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Am I missing something here? It seems Im always a few parts short of a new ORV build so Ill look for a used complete or near complete ORV on ebay instead of buying a few parts trees that add up to half the cost of a new kit.

But these ebay prices make no sense. Even at $150 shipped for a very used ORV, (sometimes even without a body) its still in the territory of just buying a brand new complete kit for $180. And some of these used ones are priced in the $200-$300 range.

When it comes to ORVs, beyond the FORD logo on bodies etc is there really a collective market for beat up original stuff? I can see something that hasnt been ReRe'd but the kits that are readily available, what gives?

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Tell me about it. I'm going through the same thing. My Frog-from-Blackfoot spares project is mostly completed but I had to break down and buy $50 worth of parts (ok, I didn't really need the gray chassis parts tree as the red version I have would have worked, but I splurged for appearance sake). Initially, I too, was just going to look for a used beater to restore or gather parts from, but the prices for these old beaters aren't worth it for my needs. Tamiya made a billion of these things plus re-re'd them and they still not cheap on the used market. The bargain days are over unless ones does some hunting.

P.S., still looking for the steering upright step screws (4) and not wanting to spend $15 on a whole screw bag to get them.

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2 hours ago, Rider400 said:

But these ebay prices make no sense.

Some of the prices people want are very optimistic.

2 hours ago, Rider400 said:

When it comes to ORVs, beyond the FORD logo on bodies etc is there really a collective market for beat up original stuff? 

The keyword is original.

I think you'll find the same thing with any Tamiya stuff from the 80's.

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I wonder if this is eBay US thing? A running ORV Blackfoot (no body shell) sold today on eBay UK for about £55 and they seem to be going for about £50-80 over here if you're willing to accept they need some work or body shells etc.

What I'm trying to say is are you guys searching eBay UK? Even with shipping costs, if you can find a deal you'll probably be better off than the prices people are demanding in the US 

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48 minutes ago, Sir Crashalot said:

Some of the prices people want are very optimistic.

The keyword is original.

I think you'll find the same thing with any Tamiya stuff from the 80's.

Yes, M38's are the same way.  I just feel lucky if someone is selling the part I want.  Usually not the case and I end up buying another restorable car to make one car out of 2 chassis.  

 

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Well hate to say it we can mainly thank this pandemic for most of the problems.... Seems that most folk who have parts or multiple copies of a car or a kit will take them and shove a massive price tag on it waitin for that one  sucker who doesn't care about price to pay them for what they think is gold... I have seen the costs triple to quadruple overnight when it brokeout worldwide....

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I'm still finding pretty decent deals, there's just a lot more to sift through. Two key issues come up:

(1) Original boxed items from 20+ years ago. I have little to no interest in those but I can at least appreciate the cost.

(2) Items from Japan. This has been discussed on these forums many times before, I'm not sure if we know exactly why, but even prior to the pandemic there was a big influx of speculative posts from Japan. If you search on Yahoo Japans auctions (the most popular online auction in Japan) you'll find a regular supply of Tamiya goods. Those same items are then cross-posted to eBay at *huge* mark-ups. Often the same item is cross-posted by multiple sellers. The thought is that the seller doesn't own the item - they're just seeing if they can flip it for quick cash. They set the price silly high which covers the export etc in the event they actually find an oversees buyer. Apparently that is lucrative enough (or requires so little effort) that a number of Japanese merchants regularly engage in the activity.

eBay won't let you exclude a particular country of origin, so we're just stuck with it (or not using eBay, which is probably the healthier option in the long run). If you need a part, Tamico / Plaza Japan / Tony in the UK have most of the bases covered.

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4 hours ago, isomer1 said:

(2) Items from Japan. This has been discussed on these forums many times before, I'm not sure if we know exactly why, but even prior to the pandemic there was a big influx of speculative posts from Japan. If you search on Yahoo Japans auctions (the most popular online auction in Japan) you'll find a regular supply of Tamiya goods. Those same items are then cross-posted to eBay at *huge* mark-ups. Often the same item is cross-posted by multiple sellers. The thought is that the seller doesn't own the item - they're just seeing if they can flip it for quick cash. They set the price silly high which covers the export etc in the event they actually find an oversees buyer. Apparently that is lucrative enough (or requires so little effort) that a number of Japanese merchants regularly engage in the activity.

Exactly this with Tamiya nitro, especially 1/8 scale parts. prices have gone through the roof.

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I must admit I've noticed what these people are putting up on Ebay for sale at ridiculous prices but are they actually selling for those prices? You see them up for sale for weeks/months even some kits for sale in the UK are rather optimistic (at best) 

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I want to restore a Gold Pan RC10 as I had one as a kid. I feel like I can't even get into a decent rolling chassis for under $200. And there were A LOT of RC10s made. I went looking on ebay for various Tamiya chassis' this weekend and was shocked at some of the prices.

Like @Saito2 said, the days of finding a bargain roller to fix up are LONG GONE. I've got what I wanted to collect, the RC10 is a "nice to have" part of my collection. I can be choosy and patient in looking for one.

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I used to buy tons of used up RCs in huge lots or on their own from Craigslist, Facebook, etc. but seems that is all long gone.  Haven't come across a good used deal in a while, been mostly buying new these days since it actually works out to be a better deal with the inflated prices and nobody has screwed anything up on it yet. 

One thing I never understood about vintage RC are the prices for "original" stuff that you can buy in rerelease form brand new.  Don't get me wrong, a nice example of a clean vehicle for a shelf queen or a new in box I totally get from a collector's perspective.  As others have said, I wouldnt even want a used original Grasshopper, ORV, Clod, etc that I was planning on actually using because it will most likely break every single plastic part within a few good runs anyway.  I build a lot of Clod-based trucks and still have a ton of original Clod stuff that I won't even bother throwing on a runner, not worth the hassle.  

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22 minutes ago, 87lc2 said:

As others have said, I wouldnt even want a used original Grasshopper, ORV, Clod, etc that I was planning on actually using because it will most likely break every single plastic part within a few good runs anyway.  I build a lot of Clod-based trucks and still have a ton of original Clod stuff that I won't even bother throwing on a runner, not worth the hassle.  

It's why I hesitate to run my vintage Hotshot anymore. Three, very gentle runs, and I broke the roll cage, shock mount, and front steering knuckle. All original parts that were just super brittle due to old age. I replaced them all with originals, but it's made me think twice about ever running it again.

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5 minutes ago, NWarty said:

It's why I hesitate to run my vintage Hotshot anymore. Three, very gentle runs, and I broke the roll cage, shock mount, and front steering knuckle. All original parts that were just super brittle due to old age. I replaced them all with originals, but it's made me think twice about ever running it again.

Exactly.  Unless the old stuff is in mint condition and will be used on the shelf, it's basically useless to me.  I actually sold my original Grasshopper to buy a re-re, by the time I was done with it there wouldn't be anything original left on it anyway after all of the breakage.  Have been much happier running the re-re regularly and haven't broken a thing.   Guess I'll have to repat the cycle in another 20-30 years, but that's how it goes...

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1 hour ago, NWarty said:

I want to restore a Gold Pan RC10 as I had one as a kid. I feel like I can't even get into a decent rolling chassis for under $200. And there were A LOT of RC10s made. I went looking on ebay for various Tamiya chassis' this weekend and was shocked at some of the prices.

Like @Saito2 said, the days of finding a bargain roller to fix up are LONG GONE. I've got what I wanted to collect, the RC10 is a "nice to have" part of my collection. I can be choosy and patient in looking for one.

Indeed I have an original RC10 gold pan sittin in my wall locker and debating on whether to ripout all of the speed run parts and restore it back to original or leave it like it is for a piece of history..... I may endup doing option 2 for I and some friends was basically the grandfathers that launched the land speed record car phase in the hobby over 25 yrs ago

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12 hours ago, acprc said:

Exactly this with Tamiya nitro, especially 1/8 scale parts. prices have gone through the roof.

Supply and demand. That’s how things work. 

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8 hours ago, 87lc2 said:

One thing I never understood about vintage RC are the prices for "original" stuff that you can buy in rerelease form brand new.  Don't get me wrong, a nice example of a clean vehicle for a shelf queen or a new in box I totally get from a collector's perspective.  As others have said, I wouldnt even want a used original Grasshopper, ORV, Clod, etc that I was planning on actually using because it will most likely break every single plastic part within a few good runs anyway.  I build a lot of Clod-based trucks and still have a ton of original Clod stuff that I won't even bother throwing on a runner, not worth the hassle.  

This. Exactly what I mean. If its a really beat down ORV I dont see the point in its collectability just because its an original. Its a pile of brittle plastic for the most part. And maybe some outdated electronics.

Of course there are exceptions to this with certain kits/parts.

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On 10/10/2021 at 11:20 PM, isomer1 said:

I'm still finding pretty decent deals, there's just a lot more to sift through. Two key issues come up:

(1) Original boxed items from 20+ years ago. I have little to no interest in those but I can at least appreciate the cost.

(2) Items from Japan. This has been discussed on these forums many times before, I'm not sure if we know exactly why, but even prior to the pandemic there was a big influx of speculative posts from Japan. If you search on Yahoo Japans auctions (the most popular online auction in Japan) you'll find a regular supply of Tamiya goods. Those same items are then cross-posted to eBay at *huge* mark-ups. Often the same item is cross-posted by multiple sellers. The thought is that the seller doesn't own the item - they're just seeing if they can flip it for quick cash. They set the price silly high which covers the export etc in the event they actually find an oversees buyer. Apparently that is lucrative enough (or requires so little effort) that a number of Japanese merchants regularly engage in the activity.

eBay won't let you exclude a particular country of origin, so we're just stuck with it (or not using eBay, which is probably the healthier option in the long run). If you need a part, Tamico / Plaza Japan / Tony in the UK have most of the bases covered.

I guess that explains why someone is asking $15,000 USD for a 1988 Avante not even in box art.  It's a hail mary, but I just can't see anyone pulling the trigger.  How dumb do they think we are?  https://www.ebay.com/itm/234172009308

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3 hours ago, A-Baum said:

I guess that explains why someone is asking $15,000 USD for a 1988 Avante not even in box art.  It's a hail mary, but I just can't see anyone pulling the trigger.  How dumb do they think we are?  https://www.ebay.com/itm/234172009308

But it's marked down from 16,798 dollars! What a deal!

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I went through the same thing with my Sand Scorcher. I have an original that’s in bad shape and needs a lot of parts replaced. When things first shut down last year I blew it apart and made a list of everything I’d need to at least get the chassis rebuilt and functional. The cost of the parts mot including radio gear and the body restoration supplies was literally as much as Tower Hobbies was selling brand new rere kits for, so I just bought a new kit. It just doesn’t make any sense to spend hundreds more for something that I’d be too afraid to drive to even have fun with.

 

It’s the same with ALL OTHER hobbies right now though. A couple years ago, you could buy out of print 20 year old styrene model car kits for $20, maybe $30 if it was something really desirable. Now, glue bombs of those kits are $50+ on ebay, and a sealed reissue is $30 at any hobby shop. Or if it’s not $30 new, you’re certainly getting a way better experience than trying to fix up an over priced, beat up kit. It’s a shame but it’s how it is now. Everyone and their grandmother got hobbies during the pandemic and they seem to be sticking with them. Even “free” hobbies like hiking, I used to always be the solitary sole on the trails, now, I’m lucky if I can find a parking spot at the same exact location.

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On 10/11/2021 at 9:27 PM, Avante2001R said:

Supply and demand. That’s how things work. 

Unfortunately your right! Can't speak for the rest of the world but here in the UK we've just had the prime example of supply and demand! Our lovely media (I'm being ironic by the way) make a none story about shortage of fuel tankers drivers knowing farewell the moronic people amongst us will flee to the nearest fuel station to fill up when 75% of people will just return to the driveway and the car will sit there......it was madness! Thus petrol stations (not so much supermarket stations) hiked up the price! My local station overnight went from £1.31 per litre to £1.49 when I asked the guy who was Marshalling the queues that's now stupid it got he said with the biggest grin on his face "supply and demand"!! I'm definitely not being political but welcome to the nasty side of capitalism! 

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On 10/11/2021 at 6:47 PM, 87lc2 said:

I used to buy tons of used up RCs in huge lots or on their own from Craigslist, Facebook, etc. but seems that is all long gone.  Haven't come across a good used deal in a while, been mostly buying new these days since it actually works out to be a better deal with the inflated prices and nobody has screwed anything up on it yet. 

One thing I never understood about vintage RC are the prices for "original" stuff that you can buy in rerelease form brand new.  Don't get me wrong, a nice example of a clean vehicle for a shelf queen or a new in box I totally get from a collector's perspective.  As others have said, I wouldnt even want a used original Grasshopper, ORV, Clod, etc that I was planning on actually using because it will most likely break every single plastic part within a few good runs anyway.  I build a lot of Clod-based trucks and still have a ton of original Clod stuff that I won't even bother throwing on a runner, not worth the hassle.  

Only a few years back, before all the badwording  re-re badword completely badworded up my hobby *snarl* there was huge satisfaction in finding parts & real kudos running restored cars where there was any risk involved, £60 for a VLB bodyshell in goodish nick was normal & body posts were non-existent so racing them about took balls. Cheap buggies like Manta Rays, Terra Conquerors etc were nothing on eBay so they got fired off ramps & used in firework experiments(!), the really expensive stuff were 3 speeds because they were rare & complete Clods because we’d used up all the axles making crawlers ha ha. Common road stuff like TL-01s, TT-01s, M-03s was cheap as chips so we all had a drifter or three as well. Anyway yes, nowadays there’s little point running anything original, or even owning it (unless it’s of personal sentimental value) just get the new version with a LiPo some 2.4 & save the tears. 

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22 minutes ago, Mad Zero said:

Anyway yes, nowadays there’s little point running anything original, or even owning it (unless it’s of personal sentimental value) just get the new version with a LiPo some 2.4 & save the tears. 

Crikey, my whole fleet is vintage. All 2.4G though so there's no glitching when I run them. And no thanks, LiPo is completely unnecessary and unstable. I'd shed quite a few tears if one of my cars (or my house!) burned down. NiMH is stable and easy, and I reckon LiPo is overkill for most casual RCers.

Back on topic, I think the prices these days are mostly reflections of people coming to understand how much goes into a working car. If you add up the parts on a $100 Blackfoot for example, would you be able to buy all that stuff for $100 separately? The "complete" price seems to be rising closer to the "parted out" price these days because people are actually doing their research before posting anything. And anything vintage that's still in good usable condition is actually worth something, because it survived all these years without getting destroyed like the rest of them.

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4 minutes ago, El Gecko said:

Crikey, my whole fleet is vintage. All 2.4G though so there's no glitching when I run them. And no thanks, LiPo is completely unnecessary and unstable. I'd shed quite a few tears if one of my cars (or my house!) burned down. NiMH is stable and easy, and I reckon LiPo is overkill for most casual RCers.

 

I see comments like this on TC every once in a while and I don't get it.  There is nothing unstable about Lipo batteries as long as cells don't drop below safe voltage and they are charged properly.  Not saying there's anything wrong with Nimh batteries, but I don't get the aversion to Lipo.  Have been using them for nearly 10 years now and never an issue.  They have more punch and don't lose power as the run goes on, really no negatives to them.  If you're worried about storing them in the house, just put them in an ammo box.  

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Too bad there was no re-re for the M38's.  WR02 is a completely different chassis and while much more capable functionally, it's not as fun to own for me.  And once GF01 was released, there was really no reason for the WR02 (again for me).  GF01 kicks -butt, it is my favorite modern chassis.  I don't know how many I have now.. I bought a handful this year.

 

As for LiPo, they are safe to use as @87lc2 mentioned above.  It's just the hassle of storing it properly, baby sitting while charging, and not being able to keep it fully charged for long durations that keeps me from using mine as I once did.  I have like a dozen 2S LiPo's that have been in storage since 2016-2018.  I check the voltage every 3 months and the good packs have consistently held a constant and balanced charge so they are stable and safe.  

These days I only use NiMH and even NiCd since I have NiCd packs I made pre-2000 that still hold a good charge.  I just keep a few charged at all times so that when I get the urge or time to drive my RC, it's ready to go.

 

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2 hours ago, Willy iine said:

As for LiPo, they are safe to use as @87lc2 mentioned above.  It's just the hassle of storing it properly, baby sitting while charging, and not being able to keep it fully charged for long durations that keeps me from using mine as I once did.  I have like a dozen 2S LiPo's that have been in storage since 2016-2018.  I check the voltage every 3 months and the good packs have consistently held a constant and balanced charge so they are stable and safe. 

Exactly, I don't need all that extra hassle in my RC life. It's supposed to be a fun hobby, and having to worry so much about the batteries is not fun for me. I definitely prefer reliable and easy over fast and fragile. I'm not out racing for pinks or anything (not racing at all in fact).

 

2 hours ago, Willy iine said:

These days I only use NiMH and even NiCd since I have NiCd packs I made pre-2000 that still hold a good charge.  I just keep a few charged at all times so that when I get the urge or time to drive my RC, it's ready to go.

You've hit on the fun part: keeping a NiMH charged up and ready for whenever the urge strikes to go for a drive. I'm all NiMH nowadays because I like the runtime (the old NiCds are stored away just in case, but I do charge one up sometimes as a bench tester). I drove nearly 2 miles (actual 1:1 miles) on a trail walk the other day on a single NiMH battery, almost an hour's worth of hiking. It wasn't exactly an easy drive for the truck either, as the trail was mostly covered in a heavy layer of leaves and twigs and debris. Threw the battery on the charger when I got home so it's ready for the next run, easy peasy. Also got a 25-pack of individual NiMH cells for a 1:1 hedge trimmer project, and there "just happened" to be a few leftover, so I'm gonna solder up some custom packs for my cars too. I wouldn't be able to do that with LiPo.

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