TD-2 - New Astute

[ThunderDragonCy 7881]

Here you go @BuggyGuy! I knew someone had done it!

Scroll back up up for how to mount the servo. 

[BuggyGuy 1106]

Little slipper upgrade:

 

Comparison of the plates (would probably also fit the XV01):

 

Assembled! So now has an associated B4 spur (which I'll swap out for a machined rather than moulded version soon), DB01 slipper pads, and the new plates from a late model 201:

Going to try and fit a lighter counter gear at some point as I have a box somewhere with some in - just not found it since moving house.

Got a load of different front hubs and caster blocks to play with next, I think the XV01 C parts could be interesting to check for fit and ackerman so I've got some of those to try, and I'm swapping over the steering and front rockers to aluminium parts with the hard hex head ball connectors tomorrow to try and sharpen that up a bit, remove some slop, and make the front a tiny bit heavier.

Got 2 weeks until the first serious meeting for the TD2 on carpet, so plenty of time for fiddling left 

 

Edit - has anyone here tried mounting the body with just velcro? I looks like it would work but would be interesting to see if it's already been done!

[BuggyGuy 1106]

Pretty much done now:

Got to shorten all the wires now it's done

Current spec:

- Lunsford Titanium turnbuckles all round

- Tamiya reinforced adjusters on all the turnbuckles

- Tamiya Aluminium front rockers

- Tamiya blue aluminium steering posts from a DB01 used as front rocker posts

- XV02 6 degree front caster blocks

- Tamiya aluminium steering parts

- Tamiya 5mm clamping wheel hexes all round

- DF03/TT02B dampers - gold springs on the rear and blue on the front from the DT02 set

- Front axles have been swapped for the M-Chassis reinforced hopup items

-TiN coated 46mm rear inner suspension shafts

- Low friction suspension balls (rear front mount point)

- Kyosho RB7SS rear driveshafts

- XV01 Carbon reinforced rear hubs

- DB01 rear arms

- Tamiya aluminium adjustable suspension mounts

- TRF racing wing

- TRF serrated wheel nuts

- Tamiya CF rear shock tower

- TA06 gear diff, with steel gears, aluminium cover, TRF VG seals, and 10K oil.

- Tamiya aluminium servo mounts

- Schumacher Impact servo saver

- TD4 slipper clutch set, with DB01 pads, RC10B4 spur, TRF201 slipper plates

- Hard hex head ball connectors all round

- Most screws swapped for titanium or aluminium where appropriate

- All the spacers have been swapped from kit plastic to aluminium versions

- 40 grams of lead melted into the front bulkhead

- Electronics wise it's got a low profile savox 1253mg servo, a Spectrum SR315 reciever (will be swapped for a KO Propo one when they come back into stock), Hobbywing 10BL120 ESC and a Speed Passion 5.5T motor. Will be using LCG shorty lipos.

 

Got a few bits left to do

- Wiring

- Fit a rear anti rollbar (the DB01 rear arms don't allow the normal TD2 rear rollbar to be fitted so need to figure out something for that)

- Fit some 1 degree TRF201 aluminium rear hubs (reversed) to reduce the rear toe (if required)

- Stickers for the body

- Swap the adjusters on the front pushrods and the servo link to the short TRF open faced adjusters from the TRF420 (awaiting stock!)

- Will also swap over to a spare set of buggy aeration dampers as well I think - will see how I get on with the DF03 ones.

Pretty pleased with the result so far, it feels very strong, there's very little slop in it, and I feel the setup is in the right ball park for carpet racing, and the setup window is also big enough to allow for plenty of tuning. Main concern is the steering geometry, the strength of the rear damper stay, and how it will handle the jumps. I'll probably try and come up with a front wing mount as well so it will be easy to fit one if needed.

Really keen to see how close I can get my laptimes with the B6.4, both cars have identical electrics, batteries, and wheels/tyres so will be a reasonably fair test.

Roll on race day 

[Nick-W 1494]

52 minutes ago, BuggyGuy said:

DF03/TT02B dampers - gold springs on the rear and blue on the front from the DT02 set

Such a great looking car.

If you don’t mind a couple of quick questions.
What oil are you using across the dampers? I’m using the TT02 alloy set with stock springs but I’m struggling to get a set up I’m comfortable with. Are the blue springs harder than the stock? 

[BuggyGuy 1106]

Just now, Nick-W said:

Such a great looking car.

If you don’t mind a couple of quick questions.
What oil are you using across the dampers? I’m using the TT02 alloy set with stock springs but I’m struggling to get a set up I’m comfortable with. Are the blue springs harder than the stock? 

Blue spring are harder then the red that comes with the TD2 (and in DT02 spring set). I felt that the blue were slightly softer than the gold that came with the DF03 damper set. I used the golds at the rear and the car just felt better with them on that the blues (that are quite short for a rear spring IMO)

I've used Team Associated 37.5wt (463 CST) at the front, and 32.5wt (388 CST) at the rear.

I expect springs and oil weights to change once I've done a few laps though, though I think it will be in the right ball park for high grip carpet.

[Nick-W 1494]

10 minutes ago, BuggyGuy said:

Blue spring are harder then the red that comes with the TD2 (and in DT02 spring set). I felt that the blue were slightly softer than the gold that came with the DF03 damper set. I used the golds at the rear and the car just felt better with them on that the blues (that are quite short for a rear spring IMO)

I've used Team Associated 37.5wt (463 CST) at the front, and 32.5wt (388 CST) at the rear.

I expect springs and oil weights to change once I've done a few laps though, though I think it will be in the right ball park for high grip carpet.

Brilliant. Thanks a lot for the answer.
I’ve got everything running slightly softer at the front. I think I’m going to order those springs. 

[ThunderDragonCy 7881]

@Nick-W @BuggyGuy The gold springs that come on the DF03/TT02 alloy shocks are the medium from the DF03 setting spring set. They are all fairly stiff, the silver hard ones particularly, although they were good for the front of something heavy and high leverage like a twin shock front end on a Thundershot / Thunder Dragon. The black soft springs from that same set are softer than the golds and quite good for a few buggies. 

[akimrc 20]

BuggyGuy: good job and good luck

My home offroad carpet track is famous Hudy Arena and the layout this season is pretty....challenge.
TBH, i dont have balls to drive TD2 here...

[SlideWRX 785]

On 1/1/2023 at 2:35 PM, BuggyGuy said:

Really keen to see how close I can get my laptimes with the B6.4, both cars have identical electrics, batteries, and wheels/tyres so will be a reasonably fair test.

Roll on race day 

For better or worse, I think we all want to see how it compares.

As for springs, @speedy_w_beans made a spreadsheet with a lot of spring rates on it. DT-02 Red, 0.34 N/mm, DT-02 Blue, 0.74 N/mm, and DF-03 gold 0.78 N/mm.  I got 0.89 on a DF-03 gold.  The TRF 201 set has a ~0.5 N/mm and the DF-03 has the black at 0.7 N/mm, but kinda a void between those.

 

[ThunderDragonCy 7881]

10 hours ago, SlideWRX said:

For better or worse, I think we all want to see how it compares.

As for springs, @speedy_w_beans made a spreadsheet with a lot of spring rates on it. DT-02 Red, 0.34 N/mm, DT-02 Blue, 0.74 N/mm, and DF-03 gold 0.78 N/mm.  I got 0.89 on a DF-03 gold.  The TRF 201 set has a ~0.5 N/mm and the DF-03 has the black at 0.7 N/mm, but kinda a void between those.

 

The petit rc buggy spring chart films k  the gaps

https://site.petitrc.com/reglages/BuggySpringChart.pdf

It can be a bit hard to find the tamiya stuff in there, but basically the TRF501 front spring set is the bridge between the trf201 springs and the DF03 springs. Worth noting that the Core RC big bore springs fit the DF03 shocks, because they are tapered and fit a standard size shock collar at the eyelet end. I have used some on my TRF211. 

[Howards 456]

On 1/1/2023 at 7:35 PM, BuggyGuy said:

Pretty much done now:

 

 

Amazing level of commitment here! Where are you going to race it?

[BuggyGuy 1106]

4 hours ago, Howards said:

Amazing level of commitment here! Where are you going to race it?

1066 Racing in Hastings

Great club, huge indoor carpet track on race days with a good crowd and great jumps!

[BuggyGuy 1106]

Found a decent way of mounting the anti rollbar so it will reach the mount points on the DB01 arms:

[Howards 456]

1 hour ago, BuggyGuy said:

1066 Racing in Hastings

Great club, huge indoor carpet track on race days with a good crowd and great jumps!

Ah, looks great... 2.5 hrs from my London gaff though

[Nicadraus 6201]

On 1/2/2023 at 3:35 AM, BuggyGuy said:

Pretty much done now:

 

Beautiful uncompromised build. Can't wait to see it run. Please share videos.

[akimrc 20]

https://circusrc.com/2023/01/kyosho-ultima-sb-dirt-master-1-10th-2wd-buggy-coming-soon/

I was using transmission parts from RB5 on TRF201 back in the day. Also driveshaft are almost identical. This will be good source for parts i think. (for TRF and TD)

[BuggyGuy 1106]

So - a day of racing is complete. The TD2 is a pretty reasonable car! I'm definitely quicker with my Associated B6 though, and the TRF211XM. But the car didn't disgrace itself and quite a few people were surprised by its performance!

Notes:

The main issue is a lack of front end bite, even on a really high grip carpet track, this stops you being able to push the car as hard as the proper competition buggies.

The weight distribution makes the car hard to get over the jumps, you have to get it it spot on. The weight in the TD2 is much more rearward than competitive cars, many of which have 4 gear, or laydown style gearboxes that puts more weight in the centre of the chassis.

Changes I'll make for next time:

- Reduce rear toe

- Soften the front slightly

- Drop the ride height a bit

- Move the lipo to be across the front of the chassis, and put a brass lipo weight underneath it, moving the steering servo to the current battery tray on the end of a long link back to the front (bit like an M07) along with the rest of the electronics.

Things it would need to match a proper competition buggy:

- Steering modifications to allow increased travel and tuning of ackerman 

- a new gearbox and chassis plate to match

To conclude - it was better than I thought it would be, and it would be absolutely fine for a novice or casual racer. But it would need significant changes to be a really great car.

I'll run it again, I think it would do better on a lower grip track, but it will be back on the shelf for the next few meetings until I have a chance to put some more work into it.

P.S This would be a great kit for someone like Exotek to make a chassis conversion kit for!

[rodeo 12]

Finally my xmas project is finished. It was hard to withstand for 133€ on sale. It was a nice build but hard to get the BL motor in. And I need to put in a bigger pinion on the 13,5 t HW motor. Standard pinion is a little too slow. Canopy is attached per velcro. 

 

[Aerobert 2147]

26 minutes ago, rodeo said:

Finally my xmas project is finished. It was hard to withstand for 133€ on sale. It was a nice build but hard to get the BL motor in. And I need to put in a bigger pinion on the 13,5 t HW motor. Standard pinion is a little too slow. Canopy is attached per velcro. 

 

That's a great looking Astute. To install a regular BL motor with the wires on the side is a real pain. What pinion do you use?

[BuggyGuy 1106]

2 hours ago, rodeo said:

Finally my xmas project is finished. It was hard to withstand for 133€ on sale. It was a nice build but hard to get the BL motor in. And I need to put in a bigger pinion on the 13,5 t HW motor. Standard pinion is a little too slow. Canopy is attached per velcro. 

Fantastic looking car

[rodeo 12]

1 hour ago, Aerobert said:

That's a great looking Astute. To install a regular BL motor with the wires on the side is a real pain. What pinion do you use?

Thx, I used the kit 17t pinion. 

[ThunderDragonCy 7881]

Any of you UK based TD2 owners upgraded to the carbon rear shock tower and got the kit tower spare? I would like to get a look at one and measure one up for this td2 based project. Would like to see if I can use the stock tower. Happy to cover UK postage and return. DM me! Thanks. 

[toyolien 4681]

1 hour ago, ThunderDragonCy said:

Any of you UK based TD2 owners upgraded to the carbon rear shock tower and got the kit tower spare? I would like to get a look at one and measure one up for this td2 based project. Would like to see if I can use the stock tower. Happy to cover UK postage and return. DM me! Thanks. 

Messaged you.

[danimaldaisy 70]

I just realized that the TD2 astute shares gearing, mid motor setup, and the Gear diff from the trf201.  That makes for lots of gearing options!

[danimaldaisy 70]

Does anyone know if the new astute has rear toe in adjustment?

Thanks!