital servo's.  I have over 15 of them on my various cars and they all work flawlessly.  Or my cheap Spektrum 2ch receivers for my DX5Pro.  I own over 20 of them and they all work great.. no sense buying (now hard to find) expensive Futaba FAAST receivers for my 4PKS-R just for my comical cars.  Really depends on the application.  I use a bunch of 1060’s too.  They are all good.

This is what I want to stay away from.. injection found on my made in the Philippines Billy.. look at the horrible injection at the level of Revell model kits! 

[svenb 3565]

1 hour ago, Fabia130vRS said:

 

 

God forbid they start producing in lets say… UK. 

Don't understand? 

[Blista 1495]

The new Avante chassis seems as though the plastics are of such a high quality it does still mean something when stamped with Made In Japan.

The economic argument of lower costs in China or elsewhere can't be ignored, however I'd prefer it if companies didn't have to rely on a race to the bottom for manufacturing costs.  Innovation and the ability to have more direct control on the manufacturing process seems to pay off in the long run over short term cost cutting.  I'd prefer a Tamiya that retains it's character and position in the market rather than have it seek growth only for the sake of it looking better on a revenue statement.

[alvinlwh 5292]

33 minutes ago, svenb said:

Don't understand? 

If you know the quality of a British made car, you will understand the joke. 

http://www.triumphspitfire.com/Jokes.html

 

[Superluminal 3532]

Yeah i wouldnt agree with that either. The UK always had and still does have an excellant reputation in the world of pricision engineering, component manufacturing and quality control / testing particularly low to medium volume production. I think we could do a good job of moulding a few modelkits.

[djmcnz 754]

All Apple products are made in China, there are very few complaints about their quality.

Be careful, generalising about Chinese manufacturing is probably racist (even though it's still quite common).

When companies outsource production they are not obliged to outsource quality control. China also has some of the most advanced manufacturing capabilities in the world.

The question should be: should Tamiya permit poor quality products to be released under their brand (regardless of where they're made)?

NB: I'm not Chinese, and I hate Apple products.

[alvinlwh 5292]

21 minutes ago, Superluminal said:

Yeah i wouldnt agree with that either. The UK always had and still does have an excellant reputation in the world of pricision engineering, component manufacturing and quality control / testing particularly low to medium volume production. I think we could do a good job of moulding a few modelkits.

I make static models where precision and fine details are far more important/noticeable (if you know the term "rivet counter") and can tell you a that Airfix is no match for Tamiya, Dragon or Trumpeter in terms of quality. I still build Airfix kits though every now and then, mind you. 

[alvinlwh 5292]

6 minutes ago, djmcnz said:

All Apple products are made in China, there are very few complaints about their quality.

Be careful, generalising about Chinese manufacturing is probably racist (even though it's still quite common).

When companies outsource production they are not obliged to outsource quality control. China also has some of the most advanced manufacturing capabilities in the world.

The question should be: should Tamiya permit poor quality products to be released under their brand (regardless of where they're made)?

NB: I'm not Chinese, and I hate Apple products.

What you are saying had been said in this article, back in 2006.

https://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/china.htm

 

[svenb 3565]

46 minutes ago, alvinlwh said:

If you know the quality of a British made car, you will understand the joke. 

http://www.triumphspitfire.com/Jokes.html

 

Aston Martin's are rubbish aren't they 🙄

[Grumpy pants 4243]

3 hours ago, Fabia130vRS said:

To be honest… I want them

ONLY to be made in Japan.

 

God forbid they start producing in lets say… UK. 

This is a really small minded comment 🤦

Totally pointless and decades behind the real world.

Shame on you. 

[Grumpy pants 4243]

1 hour ago, alvinlwh said:

If you know the quality of a British made car, you will understand the joke. 

http://www.triumphspitfire.com/Jokes.html

 

Hmmm I think this joke is over 40 years old now 👏

Wasn’t production stopped in 1979 for the Spitfire? 
 

[TWINSET 1793]

I can't  see as it matters where anything is made any more, so long as it's made to the quality you're expecting.
Even if you buy the finest 'Made In Japan' electronics, chances are it'll have individual components from all over the world.

Tamiya will have strict measures in place to ensure plastics used are to their specs, not just for their reputation, but for recyclability etc.

Over the years, complaints about Tamiya, on this forum at least, tend to be about their (Japanese) engineering and design errors, not the plastics or the part of the world in which they were made - ORV gearboxes spreading, Jugg 1s exploding on acceleration, Anniversary Porsche shells not matching the wheelbase of the chassis etc. - None of these were down to where the plastic was poured into the mold.

Indeed, in the last 20 odd years of being back into regularly building RC, only one Tamiya kit has ever had a manufacturing defect, and that was a cross-member brace on a Knight Hauler where the sprue wasn't properly cast.

 

Outsourcing to anywhere without stringent control over the end-product would be disastrous, but Tamiya have been manufacturing in the Philippines for years now with no noticeable or reported affect on quality

Cheap labour will always be attractive and, provided the quality aspect is 'Tamiya',  it shouldn't matter except to those that have outdated misconceptions about a particular country's abilities.

 

[Mad Ax 8406]

Interesting how lots of people will complain about "made in China" but lots of people are getting upset about (what I see as) a joke about British manufacturing capabilities.

Britain's manufacturing reputation got seriously dented by British Leyland in the same way that China's manufacturing quality gets dented by fly-by-night companies making shoddy knock-offs for pennies.

China is capable of making high-quality products, for the right price.  For example, most of us will recommend Hobbywing ESCs - which are made in China.

I have two MST cars which I consider to be very well made, with high quality plastics and great design.  AFAIK they're made in Taiwan.

I also love my Gmade BOM, although it needed a bit more attention during assembly, and have various good-quality Junfac parts.  I think these are made in Korea.

According to Schumacher's website, most of their parts are still manufactured in the UK (although they put their stickers on Hobbywing products and use some Chinese parts).

What we really should ask before buying something made outside of our own geographic area is: is the product being manufactured with environmental and social responsibility?  Tamiya have got photos and videos of conditions inside their Philippines plant.  I don't know about the other companies.  I have no idea what conditions are like inside the factories where the products from cheap clothes stores are made...

[alvinlwh 5292]

38 minutes ago, Grumpy pants said:

Hmmm I think this joke is over 40 years old now 👏

Wasn’t production stopped in 1979 for the Spitfire? 
 

Perhaps, but impressions run deep I suppose and these British cars jokes are still going around today. Just yesterday, I saw a vehicle driving by with the sticker on its rear saying "SAVE TIME, GET A LAND CRUISER NOT A LAND ROVER".

I heard from the grapevine in my industry that the reason Honda is shutting down its Swindon plant is due to the poor quality cars that come out of that place. I guess the "Friday afternoon car" still exists today.

[Superluminal 3532]

44 minutes ago, alvinlwh said:

I make static models where precision and fine details are far more important/noticeable (if you know the term "rivet counter") and can tell you a that Airfix is no match for Tamiya, Dragon or Trumpeter in terms of quality. I still build Airfix kits though every now and then, mind you. 

I think that probably comes down to price point - a lot of their moulds and tools are fifty years old and you could typically get two airfix kits for the price of a Tamiya kit

[djmcnz 754]

Somebody told me they still made actual cars in the UK, I though it was a proper joke (literally)!

That link about Aston Martin taught me something I didn't know.

 

[alvinlwh 5292]

5 minutes ago, Superluminal said:

I think that probably comes down to price point - a lot of their moulds and tools are fifty years old and you could typically get two airfix kits for the price of a Tamiya kit

I am comparing like for like, take this "current" BF109 for example, an improvement on their 50yo kits, but still no match for a 20yo Tamiya kit. Even a bargain basement Hobbyboss, which costs less than an Airfix kit, beats it.

[acprc 1403]

As a Quality Manager for a British manufacturing company that has exceptional quality levels for a volume product it annoys me when people who live in the UK are happy to knock British Manufacturing. We have a sister plant in China that beats us for Quality making the same product and also does it cheaper. Don't underestimate how good the Chinese are at making things.

When I first started the job I would push and promote British based suppliers all the time but 9 years in I now don't care where parts are made as long as they are made correctly and on time. It makes little difference if the process controls are robust.

Japanese industry isnt perfect, dont forget Toyota recalled 12 million cars last year for defects that needed fixing.

Most things Tamiya make come from the Phillipines now anyway so its a mute point. Tamiya does tend to favour Japanese brands to make there branded items (like Futaba for their RC gear) however the manufacturers aren't all in Japan. Makita make all their tools and are based out of Mexico , Brazil and Romania. 

[cambragol 152]

I would likely not buy them if they were not made in Japan. I would go further and say I would be even less likely to buy them if they were made in China. I would say one reason for that is because we are in a hidden war with China. Us being the west, and Japan. Or more correctly, they are waging a hidden war upon the west. Avoiding their products for reasons related to that is hardly 'racist' whatever that word means.

Referring to the OPs question, it certainly matters to me that high-end Tamiya kits would be made in Japan.

[alvinlwh 5292]

Where they are made does not matter that much, their brand (not just Tamiya) carry more weight as explained in this article.

https://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/china.htm

What does annoy me is, many Japanese brands (Tamiya for example) has an international market and yet still release documents in Japanese only. For example, I am spending hours transcribing a Mini 4WD parts list from the Japanese document into English so that I can look it up.

BTW, earlier, I was explaining a joke about British made to a person that cannot understand the joke. I am not the original person that made the joke, so please stop getting mad at me. You don't get mad at a dictionary for having a word in it that you don't agree with do you?

[Mad Ax 8406]

1 hour ago, alvinlwh said:

I heard from the grapevine in my industry that the reason Honda is shutting down its Swindon plant is due to the poor quality cars that come out of that place. I guess the "Friday afternoon car" still exists today.

I would go out on a limb and say this is a viable excuse, but I think the reasons would run much deeper than that.  I've known people who worked in the Swindon plant and say it has a very toxic culture.

[alvinlwh 5292]

5 minutes ago, Mad Ax said:

I would go out on a limb and say this is a viable excuse, but I think the reasons would run much deeper than that.  I've known people who worked in the Swindon plant and say it has a very toxic culture.

Interesting you mention the culture. I was watching a YouTube video just yesterday showing the difference in Japanese TV and UK/US one and it is completely different. Now, I know the Japan work culture is also different from the Western one, it is quite strange that their TV shows differs so much from their real life.

[catman79 346]

interesting thread, and some rather bizzare comments i have to say.  has someone said something offensive and i've missed the offence?